Legit, the first reply that doesn't say "AI art is bad because... bec- It just is ok??"
I understand what you mean. But there isn't a clear answer for this yet, there isn't a legal framework in place to determine if AI art is plagiarism or not. One can argue that people using the art of others as reference isn't plagiarism, thus AI using art as reference isn't either. It isn't tracing in the literal meaning.
Training a cnn is considered plagiarism? You say yes, somebody else says no, and there isn't any law to clear this up. It's a gray area. The AI isn't copying the art 1:1. It's mimicking what the human brain does when you tell it to think of a "red apple on top of a table". It just uses art to learn.
Obviously, as you can see, the ethical part doesn't mean something to me, otherwise I wouldn't be on a piracy forum. I believe in market competition and I disliked the monopoly of art where even mediocre artists charge premium for commissions. For example, before AI I had to waste hours on pinterest and artstation trying to find a fitting picture for a character in my ttrpgs, and now I can create whatever I want with detailed descriptions using AI in seconds. Why would I be against something as useful as this? It's also fun trying to create something in your free time without having to practice 10000 hours. Also yes people will use it for cash grabs like they always do, but It's still in infancy, it can be easily detected, and no sane person will pay for that. If AI becomes better in the future, why would I mind if people use it more? If the end result is good-looking, I won't mind.
Also, you said that most art is copyright free, so doesn't that allow people to use it to train their neural networks? They should add an AI tag too, I'm not against that. I'm against hypocrisy coming from people who pirate things, dont give a shit about copyright and then come and argue that "Using AI is theft".
excuse my rudeness and my english is bad and turning my thoughts into arguments take me hours so it will be quick and there will be a lot mistakes
ethics and morality and laws are the same thing. the statment "ethics are subjective" is false. morality is objective and morality is currently represented trough the laws. if laws do not represent morality correctly people usualy say that people using loopholes. also you said that piracy is unethical but it's also illegal. infact piracy probably more illegal then it's unethical.
comparing machine learning to human learning is completely incorrect. model is a 4gb file. it's just a different type of information. also there is not much difference between memories and skills that person have. comparing person memories to a code?
the scale. the scale of ai-art-theft for me right now feels really big. and it's probably why a lot of people pissed about ai art. the sites like fiverr that artist were using, do have ai thing on their front page even tho ai art is really like you said in the gray area. same with artsation. you do said that people would use it for cash grabs. but it's not like it's few guys it's like a lot of people. also idk whats wrong with the "tech bros" people seem like insane fanatics.
companies. the problem is that ai art model should have not been created. to train a ai model it takes like a supercomputer a lot of money and a lot of time making and organizing img-text-pairs. and models were trained on obvious copyright material. the thing is that stable ai, midjourney, dall-e are benefiting from that with a lot of money. yet to clarify. corporation stealing work from literal artists and making huge profits/get lot investments. it's like something from cyberpunk. and what it's feels like they also spreading propaganda. also companies could assume that it would hurt the artists but companies just dont give a damn. it's okay when some guy from 3rd world country pirating a movie. but when a company that makes millions does it it's just wtf.
also problem with laws is that companies have almost infinite money meanwhile artists usually pretty poor.
when if first saw an laion-2b database web-site i assumed that it's the work of few wikipedia-like dudes that scrolling trough internet to find pictures that no one would object to be used. but it's actually crawls trough entire internet including artsites like artsation twitter pixiv. its feels like it was made by a discord/reddit mod.
argument that artist deserve to be their work taken because they pirates is also problematic. because there a lot of people that do not pirate and there a lot of artist that careful with their references. and an ai takes it from everybody.
also if an artist does not care about copyright is usally benefits to copyright holder like if artist draws character from some anime/game people that see that art would be curious to watch source material. for example most people know overwatch because of its porn. meanwhile an ai erases all ownership and credit from the artist and drives that same artist from the market.
the ai art do create a problem for existing artists. like if an artist artstyle looks similar to what prompters usually like then when seeing artist work people would assume that it was made by an ai. and the thing is that an ai probably were trained on that person previous works. so it's like artist is being replaced by his own style that he invented. even if an artist dont make money from their work it's still a bs. what even the point for the artist to compete with an ai if the more artist puts the effort to improve the more he trains the an ai he competes with. and the really likely result is the artist would not post their work publicly like if you cant make any money from it and you dont get any credit then why bother with the stress from social media and not just post it in private discord for artists?
i don see much problem with people like you that generate artwork for personnel use because it's not really affecting artists that much.
people that just posting is idk but it's feels like it's also should not be. because it's like tracing. and problem with tracing is not plagiarism but the fact that tracer abusing someone's work. and also traced work also is not 1:1.
making money from gray-area-models or trying to pretend that you an artist should be a big nono.
also when i said "copyright free" i meant that artists give much more freedom to people with their works comparing to a music. and it feels just because of that freedom some people really go nuts right now.
"If AI becomes better in the future, why would I mind if people use it more? If the end result is good-looking, I won't mind."
i am not shure. for now it's really seems that it could do more harm then good. people will still draw with the pencil/digital pencil because it gives more control so it's still will be used to create something new. and since an ai gives less control. then the only thing it's good for is taking someone's work? also ai art is not an art it's just a pretty picture. when you do anything your mood could be analyzed even if you think you hide your emotions well. people can tell what person you are simply from a few text messages. the same thing with the art. but what do you get from analyzing ai art? also a lot of people do that subcotiously so people cant tell what's wrong but they can feel it. i theory even if person draws coom that can make sense too(?).
also in this particular situation f95z is a piracy fourm so why care about an ai art? idk it's just ai art gets you associated with all of the things written above.
not shure i addressed your arguments but anyway
