I get a vibe of religious fanatic while talking to you.
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Swiver
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- Sep 13, 2020
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Take it easy lads (and gentlemen, apparently, lol). For a heated discussion this has been relatively amiably spirited despite the disagreements. There's a whole lot of legitimate criticism to be made of MNG as with the best AVN.
While I argued against certain points, Adamska and others legitimately like a more straight forward netorase dynamic. Alas MNG is not and was never planned as one.
There's a coming of age, corruption arc here and jealousy is at the core of the internal tension of the male protagonist (if I'm to have any, my criticism would be that CG isn't playing on it enough to avoid inducing netorare feelings). In a deleted post describing a more modern classification of ntr/nts tropes termed active/passive cuckold play, defining active, aka alpha, cuckolding as often focusing on hardcore reclaiming by the cuck, I realized for the first time this seems to be exactly what CG is going for (and it's certainly not NTR per definitions).
From what I understand, some are taking jealousy and Vi's slutty interest in someone else as contradicting the promise of a "lighthearted" story, but I believe that devs in this wave generally mean there's no blackmail, rape, humiliating or dumping the MMC, among other things that they term non-consensual. It's kind of a trend because of political correctness and an adaptation to both censorship in the distribution platforms and a very loud anti-ntr crowd.
There's been an extended discussion on defining diversity. For a kinetic VN there's an impressive list of kinks here. Again we're talking thru each other as some actually mean diverse audience not kinks.
What those saying that the VN does not deliver on diversity is that a portion of the audience is excluded because certain kinks or parts of the story simply being featured fuck up the whole thing for them, so the promise of "diversity" is broken by excluding certain readers/wankers who are turned off, or worse, by something like Vi momentarily priotitizing interest in another man. Diversity as meant by dev has been (mis)understood as "for a diverse audience" not as "there's diverse fucking in various directions going on here".
We can understand the frustration of not being able to enjoy a very hot looking porn. It must be even worse when it has elements quite close to exactly what you wish to see. It is also understandable that someone should wish to complain and dish with empathetic fellow wankers and perhaps hoping voicing that devs hearing this would be encouraged to explore adding different paths or whatever to accomodate.
I just wish/hope people were/are kind about it. Even upvoting an opinion can be done without feeling like a piling on. There's a reason devs start out active and engaged here before disappearing into discord.
While I argued against certain points, Adamska and others legitimately like a more straight forward netorase dynamic. Alas MNG is not and was never planned as one.
There's a coming of age, corruption arc here and jealousy is at the core of the internal tension of the male protagonist (if I'm to have any, my criticism would be that CG isn't playing on it enough to avoid inducing netorare feelings). In a deleted post describing a more modern classification of ntr/nts tropes termed active/passive cuckold play, defining active, aka alpha, cuckolding as often focusing on hardcore reclaiming by the cuck, I realized for the first time this seems to be exactly what CG is going for (and it's certainly not NTR per definitions).
From what I understand, some are taking jealousy and Vi's slutty interest in someone else as contradicting the promise of a "lighthearted" story, but I believe that devs in this wave generally mean there's no blackmail, rape, humiliating or dumping the MMC, among other things that they term non-consensual. It's kind of a trend because of political correctness and an adaptation to both censorship in the distribution platforms and a very loud anti-ntr crowd.
There's been an extended discussion on defining diversity. For a kinetic VN there's an impressive list of kinks here. Again we're talking thru each other as some actually mean diverse audience not kinks.
What those saying that the VN does not deliver on diversity is that a portion of the audience is excluded because certain kinks or parts of the story simply being featured fuck up the whole thing for them, so the promise of "diversity" is broken by excluding certain readers/wankers who are turned off, or worse, by something like Vi momentarily priotitizing interest in another man. Diversity as meant by dev has been (mis)understood as "for a diverse audience" not as "there's diverse fucking in various directions going on here".
We can understand the frustration of not being able to enjoy a very hot looking porn. It must be even worse when it has elements quite close to exactly what you wish to see. It is also understandable that someone should wish to complain and dish with empathetic fellow wankers and perhaps hoping voicing that devs hearing this would be encouraged to explore adding different paths or whatever to accomodate.
I just wish/hope people were/are kind about it. Even upvoting an opinion can be done without feeling like a piling on. There's a reason devs start out active and engaged here before disappearing into discord.
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Fair enough. Let's say it is 20-30 chapters. In the first third of the game, we have established what exactly?
I just replayed it again to make sure I hadn't missed something. Where do you see this aggressive, dominant behavior prior to the sex scene with Ari?
We start out with probably the most important scene of the entire game. A sequence of images where Eric dreams Ari and Vi take on BBC as he watches. Sets the tone for the entire story that is coming. Another critical scene when he catches Ari in the men's locker room and watches her suck BBC.
There is A LOT of discussion where he clearly is a beta cuck. He has those discussions with the sisters, Ari, Vi, and even Sai. He even watches the porn Violet watched, where the girlfriend is getting taken dominantly by two other men while the boyfriend watches. Their first sex scene together he revisits the cuckold porn in his head while Violet encourages him to control her. He finally starts pounding her throat and she tells him that now she is positive that she is going to be naughty (do things that he has to watch). That seems to be what excites him throughout the entire scene. Violet is quite aggressive, and Eric is receptive to it, but not overly aggressive himself.
That motif plays through even in Chapter 6. Ari has to drag the aggression out of him. Get him extremely emotionally motivated before he does anything aggressive.
I am not seeing any of his domineering or becoming domineering side. It would make for a great build up though, wouldn't it!? Maybe six chapters isn't enough for that kind of growth. It should be, there are plenty of opportunities for him to be assertive. It makes sense that it would be, but it just falls flat.
So, after replaying it, yet again, I am confident that there is a lot of room for improvement. And showing Eric growing into an assertive boyfriend who wants to exhibit his girlfriend (versus watching her be fucked and abused by countless men) would absolutely be an improvement. But that is not what we have. Let's work with what we do have. A beta cuck who enjoys watching his girlfriend with tons of other men, preferably BBC. So, in that case, her jumping on pornstar dick at a photoshoot makes perfect sense. She is far more aggressive than Eric is. And she wants to be a slut at all costs. Going back to the beginning of the game, he wants to see her with other men. There you have it, the perfect cuckold story!
So, why are people complaining, including me? Because that is not the loving, drama-free story we were told we were getting, where Eric rules over his "sharing harem." On the other hand, he is getting exactly what he wants. A bunch of women go to other men for their desires to be met and come back to him for cleanup duty. It can be an exciting story regardless. It simply lacks consistency.
It just seems that there is a lot of wishful thinking all around, regardless of the side chosen. The solution, for me, is to see a stronger story being told. CG chooses his kinks and story and supports it with solid storytelling. That is what is missing.
More of the personal attacks because you cannot debate the points.
All these new accounts defending the dev with ignorant ferocity. Not suspicious at all. Posts on even the off-topic thread about CG being attacked. You're doing him proud! Say, do you know what happens when a game gets a bunch of reviews that are firewalled and come from accounts that don't do anything else? Probably not, as you haven't been here long. You should look that up. It will be a learning experience for you to take back to the hive.
But it is crazy now all these new accounts are here defending the story and causing arguments with everyone who disagrees with any part of the story. Interesting.
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mephistobr
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- Nov 15, 2022
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Genuinely curious, did the Devs actually promised what I quoted above or is that your wishful thinking?
Also, what drama are you talking about? Rob vs Brother? Vi vs Dad? Laura's loneliness? Those are the one's I can think of. Other than that just straight fucking.
Yeah, if you follow along on the Patreon and Discord discussions, and the comments left here by the dev and everyone defending him, many times over many pages, we have been told that Vi will always come back to Eric. There will be no drama in their relationship. That is a broad comment, but most take it to mean she will not cheat on him, he will always take her back and be excited about what she has done.
I don't think there is any reason to hold the dev to that standard. It is unrealistic and just too broad to really mean anything. We will just have to wait and see, I think.
Have you read the start date in my bio? I'm far from being a new account. And in your claim that this was going to be drama free you're sadly mistaken. I've said it before and I'll say it again. You're setting yourself up for disappointment.
You are obviously NOT the target of that comment.
It's alright if the story doesn't go my way. Wishful thinking doesn't work like that, I am pretty sure. I just support the open sharing of ideas that this site is made for, without belittling those who see things differently. Like I said, look at that opening scene dream sequence, all of the conversations with all of the women (except Anya), the locker room scene, Violet's porn and how Eric feels about it, and of course, the Chapter 6 ending. This is a BBC cuckold story, at least in some large part.
I find it funny how people are spending time writing paragraphs on the story like its made by some game of thrones best selling author. I just want more frequent updates and not reworks.
JarrenBlake
Member
- Dec 9, 2023
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Big ongoing discussion it seems. There is a post up above that does a good job explaining some of the dynamics at play. I don't think anyone feels that VI and the other girls will not be with other men. Physical fidelity is not gonna happen. So the arguments have been more about emotional fidelity and the MC as a reliable narrator. So if Eric is down for anything with no boundaries...can he even be cheated on? But even if the character will not judge, some within the audience will.
Ultimately what Swiver said above seems to drive people getting upset over it. The thought that the VN will move away from what they can accept, when it has so much that they really do like, has upset some on both sides of this argument. Will this be a story of a strong but kinky couple? Will Vi fall to corruption and/or turn into a major porn slut with no regard? What "role" does Eric fall into? Will just have to see where it goes.
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Zobra
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- Dec 31, 2019
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that was my biggest issue , she can go full-slut mode and cheat on Erik like i could give f*ck , but i'm just sick of hearing something like "go back in time & read what they said prior that or from the first photoshop" coz i don't care about that , we move on to the story to see the progress of the characters (even when i started the game for the first time , i was so sure that this was another bbc c*ckold game where MC is pathetic , but the more Updates i played (till Ch5) the more i enjoyed)...
that inner dialogue was really disturbing (more than the BJ scene itself) , the only thing that could change my opinion about her is if she felt the guilt and apologized to Erik (doesn't mater if "Erik likes it" , i don't , hehe sorry Erik
).I M O
i'd like to know (the p*rnstar route ? hell nah , A Playboy magazine Model ? why not . I M O) , Dev's answer to that will be : "if i tell you , i have to kill you"
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Almost but no major scenes yet. Does "step" counts for you?
upd. Sorry totally forgot about older sis(mb because she doesen't count for me as one
)thx poster below.
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Zobra
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- Dec 31, 2019
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yes , Blowjob with big sis , for now (use incest patch from OP).
Soo I had second thoughts, I'm sorry for you guys that the game went south for you, starting from last chapters. I can't imagine your frustration because I just don't feel the same,(haven't even tried looking from your perspective) you do deserve to get something that you wish for, time will tell, mb some branches will appear into later stages of development. Next chapter will hopefully answer your questions and mine in that matter.that was my biggest issue , she can go full-slut mode and cheat on Erik like i could give f*ck , but i'm just sick of hearing something like "go back in time & read what they said prior that or from the first photoshop" coz i don't care about that , we move on to the story to see the progress of the characters (even when i started the game for the first time , i was so sure that this was another bbc c*ckold game where MC is pathetic , but the more Updates i played (till Ch5) the more i enjoyed)...
that inner dialogue was really disturbing (more than the BJ scene itself) , the only thing that could change my opinion about her is if she felt the guilt and apologized to Erik (doesn't mater if "Erik likes it" , i don't , hehe sorry Erik
I M O
i'd like to know (the p*rnstar route hell nah I M O) , Dev's answer to that will be : "if i tell you , i have to kill you"
There is still possibility where game will change dramatically, I mentioned before Vi - may not be the girlfriend to look for as the romantic part of the game, with someone can say rapid turn of events, she did "stray far" from the MC even in my biased opinion.(there is the catch - for me it's even hotter that way)Yes, the gradual corruption and evolution is present, the ground for exploring the kink more is layed, but it still kind of feels that's something amiss. This twist won't leave my mind that "true" girlfriend is Anya.(ready for rotten tomatoes throws)It closes a lot of gaps in the story.
All in all I just love to speculate, building this fandom/fanfic in my head, there is still not so many facts told to jump to conclusions, too much variables, not all cards shown and there are still more characters to be added into the mix.
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I'm going to continue to camp in this thread and point out everyone's flawed logic on this story and you absolutely can't stop me. So you might as well put me on your ignore list.
It's clear a portion of the fan base has judiciously been using the skip function and attaching their own story to the real story or worse completely ignoring previous updates and the character interactions. Then come into this thread and ping off each other with some bizarre reality confirmation bias.
I'm all for fan fic, but this is not that.
Some of you are all mad simply, because some of us are pointing this out and shattering the fake story that's been attached to this game. Which boggles my mind how it even began in the first place and can only surmise a handful of people wanted the story to go in a direction opposite of where it was headed and thought if they were loud enough and persistent enough they'd succeed.
There are people in my DM's talking about this. This is how bad it is.
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Zobra
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- Dec 31, 2019
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Thanks for respecting my (our) opinion but it not literally "frustration" , it was like a switch in my mind from "i love you Vi" to "GFYS Vi" (in just a few words of her inner thoughts which i CANNOT ignore even if it was edited later on , some words can be more painful than a punch in the face) , so -IF she choose to go that Route then it fine [Many will love to see her full slutty "f*ck then tell/tease later" therefor that BJ scene shouldn't be changed (tho what for sure is that i definitely want to share her lol but i want Erik to be in control if it makes sense)] -I'll still play the game as i have hope on Anya to be the real Lover (while enjoy other characters as long they don't make fun of Erik or spit on his back) , But i'll skip/ignore every Dialogue related to Vi ... Unless ....
again , i appreciate your concern .
JarrenBlake
Member
- Dec 9, 2023
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Not sure why I was included in the whole "disappointed" group. My comment was about this dispute in general. Sure, like everyone I have my likes and dislikes. One thing that I do keep repeating is that both side assume they are going to get their way in the end. Those in the middle that do not care either way will likely be the happiest. At this point Vi could be corrupted, then again she might not. she might have 10-15 partners, or she may just have 3-4. She might leave Eric or she may place him head and above all others. Only CG knows at this point. So, there is nothing to be overly disappointed about.
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mephistobr
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- Nov 15, 2022
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It's incredible how you guys set yourselves up for disappointment. And you know what, it's your stupid fault, cause there's nothing in the story so far to backup your wishful thinking. You hope Anya is the true love? You don't even understand the game if you think true love means exclusivity. Sorry to break to ya but Anya is probably going to get fucked by multiple people.
dexterousgecko
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- Dec 7, 2019
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