New Game Fetish Poll - NTR or Dom, and Character Type

[kgirlffx]

It sounds interesting.

I will not vote, as this is not my genre: not intended for me.

If it was my genre (Mother/Son Incest), I would want:
John:
1) Mother non-NTR.
2) For others, it's ogre.

I would want John to be a champion: not a push-over Shota perv manlet.

And I would want my spine to eventually get un-fucked.


Regarding NTR allusions:
NTR path: no closure unless climax.
Non-NTR path: closure.

Providing closure by casting allusions away requires an effort to convince the player through historic knowledge of LIs, through the LIs themselves, or through the world somehow.

If MC is going to get neglected and laughed at by NTR world all day, the tease will clearly be tuned to the NTR crowd solely.

Of the set of people who don't like NTR, only a portion relative to the extent to which the tease bothers them will bleed from the potential demographic.

Oh!
And development time (causing cliffhangers) can be a part of the problem.

If I follow a non-NTR route, it would be much as you describe. I am personally not a fan of young or boyish protagonists. John would be less a shota perv, and more a guy who let his dreams go for mediocrity, then was forced to hit rock bottom, and with renewed passion climbs back up far higher.

In short, a kind of learning to be alpha character type. And yes, this path would include completion of treatments and being able to walk again.

Development time and cliffhangers do concern me. As a player, there it is very frustrating to have plotlines linger for years due to the dev trying to do a dozen plots at once. My general thought as of now is to tackle one route at a time and thus provide the quickest dev time to a completed story. Then I can turn to other routes or add on to existing routes.

 

[Jofur]

As has been pointed out, I would start out just making the game with a singular focus on either NTR or Netori. Splitting your game into two stories means double the work for an audience that probably won't be that interested in trying it in the first place. Doubly so since NTR is the arguably the most contentious fetish on this site.

Maybe after you've finished the game you can do a full on spin-off title from the other perspective.

 

[Oh my]

If I follow a non-NTR route, it would be much as you describe. I am personally not a fan of young or boyish protagonists. John would be less a shota perv, and more a guy who let his dreams go for mediocrity, then was forced to hit rock bottom, and with renewed passion climbs back up far higher.

In short, a kind of learning to be alpha character type. And yes, this path would include completion of treatments and being able to walk again.

Development time and cliffhangers do concern me. As a player, there it is very frustrating to have plotlines linger for years due to the dev trying to do a dozen plots at once. My general thought as of now is to tackle one route at a time and thus provide the quickest dev time to a completed story. Then I can turn to other routes or add on to existing routes.

4 LIs is a very reasonable and manageable number.
This leaves you with more time for any paths for each, facilitating potential fetish variance with each.
I would plan 3 or 4 myself as well with some potential fling arcs, but only if it suits the story.

I wonder if NTR paths would be PoV or non-PoV since John may or may not be protective of his family despite player choices.
Or that he can't do anything about it and hates it (or if he likes it) and how that sounds very difficult to write in the long run if he's trying to fight back, if I'm not mistaken.
Like he can tattle or something and maybe there's antagonist alibis in play to subvert accusations.
>I can't say I'm spying on them.
>Look {honey, dad, Mr Dude}, he's in the garden: you're being paranoid.

This framework sounds very solid, but perhaps not without its challenges.

 

[ChaosOpen]

You say both an NTR and non-NTR route, but based on what I've seen every time that has ever been said, more than likely the result will be John will have one very vanilla sex scene with the lights off in missionary while the NTR route will have a dozen or more very kinky scenes with all manner of debauchery.

If you want to make an NTR game, then make an NTR game, don't pretend it's both.

 

[E_O_N]

I might be able to give you a pointer or two. However, what some other say here is not wrong. If you are alone and have to do writing, art, sound, animations, QA, social networking etc all by yourself. Do yourself a favor and do it step by step.

One advice I can give, don't get sucked into the ntr discussion too much. There is much more than just ntr or not ntr. On this site the talk focuses way too much on that. Is the story good? What are the general elements found in it? Is it a fap game, or an adult game with fap elements? etc.

You say both an NTR and non-NTR route, but based on what I've seen every time that has ever been said, more than likely the result will be John will have one very vanilla sex scene with the lights off in missionary while the NTR route will have a dozen or more very kinky scenes with all manner of debauchery.

In most cases that is actually true.

 

[baloneysammich]

While I don't think it's inconceivable for a game to have both NTR and non-NTR routes that are each enjoyable to their respective audiences, this particular setup doesn't seem suited to something like that.

Because... I don't see why anyone would want to play a non-NTR John path. Nevermind the fact that he's not on nearly equal footing to OF. What kind of porn content would be in it for the player until mid to late game? Especially if the best case scenario is merely returning to his old status quo. Maybe it could be worth it if the payoff was turning him into the alpha and seducing all the women. But barring that, it really seems like a setup that's only suited for NTR.

So in the end, I don't think I'd play a game like this at all, because I'm neither into NTR nor into cucking a crippled guy.

 

[Oh my]

You say both an NTR and non-NTR route, but based on what I've seen every time that has ever been said, more than likely the result will be John will have one very vanilla sex scene with the lights off in missionary while the NTR route will have a dozen or more very kinky scenes with all manner of debauchery.

If you want to make an NTR game, then make an NTR game, don't pretend it's both.

Well, Romance is a 'fetish'.
It's possible to have more than one fetish in a game, but it can be tricky.
You've got an 'air of' NTR or an 'air of' Romance on paths to the degree that it makes sense.

And the prevalence of each.

NTR isn't all about fucking and neither is Romance.
Both can tease as hard as shoving it in your face.
Romance can be as simple as a mundane and boring period, or rough patch, in a relationship and being strongly tempted yet STILL remaining devoted (it says all you need to know).
Variations of 'with John' or 'with Old Friend' is the name of the game.

Since John is crippled, I'm not sure how well he'd fug.
Seems like blowjobs, cowgirl and end-game.

But barring that, it really seems like a setup that's only suited for NTR.

I'm not so sure.
He's got spy equipment and evidence that can get him booted out of the house by the girls.
He can be oblivious, but want attention.
If he wants to watch (Netorase) Old Friend fucking his daughters and keep his wife and boyfriend's gf together, he can cut a deal.

It isn't without its problems, but I'm not sure what they can do against eachother.
Maybe he can blackmail Old Friend with other intelligence gathering efforts, from connections, to absolve himself for instance.

 

[Entropylol]

kgirlffx Is a netorase path planned?

 

[kgirlffx]

4 LIs is a very reasonable and manageable number.
This leaves you with more time for any paths for each, facilitating potential fetish variance with each.
I would plan 3 or 4 myself as well with some potential fling arcs, but only if it suits the story.

I wonder if NTR paths would be PoV or non-PoV since John may or may not be protective of his family despite player choices.
Or that he can't do anything about it and hates it (or if he likes it) and how that sounds very difficult to write in the long run if he's trying to fight back, if I'm not mistaken.
Like he can tattle or something and maybe there's antagonist alibis in play to subvert accusations.
>I can't say I'm spying on them.
>Look {honey, dad, Mr Dude}, he's in the garden: you're being paranoid.

This framework sounds very solid, but perhaps not without its challenges.

Current plan is to go deep John PoV. To the point of have him be a faceless character with the camera never showing his face for better immersion.

Tentatively, the plan is to have two game modes. Hard Mode - Hidden: All John PoV, what he sees he sees. The player is updated on corruption via a stat that shows how far his family has fallen. Option to sneak in security cameras to see more directly.

Second mode, full view mode: Same as before, but every night the player can see the events of the day via a characterless PoV.

That's for netorare anyway.


As for second comment. I actually think NTR and romance are more more related than many think. A good NTR is all about romance - just not with the main character. So NTR path would be in effect, a corruption romance story for Old Friend.

The non-ntr path, if it goes forward, would be all about taking familial relationships in a new direction, the challenges of that, removing the competition, and regaining the use of his legs and ending the game with a harem. Game would end with that, or another specific LI romance. It would not continue much past that. Not into random sex scenes for no story reason.

 

[kgirlffx]

kgirlffx Is a netorase path planned?

There may be an element of that in why the character does or does not act to protect his family, but it will not be the main focus.

 

[kgirlffx]

While I don't think it's inconceivable for a game to have both NTR and non-NTR routes that are each enjoyable to their respective audiences, this particular setup doesn't seem suited to something like that.

Because... I don't see why anyone would want to play a non-NTR John path. Nevermind the fact that he's not on nearly equal footing to OF. What kind of porn content would be in it for the player until mid to late game? Especially if the best case scenario is merely returning to his old status quo. Maybe it could be worth it if the payoff was turning him into the alpha and seducing all the women. But barring that, it really seems like a setup that's only suited for NTR.

So in the end, I don't think I'd play a game like this at all, because I'm neither into NTR nor into cucking a crippled guy.

If I do a non-ntr path, it would be either just a non-sex focused game of a parent protecting his family and retaking his life. OR it would be John at rock bottom, keeping his family safe, and growing into the alpha he always wanted to be.

 

[kgirlffx]

I might be able to give you a pointer or two. However, what some other say here is not wrong. If you are alone and have to do writing, art, sound, animations, QA, social networking etc all by yourself. Do yourself a favor and do it step by step.

One advice I can give, don't get sucked into the ntr discussion too much. There is much more than just ntr or not ntr. On this site the talk focuses way too much on that. Is the story good? What are the general elements found in it? Is it a fap game, or an adult game with fap elements? etc.



In most cases that is actually true.

Thanks, good advice overall. This convo has focused a lot on the NTR angle due to the nature of the game, but def not looking to debate the merit of the genre with folks. Been there, done that. Goes bad lol.

 

[kgirlffx]

You say both an NTR and non-NTR route, but based on what I've seen every time that has ever been said, more than likely the result will be John will have one very vanilla sex scene with the lights off in missionary while the NTR route will have a dozen or more very kinky scenes with all manner of debauchery.

If you want to make an NTR game, then make an NTR game, don't pretend it's both.

Agree to disagree. I think by the very nature of NTR being a competition makes for a very rife ground for either story depending on player choice. The challenge is in making, like you pointed out, the vanilla scenes as meaningful as others.

 

[ChaosOpen]

Agree to disagree. I think by the very nature of NTR being a competition makes for a very rife ground for either story depending on player choice. The challenge is in making, like you pointed out, the vanilla scenes as meaningful as others.

A competition, while not required, it is at least assumed that it is taking place on a fair and even playing field where both parties have an equal chance of winning. NTR is the polar opposite of fair. It's not something we can agree to disagree on, it's simple reality. You cannot have an NTR and a romance in the same story because they are complete opposites of each other thematically. It's like trying to make a movie that is both psychological horror and slapstick comedy. Romance is about finding happiness while NTR is about losing it, it doesn't work because in a romance the character must be unhappy in order for him to meet the person that can bring happiness to his life, for NTR the person must first be happy due to another person then a third party must come along and rip that happiness away from him. You can't have a story with a character that is happy and unhappy at the same time.

 

[E_O_N]

A competition, while not required, it is at least assumed that it is taking place on a fair and even playing field where both parties have an equal chance of winning. NTR is the polar opposite of fair. It's not something we can agree to disagree on, it's simple reality. You cannot have an NTR and a romance in the same story because they are complete opposites of each other thematically.

So you can't have a game with sadness and happiness, because they are thematically the opposite?
A game where things are supposed to go different depending on how you approach a situation?
Quite frankly, I have not yet seen that much brain-vomit sold as indisputable truth, even on f95.

Think a second what you are actually writing.

 

[ChaosOpen]

So you can't have a game with sadness and happiness, because they are thematically the opposite?
A game where things are supposed to go different depending on how you approach a situation?
Quite frankly, I have not yet seen that much brain-vomit sold as indisputable truth, even on f95.

Think a second what you are actually writing.

What I was trying to point out is that NTR fans and romance fans are looking for two completely opposite themes that really don't fit well together. People have tried it before and every time it has been attempted pretty much both fandoms haven't really liked the game as much as they would have had the author dedicated more time and effort into picking a strength and trying to maximize it's potential.

 

[kgirlffx]

What I was trying to point out is that NTR fans and romance fans are looking for two completely opposite themes that really don't fit well together. People have tried it before and every time it has been attempted pretty much both fandoms haven't really liked the game as much as they would have had the author dedicated more time and effort into picking a strength and trying to maximize it's potential.

I don't want to turn this into a "Meaning of NTR" debate. That always goes bad.

To answer your first comment:

Fairness means different things. Yes, John - the player - would be physically at a disadvantage. But, this is his home. His family. There are hard taboo lines to cross. This will not be the kind of game where the characters flip from innocent virgin to lol whocares fk toy at the drop of a hat or by being drugged or something. I think the established familial bonds, and that the antagonist is essentially a stranger, will provide more than enough of a balance competition wise. Or to say, I am confident I can write it that way.

In short, intend to write this fairly realistically - meaning, the corruption will be slow, difficult, and insidious. Plenty of chances to stop it if you pay attention.

To the second comment:


I just don't see it that way. I think romance and ntr is linked due to the same emotions being present in both, though framed differently for different reasons. On a personal level, I prefer stories/games that ride the edge of romance and NTR till one wins out.

I know the type of game you are talking about. I've played them. Perhaps it is just ego, but I think I can do better and have both aspects without one suffering. Maybe I'll be wrong. In that case this game will be okay, and I'll have learned from it for the next. I don't think that will be the case.

TLDR: I think games that fail to capture NTR and Romance are simply not written well enough. I can do better.

 

[kgirlffx]

So you can't have a game with sadness and happiness, because they are thematically the opposite?
A game where things are supposed to go different depending on how you approach a situation?
Quite frankly, I have not yet seen that much brain-vomit sold as indisputable truth, even on f95.

Think a second what you are actually writing.

I get where he is coming from. I have seen games like he is detailing that fail to do either. And, if someone is only interested in the extremes of either end, hard ntr or grand romance, then they may not like a game that blurs the edges.

I just think he goes a bit too far in saying it is impossible. But everyone can have their opinion. Could be right, but I'm going to try my way anyway.

 

[E_O_N]

What I was trying to point out is that NTR fans and romance fans are looking for two completely opposite themes that really don't fit well together. People have tried it before and every time it has been attempted pretty much both fandoms haven't really liked the game as much as they would have had the author dedicated more time and effort into picking a strength and trying to maximize it's potential.

True, usually the time is limited to do a game where your choice really matters in general.
If a dev works solo, he is already doing a great job, if he can focus on one topic well.
However that is one of the limitation I hate about adult games, that you download something, but are unable to shape it.

I understood your initial statement completely different.
Either way, apology, my answer was too harsh.

I just think he goes a bit too far in saying it is impossible. But everyone can have their opinion. Could be right, but I'm going to try my way anyway.

It is not the "easy way" (there is no easy way for devs - not really), but this one is harder than you probably think. In sight that over 90% of games get dropped. Maybe one last advice, start small. chapter by chapter, piece by piece. Divide and conquer.
Good luck.

 

[Uthuriel]

Nice... another game dead before even being made...

I can smell the ABANDONED tag already...