- Sep 4, 2020
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I see. Well, you (Ian) only take(s) part in the book fair trip with Holly if you are not going to the Club with Cindy et all. Can´t have both in one playtrhough, it´s either - or.
- Thread starter Eva Kiss
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- Jan 6, 2020
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Playing for two main characters was really interesting. Really liked side plotlines as well (helping Perry and Holly to get out of comfort zone, Alison interactions, bitchy Minerva, Cindy side story, Molly and Lena interactions). Very good writing.
- Dec 4, 2017
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I also specified that after the club the chapter ends (Go to: The End). Pay attention to these jumps.
- Dec 17, 2019
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- Feb 7, 2018
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Why is it taking so long? (2)
One of the main things that have been making ORS’ progress slower has been the need to plan things out. With GGGB this issue wasn’t too important: my approach to writing and making VN’s has always been pretty organic, and I don’t have a set plan or structure of how things need to progress, only a base idea and a rough guideline that keeps changing and mutating. This is also necessary with this business model, since I have to release chapters as fast as possible (I have been releasing monthly for the most part during these 4 years), so I can’t afford to go dark for six months or an entire year to really plan things out and take time into pre-production.
As I said, GGGB’s structure was pretty straightforward, but with ORS’ complexity things aren’t so easy. I find myself having to take breaks during writing to think ahead and structure the main plotlines, deciding where they’re going to lead, how they’ll develop and how to set them up in the current chapter. I’ve had to go back and re-write or retcon some stuff, or add some elements that felt like missed opportunities, sometimes even after the chapters are released. And new ideas keep popping up, separate pieces suddenly come together in a way I hadn’t seen before, and it makes just writing much more complicated. Sometimes I need to stop until I figure something out, and sometimes I just need time to think and plan, and this drags the monthly production of the script.
In the end, though, I feel like this part is of vital importance. Coming up with cool ideas that don’t feel too generic or shallow is what excites me to write, and I try to construct the game in a way that flows and feels balanced. I have to find space for these moments during production, which makes things a bit messy, since I can’t really afford to take time off just to plan and think, as I said before. But in the end I feel working this way is when I’m more creative and helps me keep pushing myself to work and release content, chapter after chapter.
I hope you’re willing to continue to be patient with me, in exchange I’ll do my best to make ORS as fun as I can!
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- Dec 15, 2020
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Looks like I was onto something in my comment from Friday 
The planning stage is always a right march to get through, the bigger the project the heavier the burden. That goes for both games design and story development. I always felt similar to Eva, that the process was the most fun when I go about it in whatever way comes most naturally to me.
Sitting down and designing 3-arc story structures or hero's journey story plans before even beginning the story always bored me. When I write I usually just scribble on for however long i can contain the story in my head, then I begin to plan it out afterwards so I can better plot down my ideas.
The planning stage is always a right march to get through, the bigger the project the heavier the burden. That goes for both games design and story development. I always felt similar to Eva, that the process was the most fun when I go about it in whatever way comes most naturally to me.
Sitting down and designing 3-arc story structures or hero's journey story plans before even beginning the story always bored me. When I write I usually just scribble on for however long i can contain the story in my head, then I begin to plan it out afterwards so I can better plot down my ideas.
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- Mar 14, 2020
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- Feb 21, 2019
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I thought she had an entire storyline planned and drafted
Wow. Turns out she's doing it chapter by chapter.
This will make it a lot more difficult than it should be.
Wow. Turns out she's doing it chapter by chapter.
This will make it a lot more difficult than it should be.
- Nov 15, 2020
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I too thought she had planned the story to a bigger degree than she's given an impression of lately. But I also agree that planning and structuring stories in advance is boring, and also removes a lot of the intuitive creativity from the process. So I certainly don't blame her for it.
Of course, there's also different ways to plan the story in advance. I assume she had planned from the beginning that Ian and Cindy was going to end up together at some point, that it was going to have a long build up, and that it was related to how Ian could offer some of the things Cindy was missing in her relationship with Wade. If you've got that lined up from the start, you could easily make up the details like the photoshoots and the birthday party as you go along. The much debated time skip also indicates that she's had a basic idea since the beginning of where the characters will stand about halfway through.
Still, with two protagonists and a rather complex story, you're bound to end up with a lot of unforeseen inconsistencies and challenges about how to drive the story forward in a well functioning way. I'm not too worried whether she'll solve all these difficulties in a satisfying way, but I also don't doubt that it's a hell of a job to make all the pieces fall into place.
Of course, there's also different ways to plan the story in advance. I assume she had planned from the beginning that Ian and Cindy was going to end up together at some point, that it was going to have a long build up, and that it was related to how Ian could offer some of the things Cindy was missing in her relationship with Wade. If you've got that lined up from the start, you could easily make up the details like the photoshoots and the birthday party as you go along. The much debated time skip also indicates that she's had a basic idea since the beginning of where the characters will stand about halfway through.
Still, with two protagonists and a rather complex story, you're bound to end up with a lot of unforeseen inconsistencies and challenges about how to drive the story forward in a well functioning way. I'm not too worried whether she'll solve all these difficulties in a satisfying way, but I also don't doubt that it's a hell of a job to make all the pieces fall into place.
Yeah i understand that. That's why i played the game again with different choices to see the book fair event. One of the many perks of playing Eva Kiss's games as seen already in GGGB.
- Sep 11, 2018
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Well, it won't get easier for her, that's for sure. With ambitious projects like ORS, you need detailed planning from the start, otherwise it's very difficult to maintain structure. Even a team of experienced writers can struggle without proper planning. I think she means ironing out plot details, but if she has holes in her story this late in development, it will affect the game in the long-term. Hopefully, the dev will react properly and not scrap too much of her initial plans.
When I think about it, GGGB suffered from some narrative problems, too. You could clearly tell when her planned story ended. In the later stages, the game devolved more into a porn gallery and less of a narrative-driven experience with sex scenes.
When I think about it, GGGB suffered from some narrative problems, too. You could clearly tell when her planned story ended. In the later stages, the game devolved more into a porn gallery and less of a narrative-driven experience with sex scenes.
- Dec 15, 2020
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I'm actually surprised that people are surprised about that latest update. Am I the only one that remember when she talked about her development process previously? She makes the art of what scenes she would like to happen in a chapter first and then she builds up the story around that. Eva isn't a writer first, she's an artist.
My uni professors would have told her that, that's the wrong way to make a story too (I suspect it's also why GGGB's story fizzled out near the ending chapters), but I think creators should only really limit their methods in accordance with their experience and mood. GGGB also showed that Eva knew how to bring the different threads together, even if they were less sophisticated compared to ORS.
My uni professors would have told her that, that's the wrong way to make a story too (I suspect it's also why GGGB's story fizzled out near the ending chapters), but I think creators should only really limit their methods in accordance with their experience and mood. GGGB also showed that Eva knew how to bring the different threads together, even if they were less sophisticated compared to ORS.
- Nov 15, 2020
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But is making the art first really that different to doing the writing first? She still needs to begin by deciding what scenes she wants, and if you're making several drawings that are supposed to form a complete scene, you do kind of construct the story, if maybe not as detailed as if it's done the other way round.I'm actually surprised that people are surprised about that latest update. Am I the only one that remember when she talked about her development process previously? She makes the art of what scenes she would like to happen in a chapter first and then she builds up the story around that. Eva isn't a writer first, she's an artist.
My uni professors would have told her that, that's the wrong way to make a story too (I suspect it's also why GGGB's story fizzled out near the ending chapters), but I think creators should only really limit their methods in accordance with their experience and mood. GGGB also showed that Eva knew how to bring the different threads together, even if they were less sophisticated compared to ORS.
- Dec 15, 2020
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I would argue that it is, without necessarily wishing to imply that doing it that way is wrong.
I think the real issue that Eva is facing isn't that her way of creation doesn't work any more, but rather that the scale of her product has grown bigger than what one person can reliably output casually (at least within the time frame that she is used to keeping). A story is about more than stitched-together instances after all, so I think it's sensible to make a planned overview of where you want your story to go and what elements are essential at some point.
I see myself as a writer first for example so while I'd start a story like this in a similar way, with some concepts I want to bring together somehow, I don't think I would formulate them fully before I had an idea of how the wider narrative is supposed to work first. Eva's way of working seems sort of uncompromising to me, and I'm not saying that as a point of criticism. It's just that, now she works with an external colourist for her art, there is very little she can do to change scenes if her story structure proves complicated to fit it all into, except scrap it or reuse it later.
The thing is, Eva isn't a single creator any more, for better or for worse she's a games developer that is putting together many elements, some of which aren't only hers to create, so I think it is sensible that she realise now that her old work-ethic doesn't work completely any more. I think Eva's real issue is that she's passed from being a lone creator to being something closer to a projects manager and she has to learn to cope with that, that takes revising your writing structure too.
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- Apr 4, 2019
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In Germany it ist. Because the fighting could become very bloody, the german goverment (USK) had square enix make a not so brutal version. And thats why we dont have sleeping dogs dlcs in germany, because sqaure enix to to lazy to make them compatible with our laws.
And I dont think something like that will ever happen to any game on this side. And I am very glad about it.
Ok, Eva, we understand you. But we need to know release date. Give us a fucking date.
- Dec 4, 2017
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When it's ready.
- May 13, 2018
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