VN Ren'Py Our Red String [Ch.13.2 Full] [Eva Kiss]

[BloodyMares]

You'd also have to put walkthrough section in that as well then. Wouldn't there be some legality issues esp. GGGB drugs and murder stuff?

Yeah, I had plans for a walkthrough section for the wiki as well. I don't think fictional murder or drugs is a problem. Assassin's Creed and GTA have fandom pages, and it's all about killing or drugs. Rape or incest on the other hand... That's I'm unsure about. But then again, there's Game of Thrones wiki as well...That's what I'd like to know from the more experienced folks.

 

[jduk]

Ffs with all the censorship. It's a fictional visual novel, as far as I am concerned it can have whatever the creator wants inside of it(murder,drugs,rape,incest and everything immoral or outlawed or dodgy issue).

 

[jduk]

I am sure Eva is trying her best. But in regards to having more support and becoming slower, it's normal if you think about it.
If you just open a shop, you try your best to lure people in, even pricing products so low you make zero/negative profit,
when you become established though, you become pricing products more profit oriented, the more known/established you are,
the more profit margin you have.

 

[BloodyMares]

I'm sorry but how come every dev when is reaching a certain amount of support is becoming even slower with the releases instead of becoming faster, it's a freaking pattern here...

So pretty much will have the same content in ch 7 but with a longer period of time waiting...

1) Are you a patron? If not, why are you complaining? You get to play for free.

2) This is the game with multiple branches. Developed by a single person. I assume you don't understand about the development and coding for multiple story branches, and how much time it takes to account for every branch and outcome, and pace it out so everyone gets some type of content instead of just one character having a scene. It was easy to release first 3 Chapters, because they were mostly linear, with a few small branches. Now, after Chapter 6, you have different starting points. Basically, now the game is as complex, as GGGB was when it reached v0.20.

3) What would you prefer? To have a decent update with lots of content once a few months or a very short 5-min long "update" that only has 2 scenes at most but released each month? It's a difficult choice for the dev, and she decided to focus on the quality. When she was developing GGGB and was releasing each update monthly, everyone complained that the updates were too short, or focused only on one path...

 

[Cicica]

1) Are you a patron? If not, why are you complaining? You get to play for free.

2) This is the game with multiple branches. Developed by a single person. I assume you don't understand about the development and coding for multiple story branches, and how much time it takes to account for every branch and outcome, and pace it out so everyone gets some type of content instead of just one character having a scene. It was easy to release first 3 Chapters, because they were mostly linear, with slight branches. Now, after Chapter 6, you have different starting points. Basically, now the game is as complex, as GGGB was when it reached v0.20.

3) What would you prefer? To have a decent update with lots of content once a few months or a very short 5-min long "update" that only has 2 scenes at most but released each month? It's a difficult choice for the dev, and she decided to focus on the quality. When she was developing GGGB and was releasing each update monthly, everyone complained that the updates were too short, or focused only on one path...

I'll have to agree on this one. The story is already very complex so she needs to check everything multiple times to make sure everything is right, choice based and storyline.
Then again I'd much rather wait a little longer for a quality update that doesn't mess things up.
And ultimately, I'm very grateful that I can play this for free, since I can't afford to pledge right now

 

[Brickman]

1) Are you a patron? If not, why are you complaining? You get to play for free.

2) This is the game with multiple branches. Developed by a single person. I assume you don't understand about the development and coding for multiple story branches, and how much time it takes to account for every branch and outcome, and pace it out so everyone gets some type of content instead of just one character having a scene. It was easy to release first 3 Chapters, because they were mostly linear, with a few small branches. Now, after Chapter 6, you have different starting points. Basically, now the game is as complex, as GGGB was when it reached v0.20.

3) What would you prefer? To have a decent update with lots of content once a few months or a very short 5-min long "update" that only has 2 scenes at most but released each month? It's a difficult choice for the dev, and she decided to focus on the quality. When she was developing GGGB and was releasing each update monthly, everyone complained that the updates were too short, or focused only on one path...

Spoken absolute truth man

 

[portrapoodle]

She just said that ch 7 will pretty much be the same size as ch 6 so where is the more content for more time?!

In your opinion, how long did chapter 6 take to be released. I work it out as being from October 19th to December 12th.
The issue is that, firstly, she probably took a break for Christmas. Everyone does this. Yes, it slows everyone's work down over the holidays. If Eva worked in an office would you berate her for not working as hard over Chritmas? Furthermore, she probably did some work on Chapter 6 before redoing the whole first five chapters of the game (September to later October), so even if it takes a couple weeks more (all that I expect) it would still take roughly the same time as chapter 6

 

[Nifferman]

... and for your curiosity i did was her patreon for a few times when i could afford to be and when she was steady in her releases...

Yeah i would prefer that and i think she really did a very good job releasing quality and quantity before she was influenced ( this is my opinion) to slow down the releases...

Why tf are you so agressive?!
She just said that ch 7 will pretty much be the same size as ch 6 so where is the more content for more time?!

She did state a while back that it took her a bit more time than usual cuz of Christmas and New year

 

[portrapoodle]

i never said anythig about ch 6 tho

you did say something about chapter 6. You replied this to someone comparing chapter 6 to chapter 7

So pretty much will have the same content in ch 7 but with a longer period of time waiting...

 

[a-pollo]

ike she said on her patreon post ch 7 will pretty much be the same size or a bit bigger than ch7...

Don't forget that every new chapter have to deal with the branch complexity added in the previous ones piling up so it's not as linear as "same quantity fo content" = "same time to write and draw".

I quote BloodyMares on everything but I get it can be frustrating waiting so long for each chapter and previous Patreon's project showed such disrespect to the supporter that you surely have ground to be worryied about. But I don't think Eva could be mixed in those scenarios: she had proven to be trustworthy so far and she always explained what she had to deal with when a deadline was pushed forward. As long as she deliver the same great content we're used to I can't complain about it.

The only way to let her deliver more content quickly would probably be share the writing process with others, at least coding dialogues, but I'm not really a fan of such a scenario.

 

[Tallyhoe]

I'm sorry but how come every dev when is reaching a certain amount of support is becoming even slower with the releases instead of becoming faster, it's a freaking pattern here...

So pretty much will have the same content in ch 7 but with a longer period of time waiting...

If you think the same amount of content means the same time needed for development you are probably mistaken.
When she said "same amount" I think she meant around the same words count but should that mean the same amount of time needed? No, this is the game of branching choices and expanding stories. You need to account for every possible scenarios from every chapters so far with how the player play their game and if you don't tie them all up there's gonna be plot holes and bugfest and from what you are saying I'm sure you're gonna be the one complaining when that happens.

Eva is one of the most consistent developer out there. She started this game in what, last year? Look how far we are. Try write a 10k word story. Not even account for the ever expanding possiblities each chapters offer. It's hard. A LOT and I mean a lot of dev that got much more supporters and the last time they released anything substancial was 2-3 years ago. Eva releases every 2-3 months and now you're complaining. This is why we can't have nice thing.

Oh, and yeah I know you probably have your reasons for not supporting her anymore. But if you're playing for free then don't complain, man. You aren't entitled. It's just bad.

 

[BloodyMares]

It just feels ass-backwards to me. If you're thinking that a dev began to slack off, or is milking the patrons or whatever, why not complain about it when you're a patron directly on her Patreon? Or at least on Discord. Let her know that you don't feel like you get your money's worth. Somewhere the dev can actually see and address (or ignore) the complaint. As it is, everyone for some reason chooses to complain here, on a pirate site, where they don't even have to pay to play the game while not a single person on her Patreon says anything negative about this, encouraging her to take her time and release the update "when it's ready".

 

[ennead]

Well see imo we can't have nice things anymore and this "when it's ready" bs of you guys who are simping so hard (and i'm sry to say this)

A classic way to devaluate opinions different from yours.

I'm courios how many of you can take in their real life jobs this "when it's ready" thing from their bosses...

I'm a game designer, and my managers and lead are always asking me for deadlines, with me sometimes saying the very same "can't specify now" for complex features. And I never develop updates by only myself, there are always a lot of people (few dozens) involved, and even with that we don't always cut it in time. We rarely promise specific dates to our players, however our development time directly influences the monetization we can get out of the game.

That said, there were a lot of times when I wouldn't be able to cut my work ready for the upcoming update, and the features assigned to me were postponed till next ones. Not because I'm lazy, but because quality takes time, and you have to prioritize either speed of development or quality. It's not a binary choice, sure, but you pick where do you draw the line.

I wasn't complaining i was just pointing out a pattern which i'm sure a lot of you notice (you just confirmed my point) it with them devs when their support increase the release speed decreases...

The funny thing is, that with dev's support being increased, there would be complains in both cases.
1. A dev develops with the same speed, people will complain that that dev now have more money but the quality is still the same amateurish shit.
2. A dev opts for increased quality, which takes time, and now people will complain that that dev has put themselves on a golden pedestal like they are some kind of gods

Even if we're talking about more people involved in the making of the game, it's not quite as simple as "more people means faster and better". Now you have more people for more complex features which will take more time than when you were working on those features alone by yourself, and now the feature you are primary responsible for also takes more time. And you need to coordinate those people and verify their work too, which also takes time.

The harsh truth is that gamedev is hard, harder than it looks, there are much more than sees the eye to it, even if it's a visual novella.

 

[DrackDrap]

I'm courios how many of you can take in their real life jobs this "when it's ready" thing from their bosses...

I mean when someone is their own boss like Eva Kiss is, this point is extremely redundant.

Dude please don't make me laugh yeah it's hard when you at beginning but when you do this for a living for years it's just like any other job, i bet she could do this with her eyes closed...

 

[jduk]

John you have to take into account that the more the story progresses the more difficult it is to expand it. Think of it like a tree spreading it's branches. Also I think it's useful for a dev or anyone in general to be pressured for deadlines, as far as it is gentle and not too harsh/demanding for the job required.

 

[Tallyhoe]

Well see imo we can't have nice things anymore and this "when it's ready" bs of you guys who are simping so hard (and i'm sry to say this) some devs and put them on a golden pedestal like they are some kind of gods and of course a lot of them then take this for granted and think they can do whatever they want cuz afterall nothing can happen to them regarding patron count...
I'm courios how many of you can take in their real life jobs this "when it's ready" thing from their bosses...

Well what a coincidence, i work in the same industry tho i'm a programmer and i swear i could never afford to say this "when it's ready" thing to my team leader not me nor my colleagues and in theory we in IT have the more let's say freedom when it comes to work, now let's imagine other jobs like firefighters, medics, teachers the cleaning leady in a hotel etc imagine those saying "when it's ready"...

Those are just such a bad analogy. Why would 'when it's ready' applied to those situations lol. You are on salary and you are required to do stuff you boss tell you to complete. Eva is on Patreon. Creators show you what they are doing, and mosty they give something back as a reward for you to support them. If you like what they are doing then feel free to support. If you don't like it then stop supporting them. Easy. And the reward for each Patreon tier is specific. Some gives it monthly. Some give them out per term. Her patreon tier never said anything time specific. She say you will have access to the release respective to your tiers and that's it. If it says one release per month and she doesn't deliever that's another story.

Firefighters Medics Teachers Cleaning Lady?? Really? another lol. I don't even know how to respond to that. We're talking about game developing and creating stuff here, man. I don't know how you go to that.

Also, if you are gonna point out how she increases time with increased support, then let's talk numbers.
She had been sitting at 1700 ish patrons since she finished GGGB and started ORS for the entire 2020. How is that an increased support? The number 2000 you see now just came from the start of this year.
JANUARY 12th she was at 1800.
It's been 10 days that she's gained 200 more.
How do you allocate resources in that time period. Find new writer? Find new coder? Find new artist?
and release new chapter at the same time in 10 days? She has used resoures even before this 2000 patrons to outsource to colour artist, background artist, music to improve the quality of the game and it shows.

New coder to help, maybe? New artist for main pictures,maybe? But these things take time to recruit and I don't think she wants to wasting her time delay even more for this release. Maybe in the future chapter or future game we'll see. But it's been 12 days since she gained 200 more patrons or 'more money' as you called it lol

 

[jamdan]

This whole discussion is pointless. She has already hired at least 2 helpers, somebody to do the coloring and a company to create the environments. Probably an animator too, if I recall. All of that was posted on recent patreon posts.

This "when it's ready" stuff is even more pointless. She is self employed, every update for every game on this site is done "when it's ready" as everyone who makes these games are self employed, or do it for a hobby. Some games take half a year until it's ready. Some games are weekly or monthly. Most games, including this one, is every 2-3 months. We're still in that timeframe since the last update. It's been 50 days, so it isn't even 2 months in so far.

Just noticed the guy ranting made his account yesterday. Did you make an account on here specifically to complain? Or since you are new you're just vastly uninformed? Both?

 

[unocrus]

You know a game is good when you're waiting on the next update like an addict craving another hit.

 

[dontcarewhateverno]

Anyone know if it's possible for Lena to bang the bouncer? Question from one of those damn dirty IR fetishists who still doesn't like the idea of cheating with or fetishising S/O's friends. Jeremy is just not an appealing option for me in play-throughs, for that reason. A whole lot better with some lewd, aggressive stranger, imo. Personality-wise, he also doesn't fit the "type".

 

[scor099]

I'm sorry but how come every dev when is reaching a certain amount of support is becoming even slower with the releases instead of becoming faster, it's a freaking pattern here...

So pretty much will have the same content in ch 7 but with a longer period of time waiting...

unless you're one of her current patrons you don't get to criticize her, at least not here so just shut up and play for free.

if you have something to say to her you can become a patron and say whatever you want in her page so she can actually see what you're complaining about and respond to your concerns.

we're all frustrated and want the new update to drop as soon as possible but all we can do is wait.