VN Ren'Py Our Red String [Ch.14.1.4 Beta] [Eva Kiss]

[Noonwraith]

Yep, I don't think Eva Kiss knows anything about cuckolding.

Go back to the BaDIK thread Joshy, or EvaKiss will add a new character called Maya and Ian will have the option to cuck her boyfriend Josh.

 

[DaLuke2]

the bj scene of the Alison/Jeremy/Ian 3sum:

 

[Yellowie The Goldie]

I respectfully disagree and I will explain why:

I do not dislike the principle of a sluth path, not at all. Actually, the slut path was my main playthrough until the club blowjob scene in Chapter 10.

I thought the first ONS with Mike was hot, I thought Lena waking up Jeremy was hot, I thought cheating on Ian with Axel the first time was hot, damn, I even thought sex with Robert after the date with Ian was hot.

To me, there was a turning point on the slut path, one sentence announcing the downfall and EK losing her shit on the slut path, during the toilets blowjob to Mark:

"One more seed I had conquered".

Damn, this was the most ridiculous line in the history of AVNs - until the "gimme ur alpha cock" of the Jack scene that is.

Since then, the slut path has been increasingly boring and mediocre. I wish it had not been. It is.

That said, I do agree that it is poorly written only in absolute terms, but that when you compare it to not just 95% but 99,9% of other AVNs it is still superior.

I think it's meant to come across as cringy because the path that Lena is undertaking is just not something she would genuinely do. If you look back to Ashley in the GGGB game, you'll equally find moments of cringe and second hand embarrassment. The point is that it shows the character has degraded themselves to such an extent that they end up being beyond saving.

That moment is basically Lena admitting to the players that she's gone beyond the point of no return, she's more and more like Ivy and is beginning to adopt even Ivy's cringy sex moments.

That's how I see it, and it's fair if people call me a 'bad story' defender...But I feel like it makes sense from that point.

Not saying anything about repetitive art though. It makes sense why it would be, even if I don't like it. (It's not done using the typical RenPy models, it's art that has to be drawn and commissioned: way more expensive and way more time spent doing it.)

 

[unocrus]

Alright, Trigger Warning for those of you who might melt at the sight of a male ass!

Check out the likes on this post in the FanArt thread.

It's Not Gay Sex btw

Someone mentioned a yandere path for Loiuse and I would be 100% on board with it. Completely disrespecting her and triggering a CG like that as chad Ian during their hookup then rudely dropping her on the phone afterwards would be the perfect starting point.

 

[stuffygames]

Not saying anything about repetitive art though. It makes sense why it would be, even if I don't like it. (It's not done using the typical RenPy models, it's art that has to be drawn and commissioned: way more expensive and way more time spent doing it.)

From the looks of the FanArt thread, it might be cheaper to hire one of the better artists..? wordsmiths..? Promptsmiths (there we go) to redo the whole game, and go from there. There are a couple who have very consistent art for this game, and it would be possible to get a lot more images than how it is being done now. Plus the speed at which it could be done ofc. I know it's been mentioned and argued about before, we might be approaching the point where a good promptsmith can actually help improve a game rather than just leeching off of it's success (cindy's diaryia).

I like the art style a lot, and that can't be taken away from EK, there are a lot of imitators since GGGB.

 

[dolfe67]

The art style is quite good, mainly thanks to the colorist (big improvment from the flat art style of GGGB). But the drawing has a lot of flaws in the CG (the sprites are good), mostly in the faces but also sometimes the positions and proportions of legs/arms/hands.

In the next project using AI would be nice for more diversity in the scenes, the fan art thread has some nice examples. Maybe also improve the speed of dev, not sure if the bottleneck is the art or the writing.

 

[stuffygames]

The art style is quite good, mainly thanks to the colorist (big improvment from the flat art style of GGGB). But the drawing has a lot of flaws in the CG (the sprites are good), mostly in the faces but also sometimes the positions and proportions of legs/arms/hands.

In the next project using AI would be nice for more diversity in the scenes, the fan art thread has some nice examples. Maybe also improve the speed of dev, not sure if the bottleneck is the art or the writing.

Agreed.

I think the main bottlenecks are the coding (paths and variations), then the writing (paths and variations), art not as much. If there was A LOT more art, then it might be an issue, which is why good consistent AI art would be a welcome addition to the whole process.

I'm not a fan of AI in general, good artists are hard to come by and AI only makes them more scarce. Improving the art for something like this, where the dev is not an artist by trade is a good example where it could be useful.

 

[Yellowie The Goldie]

Agreed.

I think the main bottlenecks are the coding (paths and variations), then the writing (paths and variations), art not as much. If there was A LOT more art, then it might be an issue, which is why good consistent AI art would be a welcome addition to the whole process.

I'm not a fan of AI in general, good artists are hard to come by and AI only makes them more scarce. Improving the art for something like this, where the dev is not an artist by trade is a good example where it could be useful.

Tbf, you can use AI to add to the art and not replace art all together.

You know how there's tools for developers to use where they allow the AI to 'uplift' textures? Well, I imagine something similar can be done with art. I am not too informed on the ins and hows, but I know there's a way.

 

[stuffygames]

Tbf, you can use AI to add to the art and not replace art all together.

You know how there's tools for developers to use where they allow the AI to 'uplift' textures? Well, I imagine something similar can be done with art. I am not too informed on the ins and hows, but I know there's a way.

True, and I'm not sure either. I know you can ask an AI to tell you how to do something in almost any well known software, and even ask it to do it for you if it has access, which is how we all get less intelligent in the end I think.

The ones posting in the FanArt thread are taking art from the game as a start and refining it, then creating new images from that set of instructions. So not much of a leap to just keep doing that .

 

[ffive]

(there we go) to redo the whole game, and go from there.

JFC don't even joke about that. It's like year+ of Stan/Billy remakes didn't teach people anything, smh.

I'd also be wary to use the fanart thread as example of some, "vast, untapped possibilities for super-fast art generation". Keep in mind it's effectively a collective result of thousand monkeys from all over the intrawebs banging on thousand AI typerwriters so to speak, and yet those results are not only not many, but they're with very few exceptions just some generic images of a (semi) naked woman done roughly in ORS style and somewhat resembling the game's cast, which NGL, just blend together after a page or two of them. That one picture EK liked stands out because unlike pretty much all of them it's about something more than "here's a girl, standing".

 

[stuffygames]

JFC don't even joke about that. It's like year+ of Stan/Billy remakes didn't teach people anything, smh.

I'd also be wary to use the fanart thread as example of some, "vast, untapped possibilities for super-fast art generation". Keep in mind it's effectively a collective result of thousand monkeys from all over the intrawebs banging on thousand AI typerwriters so to speak, and yet those results are not only not many, but they're with very few exceptions just some generic images of a (semi) naked woman done roughly in ORS style and somewhat resembling the game's cast, which NGL, just blend together after a page or two of them. That one picture EK liked stands out because unlike pretty much all of them it's about something more than "here's a girl, standing".

Redoing the whole game was serious not serious. You couldn't just start using AI art in the current game, it would change too drastically. A future game in EK's style made with imperfect AI art would be more consistent and faster to make, probably less stressful too.

I like the art in ORS, a lot could look better and be more consistent, but it does give it charm. The last update seems to have quite a few changes to Lena's look in a lot of the images, not the first time it has happened. It would be interesting that if Lena chose the drugs throughout the game, and smoked, and was a super slut, that she might start looking more haggard deeper into the game. The opposite on the other end where she is a monogamus clean girl. Similar to how Ian gets a few more lines on his mid section and arms if he goes to the gym a lot, but more evident. To me in the last update Lena looks a bit worn out in the new images.

I know you have seen what a couple in the FanArt thread can do on their own, and they aren't spending days doing it. They have been working on it for awhile at this point, and are getting very consistent images now. They can drop an image described to them in minutes. Compare to EK including 30 to 50 non-sprite images (a wild guess that seems close to me) in an update, I would guess a few of days of generating and tweaking images to suit would result in a lot more than that. They wouldn't even have to come up with the scene themselves, so less thinking more prompting.

The good images (there are some not so flattering ones) in the that thread are idealized versions of the current art, smooth and perfect, because that's what the AI knows, the ideal look the masses want. They could be made to not look so perfect, but telling an AI to make something not look as nice can be horrifying (personal experience). It knows what people want, and when you try to tell it that something is too perfect, it struggles with making it less so. The plethora of AI Slop games that pop up show what the base AI is good at, perfect idealized images in a couple of pretty specific styles. 3d rendered games are idealized too, since players want a more perfect world to play in, not the real world. When a dev makes a skin for a model that is not perfect they get dinged for it being ugly.

Personally I would take the overly smooth and perfect, but consistent art over the charming and inconsistent art. Purely because going from one scene to the next when the characters look slightly different can break the storytelling a little. Consistency in AI art takes awhile to get, but someone who isn't a full time or talented artist may never be able to draw consistent characters.

 

[ffive]

I know you have seen what a couple in the FanArt thread can do on their own, and they aren't spending days doing it. They have been working on it for awhile at this point, and are getting very consistent images now. They can drop an image described to them in minutes. Compare to EK including 30 to 50 non-sprite images (a wild guess that seems close to me) in an update, I would guess a few of days of generating and tweaking images to suit would result in a lot more than that. They wouldn't even have to come up with the scene themselves, so less thinking more prompting.

I think you're being way too optimistic here, if you think AI is some sort of magical ticket to produce good images (ones that actually match what the author wants, as opposed to AI getting a prompt and paining whatever, that has little to do with what the prompt asked for) in manner of minutes and whole updates worth of them in just a few days.

You only need to take a look at some of the AI-based games (the ones that aren't just the latest NTR phone game cash grabs with a dozen images in 0.1 release and "please support my Patreon if you want more") and how it can still takes them multiple months to get an update out, that's nowhere near the level of complexity ORS gives, so it's not like they particularly struggle with scripting and writing. This is often combined with complaining/excuses how the generation is actually hard and won't people just stop bitching the next update was delayed for the third time, already.

 

[scatbordviking]

anybody recommend other 2dcg games with girls who look similar to Emma?

 

[stuffygames]

I think you're being way too optimistic here, if you think AI is some sort of magical ticket to produce good images (ones that actually match what the author wants, as opposed to AI getting a prompt and paining whatever, that has little to do with what the prompt asked for) in manner of minutes and whole updates worth of them in just a few days.

You only need to take a look at some of the AI-based games (the ones that aren't just the latest NTR phone game cash grabs with a dozen images in 0.1 release and "please support my Patreon if you want more") and how it can still takes them multiple months to get an update out, that's nowhere near the level of complexity ORS gives, so it's not like they particularly struggle with scripting and writing. This is often combined with complaining/excuses how the generation is actually hard and won't people just stop bitching the next update was delayed for the third time, already.

I think a couple of the people in that thread have put in the work on at least the female characters to get them consistent, creating a scene on par with what is already in ORS wouldn't be hard, or very time consuming for someone who already has the experience with it. I didn't imply it was a cure all, or everyone should adopt it. I've watched the progress of that thread for more than a year, and the AI only recently got to the level I could support it as an alternative.

Like anything, learning to create AI images to fulfill what you want takes time, the people adopting it for other games that aren't just cash grabs are in the learning curve, along with coding and writing. It might take them a bit to get up to speed. I don't think there are many professional developers making these games, and few do it as their only source of income. Delays, excuses, burnout, it happens all the time and games get abandonded. People clamoring for more more more ends up being too stressful for some.

I don't like AI as a whole, it's creepy at a minimum in most applications, but for something like ORS or something in the future, it could be a big plus for someone who has already admitted they are not an artist, and a plus for the players who could enjoy more images/scenes. It feels to me you are against it at all costs, I'm only pointing out how it could be useful, not trying to convince anyone it's the only way forward. If I said Stan should become the MC because he is more manly than Ian I could understand you defending not changing a thing with this much enthusiasm . AI art isn't gonna be in ORS, the look that has been developed in the FanArt thread is too nice, it would be too big a change, and I don't want that much of a change. But I don't want to keep arguing about what is possible, when niether of us know exactly how it would pan out.

 

[Lolicon Kami]

For Ian MMA fight, is it better to have mastered grappling or striking, or to have a balance between the two? I've noticed that if I only focus on grappling, then in the fight Ian literally can't do anything standing up lol

Master striking before the MMA match, and then win the MMA match with a submission technique. This ensures that after the match, you have mastered both (winning MMA match gives you enough submission skill points that's equivalent to choosing the "master submission" option).

 

[sluttyjackie]

How can u get the threesome with Lena and Holly at the beach???

 

[Blurpee69]

For Ian MMA fight, is it better to have mastered grappling or striking, or to have a balance between the two? I've noticed that if I only focus on grappling, then in the fight Ian literally can't do anything standing up lol

Master striking before the MMA match, and then win the MMA match with a submission technique. This ensures that after the match, you have mastered both (winning MMA match gives you enough submission skill points that's equivalent to choosing the "master submission" option).

I mean... varpep has an entire written guide for the fights and for how to master both Striking and Grappling. Why not just use it?

https://f95zone.to/threads/our-red-string-ch-14-1-3-beta-eva-kiss.48813/post-14497061

 

[GibboBtw]

Anybody ever had a looping permanent dialogue timer after this dialogue with Ian and bad Jess?

Spoiler

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He just keeps going...I mean, he's even now just showing up in the next scene where I'm controlling Lena and SAYING THE SAME SHIT.

Spoiler: WTF IS THIS

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Little help? Anybody...

 

[stuffygames]

Never seen that, but I usually turn off the timed choices in the options, might try that and see if it cleans that up.

 

[Tierra_Azul]

Anybody ever had a looping permanent dialogue timer after this dialogue with Ian and bad Jess?

Little help? Anybody...

Did you save a game in alpha, then continue in the beta version? Bugs like this often occur when loading a alpha save in a beta or final (or beta to final). I always save in final versions to reduce risks of gamebreaking/annoying bugs.