But there are certain events in which Rowan could not escape entirely from consequences, like Andras is Stressed Event, in which you can deny him but there are conditions that must be approved by roll dice depending on status, this event annoys a lot because tend to appear early when Rowan sucks a hell lot the so call War Hero who killed Da Twins Daddy while being lv1, so, Andras can do a visit to Alexia if the dice roll fail in success (and if this appear early you'll fail for sure), of course, she can say no to Andras, but breaks hentai logic and moreover, the very same logic of that world in the overall narrative, as many are slaughtered, raped and enslaved, they can deny as much they want to their captors...
Ren'Py Seeds of Chaos [v0.4.07] [Vénus Noire]
You can challenge him in spar match too though to prevent that, but I do agree its bit weird that he beat their daddy but can't with them. To be fair though he did have help when it came too their father. Also Jeerza does deny him magic weapons and items cuz he went half way through her neck.
I think its a just matter of bad convieant hand writing to push out the plot points with the sex scenes
Maybe theyll fix it where twins remind him he had help and had magic items to help beat their father, but you seem to lack or run dry for a fair chance against them due to being poor. Asking him questions that makes him question himself.
If I'm not mistaken about the events in favor of Jazera, if we ask for gold she even comments that Rowan fought the demon king without any magical item, but it could have been changed or I'm remembering the event wrong but I think having a magical item wouldn't fit the character (a commoner who rose to the level of hero without the help of magic, name or money being despised by almost everyone)
- May 1, 2021
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Form my understanding it was two heroes that did the actual deed of defeating the the old demon king (it been a while since I played but believe it was the high priestess and some incredibly powerful warrior guy). The rest of the the heroes were there primarily to make sure those two reached him and to make sure none of the demon forces were able to interfere.
Rowan was a good fighter but far from the best. During the war Rowan's tactical achievements were his claim to fame, so in my head canon he was primarily included with the heroes as a field tactician to help them adjust the plan as needed. So in my mind it make perfect sense that he would have a hard time standing up to Andras (the twin that seems to have inherited the demon king's martial capabilities) in a direct one-on-one fight.
Well, that's something that in the equal way bugs me, because Rowan demonstrated a lack of tactical intelligence sense when he reach Bloodmeen finally searching for his wife, after being denied help by Werden (as if there were no others nobleman who could aid him politically in audience with the ruler of Rastedel, moreover, it was more plausible to go to Raeve Keep looking for aid, as it is more near of Rowan's Home, as he had a past relationship with the nobleman there as educator of his niece, and even she could help in the task or convincing other nobles in what Rowan was declaring, but to no avail, he went alone in an act of desperation, worst, get inside without knowing what to expect (without forget he was there without a plan for escape once Alexia is found), and confront Da Sista even if the player specifically choose to search for Alexia and not confront Da Twins... Another thing is, how Rowan could be so Mastermind Tactician but still look young?, something this guy here noticed:
And as i myself noticed doing a comparison between real ppl who could be in the same social position as Rowan while doing some math of what their ages could be the moment they become nobles from those who were nobles since the beginning...
In relation to what could be the reason for Rowan's flaws from analysis of his doing, this friend was (as far as i remember and if i'm not mistaken or forgetting somebody else) the beginning of the theory:
But i began taking it seriously after this comment...
I just elaborated more around that idea pages ago... Just search "Mastermind Tactician" (which i repeated a lot lol)
Your commend made me lose a lot of hope for this game. The fact that there are a lot of people pointing our plot holes yet they are not being filed makes my aversion for this game grow.Well, that's something that in the equal way bugs me, because Rowan demonstrated a lack of tactical intelligence sense when he reach Bloodmeen finally searching for his wife, after being denied help by Werden (as if there were no others nobleman who could aid him politically in audience with the ruler of Rastedel, moreover, it was more plausible to go to Raeve Keep looking for aid, as it is more near of Rowan's Home, as he had a past relationship with the nobleman there as educator of his niece, and even she could help in the task or convincing other nobles in what Rowan was declaring, but to no avail, he went alone in an act of desperation, worst, get inside without knowing what to expect (without forget he was there without a plan for escape once Alexia is found), and confront Da Sista even if the player specifically choose to search for Alexia and not confront Da Twins... Another thing is, how Rowan could be so Mastermind Tactician but still look young?, something this guy here noticed:
And as i myself noticed doing a comparison between real ppl who could be in the same social position as Rowan while doing some math of what their ages could be the moment they become nobles from those who were nobles since the beginning...
In relation to what could be the reason for Rowan's flaws from analysis of his doing, this friend was (as far as i remember and if i'm not mistaken or forgetting somebody else) the beginning of the theory:
But i began taking it seriously after this comment...
I just elaborated more around that idea pages ago... Just search "Mastermind Tactician" (which i repeated a lot lol)
Which is sad it has potential.
Well, in defense of this game and Venus Noire Team, no game is perfect and by definition will never satisfy all audiences, even those who are it's fan base, but because of that it doesn't need to be, the reason is as you stated, the potential it have, and this game believe it or not doesn't have all it's "Lore" developed no less all the story has been shown yet, this is just the first part of the overall story and we don't know if this team after ending this saga will continue developing the "Lore" of this universe, we must remember that the Father of Modern Mythology J.R.R. Tolkien began writing in the back of a blank test paper leave by one of his students, so, you can love things with flaws as much as you can love persons with them, it's up to everyone but it doesn't mean that you could not enjoy the story, the world building, how the characters related each other, the same can be for your family, boy/girl+friend, overall friends and companions from classmate or work, the thing is, how much you like it in aside to the flaws you see on them, if the balance weight more in the liking you stay, if not you leave and leave them be as they are, as many of us recommend to leave ppl claiming how bad the game is or how milking a dev can be, i like this game even after seeing all the things i said before, that's the reason i maintain here yet, even after Rein called me one of his "Shitlords" i love him too, because of him and his team this game came to be.
don't give up on the game and it's a very good game
The fact that people are theorizing already shows that they care and want to know more about the story because no one would theorize about something they don't like
The fact that people are theorizing already shows that they care and want to know more about the story because no one would theorize about something they don't like
I don't think Rowan is a Mastermind, I see him more as someone who fails a lot but keeps moving forward Rowan isn't the best at combat, he didn't have magic or many friends but he still went to fight the demon king
This is demonstrated when he partially resisted Andras' spell, fought for months without detours to reach the twins' castle and even when captured he tried to escape several times.
I don't see him as someone who achieved the rank of hero because he had an advantage that others didn't have, I see him as someone who achieved the rank of hero despite his disadvantages through sheer resistance, several failures and several other attempts (and of course this is Just my opinion, feel free to disagree)
This is demonstrated when he partially resisted Andras' spell, fought for months without detours to reach the twins' castle and even when captured he tried to escape several times.
I don't see him as someone who achieved the rank of hero because he had an advantage that others didn't have, I see him as someone who achieved the rank of hero despite his disadvantages through sheer resistance, several failures and several other attempts (and of course this is Just my opinion, feel free to disagree)
- Apr 26, 2021
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Well, that's something that in the equal way bugs me, because Rowan demonstrated a lack of tactical intelligence sense when he reach Bloodmeen finally searching for his wife, after being denied help by Werden (as if there were no others nobleman who could aid him politically in audience with the ruler of Rastedel, moreover, it was more plausible to go to Raeve Keep looking for aid, as it is more near of Rowan's Home, as he had a past relationship with the nobleman there as educator of his niece, and even she could help in the task or convincing other nobles in what Rowan was declaring, but to no avail, he went alone in an act of desperation, worst, get inside without knowing what to expect (without forget he was there without a plan for escape once Alexia is found), and confront Da Sista even if the player specifically choose to search for Alexia and not confront Da Twins... Another thing is, how Rowan could be so Mastermind Tactician but still look young?, something this guy here noticed:
And as i myself noticed doing a comparison between real ppl who could be in the same social position as Rowan while doing some math of what their ages could be the moment they become nobles from those who were nobles since the beginning...
In relation to what could be the reason for Rowan's flaws from analysis of his doing, this friend was (as far as i remember and if i'm not mistaken or forgetting somebody else) the beginning of the theory:
But i began taking it seriously after this comment...
I just elaborated more around that idea pages ago... Just search "Mastermind Tactician" (which i repeated a lot lol)
Deeps cuts man. That was a loooooong time ago. Back when I had legitimate hopium for Rowan.
As for the player hoping for better heroic content / fewer plot holes / Rowan being less of an idiot or more powerful...yeah that was me for a long time, eventually I got so frustrated by it I stopped supporting the game. I do still read parts of it when it releases on steam, but I realized that my hope for what the game could be was realistically not what it was going to be because it is not what it is. If I were you I'd just follow as a lurker and wait for that stuff. If it comes play again, if it doesn't read selectively or just avoid.
Your best bet for that sort of stuff in the current SoC ecosystem is Hooky's Fae plot. Rowan is at least competent in it. The main focus is on an alliance with an Evil Witch or a Big-Gay Anger doggo at this moment- and while those characters might not be favorites for someone wanting to play as a hero, Rowan is at least portrayed as competent in those arcs and shown as having some opportunities. Also, Heartsong content will come eventually.
Rein likes bad guys / people suffering / writing from the POV of the person being corrupted / people losing their morality / sliding into debauchery ect ect. I dunno if he gets or gives a fuck about the good guy zeitgeist. It is generally pretty unexplored, brief, and non-cathartic in his work- though to his credit he does go out of his way to write a few moments like this even if his heart maybe isn't in it. He *does* do a great job with resist content, such as not giving into an aggressor and putting your foot in a subtle way ect. (The most recent Jezera / Rowan content is an example of such resist content.).
Historically Winter's stuff was alright for this. The crown jewel of course being the Liurial plot finale. Hommie hasn't written anything for SoC in over a year though so I wouldn't hold your breath.
LA only writes NTR. Moving on.
The other writers. Well, frankly they seem less involved in the morality of the project's content and either just trying to collect a pay-check or mainly just assigned to writing fuck-plots.
Exaggie is extremely skilled. I liked her stuff when she was writing for the gob plot like a year ago- since then she has just done gay content and I cannot speak to if it feels like it has heroic options or not. I assume most of it is just Rowan servicing the antagonists knob with his various orifices. She is on roster to write gay stuff- that is what she does
.Nyx. Historically they have mainly just written non-substantive sexy fxf cheating-plot stuff for Alexia and Andras x Girl content. Zero heroism or morality involved. They started working with Helenya this last rotation so it is yet to be seen how much heroism / morality / ect will be involved. It is one of the more ethically nuanced and charged plots in the game. There weren't many options for heroism / strength ect in the new version. It did go extra out of its way to capture the sting of what a shit person Rowan was to betray his student though (which is a good thing) on its own- but would be better if you could actually do a damned thing to try to make up for it. Rowan was an annoying weak bitch in both the scene and the lead up. Getting harassed by rape-orcs and doing nothing about it, relying on Jezera to fix all his problems and following her around like puppy dog, cumming too fast, not trying to be there for Helenya or make her first time more special/bearable despite the awful circumstances. In fairness to Nyx, most of this scene's structure was preexistent, so they may have had their hands tied when updating things. The scene they wrote after this one b/t the two was a lot better. Time will only tell. I have faith in Nyx's prose- and while I wasn't very impressed with their first piece of work on the Hel plot, we've yet to see how they can work in a more serious space as an author when they have more freedom- jury is still out.
Wildquill is Wildquill. I liked his work with Cla-min's family despite the massive numbers of typos and some awkward sentences. His other work with the project has been weaker.
As an aside. Nice to see people in the chat talk about plot a bit again instead of just thirst-trapping for their crack pairing / sexual event of choice. SoC chat had gotten super boring there for awhile.
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- May 8, 2017
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Objection, I actually like writing redemption storylines.
- Apr 26, 2021
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Duly noted, we just haven't gotten any of them yet then.
So is there no head writer around which the others focus? That would explain some of the confusion/ breaking flow.Deeps cuts man. That was a loooooong time ago. Back when I had legitimate hopium for Rowan.
As for the player hoping for better heroic content / fewer plot holes / Rowan being less of an idiot or more powerful...yeah that was me for a long time, eventually I got so frustrated by it I stopped supporting the game. I do still read parts of it when it releases on steam, but I realized that my hope for what the game could be was realistically not what it was going to be because it is not what it is. If I were you I'd just follow as a lurker and wait for that stuff. If it comes play again, if it doesn't read selectively or just avoid.
Your best bet for that sort of stuff in the current SoC ecosystem is Hooky's Fae plot. Rowan is at least competent in it. The main focus is on an alliance with an Evil Witch or a Big-Gay Anger doggo at this moment- and while those characters might not be favorites for someone wanting to play as a hero, Rowan is at least portrayed as competent in those arcs and shown as having some opportunities. Also, Heartsong content will come eventually.
Rein likes bad guys / people suffering / writing from the POV of the person being corrupted / people losing their morality / sliding into debauchery ect ect. I dunno if he gets or gives a fuck about the good guy zeitgeist. It is generally pretty unexplored, brief, and non-cathartic in his work- though to his credit he does go out of his way to write a few moments like this even if his heart maybe isn't in it. He *does* do a great job with resist content, such as not giving into an aggressor and putting your foot in a subtle way ect. (The most recent Jezera / Rowan content is an example of such resist content.).
Historically Winter's stuff was alright for this. The crown jewel of course being the Liurial plot finale. Hommie hasn't written anything for SoC in over a year though so I wouldn't hold your breath.
LA only writes NTR. Moving on.
The other writers. Well, frankly they seem less involved in the morality of the project's content and either just trying to collect a pay-check or mainly just assigned to writing fuck-plots.
Exaggie is extremely skilled. I liked her stuff when she was writing for the gob plot like a year ago- since then she has just done gay content and I cannot speak to if it feels like it has heroic options or not. I assume most of it is just Rowan servicing the antagonists knob with his various orifices. She is on roster to write gay stuff- that is what she does
Nyx. Historically they have mainly just written non-substantive sexy fxf cheating-plot stuff for Alexia and Andras x Girl content. Zero heroism or morality involved. They started working with Helenya this last rotation so it is yet to be seen how much heroism / morality / ect will be involved. It is one of the more ethically nuanced and charged plots in the game. There weren't many options for heroism / strength ect in the new version. It did go extra out of its way to capture the sting of what a shit person Rowan was to betray his student though (which is a good thing) on its own- but would be better if you could actually do a damned thing to try to make up for it. Rowan was an annoying weak bitch in both the scene and the lead up. Getting harassed by rape-orcs and doing nothing about it, relying on Jezera to fix all his problems and following her around like puppy dog, cumming too fast, not trying to be there for Helenya or make her first time more special/bearable despite the awful circumstances. In fairness to Nyx, most of this scene's structure was preexistent, so they may have had their hands tied when updating things. The scene they wrote after this one b/t the two was a lot better. Time will only tell. I have faith in Nyx's prose- and while I wasn't very impressed with their first piece of work on the Hel plot, we've yet to see how they can work in a more serious space as an author when they have more freedom- jury is still out.
Wildquill is Wildquill. I liked his work with Cla-min's family despite the massive numbers of typos and some awkward sentences. His other work with the project has been weaker.
As an aside. Nice to see people in the chat talk about plot a bit again instead of just thirst-trapping for their crack pairing / sexual event of choice. SoC chat had gotten super boring there for awhile.
I am going to say something weird so bear with me. I came here for the plot not the sex scenes! I know this being a sex game and all but to me at least the sex scenes are to far apart to fap while playing (and even when I can fap to them its only enough to go 1 or 2 times before its hours of game play again). So I got immersed into the world building and plot a lot more than the breasts and buts. Like I thought this could become a great game that can stand alone without the sex when it just started.
I did not even want the heroic content that much. I wanted for Rowan to be competent. Like I 1st noticed this game when it started back when the capital was just introduced, thinking oh so most everybody besides Rowan is going to be incompetent needing Rowan for everything. Making him struggle under the leadership of the twins trying not to lose the war or have the twins fuck up the world with teleportation (like I set myself into the mindset of a medieval general fighting a teleporting army and shat myself). I thought he would slowly grow a divide between the twins eliminating one of them at the conclusion of the capital event but failing to eliminate the other. Then in that moment when he sees his plan failing due to the incompetence of the nobbles/ priests (be it greed, jealousy or otherwise), he manipulates the other by convincing him that there can only be 1 glorious demonic leader using him till he gains control of the demonic forces and the teleport mirror, then eliminating him and starting to rule as the dark lord to rid the world from incompetence.
I really wanted a slow drop into evil, not the comedy evil from cartons or movies. No I wanted COMPETENCE for him to be the big great bad guy, so great that he can fight the world on his own maybe in the end being defeated by the heroic armies (I wanted him to have a righteous goal but slowly losing himself to evil). But that after he whipped the world into shape, making in possible for the farmers to gain status, riding the orc's from there bad nature, establishing peace between the races. Banishing the influence of the gods and so on.
Like I wanted him to be so great that every living thing be it gods or man needs to unite to stand any chance of beating him. Like there is even an old event of him speaking with the god of death in the game giving me the illusion that it was possible.
LIKE YOU GIVE ME A FUCKING DEATH GOD BUT ONLY FOR 1 EVENT!!!
That was my imagination, like at that time I thought the game had the potential of going down that route, with the NTR and gay paths being when he breaks before the conclusion. So now years later when I came back... Imagine my disappointment when I see sex finding precedence over LORE!!! Like it hurts!
I really want to like the game but the NTR ambience is so strong that I barely finished the game. Feeling suffocated and angry at the end of it.
Plot twist, then we can expect Da Twins redemptive their race? Because as far as we know is...
- Oct 4, 2022
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Yes sir, you just described preferences.The game has 2 sick fetishes that cause people to not try it or leave it early even with the story is good or not
Ntr and... seriously gay
Got anything more useful to add?
I think that makes the most sense cuz how they're viewed by others and explains why Andras likes him more so if he gets the job done more brutish than cunning like Jeerza.
Why when I do Alexia NTR path with Andras I do Rowan x Andras path so that way story wise he wants both of sexually. If I do Andras x Alexia then Jeerza x Rowan I just play off as they fine with one another slutting out for one of the twins. Why I think there should be a threesome RowanxAlexia with Andras and/or Jeerza depending on your choices. Cuz I do agree with monk56 that it does seem that way time to time and then it becomes contradiction with Rowan moments. "Just as slutty as your wife." Just have him take both at same time. "Why wait when you want something, just take it." Andras logic . Andras x Rowan x Alexia/ Alexia pregnated by Andras, Rowan turned on by should definitely be act 1 material cuz of that logic. Just saying . I just find it weird that Andras dont wanna take both of them same time storywise. He'd have lot more power over jeerza and then use Rowan to dominate Jeerza. I think Andras be lot more likeable if he was at least brute witted.Well, that's something that in the equal way bugs me, because Rowan demonstrated a lack of tactical intelligence sense when he reach Bloodmeen finally searching for his wife, after being denied help by Werden (as if there were no others nobleman who could aid him politically in audience with the ruler of Rastedel, moreover, it was more plausible to go to Raeve Keep looking for aid, as it is more near of Rowan's Home, as he had a past relationship with the nobleman there as educator of his niece, and even she could help in the task or convincing other nobles in what Rowan was declaring, but to no avail, he went alone in an act of desperation, worst, get inside without knowing what to expect (without forget he was there without a plan for escape once Alexia is found), and confront Da Sista even if the player specifically choose to search for Alexia and not confront Da Twins... Another thing is, how Rowan could be so Mastermind Tactician but still look young?, something this guy here noticed:
And as i myself noticed doing a comparison between real ppl who could be in the same social position as Rowan while doing some math of what their ages could be the moment they become nobles from those who were nobles since the beginning...
In relation to what could be the reason for Rowan's flaws from analysis of his doing, this friend was (as far as i remember and if i'm not mistaken or forgetting somebody else) the beginning of the theory:
But i began taking it seriously after this comment...
I just elaborated more around that idea pages ago... Just search "Mastermind Tactician" (which i repeated a lot lol)
I like how Andras compares Alexia too Xzatarl something definitely not being shown yet there lol. Why I like the last bit of Xzatarl moments with Alexia and Rowan/ Rowan. It makes you question her motives to be true, or just manipulative, or false. I mean why shouldnt she want to hit on Alexia in 1 on 1s or encourage her to get with Andras and let Alexia control her too watch or join in if Rowan chooses to only let Xzatarl whip him cuz hes beginning to want her?