You really are pathetic you know that? You continue to fixate on the dick growing thing just to make fun of a poster who doesn't agree with you, even though he made a lot of other pertinent points which you refuse to see. There are many things that were said by him which hold water yet you fixate on just this one point because is the easy one to attack and make fun of. For a "developer" that is a poor attitude to have towards the people that play your game. And as far as my comment i don't care what you see in it. It is my opinion and i am free to have one.
Ren'Py Seeds of Chaos [v0.4.13a] [Vénus Noire]
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You're a pirate. I have a proper attitude towards customers. I don't owe anyone else anything but basic human kindness. Which, is why pirates who are polite and helpful get polite and helpful replies.
I actually have the game on steam. I bought it fair and square. So stop assuming shit and learn how to talk to people.
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1. For steam customers, we provide various other forms of feedback, included the discord and steam threads. We encourage customers to use those channels of communication for feedback.
2. As much as developers have a responsibility to be responsive to customer feedback. Fans of a game have a basic responsibility to avoid personal insults directed at developers unprompted. The same style of communication that both you or dick potion guy used would be sufficient to get a reply deleted on discord or steam.
3. So my statement returns to the beginning. Reframe what you say as meaningful feedback, and I will address it with the same seriousness and respect it is delivered.
2. As much as developers have a responsibility to be responsive to customer feedback. Fans of a game have a basic responsibility to avoid personal insults directed at developers unprompted. The same style of communication that both you or dick potion guy used would be sufficient to get a reply deleted on discord or steam.
3. So my statement returns to the beginning. Reframe what you say as meaningful feedback, and I will address it with the same seriousness and respect it is delivered.
I didn't actually insult you until you continue making fun of someone. What i said in my original post was my opinion on Rowan, no insult on you. But you arrogance is something that is so awful it must be responded in kind. If i could get a refund i would just based on your shitty attitude. But alas, i bought the game a long time ago and i can't get a refund from steam anymore. That doesn't mean i have to suffer through your arrogance and just be a good little boy and shut up.
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I took the last line as intended as a personal insult that implied that I was lying about the game and it's contents. Was that not the intention you meant it as?
Not saying you are lying.... under the illusion that this game is something that it isn't. I honestly believe you believe this is not NTR game with cuck for a protagonist. That doesn't make it real.
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Okay, but. I am telling you that I took what you wrote as a personal insult because of the way you wrote it. This is part of the reason why giving more effective feedback is important. It avoids this kind of dynamic.
So, what you should have said instead was:
- I personally feel like within the context of the game, Rowan feels signifgantly more disempowered then you the developers seem to think.
- When I play the game, it seems to me like most scenes feature Rowan being dumped on by some other charachter.
- I feel this is true even with charachters who as supposed to be friends and allies like greyhide.
- I worry that the sheer extent of it is so vast that you won't be able to make any potential revenge by Rowan feel sufficient unless it happens at the start of Act 2 and is very extreme
- Overall, I think this reflects a problem of development philosophy. You seem to believe you're making a corruption game, when I think the real product is an NTR game.
See, the those were the basic points you were trying to get across. But, the way you worded them was much more hostile and accusatory.
I don't entirely disagree and don't entirely agree with the feedback above, and I could have used it as a starting point for a conversation. But, the way you framed it actually got in the way of the intended goal of trying to give me your perspective.
Not that I actually ignored you. A secret is, I actually do note down all of the comments, even the ones I think are rediculous. You'll notice I went out of my way to solicit even the little bit of feedback I did find valueable from rage guy.
But, at the same time, I still want respect as a developer and I think you as someone playing the game would want me to get the feedback from you better.
So, what you should have said instead was:
- I personally feel like within the context of the game, Rowan feels signifgantly more disempowered then you the developers seem to think.
- When I play the game, it seems to me like most scenes feature Rowan being dumped on by some other charachter.
- I feel this is true even with charachters who as supposed to be friends and allies like greyhide.
- I worry that the sheer extent of it is so vast that you won't be able to make any potential revenge by Rowan feel sufficient unless it happens at the start of Act 2 and is very extreme
- Overall, I think this reflects a problem of development philosophy. You seem to believe you're making a corruption game, when I think the real product is an NTR game.
See, the those were the basic points you were trying to get across. But, the way you worded them was much more hostile and accusatory.
I don't entirely disagree and don't entirely agree with the feedback above, and I could have used it as a starting point for a conversation. But, the way you framed it actually got in the way of the intended goal of trying to give me your perspective.
Not that I actually ignored you. A secret is, I actually do note down all of the comments, even the ones I think are rediculous. You'll notice I went out of my way to solicit even the little bit of feedback I did find valueable from rage guy.
But, at the same time, I still want respect as a developer and I think you as someone playing the game would want me to get the feedback from you better.
Well i am just a normal person. Not a writer (this is not a dig at you) and as such I am not a wordsmith. I just told it as i felt it. Until i saw how you made fun of that guy i actually had nothing against you. And no... it doesn't matter that he is a pirate or not. Nobody should treat someone like that.
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Yes, but it was not merely inarticulate but it was disrespectful. And that's why you got a disrespectful reply. But, you've shown willing to listen to reason, so I'm perfectly happy starting from the top. Bygones be bygones.
What is your feedback on the game? What do you like and what do you wish would improve about it?
What is your feedback on the game? What do you like and what do you wish would improve about it?
Like you said. Those are my gripes with the game. For a corruption game with a NTR optional path Rowan feel way to weak and not satisfying as an MC. There just too much dumped on him for it to come out as a credible victor in the non-cuck path of the game. The way i see it is this. He should be powerless in the NTR path, it's a given. He should be dumped upon on the pure path, given he is resisting corruption against the demon twins, but should have the glimers of hope, the making of plans to turn the tables. BUT in the full corruption path he should be a bad ass. The more corrupt he gets the more powerful he gets. At least that's my two cents on it.
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Okay. We're looking at more ways to do stuff about that. I'm not totally happy with the finale of Rastedel, nor am I happy with the Helayna claiming, which was one of the more egregious moments. Me and DM recently went back and allowed players more dominant options at the Dark Elf sequence.
Some of our other future goals include:
- Making the process of gaining allies more satisfying
- Going back over the fall of Raeve Keep and making the Helayna claiming sequence feel more like something Rowan has agency over.
- Going back over the intro and making Rowan's capture potentially more dynamic
- At least one more pass over Rastedel, hopefully giving Rowan a bit more agency there as well.
There is still work to do on the subject, and we don't think it will be 100% enough to please everyone. But, we are taking steps to examine the content and potentially allow players more options of expressing themselves through power.
Though, not by killing/dominating the twins in Act 1. Obviously.
Some of our other future goals include:
- Making the process of gaining allies more satisfying
- Going back over the fall of Raeve Keep and making the Helayna claiming sequence feel more like something Rowan has agency over.
- Going back over the intro and making Rowan's capture potentially more dynamic
- At least one more pass over Rastedel, hopefully giving Rowan a bit more agency there as well.
There is still work to do on the subject, and we don't think it will be 100% enough to please everyone. But, we are taking steps to examine the content and potentially allow players more options of expressing themselves through power.
Though, not by killing/dominating the twins in Act 1. Obviously.
Well, MC is just a little above average man rather than some tactical genius or fighting genius, he's not going to bust a foolproof plan to take down the twins, he's probably looking for ways to gain the upper hand, bit by bit and it starts with the huge orc camp, then Rastedel.
The story not giving an edge to Rowan at this point is sensical to me, for one it sets the tone, and two, we're still at the beginning of the whole story I believe. We have yet to reach the "meat" of the story, so you feeling that MC isn't doing much to win is more connected to the story not progressed enough rather than a mistake in the narration.
The story not giving an edge to Rowan at this point is sensical to me, for one it sets the tone, and two, we're still at the beginning of the whole story I believe. We have yet to reach the "meat" of the story, so you feeling that MC isn't doing much to win is more connected to the story not progressed enough rather than a mistake in the narration.
I agree, of course not... but if that status quo stays the same until let's say 75-80% of the complete game then that thing about being to much to have a satisfying victory over them becomes through. Things must change for him otherwise it will feel like the end of Mass Effect 3. Out of nowhere and not at all satisfying.
But you forget that Rowan is supposed to be this bad ass fighter that killed the twins father, the baddest demon of them all. Not saying he should do that from the begging, he had help, but he should be enough of a monster to start moving things along that path if you choose so.
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Yes, we are taking steps to address the question of Rowan and the Twins. From the start of Act 2, there will be changes to add both narrative and mechanical dimensions to Rowan's increased level of power within the castle. We've been debating how best to properly build up to it. But, we've been having conversations internally about avoiding a Mass Effect 3 style scenario.
Rowan is neither a totally normal dude nor is he an absolute mastermind. He's somewhere in between. He didn't kill Karnas in single combat. He was just one of the leaders responsible for the push to victory. He got the role of hero first and foremost for his role in the seige of Karst, and for his role in the campaign north to Bloodmeen.
I'd describe Rowan as trained and experienced fighter (but still within the realm of normal person, unlike some shounen protagonist), and have a flexible mind and willingness to do dirty deeds. He won't win by fighting with the sword against the twins, but his tactical mind is his most precious weapon to overthrow them.
I wonder if Goblins are going to be a major power in Rowan's winning, they do worship his dirty side after all, and both are like the under dog XD
I wonder if Goblins are going to be a major power in Rowan's winning, they do worship his dirty side after all, and both are like the under dog XD
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If Rowan tried to kill either twin with a sword, he'd just die. It would be brutal. Also, the answer is potentially. Goblins will be a major faction in this game, both because of Cla-Min and because the still inocomplete goblin quest.
I think we all agree that we cannot kill the twins simple and from the begging. But there should be a path in which Rowan fights back and is clear that he fights back. For me i think that the best one is corrupted Rowan path. He fights back at the twins with their own weapon. For me, a corrupted Rowan path, is a path in which he gains and gains power, and is pro active about it. And maybe half way in the game he gains the twins respect and becomes equal to them and from there it would be easier to kill/dominate them. Again this is just my opinion on the matter.
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Personally I have to agree about the helayna part. But I don't feel like that the claiming sequence is too much more like the conclusion. In my opinion there is no real happy ending for her yet. The "happiest" ending imo is if you tell her you love her and keep her as your own. Every path keeps her in a cockhungry state so neither helping her to escape nor Alexia helping her cures her and I just assume sooner or later she will succumb to her urges. Really like the alexia after helayna ecape events on the ntr route but it feels bad to lose helayna in the process. Would be nice to get her back later. But changing the claiming / including additional stuff could change the conclusion event too (for example not giving her the ring) so no worries here on my part.
Have to disagree about the greyhide part as even in the ntr path he always feels like shit after betraying his friendship with rowan and Alexia always has to be the one to seduce him. So he still feels like a real bro... even after fucking my wife
Rowan doesn't feel too weak for now imo as if he was "stronger" he wouldn't even have a reason to follow the twins. He only feels weak if you want him to be weak (ntr path).
And I get that the story is still in it's early stages (even though it sounds kinda ridiculous for a game with dozens of hours of gameplay to be in it's ealy stages). So I just personally assumed these parts of the story are still far from done. So there is still a lot of room to get revenge bit by bit on the twins too. Like slowly corrupting jezera by giving her headpats or stealing andras's cake from the fridge.
Overall love the whole story so far.
Have to disagree about the greyhide part as even in the ntr path he always feels like shit after betraying his friendship with rowan and Alexia always has to be the one to seduce him. So he still feels like a real bro... even after fucking my wife
Rowan doesn't feel too weak for now imo as if he was "stronger" he wouldn't even have a reason to follow the twins. He only feels weak if you want him to be weak (ntr path).
And I get that the story is still in it's early stages (even though it sounds kinda ridiculous for a game with dozens of hours of gameplay to be in it's ealy stages). So I just personally assumed these parts of the story are still far from done. So there is still a lot of room to get revenge bit by bit on the twins too. Like slowly corrupting jezera by giving her headpats or stealing andras's cake from the fridge.
Overall love the whole story so far.
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Throwing my at into this ring. Bought the game on steam, keep coming here for the discussions and because i am impatient so.. "Do what you want cause a pirate is free" or something like that.
I cant really see where the issue above 27 is seeing so much problems with Rowan's power, i have not done much of the ntr stuff, but i cant really say that Rowan feels weak, he "can" , if dice allows, battle against an orc champion in the arena and win, he does manage to hurt Adras in a point and there aren't really any npcs that come to mind that go after Alexia other than the red brute we all love to desire to see have his but kicked.
I have to say i agree, in some sense, with the idea that Rowan does not get a good amount of power to do much in terms off revenge or getting something palpable from acts of defiance.
Using Rastandel has an example, the werden route, i admit, i bitch and moaned here about how much i disliked it, so i shall try to use this example in a better way, not getting something big or immediate from that makes sense, its the first arc and all. But at the same time, it goes to great extremes to punish the players effort in getting there, and shows little reward, yes, a vague "that will help in the future because now there is a resistance" can try and show that its not a purely punishment for players who think a game called seeds of chaos can have a "even lesser evil route", but it does not make it better. In immediate and medium term times it just becomes a bad deal. A lesser evil Rowan can still save delane, corrupt praticia or put jackes in charge,get the daughter of werden has a slave and more or less have more of the city under control and someone who might be with him in the distant betrayal of the twis. that is close to 3 "good things" . A werden route Rowan has delane turned into a latex husk, the efforts to rescue her be for nothing, gets nothing for said efforts and gets no closer to anything. I believe most will go with lesser evil in that situation.
Now, do i believe Rowan should be sucessfull and recieve everything in that route? No, that would not make sense, do i belive he should get something more that a vague unlock of resistance content? I do, something to show the player Rowan is learning better that just take everything that could go wrong and making it go wrong, maybe he gets better insight on how the sister (i forget how to write her name) spie network works, at least something better than "we always knew that you did x", its not out of this world to imagine that lady delane appearing in the city after mysteriously escaping can be pointed at "the hero did it". But it just seems..strange that Rowan did not see that one coming, the sister prety much has "i belive i am a master of spies and intrigue" writen on her.
Al that said, has a whole the story is good one route does not change the rest.
Finishing in a question, will the goblins and the orciad lines be mutialy exclusive or will Rowan be able to recruit both groups?
I cant really see where the issue above 27 is seeing so much problems with Rowan's power, i have not done much of the ntr stuff, but i cant really say that Rowan feels weak, he "can" , if dice allows, battle against an orc champion in the arena and win, he does manage to hurt Adras in a point and there aren't really any npcs that come to mind that go after Alexia other than the red brute we all love to desire to see have his but kicked.
I have to say i agree, in some sense, with the idea that Rowan does not get a good amount of power to do much in terms off revenge or getting something palpable from acts of defiance.
Using Rastandel has an example, the werden route, i admit, i bitch and moaned here about how much i disliked it, so i shall try to use this example in a better way, not getting something big or immediate from that makes sense, its the first arc and all. But at the same time, it goes to great extremes to punish the players effort in getting there, and shows little reward, yes, a vague "that will help in the future because now there is a resistance" can try and show that its not a purely punishment for players who think a game called seeds of chaos can have a "even lesser evil route", but it does not make it better. In immediate and medium term times it just becomes a bad deal. A lesser evil Rowan can still save delane, corrupt praticia or put jackes in charge,get the daughter of werden has a slave and more or less have more of the city under control and someone who might be with him in the distant betrayal of the twis. that is close to 3 "good things" . A werden route Rowan has delane turned into a latex husk, the efforts to rescue her be for nothing, gets nothing for said efforts and gets no closer to anything. I believe most will go with lesser evil in that situation.
Now, do i believe Rowan should be sucessfull and recieve everything in that route? No, that would not make sense, do i belive he should get something more that a vague unlock of resistance content? I do, something to show the player Rowan is learning better that just take everything that could go wrong and making it go wrong, maybe he gets better insight on how the sister (i forget how to write her name) spie network works, at least something better than "we always knew that you did x", its not out of this world to imagine that lady delane appearing in the city after mysteriously escaping can be pointed at "the hero did it". But it just seems..strange that Rowan did not see that one coming, the sister prety much has "i belive i am a master of spies and intrigue" writen on her.
Al that said, has a whole the story is good one route does not change the rest.
Finishing in a question, will the goblins and the orciad lines be mutialy exclusive or will Rowan be able to recruit both groups?