VN Ren'Py Stray Incubus [S2 Ch.3b] [IP Studios]

[ramvivat]

Can someone translate this post? I don't speak Shakespearean typewriter monkey.

magic for the uninitiated does not have to be easy to understand. I'm sorry, peasan. =)

 

[ramvivat]

compressed please kind sir

hahaha nope!
That's not how it should be, that's how it should be:
compressed, kind sir, can you make it?*

*A reference to pulp fiction
=))

 

[maxthruster]

magic for the uninitiated does not have to be easy to understand. I'm sorry, peasan. =)

Think that joke went over your head there, bud. Anyway, all teasing aside, the point about your ideas of magic has already been addressed way back when - they're not crazy or stupid, but by and large when you want your magic to do something the best way to convey that is to show it, just like any other plot element.

As of right now, the only real indication of the bond's effects is when Zycris thinks about how pretty Illya is and she blushes. It's possible that this was just a physical response to holding hands with a handsome stranger, but I think it's likely due to the bond, showing that they can pick up on each other's feelings at least a little bit.

However... that's it. There's no other real indication of the bond for the rest of the chapter. Zycris doesn't seem to pick up on any of Illya's thoughts or feelings, they don't really have any moments of notable synchronicity, nothing. Just Zycris shouting a cringy line and Illya hopping into bed with him. Hell, I'd even take the bond mark glowing when those things happened as a sign it's influencing their behaviors - it's a bit hamfisted, but it works - but nope. Nothing.

As for your bit about memories and data transfers... it's a bit hard to tell through the broken English, but I think the point you're making is that the bond spell is copying their memories and pasting them into each other's brains? Correct me if I'm wrong there. If that is the argument, then I simply don't see any reason to support it. Neither Zycris nor Illya shows any signs of suddenly knowing about each other's pasts. That effect also isn't mentioned when they're being bonded, so it seems kind of weird to cite; no evidence points to it, and the only argument you've provided seems to be "magic doesn't have to make sense."



That brings me to the overall issue behind the magical bond and the whole weird thing between Zycris as Illya: you're right, magic doesn't have to make sense, and in universe there's been plenty of weird or contrived spells that don't necessarily make sense which we haven't really questioned much of. The problem isn't really a lore one, but a narrative one. The bond spell doesn't seem to have immediately made them soulmates or anything; it seems like the intention was for it to have a more gradual effect, bonding them over time. But this update is very different from past Stray Incubus releases because it skips through very large portions of potential content. We don't get that time.

Think about the mission to investigate the Butcher. We don't show up and immediately find a bloody corpse; we wander around town, we interview locals, we meet people not associated with the mission and we plot how to capture this vicious killer. We take our time. This also gives us plenty of opportunities during the mission to bond with other characters, to explore Zycris's growth, and to see more parts of the world. This has long been a game which luxuriates in its own atmosphere. The changing of hands caused that measured pace to slip, which was one of the biggest criticism of the episode; most likely, it's the cause of the weirdness around the bond too - they wanted it to display a gradual change, but because the game skips around so much it gets lost in the shuffle and ignored.

 

[Versace217]

hey, it is magic bond, ok? it is direct placing low-level (subconscious) memories (body memories) into brain (some sort of wireless DMA transfer). it is puting datas in those memory area in which your conscience may not have random access but just associative.
you can a) collect datas from sensors by dt and b) you can just copy database from other source - and resuts will be same. capiche?

Like maxthruster above just wrote and like me and others have previously stated, even if what you said was the case we do not see enough instances of that happening to make this a credible and workable scenario.

We just simply have to wait for the new update which should also include the rework of the previous update. It should hopefully solve all of our questions and concerns regarding the last update.

 

[ramvivat]

Think that joke went over your head there, bud. Anyway, all teasing aside, the point about your ideas of magic has already been addressed way back when - they're not crazy or stupid, but by and large when you want your magic to do something the best way to convey that is to show it, just like any other plot element.

As of right now, the only real indication of the bond's effects is when Zycris thinks about how pretty Illya is and she blushes. It's possible that this was just a physical response to holding hands with a handsome stranger, but I think it's likely due to the bond, showing that they can pick up on each other's feelings at least a little bit.

However... that's it. There's no other real indication of the bond for the rest of the chapter. Zycris doesn't seem to pick up on any of Illya's thoughts or feelings, they don't really have any moments of notable synchronicity, nothing. Just Zycris shouting a cringy line and Illya hopping into bed with him. Hell, I'd even take the bond mark glowing when those things happened as a sign it's influencing their behaviors - it's a bit hamfisted, but it works - but nope. Nothing.

As for your bit about memories and data transfers... it's a bit hard to tell through the broken English, but I think the point you're making is that the bond spell is copying their memories and pasting them into each other's brains? Correct me if I'm wrong there. If that is the argument, then I simply don't see any reason to support it. Neither Zycris nor Illya shows any signs of suddenly knowing about each other's pasts. That effect also isn't mentioned when they're being bonded, so it seems kind of weird to cite; no evidence points to it, and the only argument you've provided seems to be "magic doesn't have to make sense."



That brings me to the overall issue behind the magical bond and the whole weird thing between Zycris as Illya: you're right, magic doesn't have to make sense, and in universe there's been plenty of weird or contrived spells that don't necessarily make sense which we haven't really questioned much of. The problem isn't really a lore one, but a narrative one. The bond spell doesn't seem to have immediately made them soulmates or anything; it seems like the intention was for it to have a more gradual effect, bonding them over time. But this update is very different from past Stray Incubus releases because it skips through very large portions of potential content. We don't get that time.

Think about the mission to investigate the Butcher. We don't show up and immediately find a bloody corpse; we wander around town, we interview locals, we meet people not associated with the mission and we plot how to capture this vicious killer. We take our time. This also gives us plenty of opportunities during the mission to bond with other characters, to explore Zycris's growth, and to see more parts of the world. This has long been a game which luxuriates in its own atmosphere. The changing of hands caused that measured pace to slip, which was one of the biggest criticism of the episode; most likely, it's the cause of the weirdness around the bond too - they wanted it to display a gradual change, but because the game skips around so much it gets lost in the shuffle and ignored.

Dude, I'm sorry, without trying to show that I'm a snob, but have you ever, in your spare time, thought about how a person and his memory and consciousness work? that a person has long-term memory and short-term memory, that a person, like a computer, has a system of sensors with which he collects information about his environment. it has a data processing system. and based on the analogy of a person as a computer, an information system, you will come to the same conclusion that I came to - that with the help of external communication, you can form a block of data in memory that did not originally belong to a person, were not formed by him personally.
BTW i quite sure You already know about hypnosis. and can you simply consider that this witch (witch, sorceress, whatever you want to call it) could have performed a hypnosis session by introducing new data to this couple?

Just try to think like that.

 

[maxthruster]

Dude, I'm sorry, without trying to show that I'm a snob, but have you ever, in your spare time, thought about how a person and his memory and consciousness work? that a person has long-term memory and short-term memory, that a person, like a computer, has a system of sensors with which he collects information about his environment. it has a data processing system. and based on the analogy of a person as a computer, an information system, you will come to the same conclusion that I came to - that with the help of external communication, you can form a block of data in memory that did not originally belong to a person, were not formed by him personally.
BTW i quite sure You already know about hypnosis. and can you simply consider that this witch (witch, sorceress, whatever you want to call it) could have performed a hypnosis session by introducing new data to this couple?

Just try to think like that.

That's cool and all, but as I already addressed, we don't see anything in the game from which to infer this. That's the whole problem with what you're saying. Sure, it's not impossible that the sorceress hypnotized them... but we saw nothing to say that she did. Your computer allegory is equally baseless - and, I should point out, exactly what I refuted earlier.

Again, nothing your saying is impossible, but we simply haven't seen anything to support it in game. If that is indeed what's happening, it's been written in pretty poorly. Either way, I hope we'll see the bond spell expanded on a bit in the episode rewrite, so we can see it more fleshed out.

 

[ramvivat]

Neither Zycris nor Illya shows any signs of suddenly knowing about each other's pasts.

this is not necessary - you just need to form a "feeling of the elbow", and this is closer to the body memory, to the subconscious - when your body calms down in the presence of a familiar smell and adjusts to the right mood. this is a kind of knowledge of "my pack member is nearby, everything is fine, my back is covered"

You know how scented candles work in spas, right?

 

[maxthruster]

this is not necessary - you just need to form a "feeling of the elbow", and this is closer to the body memory, to the subconscious - when your body calms down in the presence of a familiar smell and adjusts to the right mood. this is a kind of knowledge of "my pack member is nearby, everything is fine, my back is covered"

You know how scented candles work in spas, right?

You'd still want to actually show it in the game. Even a single line of thought by Zycris along the lines of "I've only just met her, but I feel like I've known her all my life" or him thinking after the tournament that it's odd he felt so protective of her or something would suffice if the bond created such an instant and powerful connection. But we don't even get that much. That's the problem, that's what people are arguing. The actual mechanics of the spell are irrelevant, even if it's fun to debate them, because we don't see any evidence the spell has actually done anything to spur those feelings.

 

[ramvivat]

You'd still want to actually show it in the game. Even a single line of thought by Zycris along the lines of "I've only just met her, but I feel like I've known her all my life" or him thinking after the tournament that it's odd he felt so protective of her or something would suffice if the bond created such an instant and powerful connection. But we don't even get that much. That's the problem, that's what people are arguing. The actual mechanics of the spell are irrelevant, even if it's fun to debate them, because we don't see any evidence the spell has actually done anything to spur those feelings.

OK. our real life. Love at first sight: "we just met and it feels like you've known her all your life, you feel at ease and calm around her" - or would you say that it doesn't happen that way?

Tell me and I'll just stop arguing.

 

[maxthruster]

OK. our real life. Love at first sight: "we just met and it feels like you've known her all your life, you feel at ease and calm around her" - or would you say that it doesn't happen that way?

Tell me and I'll just stop arguing.

For what it's worth, no, love at first sight the way it's depicted in media is not a thing in real life.

But I'm glad you brought that up. Because, again, the criticisms of the bonding spell are about the narrative use of it. Think about movies, TV shows, books or whatever type of media you like that features a love at first sight narrative. Two characters meet, are immediately drawn to each other, have a whirlwind romance, happily ever after. During that time, how often is it acknowledged that this is unusual? Characters commenting on how they don't normally move this fast, characters thinking about how they've never felt this way before, characters talking to friends and family about this incredible person they met and maybe even suffering some teasing about the nature of their relationship. The world around them acknowledges that this is unusual. That's the point I'm getting at with the bonding spell.

 

[JakeyEng]

So just want to be clear on release timing, the rework for S2 Ch3 is releasing at the same time as S2 Ch4, which is probably in the ballpark of half a year away?

 

[lonzee]

Every time their hair changes, why do they end up looking like completely different/new characters?? It feels weird to me, because sometimes it looks good and sometimes it looks bad…

 

[maxthruster]

Every time their hair changes, why do they end up looking like completely different/new characters?? It feels weird to me, because sometimes it looks good and sometimes it looks bad…

There's a few reasons for this. A lot of the characters lack defining facial features, the style and quality of renders changes over time, and honestly a big issue with HS games overall is that most of the characters end up looking samey because they're trying to conform to a certain standard of beauty.

 

[Wolfeszorn]

Every time their hair changes, why do they end up looking like completely different/new characters?? It feels weird to me, because sometimes it looks good and sometimes it looks bad…

And it´s going to get even worse when the new dev changes the characters looks to something he likes in the coming updates...

Don´t get it wrong though. The game Died when the old Dev abandoned the game. Whats left of it is a fan project with a new dev thats way too full of himself.

 

[lonzee]

And it´s going to get even worse when the new dev changes the characters looks to something he likes in the coming updates...

Don´t get it wrong though. The game Died when the old Dev abandoned the game. Whats left of it is a fan project with a new dev thats way too full of himself.

huh? realy? so this game is dead? bruh even though I played almost all the way through Season 1, and in my opinion the storyline was good.....

This game actually has really good potential to continue… it’s such a shame :”)
I’ve lost the motivation to play it again after it changed developers… maybe I’ll delete the game late or maybe i'll play Season 2 first after finishing Season 1. If it turns out bad, then oh well, I’ll just delete it
Thanks for letting me know.

 

[maxthruster]

huh? realy? so this game is dead? bruh even though I played almost all the way through Season 1, and in my opinion the storyline was good.....

It's not entirely dead. The original developer was forced to abandon the game due to financial problems, but some other devs have picked it up in his stead. Their first release(season 2 episode 3) was met with... disappointment, to put it mildly; you can read further back in the thread to see why, if you like. Tl;dr is that the writing was very bumpy and poorly paced, and the render style was a very dramatic shift from Flynn's style. They're currently working on a rework which should be released along with the next episode.

Some people already believe the game is over and that the new devs will be unable to right the ship. Some are giving them a second chance to see if they can learn from their mistakes. It's largely up to you whether you want to be optimistic or pessimistic about the game's future, but either way I'd recommend finishing the game to get a fuller idea of what's going on before making any decisions. Even if you decide you won't continue after that, season 2 is still worth playing.

 

[zertAlf]

hello, i start playing chap 1 and so far it was pretty good ( i was hopping for some bulge from the size of the protagonist ) but i just do the convoy manor night part and i really feel like the dev is taking us for pure dumb retard !!!!!! I feel really frustrate from that part and see the prota be thiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiissssssssssssss DUMB make me lose it !!!! Like ok i don't get it the first kill ( and i steal think it wasn't obvious due to the unknowing creature of this world and could have been somethink else ) but after all the bad choice from the mc we wake up in the room with again a faceless death and some disaper ( i start to be suspicious but steal not 100% sure but it's like i have the lesson from stephanie about face dopplangger creature repeat itself in my head ) and when i see centoria without any face mark i go in perso gallery and see im not crazy and she have mark on her face and she give shit explanation about the situation im now 100% sure but no we steal have to stay dumb and support all the monor bullshit like separate when you can move in group or the best part where the enemy don't kill us first when we are sleeping ( sry but this part was soooooo bad frustrating and dumb just why ) or the tamara who sleep in this situation but stay awake after and the toys in first room inspection ( in vn mod ) who is obviously a dopp like steph was explaning in his lesson JUST BEFORE THE MISSION and i get it he was thinking i make the mc distracted by his love aura think but pls the other are suppose to have listen the lesson at least and the manor scene is tooooooo much obvious. Sry but i have to let it out but soo far really good game thx dev !!! ( just want to know if i was the only one who almost lose it and just spam clic at all the rest of this bullshit ? )

 

[Wolfeszorn]

hello, i start playing chap 1 and so far it was pretty good ( i was hopping for some bulge from the size of the protagonist ) but i just do the convoy manor night part and i really feel like the dev is taking us for pure dumb retard !!!!!! I feel really frustrate from that part and see the prota be thiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiissssssssssssss DUMB make me lose it !!!! Like ok i don't get it the first kill ( and i steal think it wasn't obvious due to the unknowing creature of this world and could have been somethink else ) but after all the bad choice from the mc we wake up in the room with again a faceless death and some disaper ( i start to be suspicious but steal not 100% sure but it's like i have the lesson from stephanie about face dopplangger creature repeat itself in my head ) and when i see centoria without any face mark i go in perso gallery and see im not crazy and she have mark on her face and she give shit explanation about the situation im now 100% sure but no we steal have to stay dumb and support all the monor bullshit like separate when you can move in group or the best part where the enemy don't kill us first when we are sleeping ( sry but this part was soooooo bad frustrating and dumb just why ) or the tamara who sleep in this situation but stay awake after and the toys in first room inspection ( in vn mod ) who is obviously a dopp like steph was explaning in his lesson JUST BEFORE THE MISSION and i get it he was thinking i make the mc distracted by his love aura think but pls the other are suppose to have listen the lesson at least and the manor scene is tooooooo much obvious. Sry but i have to let it out but soo far really good game thx dev !!! ( just want to know if i was the only one who almost lose it and just spam clic at all the rest of this bullshit ? )

first of... jesus christ, this shit is so hard to read, i´m getting a headache trying to decipher your message, but i´m trying to answer your question in one simple sentence.

Everything you think doesn´t matter, since the dev who made the part you are talking about abandoned the game.


if you reach the latest chapter, you might want to cuff yourself to a chair since your disappointment is going to be ten times worse if you see the abomination they created.