VN Ren'Py STWA: Unbroken [Pt. 7] [STWAdev]

[Defenestrator.for.traitor]

The MC isn't afraid of a romantic commitment, he is incapable of it, because he still can't let go of Zaina. He even says as much when he and Alistar step outside to discuss Vi and Ines staying with them for good. The MC can't even have someone say her name out loud without falling apart, so that needs to be resolved first for the MC to enter a new commited relationship; he can't start something new with a Ghost still hovering over him.

As for Els, I always knew that something is seriously wrong with her, just not what exactly. Part 6 helped a lot in honing in on what exactly that is though.

We get the first "warning" when Els and the MC go to the movies and the MC has a conversation with Zaina, who is obviously dead, so he is really talking to his subconscious.

"She's perfect, or that's what she wants people to see." and then the one word that kinda sets the tone as far as Els is concerned "Dangerous.". The MC with his military background calling her dangerous always stuck with me, but I never could put it together.

I thought we need to know what trauma Els has suffered to really get a grip on her, but during part 6 it all started to make sense. She isn't reliving some trauma when we see her covered in blood, she is fantasizing, drawn back to the memory of violence.

We've all been out with buddies and some other dudes gave you some looks and everyone knew, one wrong word and shit will go down. The only way it becomes unavoidable by default, is if any girl/woman opens her mouth, then there is literally no way a bunch of intoxicated guys will back down and the situation resolves peacefully. So Els, while standing next to the undefeated Light Heavyweight and Heavyweight contender, decides to take the lead and makes 100% sure the fight is gonna happen and then later even admits that it felt really good.

Then of course the bite while kissing, a bit too on the nose but maybe the developer wanted to check how many players will look past El's visuals to see the monster lurking below; she "just" wanted to taste his blood.

The whole pacifist shtick is not because she can't stand violence, her entire backstory contradicts that on multiple counts, it's because she's afraid that she loses control of herself when she is near violence. During the MC's fight, she doesn't give a single word of encouragement or motivation, instead the only time she opens her mouth is when she comments on the opponents injuries, that's where her attention is at.

Her deepest fear is losing control, so whenever that happens, like flying on an airplace, the new staff changing things at the center or a meeting with her dad, the face she puts on starts to crumble and she panics and starts to fantasize about her violent memories.

I never understood why Els first said to Alistair and then to Vi that she believes the MC is the only one that could "really understand her", but now that makes a lot more sense. She knows the MC has killed many people, was in several near-death situations, and has seen the darkest side of humanity. Els believes that she is so broken, that it takes someone with the MC's experiences, to not run away and be disgusted when she tells him the truth.

I have no doubt that there will be an Els ending, but I really wonder if there will be an Els happy ending or if the developer has some really fucked up shit in his mind.

More or less same take I got from Els. I understood what she was at the pool scene and when you add manipulative side of her, I think she is a hard pass.

 

[Bombmaster]

More or less same take I got from Els. I understood what she was at the pool scene and when you add manipulative side of her, I think she is a hard pass.

The dead friend, Davis? If I'm remembering his name right is a very fun dynamic talking in your head about her if you go full infamy route.

I do think she is the right Li for the infamy Valentine.

 

[RoryTate]

Ever since that talk, I've been pushing people away and declined all romantic advances, except for Kana.

Kana is a great choice for playing this game. Being with her is relaxing, maintenance-free, and always fun. I can't think of any scene she's been in where her smile doesn't brighten the story and bring life to the world being built. While she is "broken" in a way, she doesn't let it affect her too much, and instead uses it more constructively than the other LI's. That isn't to say she doesn't need support and help from her friends, but more so that she isn't anywhere near as angsty as the others in dealing with her personal challenges. I like that a lot about her. I really think Kana could end up as the dark horse in this race of great love interests in this game (and all the girls are awesome in their own way I feel). She has some really great potential as far as a close and intimate relationship and possible exciting sexual situations are concerned.

In real life, I absolutely hate people who take what they know of you, and use it against you. Elspeth is like this. In this playthrough I've been open with her, but she remains closed off and playing games.

Els is...complicated. I don't get the same sense as you that she is trying to deliberately harm the MC, by using his vulnerable admissions against him. But yes, she is manipulating things at times to get what she wants out of the situation (note: what she wants is of course the burning question here, and from the story so far that appears to be a complex mix of what she thinks is good for herself, and what she imagines is good – or at least hopefully neutral – for the MC). The important thing to realize though is that she is not just the mind games she is sometimes openly inflicting on the MC. She has admitted that she is playing games at times because she wants a partner who can match her wits, and if we accept that explanation, then this is just her way of finding someone who isn't weak (i.e. she doesn't want a "Men are like kitchen tiles – lay them right once, and you can walk all over them for the next ten years" type of toxic relationship, which is a good thing). I don't entirely accept this explanation either, but while her motivations are likely more complicated than just this one desire – because she has secrets and thus other potential reasons for her behaviours – I generally get the sense that she is at least honest with the MC about being his friend. She may even be a rare "ride or die" companion for the MC, though we'll have to wait and see on that one.

I would argue more in Els's favour because a person's character has to be judged by all of their actions. Including the things they don't do. We need to be fair and consider everything about Elspeth, such as: her volunteer work funding and managing the Center to help struggling veterans; her independence from her family and her eschewing of the valuable status associated with them despite the significant loss of power and influence she has to accept because of it; her no-strings-attached offer of support for the MC in the form of an experienced and recommended therapist; the fact she doesn't become aggressive and try to sabotage the other women who might take the MC from her, and instead feels confident in her own attractiveness to let the chips fall where they may; and more. That last point demonstrating her healthy attitude towards a relationship is quite important I feel. We know that she wants – and perhaps even loves – MC, but she is willing at some reasonable level to leave him free to make that important choice of what he wants without stacking the deck unfairly so that she is the only option left. That shows a considerable amount of maturity and makes her a very attractive option as a partner (IMO of course), and I would argue it speaks well to her ultimate intentions toward the MC.

 

[Quetzzz]

It's not her thing. They both behave the same towards each other. In the swimming pool, for example, it is Mc who lowers the mood.

MC lowers the mood because she intruded on his mental space. They had a nice evening together, Valentine agreed immediately to go with her to her father, to be a good friend. Afterward, she suddenly tries to bash through his walls. Objectively, she probably did that because she wanted to be a friend too, but to me, it came across as her trying to shape Valentine in what she wanted him to be.

I am talking about the girls and only those who know first hand what it is like. not from what they have been told like Ines. Mcnab knows him too. I didn't mean Vi knows the events of mc's life. Vi knows mc's real personality (what he's like), because she's been so close to him in the past. And she tells mc that he doesn't behave the way he really is, and that she knows you're not like that.

Vi also hasn't seen Valentine in what, 8 years? People change a lot in their early twenties regardless, add to that being in active war zones. So even she wouldn't know what his real personality is under the trauma he's hiding from. Regardless, all the people I mentioned already know more about Valentine than the player does.

I just played through the part where Els talks to Vi. Els really showed her colors there, it really is a game to her. She's mentioned that a few times, including to Valentine. Yeah, I'd rather not be a pawn.
Now, from what Vi said, apparently the MC is back to how he was? Unknown to me (because the player is never told), Valentine was a heart-on-the-sleeve kind of guy. Funny too, but then Els also accused the MC of using humor to hide behind. But this is what he's always done, right? Because being the clown was a coping mechanism to not get left out.

Els is ahead of him in recovery. Even though she keeps having hallucinations, The mc too, talks to his ex and Davis. They're both fucked up, but she can control it better, let's put it that way.

Maybe I'll reconsider that when I finished this chapter.

I don't want to change your opinion, but without playing her paths you don't have all the info.
Play them and then comment on them.

Commenting on it early is half of the fun. Because, this is what's going through my head right now, and the impression I have of her at this moment. I'm not critiquing the entire game after only playing it for 10 minutes.
And as far as my opinion goes, I'm always happy to change it when new information comes to light. I just ranted because I got fed up with Els' behavior (And also because I'm genuinely interested in how other people experience this.), and so far I haven't seen anything that makes me change my mind. She might become more relatable as more details are shared, I still treat her as a good friend. But after the pool scene she's lost my romantic interest entirely, I'm not playing her game.

 

[Mr. Muscles]

No El slander pls.

 

[TimHawk]

Els is...complicated. I don't get the same sense as you that she is trying to deliberately harm the MC, by using his vulnerable admissions against him. But yes, she is manipulating things at times to get what she wants out of the situation (note: what she wants is of course the burning question here, and from the story so far that appears to be a complex mix of what she thinks is good for herself, and what she imagines is good – or at least hopefully neutral – for the MC). The important thing to realize though is that she is not just the mind games she is sometimes openly inflicting on the MC. She has admitted that she is playing games at times because she wants a partner who can match her wits, and if we accept that explanation, then this is just her way of finding someone who isn't weak (i.e. she doesn't want a "Men are like kitchen tiles – lay them right once, and you can walk all over them for the next ten years" type of toxic relationship, which is a good thing). I don't entirely accept this explanation either, but while her motivations are likely more complicated than just this one desire – because she has secrets and thus other potential reasons for her behaviours – I generally get the sense that she is at least honest with the MC about being his friend. She may even be a rare "ride or die" companion for the MC, though we'll have to wait and see on that one.

I would argue more in Els's favour because a person's character has to be judged by all of their actions. Including the things they don't do. We need to be fair and consider everything about Elspeth, such as: her volunteer work funding and managing the Center to help struggling veterans; her independence from her family and her eschewing of the valuable status associated with them despite the significant loss of power and influence she has to accept because of it; her no-strings-attached offer of support for the MC in the form of an experienced and recommended therapist; the fact she doesn't become aggressive and try to sabotage the other women who might take the MC from her, and instead feels confident in her own attractiveness to let the chips fall where they may; and more. That last point demonstrating her healthy attitude towards a relationship is quite important I feel. We know that she wants – and perhaps even loves – MC, but she is willing at some reasonable level to leave him free to make that important choice of what he wants without stacking the deck unfairly so that she is the only option left. That shows a considerable amount of maturity and makes her a very attractive option as a partner (IMO of course), and I would argue it speaks well to her ultimate intentions toward the MC.

If Els would have done all those things altruistically and without an agenda a lot of your conclusion would be true, but what if it's a need ? What if you want it to be true and ignore all the signs that say differently ?

At the Center she hears every single day about someone's elses violent encounters and she gets to experience them third person.

She has a father who is rich beyond means and who runs charities, yet to fund her Center, she asks Alistair and the MC and when her father finally decides to kick money in, she is not happy.

She was MI, Military Intelligence, and yet she challenges an SFO, Special Forces Operator, that she has seen or been in as much shit as he, that's ludicrous and a clear break with reality. MI's can get deployed to combat zones, to take statements, follow up on tips or debrief informants, but they don't get deployed into combat, that's not their training or their job. It CAN happen, but to say that she has seen as much action to someone who has trained local forces behind enemy lines is just bonkers.

And Els tells Vi straight up why she likes the MC, because when he fights or trains she believes he is who he really is at his core, again a direct link to violence.

As a matter of fact, we have yet to see a single shred of evidence that she has feelings for the MC, what she does show and even say is, at least in her mind, an almost pathological dependence on the MC, that he is the only one that would accept her for who she really is.

And while we are at it, does she want to help the MC out of concern, friendship and love or because she can hold on to the hope, that if he can be fixed, she can too.

 

[Quetzzz]

Kana is a great choice for playing this game. Being with her is relaxing, maintenance-free, and always fun. I can't think of any scene she's been in where her smile doesn't brighten the story and bring life to the world being built. While she is "broken" in a way, she doesn't let it affect her too much, and instead uses it more constructively than the other LI's. That isn't to say she doesn't need support and help from her friends, but more so that she isn't anywhere near as angsty as the others in dealing with her personal challenges. I like that a lot about her. I really think Kana could end up as the dark horse in this race of great love interests in this game (and all the girls are awesome in their own way I feel). She has some really great potential as far as a close and intimate relationship and possible exciting sexual situations are concerned.

You say it better than I can. Kana is indeed relaxing and fun. But she also isn't shallow or "just a lay", she has character and that's what I like most about her. (Just a sidenote, not saying you said the opposite.)
Kana is the underdog in her story, in a way. In real life, I always root for the underdog, so maybe that's what attracts me to her. Also, the Christmas scene was the first one I actually felt positive emotion in this game (besides a laugh here and there).

Els is...complicated. I don't get the same sense as you that she is trying to deliberately harm the MC

No, "harm" isn't what I'd call it. She asked MC how many people he's killed, he answered honestly (lost count). At the pool, she used this moment of honesty to try and break Valentine (murderer). (Now, I'm sure she'd still call this out as a trait of them both, even if the MC didn't answer that question, but it is what it is.)

I don't entirely accept this explanation either, but while her motivations are likely more complicated than just this one desire

Right, I think we agree on this entirely. It's more or less what I'm thinking right now. And what I want from Valentine, what I'd do, is to stop playing her game. I don't think the actual game will let me, though.

I generally get the sense that she is at least honest with the MC about being his friend.

I think so too, but she's also too secretive and closed off. She gives glimpses then pulls back the curtain. Probably part of her game, I doubt Els says anything by accident. Again, part of the reason why I'm giving her the cold shoulder. Not playing her game, since I can't call her out.

her volunteer work funding and managing the Center to help struggling veterans

Els admonishes Valentine for having a wall, while the Centre might very well be a part of her wall. Objectively she's putting good in the world, but what if all the volunteers and vets are just there to validate her sense of self-worth (as the heir), or if she did it out of a sense of guilt? At least from what she says herself, I get the impression that she put a lot of allies in harms way.
This is a bit of a tangent, maybe. I'm just wondering if her motivation has any weight here. Valentine is putting good into the world too, and much of it is fueled by his own sense of guilt.

her independence from her family and her eschewing of the valuable status associated with them despite the significant loss of power and influence she has to accept because of it

Yet she will become heir to the Astair family. I don't really see this, tbh. The way I see it, that status and influence is guaranteed.

her no-strings-attached offer of support for the MC in the form of an experienced and recommended therapist

I just played this part (but plan to reload and watch the video instead).
Valentine isn't hurting a fly, he's not suicidal (though he's not really living yet either), and he's not depressed. And, at least my MC, has made a big step by telling Kana she'd be the only one for him, and he wants to be committed to her. I'm very weary of taking Els up on any offer, because she doesn't respect my boundaries. That's the same reason why Vi is out of the race, for me.
And honestly, I think Valentine is fine. Maybe I'm clueless, or maybe the game keeps me clueless. I just don't get the sense that Valentine needs a therapist. Compare this to the MC of "Long Road Home", who gets a violent episode when triggered. That's a guy who needs therapy.

the fact she doesn't become aggressive and try to sabotage the other women who might take the MC from her, and instead feels confident in her own attractiveness to let the chips fall where they may

In part, yes. But I highly doubt that the undertone of Els' conversation with Vi on the beach was for Vi's benefit. Honestly, I don't even understand why Vi went with her to the bakery after that talk. Els got what she wanted from that conversation, Vi (again) didn't respect Valentine's wishes and blabbered, and then still got no information, except for realizing that Els is pursuing Valentine.
("Be careful Gingersnap, I play for keeps.", "You really don't know what you're getting into.")

We know that she wants – and perhaps even loves – MC, but she is willing at some reasonable level to leave him free to make that important choice of what he wants without stacking the deck unfairly so that she is the only option left.

This might be true. She's certainly one of the few LIs who hasn't really thrown herself at the MC. I don't entirely agree with "leave him free", because I'm convinced that her wanting to help Valentine is directly related to her feelings for him. If he's to be her partner, he'll have to be at his best, after all.

 

[Quetzzz]

As a matter of fact, we have yet to see a single shred of evidence that she has feelings for the MC, what she does show and even say is, at least in her mind, an almost pathological dependence on the MC, that he is the only one that would accept her for who she really is.

And while we are at it, does she want to help the MC out of concern, friendship and love or because she can hold on to the hope, that if he can be fixed, she can too.

I need to take a course in writing, because you said in a few lines what I need 1000 words for. xD

 

[Quetzzz]

She touches his bottom, because he always responds evasively or jokingly on serious topics, and it's the only way to get him to talk or to let his guard down a little.You only have to look at the outcome of that discussion. The Mc starts going to group therapy.For his recovery.

She said it herself "I kissed you because I wanted to.", why wouldn't she do anything just because she wants to? Do I have to give her the benefit of the doubt, that she didn't do it for her own benefit? Even if Valentine benefits in some way, where does her game stop, and genuine compassion start?
Therapists will let you lie to them for as long as you feel the need to. If Els wanted to help Valentine, she didn't have to force it. She didn't need to keep escalating, and I hate that it worked.
I said earlier that I would've liked this game even more if I just got to play Valentine's story. The fact that we have choices, makes it the player's story, about how the player reacts while in Valentine's skin. At the same time, we're way behind on crucial information to make these choices in a roleplaying way. Inferring how Valentine accepted Els' confrontation by looking at what he does next... That's the reverse of how choice-based games work. The way I see it, if Valentine was as damaged as Els claims, then he'd have stopped going to group entirely, instead he does a 180 without the player's input.

People change, yes, but the base doesn't change much or that's what Vi at least believes the mc hasn't changed. (It also depends on the path you are taking) he just hides it so he doesn't feel something similar again. But deep down those feelings are what saves him. For example at his lowest point, he decides to help Emrit (He shows that he feels for others) and that's where his recovery begins. Having a goal.
I could be wrong about Els but I think she takes the rivalry with the girls as a game, not the relationship with the mc. She feels very superior to the others.

But the base is that Valentine has always used humor as a coping mechanism. It's just dialed to 100 due to his trauma. Valentine has been in high stress situations for 4 or-so years. Even people who've never seen combat, come out of the military differently than how they went in. Our experiences change us, sometimes fundamentally.

I think you're right that Els feels superior, I don't think she'd physically harm any of the women, but she will play games with them, and I don't think they'll be pretty.

In the case of Els, she is mysterious, and very competitive. You have to be patient with her, little by little she is opening up.

Not in this playthrough. When I play through the game again, I'm sure my choices will be biased by the meta knowledge I've gained. I mentioned it before, but I think the player is kept in the dark too much about a past that's defining him. When we ultimately learn about all these events, I'll happily game the game to see all the content it has. (And yes, I'm getting so fed up with all the JJ Abrams-style black boxes and the drip-feeding of information.)

 

[cxx]

If she's indeed behind the "hack", then I hope we'll get the option to tell her to fuck off.

not pants down and ass up?

 

[Quetzzz]

not pants down and ass up?

Nope, I'd just ogle her ass once more as she leaves.

She keeps escalating the situation because that's how she thinks she can make the mc react, which she does by the way. I understand that you don't like the ways, but we are not them and we don't have the same needs.

And that's a failure of the game IMO. If STWA just wanted to tell a story, he could've done that without player choice.
Of course, you're right. We are not them, but we're still allowed (and even encouraged by all the mystery) to draw our own conclusions. Maybe if I had more background on Valentine, and actually noticed the way he struggles, I would've felt differently.

He used to be the joker in the group, but he also showed empathy for others.
Now he uses it to avoid talking about topics that don't interest him.
He has changed, creating a wall, but deep down he is still the same. And between all of them they are helping him to become the same (or at least a better version than he is now), to overcome PTSD and to get over the death of his fiancée.

He's still showing a lot of empathy, though. Well, depending on the path. My Valentine encourages others and helps when he can. He's a Face. In hindsight, I picked Face because of Kana. Valentine wants to clean up his image (implicating he realizes that putting up a front of being unreliable is to his detriment), and I chalk most of 'my' character growth up to that. The world knows us by what we say and do, people can't read our mind. That's what Kana made Valentine realize.

In this chapter we learn a lot about the Mc's history . We found out part of the history with Vi. And what happened with the ex.

I'm right after the beach brawl, so I'm sure I'll get to know about that soon.

 

[Quetzzz]

I think that to get to know the characters well you have to play with each of them. Because that's where you really get to know them and they really open up to you and tell you more.
Once you've played them you judge them differently. You may like them more or less, but you know their motives.
In the case of Els, she is mysterious, and very competitive. You have to be patient with her, little by little she is opening up.

Finished chapter 6, and took a small detour to play Els' sex scene.
I wish everything Valentine confronted her with, he would've done in a platonic way. This girl is crazy, she gives me the vibe of a woman who wants to get hit to feel loved. Or maybe just to feel anything.

"I wanted you, I took you, and now I have you.", positively mental. The whole sex scene plays out as a fight for dominance. Probably one of her tests, again.

But:
"I don't want to dance anymore."
"The game has been fun. Truly I've enjoyed our spars."
"But games aren't all I want. I do want more."
"You're nosy, and on occasion smug."
"You hold far too many cards close to the chest, and sometimes you concern me."
Valentine should've said something to that extent even when turning her down, instead of copping out with "now is not the place or time." These things needed to be said.

Valentine saying that if Davis wasn't redeemable, he sure as hell wouldn't be, makes me think there's another mystery box being set up. Valentine thinks he's done worse than what Davis did, so far we haven't seen anything like that.

As for the revelation about Vi's past, I was hoping there was a bit more to it than the scene at the police station. It only confirmed my suspicions that Valentine saved Vi, and it led to a fight. I'm not sure if a dog was present the last time she got a panic attack.

 

[RoryTate]

I just played through the part where Els talks to Vi. Els really showed her colors there, it really is a game to her. She's mentioned that a few times, including to Valentine. Yeah, I'd rather not be a pawn.

To be honest, the Els/Vi interaction you are referencing here is the scene that cemented Els as "best girl" for me. Relationships are always a competition of some kind in the real world, so saying she is playing a "game" to win the MC's love ultimately says nothing about her.

More importantly though, if anyone thinks that Els is selfish and/or abusive in some way, then let me tell you, as horrible as a "mean girl" can be to a guy, they're always ten times worse to other women. That's the true gauge for spotting awful female behaviour. Especially if they are malicious enough to see that girl as an obstacle on their way to a man's affection. If Els was putting on an act (and that is a big if as far as I'm concerned), and she was truly not a nice person underneath, then she would have taken an inexperienced and shy girl like Vi and just eaten her up and spat her out without a second thought. Again, let's consider what we didn't see in this scene. There was no comment like: "You've grown into such a beautiful young woman, Vi, despite what happened to you." Ouch. We didn't see that type of negging from Els, subconsciously reminding Vi of her scars, and attempting to undercut her self-confidence. Or if you think that's bad, how about: "Before you try to win Valentine's heart, make sure you borrow my razor and get rid of that hair on your chin. Oh...sorry. My bad, that's not facial hair. Oh well, I'm sure he'll get used to it." Double ouch. Now that one is obviously too direct of an insult, but Vi's weakness is clear, and a truly awful person could easily find dozens of ways to try and destroy her through pointing out the unimportant and superficial blemishes she carries on her face and elsewhere.

But what actually happened in this scene? Well, instead we get Els giving Vi what I can only describe as an adult version of a pep talk. It is full of good advice, by encouraging Vi to fight for what she wants, and telling her to share her honest feelings with MC. That's...kind of wholesome. Personally, I saw this as Els supporting Vi in a direct way, because Els wants other women to become independent and confident too. Yes, she was honest about her own intentions to win that contest, but the bits of dialog you refer to as "warnings" to Vi have to be considered in context:

("Be careful Gingersnap, I play for keeps.", "You really don't know what you're getting into.")

With the first quote, Els is simply saying she isn't going be a pushover. She says she "plays for keeps" only after encouraging Vi to fight for what she wants, so it makes sense that Els would then say that she was going to be fighting her hardest to win the MC as well. And the context of the second quote ("You don't know what you're getting into") is specifically around Vi not understanding who the MC is, so it is part of a much different subject than warning her about some imagined retribution in general. Indeed, Vi doesn't hear it as a threat at all, and she only responds by standing up for herself and noting the many years she spent growing up with the MC as being more important than Els's shorter time spent with him as a coworker.

And as an aside, because this is important, let's actually consider this question of: "Who knows the MC best?". Els's "I'm the better match" is not her saying that MC has changed from war. What Els is noting here is that Vi still sees the MC with the blind adoration of a child. To Vi, the MC is a pristine white knight from out of a fairy tale, while Els instead understands him as a full human being, flaws and all. To Vi, the MC is still stuck in that "apple in a young girl's eye" fantasy of an older boy, which Els recognizes – rightfully – as not serving as a good starting point for a healthy long-term relationship. This is a very strong insight from her. By saying: "You don't understand him like I do" she's actually trying to help Vi, and the MC too, by giving Vi some "tough love" and telling her to grow up and see him with a woman's eyes, or if they do end up together, neither of them are going to be happy in the long run when reality inevitably destroys that illusion.

So yeah, I think we came into that conversation with very different perspectives, and it definitely changed how we viewed Els's actions within it quite significantly. I accept that I could be wrong about who she is, though I think that is not likely. However, if future actions do reveal a more dismissive and completely selfish personality, then I'll be willing to admit that her act fooled me. But that would require some major recontextualization through a strong narrative thrust by the story's author to not break verisimilitude for me. Els has had a lot of opportunities and temptations to go full sociopath if that's what she was truly hiding, but – so far at least – she has shown herself through her actions to be a person of integrity, and so I'm running with that for now.

And while we are at it, does she want to help the MC out of concern, friendship and love or because she can hold on to the hope, that if he can be fixed, she can too.

Your ideas about how Els sees her enjoyment of violence (or at least being drawn to violence out of some morbid curiousity) as something truly disgusting about her, and a serious character flaw only the MC could accept, is an interesting facet of her personality I hadn't really considered. This could indeed be the case, but there's a disconnect that happens here. At this point in the story, without any context for her concern, my honest reaction to this revelation from her would be: "Congratulations. You're an adrenaline junkie. Now let's celebrate by having some more wild and rough sex." Yes, that's a bit of a crass joke about what is probably a touchy subject for her, but right now I can't see why she cares so much about this. You think you're the only person in the world who has twisted thoughts sometimes? Seriously?

I mean, there could be something truly dark behind it all, but I also wonder if it's maybe partly indulgent self-pity that's making it overblown. On the one hand, Els seems too strong-willed to feel sorry for herself over nothing, but on the other hand people can surprise you with their ability to delude themselves.

Actually, this might be a sort of last resort for a smart MC to draw out those secrets from Els. MC: "You know you just sound like you're wallowing in self-pity? Part of me wants to just tell you to snap out of it." Els: "You don't know what I've seen, or what I've been through." MC: "Yeah, I don't. And that's the problem. Until I do, all I can say is to stop feeling sorry for yourself. Because you know what? I'm tired of having to imagine all the horrible memories that would make you put up such huge walls around yourself, all so that I don't 'hurt your feelings'. Look. If you're not ready to talk about it, then I won't make you. But you should understand: it's mentally exhausting for me to live like this."

I just played this part (but plan to reload and watch the video instead).
Valentine isn't hurting a fly, he's not suicidal (though he's not really living yet either), and he's not depressed.

Well, the MC does have long conversations with his two dead friends regularly. Though I understand what you are saying here, because even those particular delusions (whether they are diagnosed as just auditory hallucinations or outright schizophrenia) are not really presented to the reader as an "illness" that he is concerned about. In the story they just sort of...happen. The imagined conversations are used more as a narrative device to avoid relying on excessive flashbacks than anything else. So I feel it doesn't quite land to us readers as representative of his poor mental health. However, even if those interactions are just meant as symbolic and are not an actual psychological issue that is dealt with directly, it's still clear from them that he has things that are bothering him from his past life.

So I don't think that therapy is out of the question here, though a lot of that depends on getting the right kind of therapist. The MC has been dealing reasonably well with his problems so far, at least to my untrained eye. So as long as he gets counseling from someone who recognizes that he is processing things in a "moving into the future" manner (the more "masculine" approach to healing, which is primarily done through being active and by the creation of new memories and experiences) rather than forcing him into a "reminiscing about the past" solution (the more "feminine" approach, realized through talking and the discussion and understanding of existing memories), then I think he can benefit from some professional insight into his situation. That's why I think the "group chat session" stuff at the Center is not a good fit for him. Like most guys, he just leaves long discussions and meetings mentally exhausted and feeling like both they and he were unproductive. Physical training and fighting have clear and tangible outcomes, which from the story have shown to mean more to his mental well-being than endless talking and words.

 

[RoryTate]

No El slander pls.

I know this was very likely made in jest, but as someone who is rocking an Elspeth-exclusive save as their canon playthrough, let me with all seriousness say that I welcome any and all criticism of characters, stories, etc, that I happen to like. If the comment is made in good faith, then well-thought-out critique helps me to better understand why I enjoy something. And if it happens that I'm not able to properly rationalize my position in favour of that character, plot element, etc, then I get to see the stuff that I missed and I learn more about the story just the same. It's a win-win either way.

 

[RoryTate]

A few last interesting topics that I missed addressing in writing out my earlier wall of text:

Els admonishes Valentine for having a wall, while the Centre might very well be a part of her wall. Objectively she's putting good in the world, but what if all the volunteers and vets are just there to validate her sense of self-worth (as the heir), or if she did it out of a sense of guilt?

This is a bit of a philosophical distinction, but the word "altruism" doesn't necessarily involve a detailed deconstruction of base human instincts and motivations. Otherwise, every possible action that a human being can take comes down to: "It makes me feel good", and everything just becomes morally grey. Personally I disagree with that kind of mindset (not saying this is what you believe, I just want to use it to frame my point). Consider the case where Els felt that same sense of guilt and she became overwhelmed and responded by becoming a drug addict, and running from her pain. I would call that response/behaviour "selfish", and at some point "destructive". However, if she instead takes action by pouring herself into volunteer work and trying to make up for the wrongs she feels she has committed, then I call that behaviour "altruistic". I believe this is a very real and important description for us to have in our language, because it is not easy or common that someone reacts with such maturity and so productively for the larger community when they feel strong guilt and possibly even self-hatred over past decisions.

Whatever her emotional needs are that drive her to help others at the Centre, the most important point is that she is actively working to make the world a better place. And maintaining that kind of commitment to volunteer work is not easy. I actually have experience in this type of situation. I spent over 15 years with a specific volunteer organization, and I can count the number of people who kept at it for more than a few months on both of my hands. Helping out the larger community is not work you can do for long because of anger or some other vulgar selfish desire; it takes a strong sense of purpose and personal investment in the activity to persevere for any significant period of time.

Yet she will become heir to the Astair family. I don't really see this, tbh. The way I see it, that status and influence is guaranteed.

Most people living in Elspeth's shoes would have grown up to be a spoiled brat, waving around their money and status as a young adult to get everything in life handed to them on a silver platter. But she chose a much different path. She angered her family by immediately joining the military when out of high school (against their wishes), which risked her future status as their "heir". She worked hard to become her own person – someone who is self-sufficient and does not rely on her family for anything (at least if she can help it). The things she has in her life right now are only those things she has earned, and that is the stark difference I see.

Is she a perfect person? The answer to that is of course no. She has her own flaws and conceits, just the same as any human being.

Are many of her actions laudable and worthy of consideration? I would say the answer to that is most definitely a resounding yes.

 

[parachina]

Hi guys,

Since there is no update from the replay mod, I made a new one:

Gallery Mod:
Update date : 03.10.23
Game version : The Unbroken Pt6

Features:

Spoiler: features

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Installation :

Spoiler: installation

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Feedbacks are welcome ! Oh and if you think that I have missed some scenes, let me know.

any time the MC speaks i get errors:

Full traceback:
File "game/gallery_mod/replays.rpy", line 1881, in script
mc "And what's got you so flustered?"
File "D:\Users\xxx\Downloads\TheUnbroken-Pt.6-pc-compressed (1)\TheUnbroken-Pt.6-pc-compressed\renpy\ast.py", line 678, in execute
who = eval_who(self.who, self.who_fast)
File "D:\Users\xxx\Downloads\TheUnbroken-Pt.6-pc-compressed (1)\TheUnbroken-Pt.6-pc-compressed\renpy\ast.py", line 576, in eval_who
raise Exception("Sayer '%s' is not defined." % who.encode("utf-8"))
Exception: Sayer 'mc' is not defined.

 

[Walter Victor]

Wow! Just... wow! Yup! That's why I joined F95, to read philosophical treatises about the motivations of NPCs in a porn game!

I wonder, though, what Descartes would say about this.

 

[cxx]

Wow! Just... wow! Yup! That's why I joined F95, to read philosophical treatises about the motivations of NPCs in a porn game!

I wonder, though, what Descartes would say about this.

he'd have died already due stroke or would be happily fapping.

 

[Defenestrator.for.traitor]

Wow! Just... wow! Yup! That's why I joined F95, to read philosophical treatises about the motivations of NPCs in a porn game!

I wonder, though, what Descartes would say about this.

Descartes says “I now seem to be able to lay it down as a general rule that whatever I perceive very clearly and distinctly is true”, so I'd think he would have avoid to make a comment for an unfinished business due to lack of clarity.

 

[Bombmaster]

Maybe I'm missing reading about Els competitive streak and turning everything into a game, should it be so strange for someone coming from a very successful family that in a way to compartalize she turned this competitive environment in a game to keep a degree of sanity and maybe having a little fun.