Ren'Py Summertime Saga [v21.0.0 wip.4468] [Kompas Productions]

[irrelevantname]

Do you feel bad for people who often give money to buskers? Because that's effectively what this is.



This is incorrect. It hasn't even been 5 months since the 17.0 release, let alone the 17.5 release.

We're halfway through the 4th month of 2019. The 0.18 update was released before christmas. Sir, are you on psychedelic drugs?

 

[dirgetka]

Lads:

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[seraphimd2]

tl;dr waaaaaay below.

I'm patiently waiting for the release of the next update, like I always have done. Sure, I can't wait (figuratively) but I have too much respect for the process to understand how people can be so enraged and obtuse.

The team earns 52.000 dollars a month (according to posts above). That looks a like a lot of money, but so many people see this number and just think one person gets it, or it entitles them to rage against everything.

But let's take a more rational approach at this budget, shall we, and pretend that Kompas Productions is a business (which it is)?

Disclaimer: I'm no expert, but I'm trying to look at the budget rationally. I've worked from home for six years, having to manage costs for my own utilities and office supplies, so I know a little bit about these costs at least.
Also I would like to state that the costs I present are either an acceptable minimum (like 80 dollars for an office chair, and 500 dollars for a laptop). The actual costs for a company are likely to be much higher. Food is also calculated at a minimum, and so are utilities. Taxes are only calculated for persons, not for the company itself. Meaning that the number people take home in these calculations is most likely too high (that is, people probably take home less than described here).
Lastly, I've calculated in the way that each employee gets exactly the same amount of money.


How much does Kompas actually get from Patreon?
Patreon takes a 5% cut of the $52000, so that means that (52000 - 2600), 49400 is left

There are 7 people on the team according to the official Summertime Saga page. So that would leave 7057 dollars per person, per month. That's quite a bit of money, but Kompas' employees can't just run about and buy jetskis from that money. Let's see where that money actually goes.


Financial security
Any company that wants to exist further than the project it is currently working on, reserves some of its left-over revenue for later. If Kompas sets aside 10000 dollars a month, it would mean that after two years of saving (=240,000 dollars) they could exist for nearly 5 months (240,000 dollars, using 50,000 dollars a month like they do now). So, setting aside 10,000 dollars a month is not a luxury but a financial safe-guard, incase the company hits a dry spell, all the backers stop paying, or anything else happens unexpectedly that puts them in a financial bind.
Again, this is a minimum of a safe guard (see incalculable costs).


Home office
That would leave 39400 to divide over Kompas' employees. But wait, there is more. We have to consider fair payment of office supplies. Yes, you personally own a computer. Yes, you pay electricity anyway. But what you might not realise is that if you go to an office building to work, these matters are paid for you. That screen that gets replaced every two years? That new desk you get? That office chair? All stuff you need to calculate into your economic model if you work from home. Naturally, you don't need a new office chair every month, and neither do you need a new desktop or laptop, so these costs are divided by 24 months, which is a normal corporate write-off. After this, these supplies are deemed worthless.

Office supplies and utilites:
- Office chair, 80 dollars / 24 = 3.33
- Laptop (basic), 500 dollars /24 = 20.83
- Desk, 100 dollars /24 = 4.16
- Utilities, 150 dollars a month (an average month of utilities is 100 dollars if at home. Considering you spend 8 hours at work, actively using electricity, heating, and water, this is not a high number. Also included in this is the breaking of lightbulbs, cables, etc.)
- Internet subscription, 50 dollars

Total = 228.32
However, this is per person, so the total write-off per month is 228.32*7 = 1598,24

Leaving us with 39400-1598 = 37800

Again, this is considering the minimum. This is about the cheapest office chair and desk from your local Ikea, a budget segment laptop, etc. It also doesn't include a mouse, drawing tablet, keyboard, lamps, paper, pens, etc. etc. While technically you could make due with the noted above, it's really not a comfortable work space.
Considering a company can dodge VAT, you'd have to add 50% to all prices to be at a comfortable place (for example a 1000 dollar laptop, retail value).


Death and Taxes
So, that leaves 5400 dollars per person, per month, which comes down to 64800 per year, per person. After taxes, that leaves roughly 52,000 dollars, which means they have 4300 dollars a month to spend.

As put in the disclaimer, the number per person per month, is calculated without first calculating corporate taxes. The actual number any employee takes home is much likely lower (see below).


Incalculable costs
I'm sure I missed a lot, and again, I'm no expert. 4300 dollars a month might seem a lot of money (and it is, to a lot of people, yours truly included), but what I haven't written about yet, and what cannot be calculated in terms of money, is the risk involved. Each project that takes a considerable time of one's life, without financial guarantee, must be accounted for with a higher financial return. Kompas needs a lot of cashflow to sustain itself, for a number of good reasons.
We also haven't discussed potential growth (new employees, centralised office, servers, etc.), sick leave, pension plans, etc. Then there are the future projects, which might need a jump start before additional investors can be found, and of course the number of hours Kompas actually worked without getting a single cent. Don't forget, Summertime Saga didn't always get 52000 dollars on Patreon a month. I'm sure that, for a long time, before Kompas was on Patreon, it already existed in some form, and consumed a lot of time or energy. Sure, this might have been a hobby, but it's really not a bad thing to get paid for it in the end.


Addition and criticisms welcome
Please, take all of this, read it through, correct it, add stuff, and reupload it yourself.


Final thoughts
What I have calculated here is what I believe is the minimum Kompas needs to run the company proficiently, in the most minimalist way. The office supplies used make for an uncomfortable setting. The safeguard in place is severely lacking. There is no plan in case of illness, no pension plan, no insurances. Take this into account too!
Personally, I think that whatever Kompas is making, they deserve. So far, they haven't hidden any content of the game behind a paywall, and let those who can't afford it, or don't want to, play the game for free. The backers make this possible, and for that I am thankful. It's also a choice by Kompas, and a sign of trust in its fan base. I'm sure that such a thing is not easy to do, because you have a more direct dependancy on your followers.
I wrote all of this because I'm growing more and more tired of the way this discussion loses all substance. There are people that think Kompas is getting way too much money, and all they do is yell that people should stop paying. The other side argues against them sometimes, or asks them to stop visiting the forum if they don't care. Why the former do keep yelling that everyone should stop paying still baffles me.
I hope this discussion can remain civil, and grounded in arguments. I'm open to critique (if substantiated by good arguments), and am willing to adjust my view. The view I won't adjust is that I have thoroughly enjoyed Summertime Saga so far, am thankful for all the time and effort its many creators put into it, and that they, in my opinion, deserve every penny they have gotten for it so far.

Thanks for reading!

tl;dr: Does Kompas get a lot of money? Yes, but probably way less than you think because running a company costs money, and they deserve it in my opinion.

Dude your maths is fine but this is 1970s logic. were you sent in with a smoke grenade to say 600k per year is barely enough?

Firstly, its a start up, and no business that starts up just cranks 20% of all profit in a piggy bank for a rainy day, they get a loan and work their guts out to pay it off, so 10k per month back in the numbers please.

So my maths is this:

49400 post patreon Agreed.

The "office" is his basement. his equipment already he had by his own admission and hasnt upgraded. total cost to business 0 dollars.

49400

All other staff (except one) are subcontractors offsite, have their own equipment and cost centres and would most likely invoice for the work they do (which is why its delayed all the time) they dont work on this game full time like him but we'll get back to this as a cost later.

Wife is also "full time" and one of thhe 7, but 0 cost as shes a tax write off and thus apart from drawing a wage has 0 input into business.

49400

OK, so now whats the subbies costing? Writing, is maybe a full 40 hour week in a 4 month dev cycle. US average wage 60k / 52 weeks = $1200

Animator lets say 1K per animation and theres 5-6 per update (max) 6K

Coder, whats a bad coder worth an hour? 100 bucks? 10 hours a week? 1k?

Music SFX guy? well again per music (none in this update) not even on the tracker anymore.

Some dude doing server website and discord. probably work experience and cheap

I actually only see 4 people as "working" having come off the website, 2 of them posing.

Anyhow.... lets say they put in as much effort as Darkcookie, so 1.5 hours 3 days a week (as per stream) so 4.5 hours total at 100 bucks an hour x 2 of them $900 per week.

So total invoices from subbies is per month (over 4 month cycle) is animator 1.5K, coder 4k, website 1k (generous), posing 3.6k. total 10k, hell lets say 15K per month to make it all fair, HELL lets say 20K per month which it sure wont be.....

So we're all clear, even at that:

29400 left.

So we're crystal on this, he's not paying rent, his house is his place of work. his subbies invoice him and this comes off his income pretax, and they carry their own cost centres.

Him and his missus are taking in 29400 per month pre tax or 352K and change, with all the tax benefits of a business at home.

I appreciate your post above, it's well thought out and from a good place in your heart. But dude, you're numbers are not close.

Gotta love it, the dev tracker goes up 2 percent and it's like a bomb went off in here with all the crap flying with the usual moans and complaints. And when the update comes out, 9/10 ppl that have been crying in here about anything and everything they can think of from DC fleecing people with a FREE game, to who knows what else, will shut up for a week 'cause they're playing the game. Until the dev tracker shows progress again, and it's time to start bitching and moaning again, even though most whiners here haven't put a dime into the game.

Hats off to DC, I don't think there is another adult game that creates this kind off buzz. That's just another achievement this game has to its name.

i dont even bother anymore,Judith seems far on the horizon,but the economical administration argument kinda remembered from my classes on the University...good times

 

[seraphimd2]

What bothers me its that people dont realize that there isnt a motive to fight against each other here,we can argument with each other all the time,get scolded by the Mods,and still,people turn back to discussing economics...lets be frank here people,it doesnt matter trying to crack your head about the logistic and numbers behind Kompas work,it really doesnt matter,DC already mentioned and acknowledged that the development isnt anything near perfect(a good number of times too,showing that he is aware of this flaw),but what you guys must understand its that until he decides doing something about it,you guys cant do anything,really,its his decision,if shit goes wrong someday and backfire on him,well,its his problem to deal with...what i dont get it thought is why you guys insist on going apeshit if someone honeycoat or shitsling them,gotta love having the Mods breathing on ya neck to do this so frequently...

 

[Eoin]

Keep it on-topic, lads. If ye want to chat about stuff not SS, go to off topic or PMs.

 

[mattius77]

I'm not quite sure what is more amusing:

That we're 2 1/2 years into what I regard as the best h-game I've ever played, and people are still bitching about how much money the dev makes vs how slow the dev cycle is.......

.......or that we've now resorted to forensic economics to justify the money the dev makes and the pace of the dev cycle.

el-oh-el

It is what it is. Accept it or do not. If the former, great... perhaps you can explain to me how an incest pr0n game now has an impregnable cow-lady. If the latter....... well........ you'd be doing yourself and us all a favor if you just moved on.

 

[asraa]

I bet that 0.19 version will come out next year.

 

[mattius77]

I was thinking about this earlier today.

There are over a dozen ladies that MC can get busy with, most of which are 'unlockable' in the same save, plus a (thankfully) one-timer. In addition there are like 2-3 other ladies that have repeatable h-scenes that aren't full sex but still result in, er, 'completion', and a couple others with lewd content. All at the same period of time, with I think like 5 or 6 more in the pipeline (no pun intended).

I was no slouch before I got married, but I have to say that's quite a busy 'summer' if you ask me. lol

 

[Laziness]

I was thinking about this earlier today.

There are over a dozen ladies that MC can get busy with, most of which are 'unlockable' in the same save, plus a (thankfully) one-timer. In addition there are like 2-3 other ladies that have repeatable h-scenes that aren't full sex but still result in, er, 'completion', and a couple others with lewd content. All at the same period of time, with I think like 5 or 6 more in the pipeline (no pun intended).

I was no slouch before I got married, but I have to say that's quite a busy 'summer' if you ask me. lol

iirc, the game is set in Summerville. So technically it's 'summertime' ALL the time!

 

[Glorious Cat]

97% !
My body is ready

 

[Automata]

Yes you can. It's call placeholder art, everyone with a brain does this. Most of the coding can be done before getting the art, you have only have point regarding the animation.

Fine let me clarify, they have said in the past they can't do it.

I understand the idea behind placeholder art and have used stand-ins myself when coding. I don't know their workflow or why they said they couldn't do coding without the art. If you're really curious I'm sure you can dig up the discord statement where they referenced this.

 

[diras2010]

okay, we're at the doorstep of the next release, my expectations are mostly in for the v.0.18.5 rather than the v.0.18.0 because generally the first release still has bugs to fix, and a later release has those bugs already patched

said so, i expect to see a improvement in the way the game runs, since a lot of the code has been re-written and just a small part of the old codebase is left to be re-done, as i said before, the v.0.21 would be the starting point of cross-versions saves

i would dare to say tha this release will be ready for the end of April, (v.0.18), the other will be for mid May (v.0.18.5) and the next version (v.0.19) will be for the end of December

 

[dirgetka]

I hope people aren't expecting the update to be anything other than Diane-tier, especially given that it's technically getting split out over 1.5 updates. The only thing in this update that I'm super pumped for is the DEX grind getting untangled from Jenny's progression; actually makes replaying the game from scratch feasible without hanging myself

 

[j4yj4m]

I hope people aren't expecting the update to be anything other than Diane-tier, especially given that it's technically getting split out over 1.5 updates. The only thing in this update that I'm super pumped for is the DEX grind getting untangled from Jenny's progression; actually makes replaying the game from scratch feasible without hanging myself

To be fair, in Diane's case it was clear that she'd only get a revamp and an extension while in Jenny's case there likely won't be that much old content left. I mean, her quest- and storydesign was really bad and the whole DEX thing was just the icing on that cake. I'm fairly certain that replaying her story will feel a lot better compared to Diane, where indeed a lot was changed but most of those changes where so subtle that many probably didn't even care.

Else you'll probably be happy to hear that, according to Dogeek, we'll get a new cheat mode in which all stats are done. So there won't be any stat grinds for replays anymore.

 

[Genji]

From 3 update to 2 update,what a suprise

 

[Gguga12]

97% !
My body is ready

View attachment 285839

Soon

 

[McSlut]

CURSE YOU MIA AND EVE FANATICS!!! MY WAIFU JUDITH DESERVES AN UPDATE!!!Also Banana if you are reading this, don't hate on Judith.

i feel personally attacked by this post, let me tell you this.. if judith wants to win maybe dc needs to make her lose a couple pounds, as long as this doesn't happen i'm gonna keep voting for my two favourite summertime saga waifus eve and mia.

 

[Badjourasmix]

i feel personally attacked by this post, let me tell you this.. if judith wants to win maybe dc needs to make her lose a couple pounds, as long as this doesn't happen i'm gonna keep voting for my two favourite summertime saga waifus eve and mia.

WOW bro not cool. Fat shaming in 2019.

 

[Steve3444]

It's a perfectly fine preference not to be attracted to fat people

 

[PatreonTed]

We're halfway through the 4th month of 2019. The 0.18 update was released before christmas. Sir, are you on psychedelic drugs?

No, but are you? 18.0 has not been released yet.

17.0 was released November 23rd so five months would be April 23rd. The OP posted before that, which means it has not yet been five months since 17.0 has been released.