VN Ren'Py Superhuman [v0.99999b] [WeirdWorld]

[DecadentDesires]

The reason that most of us think it's Aos is simply that we understood everything clearly and what this individual said. The apostles speech is usually not fully understood, we also know that the 3rd and 4th are weird in that they mostly work together.

That makes sense. I feel you're probably right. I feel that even if MC was evolving to his fourth stage, he would probably still not understand her completely. But it could just be that Fourth is now trying harder to make herself understood more because she sees MC as having proven his worth so he's now worth the effort of translating too. It could also just be the Eye being more empowered and translating more for MC. He showed during MC's third evolution that he has the power to completely shut out their ability to communicate with MC when he desires(or at least in that moment).

Granted, I am biased. I'm more interested in MC's fourth evolution than Aos and Stephen and Detective Dude's Activities, but there's probably a reason why WW chose to use a Daone Sidhe as basically the last boss of the Monster World Arc so I wouldn't be surprised if it is Aos. I think both Memory's increased involvement in MC's progress and enlightenment on Aos are coming. It's just a matter of when.

 

[DecadentDesires]

Is there any reason to think Henri was lying when he told you so? Also that's Henri not Klaus. Klaus is the mafia kid we killed.

He's talking about when Klaus told Danica that Xanthe Sr wasn't a superhuman in the Mafia arc. Xanthe could still be human. Henri didn't state Xanthe was superhuman if my memory serves right. It's possible he's just using his own private, super high tech to enhance his intellectual capabilities like he helped Alice and Micheal with their... capabilities with a super soldier serum he created, derived from a captured monster corpse(That thing seems dead).

 

[necromater]

 

[RabbidSupreme]

2. Of the five captains, is it ever explained or hinted at how Bernhardt is so absurdly powerful even compared to S+ monsters?

WW actually answered this in a stream a while back, he said that he's the best case scenario for a superhuman. He has the talent, the right mindset, perfect compatibility with his monster parent, finished his trials and was able to reach evo 5 naturally. That and he's been a superhuman for a while now

 

[jjtom000]

He's talking about when Klaus told Danica that Xanthe Sr wasn't a superhuman in the Mafia arc. Xanthe could still be human. Henri didn't state Xanthe was superhuman if my memory serves right. It's possible he's just using his own private, super high tech to enhance his intellectual capabilities like he helped Alice and Micheal with their... capabilities with a super soldier serum he created, derived from a captured monster corpse(That thing seems dead).

You are right. I mixed it up. Henri just said his mind is augmented, but he didn't say if he was a superhuman or not. It was Klaus who said it after they lost Aos.

 

[jjtom000]

WW actually answered this in a stream a while back, he said that he's the best case scenario for a superhuman. He has the talent, the right mindset, perfect compatibility with his monster parent, finished his trials and was able to reach evo 5 naturally. That and he's been a superhuman for a while now

WW said natural evo is not better. He would be even stronger if he used Bramon's serum.

 

[Grimnir098]

WW said natural evo is not better. He would be even stronger if he used Bramon's serum.

Do you have a quote from WW?
Because I'm pretty sure all the serum does is force an evolution, which is important because when an evolution happens is generally just luck.
The serum is neither better nor worse, although if you haven't completed all the prerequisites to reach level 5 and still use the serum, you won't be as strong as if you had completed all the prerequisites.
I think those prerequisites are the trials MC and Michael have been going through recently, and they appear to have their own unique benefits. Michael, for example, being able to absorb the evolution trance mindset so he can have it constantly instead of only shortly after evolving.
That's why the natty level 5s are unbelievably stronger than artificial level 5s.

 

[KyngC]

The people writing the the Superhuman wiki should really add a personality section to each of the different character profiles

 

[Rutonat]

Do you have a quote from WW?
Because I'm pretty sure all the serum does is force an evolution, which is important because when an evolution happens is generally just luck.
The serum is neither better nor worse, although if you haven't completed all the prerequisites to reach level 5 and still use the serum, you won't be as strong as if you had completed all the prerequisites.
I think those prerequisites are the trials MC and Michael have been going through recently, and they appear to have their own unique benefits. Michael, for example, being able to absorb the evolution trance mindset so he can have it constantly instead of only shortly after evolving.
That's why the natty level 5s are unbelievably stronger than artificial level 5s.

The game itself discusses at length of the fact that forcing evolutions isn't the best.
Not only does it carries the risk of failing and the Superhuman going crazy because "they weren't ready", but it also makes it occur before their power and body decide it's time, meaning it can force it to happen before their state matures enough, lowering their strength in the end.
It's literally a plot point that comes back multiple times, that it's not the best shortcut, and that weighing the pros and cons makes it tempting.

Otherwise, the old man would hand them out like candy so that H.E.R.O. can have plenty of strong Superhumans.

 

[RabbidSupreme]

WW said natural evo is not better. He would be even stronger if he used Bramon's serum.

WW later said that those who have the ability to reach level 5 naturally are better than those who can't. So yes if any of the big 3 got the serum they would get more out of their evo, but them being able to do it without means that they were more gifted than those who would've been stuck at level 4 without Xanthe

 

[obibobi]

The game itself discusses at length of the fact that forcing evolutions isn't the best.
Not only does it carries the risk of failing and the Superhuman going crazy because "they weren't ready", but it also makes it occur before their power and body decide it's time, meaning it can force it to happen before their state matures enough, lowering their strength in the end.
It's literally a plot point that comes back multiple times, that it's not the best shortcut, and that weighing the pros and cons makes it tempting.

Otherwise, the old man would hand them out like candy so that H.E.R.O. can have plenty of strong Superhumans.

There's that but that reasoning is more for the main characters, Bramon is only one man and each serum is expensive and time consuming, it needs to be tailor made for the individual, given his view of things, I think he is perfectly willing to hand them out like candy if he had the means and was allowed too, willing to sacrifice some level 1's for a level 2.

Ella said herself that very few Superhumans can reach level 3, let alone level 4 or 5, so most Superhumans simply aren't worth the investment. The MC and his allies are a cut above the rest, most Superhumans are the background characters that Alice was trashing for the Aldians, Michael and Tiffany even with her connections, wouldn't have been granted the serum unless they where the extreme stand outs they are.

 

[SasugaRyzeSama]

There's that but that reasoning is more for the main characters, Bramon is only one man and each serum is expensive and time consuming, it needs to be tailor made for the individual, given his view of things, I think he is perfectly willing to hand them out like candy if he had the means and was allowed too, willing to sacrifice some level 1's for a level 2.

Ella said herself that very few Superhumans can reach level 3, let alone level 4 or 5, so most Superhumans simply aren't worth the investment. The MC and his allies are a cut above the rest, most Superhumans are the background characters that Alice was trashing for the Aldians, Michael and Tiffany even with her connections, wouldn't have been granted the serum unless they where the extreme stand outs they are.

It doesn't need to be tailor-made, it just decreases the chance of evolution going wrong and monsterification if it is. As he said, it's just 100~ something monsters juice, the problem with making it is with monster material more than anything, and that's becoming less and less of a problem lately in the story, so it could be made en masse. Bramon though brilliant is just a man, and whatever he can do can be taught and replicated by another people, he doesn't dance in Voodo mask around the syringes to make it work, he's not essential in making them.

The problem I think isn't with what Bramon is or isn't willing to do is only a part of the matter - H.E.R.O. has more than one person calling the shots, if others are against Bramon making a cystern of it and handing it left and right then he can't do it in any capacity openly, in contrast to the superhumans at their council he have no force argument, and I cannot see him just doing things "I want so I'll do it, fuck you" to spite Malik or Bernhardt without being stopped and put in place in more or less brutal way. And other captains might have reasons to not want it - Malik seems like a person that wouldn't risk lives of other people without minimizing it as much as possible (which takes time), Bernhardt have his reservations with serum at least seeming to be less effective in contrast to natural evolution, others might too. There probably was a vote for that already, and the effect are as seen.

 

[obibobi]

It doesn't need to be tailor-made, it just decreases the chance of evolution going wrong and monsterification if it is. As he said, it's just 100~ something monsters juice, the problem with making it is with monster material more than anything, and that's becoming less and less of a problem lately in the story, so it could be made en masse. Bramon though brilliant is just a man, and whatever he can do can be taught and replicated by another people, he doesn't dance in Voodo mask around the syringes to make it work, he's not essential in making them.

The problem I think isn't with what Bramon is or isn't willing to do is only a part of the matter - H.E.R.O. has more than one person calling the shots, if others are against Bramon making a cystern of it and handing it left and right then he can't do it in any capacity openly, in contrast to the superhumans at their council he have no force argument, and I cannot see him just doing things "I want so I'll do it, fuck you" to spite Malik or Bernhardt without being stopped and put in place in more or less brutal way. And other captains might have reasons to not want it - Malik seems like a person that wouldn't risk lives of other people without minimizing it as much as possible (which takes time), Bernhardt have his reservations with serum at least seeming to be less effective in contrast to natural evolution, others might too. There probably was a vote for that already, and the effect are as seen.

Your arguments is based on the idea of what it's ingredients are and going, those are easy to acquire, so it must be easy to make despite almost every point made within the game saying otherwise. If it was that easy Ella an established genius at this sort of thing wouldn't have needed to break in, Deryl wouldn't have needed so much time to make an inferior version, despite having direct access to the original, Bramon himself said they make time to make and his son, another established super genius said he can't do it. Yes in real life you can replicate someone else's work easily enough with the knowledge and expertise, but Bramon is a brilliant man in a superhero setting, that often means they are essential in making them.

HERO's morales have already shown they would allow it, they are willing to empower willing people, despite their being a small chance of success and a higher chance of death or worse and that many of the Superhumans for Hero are desperate for that serum and would take the risk.

Then you have Sin who only seem to have access to the inferior monsterisation version, this version is only recently perfected, it's clearly more than just shoving monster blood in a syringe.

 

[Ddlc]

There's that but that reasoning is more for the main characters, Bramon is only one man and each serum is expensive and time consuming, it needs to be tailor made for the individual, given his view of things, I think he is perfectly willing to hand them out like candy if he had the means and was allowed too, willing to sacrifice some level 1's for a level 2.

Ella said herself that very few Superhumans can reach level 3, let alone level 4 or 5, so most Superhumans simply aren't worth the investment. The MC and his allies are a cut above the rest, most Superhumans are the background characters that Alice was trashing for the Aldians, Michael and Tiffany even with her connections, wouldn't have been granted the serum unless they where the extreme stand outs they are.

Just after the mafia arc Nico talks with Xanthe about getting the evolution serum for her. Nico is not only a liutenant, but also has a very useful power to keep HERO working, and is considered one of the strongest. Even so she was trying to exchange favors with Xanthe for the serum, so i really don't know the logic behind why some get it or not.
Michael was stuck in lvl 1 for a long time, so i assume it was an investment in someone with potential, Tiffany is the daughter of Dexter, she will definitly have special treatment. Clark and Alexis had them back in their fight against Ella, it seems they were saving the serum for a difficult situation, or maybe unsure about the results. Zack got it to recover from his coma.
I think it's a decision from the high ups of HERO, case by case, and that not all of them take the idea lightly, but if Xanthe is willing to make more superhumans even if he has to sacrifice safety, i don't imagine him caring about giving the serum to more people.

 

[SasugaRyzeSama]

Your arguments is based on the idea of what it's ingredients are and going, those are easy to acquire, so it must be easy to make despite almost every point made within the game saying otherwise. If it was that easy Ella an established genius at this sort of thing wouldn't have needed to break in, Deryl wouldn't have needed so much time to make an inferior version, despite having direct access to the original, Bramon himself said they make time to make and his son, another established super genius said he can't do it. Yes in real life you can replicate someone else's work easily enough with the knowledge and expertise, but Bramon is a brilliant man in a superhero setting, that often means they are essential in making them.

HERO's morales have already shown they would allow it, they are willing to empower willing people, despite their being a small chance of success and a higher chance of death or worse and that many of the Superhumans for Hero are desperate for that serum and would take the risk.

Then you have Sin who only seem to have access to the inferior monsterisation version, this version is only recently perfected, it's clearly more than just shoving monster blood in a syringe.

Ella isn't a genius, she has a lot of knowledge about monsters, their powers and apostles that she either learned herself or was taught, if the serum or its equivalent was already used somewhere, she probably would knew. But to our current knowledge it was not, Bramon was probably the first being ever to develop it and apply to others. Not that it didn't happen before, but that it was made not on accident, and recognized as such. Consider MC - his third evo was triggered by the similar mechanism as his serum, lots of different monster material, but MC didn't even realize that until Bramon explained it to him. Without that it would probably be lost to time. Now, the serum is lots of monster parts in a syringe, and as evident by MC reacting to exactly that, if you're lucky it works without monsterification, but I think the intent put into it is the exact ratios and preparation, with over a hundred different monster species mixed finding the one needed for an individual is the problem and time-consuming part, not the making it at all.

And yeah, I'd agree his expertise and, well, his very own brain and mind was essential in developing the serum over the years, that when you already know how to do it, then it can be taught. And Tanos said he can't make it, true too. But, do he know the mechanism behind it? He very well might not, and that's what is stopping him from making one, certainly not etics or lack of monsters. Deryl might know how to do it, but the way of determining the ratios or some other mechanism wasn't given to him by Bramon. Why wouldn't he do it then? Well, why won't anyone else gamble someone's life, their close friends to boot on something that might quite possibly fail. All speculations on my part, yes, but not without premises.

 

[PerpetuallyAmiss]

WW said natural evo is not better. He would be even stronger if he used Bramon's serum.

More accurate I think, is that artificial isn't weaker and the sooner you reach level 5 the better in terms of accruing power. Might disqualify you from trials though depending on what they are.

 

[hsuaisbsjsh]

Just after the mafia arc Nico talks with Xanthe about getting the evolution serum for her. Nico is not only a liutenant, but also has a very useful power to keep HERO working, and is considered one of the strongest. Even so she was trying to exchange favors with Xanthe for the serum, so i really don't know the logic behind why some get it or not.
Michael was stuck in lvl 1 for a long time, so i assume it was an investment in someone with potential, Tiffany is the daughter of Dexter, she will definitly have special treatment. Clark and Alexis had them back in their fight against Ella, it seems they were saving the serum for a difficult situation, or maybe unsure about the results. Zack got it to recover from his coma.
I think it's a decision from the high ups of HERO, case by case, and that not all of them take the idea lightly, but if Xanthe is willing to make more superhumans even if he has to sacrifice safety, i don't imagine him caring about giving the serum to more people.

i mean nico is basically immune to anyone power if she grows to where she can teleport planets. like what will happen if she teleports the planet to that dimension the portal ring teleported mc to in the dead end where he tried to attack Charlie or if she teleported it into the middle of the strength eater ocean? heck and if she cant teleport planets she could maybe teleport the core if she grows strong enough

 

[Rutonat]

There's that but that reasoning is more for the main characters, Bramon is only one man and each serum is expensive and time consuming, it needs to be tailor made for the individual, given his view of things, I think he is perfectly willing to hand them out like candy if he had the means and was allowed too, willing to sacrifice some level 1's for a level 2.

Ella said herself that very few Superhumans can reach level 3, let alone level 4 or 5, so most Superhumans simply aren't worth the investment. The MC and his allies are a cut above the rest, most Superhumans are the background characters that Alice was trashing for the Aldians, Michael and Tiffany even with her connections, wouldn't have been granted the serum unless they where the extreme stand outs they are.

If the fact Bramon is alone was the issue, they'd have started producing them a lot faster with Deryl's help.
There's a lot more afoot than "Bramon is just one man and materials are rare", clearly.

More accurate I think, is that artificial isn't weaker and the sooner you reach level 5 the better in terms of accruing power. Might disqualify you from trials though depending on what they are.

Imma press X to doubt.
The natural method ensures the superhuman has had time to master their power correctly and cultivate it. Evolving too soon means not having the same mastery and experience. Plus, evolutions magnify the strength already present, so forcing an evolution too quickly would mean magnifying a lesser strength, thus leading to a lower total once at Level 5, in all logic.
Otherwise, if the end result was to be the same strength, some high ranks would have been made Level 5 years ago solely based on their specific power being highly useful.

 

[Grimnir098]

The game itself discusses at length of the fact that forcing evolutions isn't the best.
Not only does it carries the risk of failing and the Superhuman going crazy because "they weren't ready", but it also makes it occur before their power and body decide it's time, meaning it can force it to happen before their state matures enough, lowering their strength in the end.
It's literally a plot point that comes back multiple times, that it's not the best shortcut, and that weighing the pros and cons makes it tempting.

Otherwise, the old man would hand them out like candy so that H.E.R.O. can have plenty of strong Superhumans.

All evolutions carry the risk of failing, and it's not like you suddenly evolve just because you're ready for it. The serum can make you evolve before you're ready, but so can other things. Kenny evolved with literally a power of 1, and clearly he wasn't ready.
Also, it doesn't lower your power to evolve early, it's actually better in terms of power accumulation. It might cut off certain abilities you could have developed, or make those abilities weaker, but I don't think we actually have confirmation on that.

All in all, the serum isn't worse than a natural evolution. It's arguably better because mental stability is important for a safe evolution, meaning you can take it when you're calm and mentally prepared.

 

[Grimnir098]

Plus, evolutions magnify the strength already present, so forcing an evolution too quickly would mean magnifying a lesser strength, thus leading to a lower total once at Level 5, in all logic.
Otherwise, if the end result was to be the same strength, some high ranks would have been made Level 5 years ago solely based on their specific power being highly useful.

You also accumulate power more quickly at a higher level. I'm pretty sure it's specifically stated in-game that reaching a higher level is better.

The reason people aside from the Big Three weren't level 5 earlier is because Xanthe hadn't created the serum. Lexi and Clark were literally testing it, and only used it because they needed level 5 to defeat Ella.