Personally I hard disagree on this, if there's a "tag" I avoid like the plague in AVNs is the "Kinetic Novel" one, this tbh also applies to most videogames, it's rare for me to enjoy story heavy games where I have zero agency on the story (and protagonist).
The reason behind it is simple, good writers usually end up being that, good writers, some turn to script writing, but not really writers of AVNs, or for that matter videogames in general.
I don't want to undermine the writing skills of the folks writing AVNs (also because I have the writing skills of an amoeba), but I have yet to find a single one that I would consider worth reading on its own as a book/story.
What's the issue one might add? I like to immerse myself in the stories/games/movies/etc.. (yes even on the fap material hehe) I approach, and if I'm to experience it through the eyes of someone who's not me, that someone and the story have to be written VERY well.
AVNs and games provide a level of agency (via choices/mechanics/game loops) that "fills in" for their lack of great storytelling and allows me to immerse in them in a different way.
That said:
- This is of course a personal opinion
- I do agree that is generally easier/better to avoid 300 story paths/alternatives
- A story has to have a "core"/leitmotif anyway and reach its conclusion.
Well said, but I agree with you more than might be apparent. I was not saying that the game would be better if it more closely resembled a kinetic novel. I actually agree that most kinetic novels end up being boring, and I often end up skipping through them, because as you said, the writing ends up being not all that great. And in general, I actually don't expect the craziest, most brilliant stories in these games. What I do hope for is that a developer has a solid idea of where the story is heading and keeps the plot moving along; by keeping the plot moving along, the dev will then be able to add sexy scenes at a decent pace. A broken story will hold sexy scenes hostage.
I repeat,
a broken story will hold sexy scenes hostage. And one way a dev can break his/her story and get lost is by adding a bunch of branching paths. Branching paths do offer potential for variety and immersion, but as you say with the story element (that it is often done poorly), I see devs often messing up their choice-based games. (Judging by point #3 in your second comment, I think you sorta agree with this.)
I will also avoid an adult game where its story might seem decent but its very setup ensures that the sexy scenes cannot be added until months and months into development (like in slowwww corruption games). I've made the point in other game threads that if a developer is making a game and story like this, he's got the wrong kind of plot working. As you implied, we're not here just for the stories; nor are we just here for the sexy scenes.
I agree that establishing some form of agency is critical; I find games with agency feel much more immersive and alive. But as I said in my previous post, I think the detective work is more than adequate in providing the immersion factor. In these adult games, I think there are three main pillars: story, sexy scenes, and gameplay style. But regarding gameplay, there aren't many options, and adult games usually fall into one of three styles: choice-based system, puzzle or minigame system, or sandbox style system where the MC has to grind stats. My personal preference is for a puzzle or minigame system, as I think this option best lets a developer tailor gameplay to reflect a game's story world and plot.
I agree that a choice-based system might provide some sense of agency and therefore immersion, but this potential benefit seems outweighed by so many potential cons. For example, in a choice-based game, often huge swaths of awesome sexy scenes might be skipped by a player's choices, forcing the player to play a second playthrough to see those other scenes. Often, I'll be presented will multiple hot girls, but then I'm forced to choose one to pursue--like, c'mon, dammit! These games require second playthroughs, but I never slow down and embrace them again as I did in the first playthrough; rather, I usually skip through all the text/dialogue and input the correct choices for the girl I'm after (according to some walkthrough), all to quickly get those scenes that were initially denied.
In a game such as Tenebris, the player would also have to wade back through all the detective work. This would be exceptionally tedious.
To add variety, I would prefer to see easter eggs, like stuff the player could hunt down if he wants to, stuff that would lead to side scenes. NLT Media's kamasutra pages come to mind. But adding choiced-based narrative elements, in my opinion, pose too great a risk of cluttering the game.
But this conversation might be largely unnecessary. So far, I've had the sense that Honey Tales understands the importance of the three main foundations in adult games (story, adult scenes, and gameplay) and likely has a good sense in how to balance them all. He's hinted at interesting plot points on his Patreon, leading me to believe he's likely a cut above other devs in understanding and appreciating what a good story is, and his comments on having some choice-based elements lead me to think that he knows their potential pitfalls. That is, he's already aware of all the nuance inherent in these games, and knows how important it is to balance everything.
But thanks for your detailed comments! Nice to hear such well-worded perspectives from other peeps.
