Ren'Py The Bite: Revenant [v0.9322] [madmate.games]

[Olsens.M]

One reason people don't like such choices is because in a way that's not a choice at all - if you can't continue after making a choice, it doesn't count as a story choice, because then there's no more story. Choices are for offering alternative stories. If a character is meant to die, then there must be a story for why he dies, and the consequences, enough story to make people want to choose it. The story didn't stop when Gandalf or Harry or those in the Avengers died, it carries on after that for quite a bit (and they came back anyway but I know that's not the point), because the deaths are telling a story, and don't serve as an ending.

Reloading isn't part of the story, by choosing the only option to carry on, that makes it the only canon option. Games with death as wrong choices have to serve a purpose, for example Telltale-style games with a wrong set of choices leading to a permanent death, which has lasting consequences and narrative importance, and referenced later in the game. Games that have death as "try again" only serve a mechanical purpose, which is not needed for a story with no difficulty components. Story-wise, the deaths did not happen, there are no timelines in which the deaths happened. The worst CYOA books were the ones that only had one correct path and other choices leading to 1-page ends. Just wasting everybody's time trying to remember where that previous page was. Even then, 1 page is more than a straight game over.

Having a wrong choice is good for storytelling, if you follow up and actually tell a story, not just "try again".

If we compare Mario's game with this VN it would go like this...

Mario took the choice to jump in a tube and died. In Mario's game, you can try to jump again (go through the same choice) and succeed.

Now If we take Mario's jump situation to this VN, he would have only 2 choices, jump or not to jump. If mario jumps it is certain that mario WILL die. If mario do not jump, he won't die, but he won't move from where he is standing.

How does this guy compare Super Mario's game to a VN and after writing a lot of shit he says his ideas are hard to refute?

 

[Olsens.M]

Of course you are allowed. But as I included last in my last reply while you answering (i mentioned this so you may not have seen it), it is very different for a choice to be a bad choice one dislikes than to criticize it as a game design flaw. You are using future knowledge to criticize the choice. With future knowledge, the choice is trivial, from a maximizing results point of view, not immersion.

If anything, immersion taken to the extreme suggest you do what you did, your story in The Bite ended. But you could take the same approach in any game. Take any standard game that has battle choices, first person shooter, rpgs, pokemon whatever.. we usually die and reload.. or do you only finish games in which you never die?

The thing about the games you mentioned is. you die for a reason. You die because you were not skilled enough, you didn't have the best gear, your aim isn't good enough, you didnt jump in the right place (as someone mentioned Super mario bros games). You died in those games because you were not good enough or made a mistake in the battle, but you did battle, and you "reload" to battle again, and again and again, and again. This game is telling you, hey DO NOT FIGHT, DO NOT BATTLE, YOU CAN'T BATTLE IN THIS GAME OR YOUR ONLY OUTCOME IS TO DIE. The other games you choose to battle because you can best your enemy and win.
This comment and comparision is so stupid. This game has no battle feature, it is a story that tells you that if you choose to battle you will die, end of story. If you wanna proceed, be a pussy and surrender. So I understand him, he died, he chose the path he wanted and he is ok with it. He played 30 minutes of the game, died and can't go further. So he should play other games.
The same as me. I previously chose the traits that would give me strength, power, survivability, agility and my MC would have some MMA knowledge, he wouldn't be a master, but would have some knowledge, and it was never important in the game. For being a fighter, a survivor, he tried to fight from her grasp and died. So farewell to Natsu - The dragonslayer, my MC. We are dead.

 

[Olsens.M]

FunFuntomes

 

[Ayhsel]

The thing about the games you mentioned is. you die for a reason. You die because you were not skilled enough, you didn't have the best gear, your aim isn't good enough, you didnt jump in the right place (as someone mentioned Super mario bros games). You died in those games because you were not good enough or made a mistake in the battle, but you did battle, and you "reload" to battle again, and again and again, and again. This game is telling you, hey DO NOT FIGHT, DO NOT BATTLE, YOU CAN'T BATTLE IN THIS GAME OR YOUR ONLY OUTCOME IS TO DIE. The other games you choose to battle because you can best your enemy and win.
This comment and comparision is so stupid. This game has no battle feature, it is a story that tells you that if you choose to battle you will die, end of story. If you wanna proceed, be a pussy and surrender. So I understand him, he died, he chose the path he wanted and he is ok with it. He played 30 minutes of the game, died and can't go further. So he should play other games.
The same as me. I previously chose the traits that would give me strength, power, survivability, agility and my MC would have some MMA knowledge, he wouldn't be a master, but would have some knowledge, and it was never important in the game. For being a fighter, a survivor, he tried to fight from her grasp and died. So farewell to Natsu - The dragonslayer, my MC. We are dead.

Bla bla bla... "I am a super macho man.. No matter how many times I was told in game I was super week and my enemy was strong, that she could rip us to dead, that she was a psycho bitch, that we were just born and this is a dangerous world, If i choose to fight I should win cause I am a macho man... i mean, I chose all the fighting skills, fuck lord I even have "some MMA knowledge" which should be as useful fighting a vampire as a toothbrush in a katana fight.. so why is a super powerful bitch that in lore is supposed to be able to defeat me... able to defeat me?"

Seriously read what you wrote...

So no.. it is not my comment that is stupid. In fact it has nothing to do with that. My comment has to do with the critique about a game design.

You are simply sad the choice you wanted to make does not lead to what you want. Stop bitching about it and accept it is what it is.

 

[Vidal the king of Pervert]

The thing about the games you mentioned is. you die for a reason. You die because you were not skilled enough, you didn't have the best gear, your aim isn't good enough, you didnt jump in the right place (as someone mentioned Super mario bros games). You died in those games because you were not good enough or made a mistake in the battle, but you did battle, and you "reload" to battle again, and again and again, and again. This game is telling you, hey DO NOT FIGHT, DO NOT BATTLE, YOU CAN'T BATTLE IN THIS GAME OR YOUR ONLY OUTCOME IS TO DIE. The other games you choose to battle because you can best your enemy and win.
This comment and comparision is so stupid. This game has no battle feature, it is a story that tells you that if you choose to battle you will die, end of story. If you wanna proceed, be a pussy and surrender. So I understand him, he died, he chose the path he wanted and he is ok with it. He played 30 minutes of the game, died and can't go further. So he should play other games.
The same as me. I previously chose the traits that would give me strength, power, survivability, agility and my MC would have some MMA knowledge, he wouldn't be a master, but would have some knowledge, and it was never important in the game. For being a fighter, a survivor, he tried to fight from her grasp and died. So farewell to Natsu - The dragonslayer, my MC. We are dead.

I am not very smart so keep that in mind but isn't it true that older the vampire is the stronger they are

I mean I'm not saying it's impossible for the MC to beat an older vampire

but for right now in the story it would be absolutely ridiculous for a new vampire to beat a much older and more experienced vampire without more training and unlocking more of his abilities or some special power that
he doesn't know he has yet


but on a more important side note

Spoiler

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[Abhai]

but on a more important side note

Spoiler

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just you

 

[JoeTheMC84]

I am not very smart so keep that in mind but isn't it true that older the vampire is the stronger they are

I mean I'm not saying it's impossible for the MC to beat an older vampire

but for right now in the story it would be absolutely ridiculous for a new vampire to beat a much older and more experienced vampire without more training and unlocking more of his abilities or some special power that
he doesn't know he has yet


but on a more important side note

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Never saw the scene, but Emilia is hot so, I don't blame you, whatever gets you going...

 

[Tumai]

much like the loss to Emelia in this game, you take a loss against Malak resulting in Bastila getting captured no matter what you do or how good a player you are.

Exactly. However, judging by some of the comments here, there must be dudes here who never surrendered their names like a wuss to captain whats-his-name and walked meekly to the chopping block, only to be saved by a dragon attack completely out of their agency in Slyrim. Nope by trying and trying again, they chewed through the rope bindings with their teeth and slaughtered everybody in Helgen with thier bare hands and got clean away under their own agency.

By pure l33t skills their Kratos (God of War 2) never got killed by Zeus, skipping the Underworld level altogether and won the game there and then.

Despite Bioware categorically confirming that any attempt to sleep with Morinth (Mass Effect 2) would result in death and an instant game over, somehow, somewhere, someone, by reloading 546 times and big dose of sheer machismo must have survived it.

 

[cxx]

Never saw the scene, but Emilia is hot so, I don't blame you, whatever gets you going...

hot and deadly.

 

[JoeTheMC84]

Exactly. However, judging by some of the comments here, there must be dudes here who never surrendered their names like a wuss to captain whats-his-name and walked meekly to the chopping block, only to be saved by a dragon attack completely out of their agency in Slyrim. Nope by trying and trying again, they chewed through the rope bindings with their teeth and slaughtered everybody in Helgen with thier bare hands and got clean away under their own agency.

By pure l33t skills their Kratos (God of War 2) never got killed by Zeus, skipping the Underworld level altogether and won the game there and then.

Despite Bioware categorically confirming that any attempt to sleep with Morinth (Mass Effect 2) would result in death and an instant game over, somehow, somewhere, someone, by reloading 546 times and big dose of sheer machismo must have survived it.

I completely forgot about the Morinth death scene, that's almost a perfect analog for this.

 

[JJJ84]

Bla bla bla... "I am a super macho man.. No matter how many times I was told in game I was super week and my enemy was strong, that she could rip us to dead, that she was a psycho bitch, that we were just born and this is a dangerous world, If i choose to fight I should win cause I am a macho man... i mean, I chose all the fighting skills, fuck lord I even have "some MMA knowledge" which should be as useful fighting a vampire as a toothbrush in a katana fight.. so why is a super powerful bitch that in lore is supposed to be able to defeat me... able to defeat me?"

Seriously read what you wrote...

So no.. it is not my comment that is stupid. In fact it has nothing to do with that. My comment has to do with the critique about a game design.

You are simply sad the choice you wanted to make does not lead to what you want. Stop bitching about it and accept it is what it is.

Yeah.
And not to mention the fact that dev already has a set structure of how his whole story will flow.
Assigning points to fighting skills/stats and expecting just cause that option is there in terms of gameplay, it will influence how already set and fixed events turn out in the main VN aspects of the story and the set lore.

lol as if that will actually happen.

Seriously, it's comedy seeing people get upset about this, when this game is not the only one in this site which implements such choice mechanic (where a wrong choice ends up in instant game over/abrupt ending).

 

[Arigon]

I completely forgot about the Morinth death scene, that's almost a perfect analog for this.

heh
I forgot to remove myself from updates so I get sucked back in by comments like this one.

In BG3 (Balder's Gate 3) you supposedly MUST resurrect a character GALE or game over. I proved that wrong. While that goes against this, I thought I would throw it out there.

for what it is worth, my issue with the game, and why I have stopped playing, had nothing to do with the death scene happening, it was rather the sum total of flawed logic, total mess ups by the author such as beating heart and breathing when they had already pointed out that was not necessary during the visit to the doctor and the smell there, and a number of other errors and logical flaws. Logical flaws are why I almost stopped BaDIK even though I bought that game, so with this, it was easier.

I also offered my services to this author lol.

Peace

 

[Hildegardt]

And not to mention the fact that dev already has a set structure of how his whole story will flow.

Not even pure text adventures have that much freedom to allow the player to defeat an antagonist the second time you ever see them. I don't think people actually expect major branching like that at this point in the story and if they do then they just shouldn't.
The way I see it, the only alternative would be to have no options to choose from. So why not just enjoy a fun gore scene, before rolling back a few screens and moving on with the game? It's such a weird hang-up.

 

[Arigon]

I am not very smart so keep that in mind but isn't it true that older the vampire is the stronger they are

I mean I'm not saying it's impossible for the MC to beat an older vampire

but for right now in the story it would be absolutely ridiculous for a new vampire to beat a much older and more experienced vampire without more training and unlocking more of his abilities or some special power that
he doesn't know he has yet


but on a more important side note

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

In general, if using VtM which this author clearly attempts to use concepts from, your statement is true. Older generally equals more powerful.
However, if your younger vampire is sired by an extremely low generation (close to the clan founder) vampire, then you are what VtM called a "Pretender". Essentially, you are far far more powerful than you otherwise would be, and compared to the average vampire of 8th to 13th generation, you will exceed their powers pretty dramatically.

I can offer specific examples if needed, but basically 2 things determine the power of a vampire
Age
Generation
Generation makes more of an immediate difference in terms of powers and limits, and Age generally means higher levels of skills though even that can be challenged.

Peace

 

[Ragnar]

I am not very smart so keep that in mind but isn't it true that older the vampire is the stronger they are

I mean I'm not saying it's impossible for the MC to beat an older vampire

but for right now in the story it would be absolutely ridiculous for a new vampire to beat a much older and more experienced vampire without more training and unlocking more of his abilities or some special power that
he doesn't know he has yet


but on a more important side note

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Guro is not my thing but the scene was great imo.

 

[Vidal the king of Pervert]

Guro is not my thing but the scene was great imo.

Guro God damn it I'm not into Guro too I was talking about how bad ass she looked in that scene that is what turns me on

 

[Vidal the king of Pervert]

In general, if using VtM which this author clearly attempts to use concepts from, your statement is true. Older generally equals more powerful.
However, if your younger vampire is sired by an extremely low generation (close to the clan founder) vampire, then you are what VtM called a "Pretender". Essentially, you are far far more powerful than you otherwise would be, and compared to the average vampire of 8th to 13th generation, you will exceed their powers pretty dramatically.

I can offer specific examples if needed, but basically 2 things determine the power of a vampire
Age
Generation
Generation makes more of an immediate difference in terms of powers and limits, and Age generally means higher levels of skills though even that can be challenged.

Peace

thank you so much like I said before I can't read so whenever somebody teaches me something I'd never had the chance to learn I'm happy

 

[JoeTheMC84]

thank you so much like I said before I can't read so whenever somebody teaches me something I'd never had the chance to learn I'm happy

 

[Arigon]

that is an offensive and shitty post

 

[Canto Forte]

The whole margholis mansion mission was offensive and shitty to Mc and to the players.
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