Ren'Py The Bite: Revenant [v0.9322] [madmate.games]

[Hildegardt]

Again, depending on the lore you go by, Vampires don't have working organs. Their body doesn't require sustenance like humans do, and don't produce bodily fluids like humans do. The food we consume, the liquid we drink, all feed our body's "eco system". Without any of that, our body shrivels up and dies. Like a Vampire.

Since they have no working organs, they can't produce the fluids/waste a living body would. They don't urinate or defecate or produce saliva. They can't cry either (depending on the lore you use). They have no bodily fluids cause they have no working organs to produce them. Thus, no cum.

How do they make their vocal cords flap to speak without breathing? Why's the heart the only muscle they can't move?
If we're picking and choosing which body parts function and which don't, why does it have to be the fun ones that don't work?

 

[whichone]

Vampires don't have a heartbeat (depending on the lore you go by). Thus, no blood pumping through their system (the heartbeat you hear is blood pumping through your system via the heart). So blood flow is a problem. No heartbeat, no blood flow. As well, no blood pressure. Thus, no blood flow to get an erection.

As for the desire to have sex, again depending on the lore you go by, Vampires don't have human emotions. They don't have the same drives that humans do as their undeath state deprives them of such things. They pretend to be like humans (with emotions, wants/desires) just to blend in to society. They don't actually crave the things humans do.



Again, depending on the lore you go by, Vampires don't have working organs. Their body doesn't require sustenance like humans do, and don't produce bodily fluids like humans do. The food we consume, the liquid we drink, all feed our body's "eco system". Without any of that, our body shrivels up and dies. Like a Vampire.

Since they have no working organs, they can't produce the fluids/waste a living body would. They don't urinate or defecate or produce saliva. They can't cry either (depending on the lore you use). They have no bodily fluids cause they have no working organs to produce them. Thus, no cum.

Thanks man, that was interesting!
Begs the question, how do they move? Muscles require oxygenated blood flow to work.
Doesn't seem to account for Lilitu of Sumerian myth, Empus & the strige, of Greek myth & the strix of Roman.
They all used sex as a hunting tool & Lilitu ensnared multiple lovers for eternity.
Strige, in Greek, were actually considered living members of the community, rather than undead.

But again, in the end, it's all supernatural. There is no definite proof of any of this, cause it is all fantasy. Make up whatever rules you want or go off what someone else has already made up. None of this matters lol.

Ha ha ha, yeah, true. But if a literary precedent has been set, then it often seems weird if a next story completely changes the premise.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

How do they make their vocal cords flap to speak without breathing? Why's the heart the only muscle they can't move?
If we're picking and choosing which body parts function and which don't, why does it have to be the fun ones that don't work?

Thanks man, that was interesting!
Begs the question, how do they move? Muscles require oxygenated blood flow to work.
Doesn't seem to account for Lilitu of Sumerian myth, Empus & the strige, of Greek myth & the strix of Roman.
They all used sex as a hunting tool & Lilitu ensnared multiple lovers for eternity.

Regarding Lilith, I mean, if you're going off True Blood standards, then sure. But folklore also states Lilith wasn't just a Vampire, but a demon as well. So... half & half lol. Thus her ability to still have a functioning body unlike a "full-blooded" Vampire. Like Blade, with his whole "all the benefits of a Vampire, but none of their weaknesses".

As for the muscles, it's the reason they drink blood. They don't flow blood through their body like normal humans would (pumping via the heart and veins to get a steady blood flow). They manipulate the blood they drink and "move" it to different locations throughout their body to essentially fuel those areas.

Same with speaking. Can't quite talk with a bone dry mouth and tongue. Thus, shifting the blood around in the body to where it is needed. It's all just manipulation of the blood. Vampires master it, and move it around their "corpse" to where they need to use it.

Ha ha ha, yeah, true. But if a literary precedent has been set, then it often seems weird if a next story completely changes the premise.

There is so much Vampire lore out there with different tales on how Vampires "really" are, all from different time periods and lands. With it all being fantasy/myths/tales, there is no way to determine which is the definitive version. It's like a game of telephone. It's going to change as it passes through the generations. I mean heck.... we had sparkly vampires at one point.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

I'm going off the original Lilitu, from Sumerian legend, which gave birth to the Hebrew character, Lilith (Adam's original partner).
Absolutely a demon.
A large amount of early vampires were demons, they often took human form.
As such, they had a working human body.
As I said, in ancient Greek, the strige were considered living members of the community.

So they could, very easily, move that blood to their sexual organs, if they chose to?

I mean, they could, but what purpose would it serve lol? Again, no working organs so no bukkake of Vamp-Jizz™ to coat the ladies with. They would get no release or benefit from it, except for the sole purpose of pleasuring a woman. But it would be the same as her just using a dildo.

Sure it could be used as a tool to seduce a woman with sex to feed on her afterwards. But you'd just be refilling the blood you sacrificed to give yourself a woody in the first place. So a futile effort, when you could of saved that blood for something more useful instead. But more power to ya if you want to go down that path any ways lol.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

Fair point, assuming that they have no nerve endings or physical sensation would make the act of sex rather redundant.

As the human body can keep all other blood related functions running, whilst getting a boner, I would wager that there is far more blood in a human body, than is used to get & maintain an erection.
You'd 100% be in positive equity, by the end.

Well humans have our own blood supply constantly pumping through our body. When we get an erection, we are still keeping that blood in our body. The blood in a human is just constantly pumping throughout. We aren't losing blood for doing certain actions.

Vampires on the other hand, expend the blood they use. Thus the need to keep on feeding. It's their curse. They don't have a steady amount of blood flowing through their body like humans do. The only blood they have, is what they drink. They have to keep on replenishing that blood in order to use it. And when they use it, it "evaporates" so to say.

So when they decide to use that blood for an erection, that blood gets spent. And in order to maintain that erection during the entirety of intercourse, they have to keep spending more and more blood, leaving them in a weakened state from all the blood they lost just maintaining the erection. Thus they need to feed afterwards to regain all that blood they lost. Making the whole act of sex, worthless for them.

Now consider the fact they have to also manipulate that same blood to move their joints and muscles, pretend to be human with breathing and such, along with trying to have sex and keep an erection: That's a lot of blood they have to go through just to pleasure someone.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

That doesn't matter.
There is still more blood in a human body, than there is in an erect dick.
So the vampire who used sex as a hunting tool would absolutely gain more than they spent.

Again, humans don't have to regain their blood. They always have a steady stream of blood in their system. As well, humans don't have to "spend" blood to power parts of their body. Our body just runs off what we already have inside us and "recycles" it.

Vampires aren't just spending a tiny amount of blood to poof up an erection. They have to continuously spend blood to maintain that erection. Depending on how long the act of sex lasts, depends on how much blood they have to spend on that erection.

On top of that, they have to spend blood on their movements. Thrusting actions, gripping, lifting, etc. All those actions that we humans do during sex, Vampires have to spend their blood resources to do them. So not only are they spending blood to maintain an erection during sex, they are also spending blood to control their muscles during the entirety of the sex act.

It's more than just drip feeding a little here and there to your boner. It's the whole act of sex that is draining a Vampire's blood supply. To the simple movements of a kiss, down to the powerful thrusts of the hips, it all costs some amount of blood to put on that performance.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

Mate, it's the expenditure of 130 ml vs income of 5,455 - 6,819 ml.
Even if you multiplied expenditure by 20 (2,600 ml), you'd still be over 100% positive equity.

Ack, why'd you have to go and bring math into it lol?

I have no idea about all of that. We are just talking about a fictional race that requires blood to fuel its body parts. Vampires don't have a steady blood system in their body. Whatever blood they have, is whatever blood they drank before having sex. So it's safe to assume they don't have 100% blood supply in their system like a human does.

Unless they drain a human completely of all their blood before sex, then they are working with less than 100% blood in their system. And unlike humans, they are losing that blood by the second. It doesn't just hang out in their system whenever they want to use it. It is constantly dissolving away. Thus the need to constantly replenish it. The only blood they have in their system is whatever their last meal gave them. And unless they fed literally just before sex, they've already lost some of that blood just going through their day (night), before getting down to the action.

You can't compare a human's blood use to that of a Vampire. Humans still keep their blood. We aren't losing it by performing actions. Vampires are losing blood constantly for every action they perform and have to keep on resupplying it. And it's not an easy resource for them to obtain. They can't go down to the 7-Eleven and just pick up a Slurpee of blood.

 

[Hildegardt]

And unlike humans, they are losing that blood by the second. It doesn't just hang out in their system whenever they want to use it. It is constantly dissolving away. Thus the need to constantly replenish it. The only blood they have in their system is whatever their last meal gave them. And unless they fed literally just before sex, they've already lost some of that blood just going through their day (night), before getting down to the action.

Where does the blood go? And if this has to do with magic again, then I'm not sure how relevant this is to The Bite. It seems like this game is going for a biological explanation of vampires. I feel like the Doc would be more open to the possibility of magic, if she noticed the vampires she's examining are turning blood into mana.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

Just to show you that the human body contains a lot more blood than is required for an erection.
To show that a vampire using sex as a hunting tool would absolutely gain more than they spent.
Hence it is an effective hunting tool & probably why it has been used extensively through history of the myth.

Yeah but you're talking about a human body. Vampires don't have the same amount of blood in their system as a human body does. Whatever blood a vampire has in their system is the blood that came from their last meal. And unless they are draining victims completely dry, they don't have the same amount of blood as a human.

Vampires tend to try and stay inconspicuous. Meaning not leaving a trail of bodies in their path. They tend to only drink what they need for the day and move on. A glass here and there, but certainly not an entire human's worth of blood.

You just can't compare the two. A human's blood will always be there in their system (unless, of course, they have an accident that makes them lose it lol). A Vampire's blood supply is all going to be based off how much blood they consumed that day and what they have done throughout the day to use that blood supply. It's an ever-changing variable that you can't set in stone to a specific number.

Where does the blood go? And if this has to do with magic again, then I'm not sure how relevant this is to The Bite. It seems like this game is going for a biological explanation of vampires. I feel like the Doc would be more open to the possibility of magic, if she noticed the vampires she's examining are turning blood into mana.

No one knows. It's all fantasy and it is up for interpretation. All we know is vampires "consume" the blood they drink to fuel themselves. Thus the reason to continuously feed is a need for them to survive, because they "use up" the blood.

Yeah I think we went a bit off with this discussion as we are just talking about Vampires in general, not particularly the game (though it does deal with Vampires), but just Vampires in general.

 

[boobsrcool]

any word on next patch

 

[SpyderArachnid]

I'm talking about the amount of blood in a human body, because that is what the vampire will be consuming.
I'm talking about the amount of blood required to get an erection, because it doesn't matter if it's a vampire or a human, it still requires the same amount of blood to get an erection.
If the amount consumed is considerably greater than the amount expended, then it is, quite literally, efficient.

I don't see any logic suggesting that the blood needs constant replacement in a vampire's erection. Why? Where does it go?

It's just how fantasy says it is lol. Vampires drink blood to use it to fuel themselves. That blood "goes away" when they use it. Thus the need to keep replenishing it so they continue using it. I don't write this stuff, it's just how fantasy says it goes lol.

Vampires expend the blood they consume to fuel their body. A constant use of blood for an action, consumes that blood as you use it. In order to keep a fire going, you have to constantly replenish it. Otherwise, it dies out. Same principle. In order to maintain something that uses the blood over time, you have to keep feeding it more blood to continue maintaining it.

Vampires have a limited supply of blood in their system. Humans have an endless supply of blood. We can keep on pumping that same blood over and over into parts of our bodies to fuel them without any loss. Vampires don't have that luxury. They lose that blood when they use it and it depletes from their overall supply of blood. It doesn't refill itself, they have to go out and get more blood to keep using it, otherwise, they die out like a fire.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

It's the equivalent of food.
They drink it, their body apportions it to the places that need fuel to operate.
It gets used up/burned off doing that, same as food does/calories do.
It needs re-oxygenation, in the human body.
If vampires have no vasculatory system & no working lungs, the blood does not circulate and get refreshed.
I see no reason in this for why an erection would do the same & burn it off. It's simply swollen by blood. It's not consuming blood.

Seems to me that they'd just need to apportion the small amount of blood required and that would be it.

This is like trying to explain how unicorns fly without wings lol.

I just go off what basic fantasy tells about Vampires. For every action vampires make, they consume blood in the process. They can't store blood, as it gets consumed when they use it. I don't know how fast or how long it lasts before it is consumed, I just know like everyone else, that blood is consumed when they use it.

So who's to say that they can't just simple stuff some blood in their howdoyado and keep it there? Or if they do stuff the blood in, will it just get consumed and they have to keep stuffing more blood in over and over to maintain it since it is consumed when they use it?

No one knows how exactly it works. There is no definitive proof that tells us how it all works cause it is all just fiction. We can just keep going off what we read and determine from that how we think it should work. I'm just going off what I know of Vampires and that when they use blood for anything, it gets consumed. Thus they have to continuously use blood to keep doing that action.

Because if they could just store blood in their body and not consume it, then they would never need to continuously drink blood cause they would have no reason to since they have a constant "stored" supply in their system. Thus it leads me to believe any blood they try to store in their system, for any purpose, would be consumed.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

Aah, well, we were talking about mythological vampires from early civilisations, not today's twinkling vamps.

I'm just going off common Vampire knowledge, not anything inparticular. All Vampire lore, regardless where it comes from, has some of the same common traits. Of course they all have different little twists here and there, but they all have many similarities between them.

They are undead, they drink blood, they expend blood (thus the need to drink it in the first place), they have super strength and speed, no heartbeat, cold to the touch, etc etc. The common Vampire tropes. But then you get into the more specialized stuff like sunlight, garlic, or even... twinkling lol. I'm not going off that stuff. Just the common stuff that is found between them all.

 

[whichone]

All Vampire lore, regardless where it comes from, has some of the same common traits.

Yes, the vast majority of them used sex as a weapon.

The common Vampire tropes.

Precisely what sex and seduction were, throughout the history of the myth.
It is really only the more recent iterations which have not been sexually active creatures.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

Yes, the vast majority of them used sex as a weapon.

Precisely what sex and seduction were.

Except that's not something that they were, that is something that some of them did. Being a sex machine wasn't something that happens to you just cause you are a Vampire. It is a choice some made, it's not forced. You don't see Nosferatu out there chatting up the ladies at the club. And he came before Dracula and all the other "sexualized" Vampires of the modern age.

 

[whichone]

Being a sex machine wasn't something that happens to you just cause you are a Vampire. It is a choice some made, it's not forced.

Who said that it was?
Doesn't matter why it was there throughout history.
Just that it was.

You don't see Nosferatu out there chatting up the ladies at the club. And he came before Dracula and all the other "sexualized" Vampires of the modern age.

Nosferatu was based on Stoker's Dracula. So didn't come before it, at all. It came 25 years later.
The film had to change the names because Stoker's widow pressed charges.

We're talking about vampires dating back to Ancient Greece, Sumeria, Roman times.
Throughout history they have used sex.
Vampires of the modern age have become desexualised, not sexualised.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

Who said that it was?

You did when I was talking about the common traits of Vampires. I mentioned how the common similarities between them were them being undead, or drinking blood, and such and you replied to that by adding "using sex as a weapon". That's not a trait, that's just something that some of them did. It's not part of the Vampire curse that is placed upon them like the other things I mentioned, it was just something that some of them chose to do.

They weren't forced into it by their curse like the other things I mentioned, so it didn't make sense that you would include that amongst the other traits that they were forced to inherit from the curse.

 

[andrew david irving]

I agree throughout history vampires are supposed to have had sex and use it to lure prey. In recent lore vampires can still have sex .... but .... there are a few modern writers seem to have changed the rules ... such that the vampires involved must be either nearly human or use the Blush of Life to be able to have sex - with the blood content seemingly irrelevant. There are hundreds of vampire books out there and my take on the debate in this thread is that VtM / White Wolf Products concentrate more on the violence aspect, and that is their choice - even though there is still sex in their works, just not so much. The dev of The Bite is obviously allowed to write their own fantasy, and if that includes sex - shock horror - then so be it.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

What utter tosh. No-one ever said that they were forced into anything. Where are you inventing that rubbish from?
I simply proved that it was an efficient hunting method, in contrast to your claim & that it has been used throughout the history of the myth.
Never mind your recent stuff, even Dracula, we're talking about stuff from as far back as B.C.

The fact that you think Nosferatu came before Dracula tells me everything I need to know on your knowledge.

No reason to get so hostile over it. I thought we were just having a nice discussion here.

I was going off your quote in response to what I posted. I was talking about traits that were forced on Vampires because of the curse of Vampirism. Then you replied to that particular part of my post by adding "sex as a weapon" to that list. Which is not something that was forced on Vampires because of the curse. I never said they didn't use it, in fact some of them did. I just said it didn't make sense for them to do it because of the blood cost.

This game is based off modern Vampires, not ancient Vampires from the B.C. period. Thus my discussion is centered more on modern Vampires as it pertains to this game.

As for Nosferatu and Dracula, I was talking about Stoker's version. They are about a decade apart with Nosferatu coming first.

 

[SpyderArachnid]

Then please pay attention and don't create arguments against things which no-one said.
Putting words into someone's mouth then arguing as if they said it, is unnacceptable.
I did not add it to your list, at all.
You spoke of common traits, which I have proven using sex is one of. It is a common trait, found throughout vampire history.
We have been talking, since the beginning of this conversation, about vampires from Sumerian, Greek & Roman mythology being sexually active creatures.

Except we haven't. You brought all that into this. I was just talking about Vampire blood use and how it is consumed. You brought up ancient Vampires from mythology and how they used sex as a weapon. I mentioned it briefly with Lilith, because she was also considered a demon, then went back to talking about basic blood use in Vampires.

I wasn't discussing mythological Vampires at all. You're the one who kept trying to use them as an example. I was just talking about Vampires in general (in a more modern sense as it pertained to this game) and how they used blood.