VN Trans games done right

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

Well, if you are reading this I assume you enjoy games with futa/trans content. If you don't, probably there are other threads more suited to you. Two things first. After playing a LOT of games on this site, characters that could be termed a ”futa”, that is, someone with both a penis and a vagina (usually instead of balls) seem to be quite rare. I've seen three I think, in MaouSama, Seeds of Chaos and in Tales of the Unending Void. I'm sure there are more, especially in more fantasy/hentai related games, but generally, in western VNs they seem quite rare, so from here on I'll be referring to these characters as ”trans” only, because that is the correct term (unless you want to get deep into the semantics of it), with the occasional use of the word ”trap”, indicating a character that is actually a male (no breasts etc) but very feminine in appearance.

So, after a month of playing most VN/Renpy – and the occasional Unity - games that are tagged with futa/trans, and has a male protagonist (if it has a female or trans protagonist it really becomes a different type of game) these are my conclusions. But before that, why limit myself to VN/Renpy? Well, the grinds usually inherent in RPGMs and similar builds makes me avoid them, and the HTML builds are usually not great either, but admittedly, there probably are lots of games out there with different game engines that I have ignored. Maybe I'll get to them later.
Anyway, the conclusions: There really are a actually quite a few of them (games with trans content). Some of them pretty good games in their own right, not so many of them worth playing for the trans content however. IMHO, they fit into three categories:

1. Games that genuinely gets the trans content right.
   
2. Games that have potential to get it right, but somewhat misses the target, or hasn't gotten there yet, but might in future updates.
   
3. Games that completely misses the opportunity, for a number of reasons.

What makes a game a category 1, 2 or 3? It depends. In some cases: time and updates. It might be a 1 in a year but it's a 2 now, because the storyline hasn't progressed to where it should/will be yet. But generally, what makes a game a category 3 or 2, again IMHO, is a lack of understanding of trans characters. Usually they're a female render that the dev has slapped a penis on, and that's it. Both visually (as in how the sex scenes are visualized) and in emotionally, they are ”empty”. Less fleshed out and more stereotypical even than your standard female character, or mindless cumdumps only there for the MC to use as fuckdolls.
Now, a word about me, without divulging too much about my private life, when I was a younger man I had a brief relationship with a trans person, and a few years later, a purely sexual encounter with another trans person (back in the days when they were still termed ”shemales”, before we twigged that that was a pretty derogatery term). So I do have some experience with this, although obviously not nearly as much as for example someone who is trans themselves, or who has a trans person as a family member etc. But unlike for many people, to me being a trans is not ”other”, it is not an unknown quantity, they are real people. And that is the problem with most games on here.
Obviously, these games are not Pulitzer award material, they're played for the fap, not to be taken seriously, agreed. I mean, elf-rape-gangbangs and furries? I get that, or actually, I don't, but I get that these are just fantasies and arousing for some. Hell, I have some weird fetishes of my own, not judging anyone. However, if we just want to fap, wouldn't it be quicker just to go on Pornhub and find your fetish of choice? I play these games for immersion, for story as well as sex, and the better both are, the better the experience. So let's look at those three categories I mentioned before, starting from the bottom.

3. ”Games that completely misses the opportunity, for a number of reasons.”

The best example I've come across is probably Depravity. It has a trans character, and yes, you can have sex with her (once, in current build), but you may not want to. When MC finds out she is trans he basically screams and runs for the door (great move there, good way to make people comfortable about themselves). It gets worse. If you let another character (mom, if I remember it right) convince MC that love is fine regardless of dick presence he goes back to her and … is gentle with her? Reassures her that he really likes her, regardless of extra bits? Makes sweet love to her to make her feel ok with his previously assholey behaviour? Yeah right. No, MC basically hatefucks her dry with his oversized cock. Completely ignoring her genitals, he goes straight for what would be a ruptured sphincter in reality, uses and abuses her a bit and then takes off. I honestly think I want to see this MC gang raped by orcs before this game is over, and I don't mean that because that turns me on, it really doesn't. He is just such an asshole.
Another game that misses the opportunity badly is Allison fall of the Apples. Now, don't get me wrong, the two scenes with Tiffa are actually pretty hawt. First time you meet her is in a public restroom where you can fuck her (hawt!) or give her a golden shower (hawter! If that's your thing) and then you can meet her later to give her a real pounding (also hawt! scene). So what is the problem? Two problems actually. Firstly, according to the game-thread you can only meet her on the dom-path, which hasn't really been fleshed out yet, took me half an hour to play through. Secondly, who he hell is Tiffa? Some sort of living fuckdoll that just exists to satisfy the needs of masculine men who happens to walk into her store? Every other character get some sort of exposition, Tiffa doesn't need any it seems. She is just a cum dump for the MC. So why can't we meet her on the romance path? Why can't she get any back story? Completely lost opportunity (although hawt! As stated before).
But mostly, in this category of games it's not simply a missed oppportunity but rather a needless inclusion. Yeah, a trans character is in there somewhere but it's hard to see why, apart from that it might draw in some curious punter who sees the tag and gets his/her hopes up. MC might be given a blowjob or some such, but it's never clear why the trans character is trans, rather than a female. Just for the titilation I guess. Games in this vein are too many for a complete list but here are some examples: Personal Trainer, High Rise, Shelter, Taffy Tales (might conceivably improve with later updates), Locked Away (ditto), Bad Teacher, The City of Broken Dreamers ...

2. ”Games that have potential to get it right, but somewhat misses the target, or hasn't gotten there yet, but might in future updates.”

Well, there are many of these as well, and quite often it's because they might not have gotten to where they should be or will be in the future. Look at Apt 69 for example, an adorable trap as a possible future love interest, bags of potential, but ON HOLD, that dreaded tag. Other games that have lots of future potential if it is done right but aren't nearly there yet: The Shrink (well, probably unlikely...), SpaceCorps (more gay content than trans so far, but feels like this will very soon move up a category, dev certainly isn't hesitant to shove cocks into the MC!) did I mention that it's also fucking hilarious? Also; Braveheart Academy. This one already has a great little romance and one very good sexscene with an adorable little trap, and the MC certainly says all the right things, makes the right moves. It will probably be in the top category when it is more of a finished article. Gates Motel; not for the faint of heart and promises to get even more freaky in the future, but quite fascinating and the MC's trans sibling has bundles of potential.

However, the most annoying/unessesary example in this category is the game that takes the (shared) no 1 spot for sexy trans characters: WVM.

What! I hear you say. That's a great game for trans lovers! Well … nearly. It probably will be. Yes, Shauna is amazing and the other two characters, Penelope and Skye are potentially great as well. But after a lot of sex scenes with Shauna and a few with Penelope, they're still females who have one less hole. The dev has admittedly solved this quite cleverly by introducing the idea of Shaunas discomfort with her body, therefore the MC never really actively doing anything with her penis is explained (even managed to make it belivable in the case of Penny as well).
But seriously. If you had an amazing girlfriend like Shauna, wouldn't it be on top of your to-do list to make her comfortable with her body? In the near future (as in next update) I really want to see the MC make a serious effort to get Shauna comfortable with her penis, if he truly loves her. MC: You need to get down there and show her how much you care. Otherwise, fuck off. Seriously, Now, if this happens, this game will move from this category to the next.

1. ”Games that genuinely gets the trans content right”
   
   Yes, they do exist, and there are more of them all the time. Some games that are very early in development but are already there in terms of trans content: Exiles and The New Me. Exiles is really the flavour of the month for trans lovers on this forum and rightly so: Three main love interests: One female, one trap and one trans, all beautiful and engaging characters. Funny, well-written, good graphics and hella sexy. When this is done it will probably be one for the ages. The New Me is also early in development but already has two (optionally) trans characters, if this dev keeps it up and keeps opening things up (pun intended), this will be just fine. Dialogue needs a bit of work though and it is admittedly somewhat rough around the edges in many aspects. But the potential is huge.
   Summertime Saga has an adorable romantic storyline with Eve, a trans girl in MCs class, and might be even more improved in the future, but even in it's present state the game is well worth playing just for that part. Moving on:
   Fetish Locator. Also a bit early in development and considering how few sex scenes there are so far between the MC and the trans character, perhaps it should be in category 2 instead, but I will include it here because Lyssa is, together with Shauna from WVM, the hottest trans character in any game and also very beliveable. She feels real, she feels engaging and the MC interacts with her in such a way that it would be inconceivable for him to start treating her as just a cum dump. A beautiful romance is blossoming, MC is in no way scared of her penis (dev hints at more to come in this area), all is well with the world.
   Lunars Chosen. Sexually fantastic: MC is happy to give, happy to recieve. One trans character, one more hinted at (possible future?). I don't quite like the fact that it's ”magic”, a female that has magically aquired a cock, rather than an actual trans character, but perhaps that's a way to make it more palatable for players who are on the fence? Anyway, the switching sells it for me, Amy is fucking hawt! and the MC genuinely doesn't seem to mind Amy's penis (to put it mildly) and is generally quite likeable, so this one goes up to the top of the rankings. Only edged out by:
   Midlife Crisis. One of the most unexpected games of the year for me. Admittedly, Tracy isn't as stunningly hot as Shauna or Lyssa, but perhaps because of that she comes across as the most authentic and realistic character. Insecure at first, very enthusiastic once the really likeable MC starts to make her feel good about herself: romantically and sexually. I truly loved the scenes between the MC and Tracy, it felt like watching a sexy romcom, but in a good way. Now this is the way you do it. And it will only get better from here I think.

Did you really read all the way down here? Amazing. Well, if you did, perhaps you have something to contribute, an alternative to my ranking system for example. Perhaps this could live a bit longer if we use this this a source/guide for those looking for the good stuff but wanting to avoid the bad stuff when it comes to trans content? If not, then not. Thanks for reading anyway.

 

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

Interesting thread. Suggestions?

Mh, I'd list the categories in reverse order: if I want to play a game with a transgender character, the sooner you name the good ones, the better for me (yes, I'm lazy).
I'm not sure explicitly naming the bad games is a good choice: I fear it will attract some criticisms.
Not an alternative system, a complementary one instead: a list of the games you have played, sorted in alphabetical order, rated with just an emoji and with a link. Something like vhal does in his thread about Foot-fetish games.

Looking for your review of Dr. Amana.

Oh, I know, i rewrote the order a number of times, but in the end I decided to keep it as is because: scrolling down to where it says 1 instead of reading all the way can't really take that long, can it? There are gaps and everything to help the reader find the correct place to start ...

Criticism? Possibly. Probably? But in this case I think warranted, and possibly it might act as a kick up the backside to the dev: do over, do better. Notice that it is in no way a criticism of their actual games as such but of one aspect of the games that should be improved. It's like hearing a great album but you can't help but notice that the producer fucked up the drum sound. Still a great album, but if the artist is made aware of it (sometimes they are, sometimes you become somewhat "home blind"), then they get a chance to remix it later on. It's not hating on someones vision per se, it's pushing them to improve.

Thank you for the suggestion, I might implement that.

Dr Amana is on my list, but perhaps I should move it up. Thank you again for the suggestion.

 

[Deleted member 193776]

Well, if you are reading this I assume you enjoy games with futa/trans content. If you don't, probably there are other threads more suited to you. Two things first. After playing a LOT of games on this site, characters that could be termed a ”futa”, that is, someone with both a penis and a vagina (usually instead of balls) seem to be quite rare. I've seen three I think, in MaouSama, Seeds of Chaos and in Tales of the Unending Void. I'm sure there are more, especially in more fantasy/hentai related games, but generally, in western VNs they seem quite rare, so from here on I'll be referring to these characters as ”trans” only, because that is the correct term (unless you want to get deep into the semantics of it), with the occasional use of the word ”trap”, indicating a character that is actually a male (no breasts etc) but very feminine in appearance.

So, after a month of playing most VN/Renpy – and the occasional Unity - games that are tagged with futa/trans, and has a male protagonist (if it has a female or trans protagonist it really becomes a different type of game) these are my conclusions. But before that, why limit myself to VN/Renpy? Well, the grinds usually inherent in RPGMs and similar builds makes me avoid them, and the HTML builds are usually not great either, but admittedly, there probably are lots of games out there with different game engines that I have ignored. Maybe I'll get to them later.
Anyway, the conclusions: There really are a actually quite a few of them (games with trans content). Some of them pretty good games in their own right, not so many of them worth playing for the trans content however. IMHO, they fit into three categories:

1. Games that genuinely gets the trans content right.
   
2. Games that have potential to get it right, but somewhat misses the target, or hasn't gotten there yet, but might in future updates.
   
3. Games that completely misses the opportunity, for a number of reasons.

What makes a game a category 1, 2 or 3? It depends. In some cases: time and updates. It might be a 1 in a year but it's a 2 now, because the storyline hasn't progressed to where it should/will be yet. But generally, what makes a game a category 3 or 2, again IMHO, is a lack of understanding of trans characters. Usually they're a female render that the dev has slapped a penis on, and that's it. Both visually (as in how the sex scenes are visualized) and in emotionally, they are ”empty”. Less fleshed out and more stereotypical even than your standard female character, or mindless cumdumps only there for the MC to use as fuckdolls.
Now, a word about me, without divulging too much about my private life, when I was a younger man I had a brief relationship with a trans person, and a few years later, a purely sexual encounter with another trans person (back in the days when they were still termed ”shemales”, before we twigged that that was a pretty derogatery term). So I do have some experience with this, although obviously not nearly as much as for example someone who is trans themselves, or who has a trans person as a family member etc. But unlike for many people, to me being a trans is not ”other”, it is not an unknown quantity, they are real people. And that is the problem with most games on here.
Obviously, these games are not Pulitzer award material, they're played for the fap, not to be taken seriously, agreed. I mean, elf-rape-gangbangs and furries? I get that, or actually, I don't, but I get that these are just fantasies and arousing for some. Hell, I have some weird fetishes of my own, not judging anyone. However, if we just want to fap, wouldn't it be quicker just to go on Pornhub and find your fetish of choice? I play these games for immersion, for story as well as sex, and the better both are, the better the experience. So let's look at those three categories I mentioned before, starting from the bottom.

1. ”Games that completely misses the opportunity, for a number of reasons.”
   
   The best example I've come across is probably Depravity. It has a trans character, and yes, you can have sex with her (once, in current build), but you may not want to. When MC finds out she is trans he basically screams and runs for the door (great move there, good way to make people comfortable about themselves). It gets worse. If you let another character (mom, if I remember it right) convince MC that love is fine regardless of dick presence he goes back to her and … is gentle with her? Reassures her that he really likes her, regardless of extra bits? Makes sweet love to her to make her feel ok with his previously assholey behaviour? Yeah right. No, MC basically hatefucks her dry with his oversized cock. Completely ignoring her genitals, he goes straight for what would be a ruptured sphincter in reality, uses and abuses her a bit and then takes off. I honestly think I want to see this MC gang raped by orcs before this game is over, and I don't mean that because that turns me on, it really doesn't. He is just such an asshole.
   Another game that misses the opportunity badly is Allison fall of the Apples. Now, don't get me wrong, the two scenes with Tiffa are actually pretty hawt. First time you meet her is in a public restroom where you can fuck her (hawt!) or give her a golden shower (hawter! If that's your thing) and then you can meet her later to give her a real pounding (also hawt! scene). So what is the problem? Two problems actually. Firstly, according to the game-thread you can only meet her on the dom-path, which hasn't really been fleshed out yet, took me half an hour to play through. Secondly, who he hell is Tiffa? Some sort of living fuckdoll that just exists to satisfy the needs of masculine men who happens to walk into her store? Every other character get some sort of exposition, Tiffa doesn't need any it seems. She is just a cum dump for the MC. So why can't we meet her on the romance path? Why can't she get any back story? Completely lost opportunity (although hawt! As stated before).
   But mostly, in this category of games it's not simply a missed oppportunity but rather a needless inclusion. Yeah, a trans character is in there somewhere but it's hard to see why, apart from that it might draw in some curious punter who sees the tag and gets his/her hopes up. MC might be given a blowjob or some such, but it's never clear why the trans character is trans, rather than a female. Just for the titilation I guess. Games in this vein are too many for a complete list but here are some examples: Personal Trainer, High Rise, Shelter, Taffy Tales (might conceivably improve with later updates), Locked Away (ditto), Bad Teacher, The City of Broken Dreamers ...
2. ”Games that have potential to get it right, but somewhat misses the target, or hasn't gotten there yet, but might in future updates.”
   
   Well, there are many of these as well, and quite often it's because they might not have gotten to where they should be or will be in the future. Look at Apt 69 for example, an adorable trap as a possible future love interest, bags of potential, but ON HOLD, that dreaded tag. Other games that have lots of future potential if it is done right but aren't nearly there yet: The Shrink (well, probably unlikely...), SpaceCorps (more gay content than trans so far, but feels like this will very soon move up a category, dev certainly isn't hesitant to shove cocks into the MC!) did I mention that it's also fucking hilarious? Also; Braveheart Academy. This one already has a great little romance and one very good sexscene with an adorable little trap, and the MC certainly says all the right things, makes the right moves. It will probably be in the top category when it is more of a finished article. Gates Motel; not for the faint of heart and promises to get even more freaky in the future, but quite fascinating and the MC's trans sibling has bundles of potential.
   
   However, the most annoying/unessesary example in this category is the game that takes the (shared) no 1 spot for sexy trans characters: WVM.
   
   What! I hear you say. That's a great game for trans lovers! Well … nearly. It probably will be. Yes, Shauna is amazing and the other two characters, Penelope and Skye are potentially great as well. But after a lot of sex scenes with Shauna and a few with Penelope, they're still females who have one less hole. The dev has admittedly solved this quite cleverly by introducing the idea of Shaunas discomfort with her body, therefore the MC never really actively doing anything with her penis is explained (even managed to make it belivable in the case of Penny as well).
   But seriously. If you had an amazing girlfriend like Shauna, wouldn't it be on top of your to-do list to make her comfortable with her body? In the near future (as in next update) I really want to see the MC make a serious effort to get Shauna comfortable with her penis, if he truly loves her. MC: You need to get down there and show her how much you care. Otherwise, fuck off. Seriously, Now, if this happens, this game will move from this category to the next.
3. ”Games that genuinely gets the trans content right”
   
   Yes, they do exist, and there are more of them all the time. Some games that are very early in development but are already there in terms of trans content: Exiles and The New Me. Exiles is really the flavour of the month for trans lovers on this forum and rightly so: Three main love interests: One female, one trap and one trans, all beautiful and engaging characters. Funny, well-written, good graphics and hella sexy. When this is done it will probably be one for the ages. The New Me is also early in development but already has two (optionally) trans characters, if this dev keeps it up and keeps opening things up (pun intended), this will be just fine. Dialogue needs a bit of work though and it is admittedly somewhat rough around the edges in many aspects. But the potential is huge.
   Summertime Saga has an adorable romantic storyline with Eve, a trans girl in MCs class, and might be even more improved in the future, but even in it's present state the game is well worth playing just for that part. Moving on:
   Fetish Locator. Also a bit early in development and considering how few sex scenes there are so far between the MC and the trans character, perhaps it should be in category 2 instead, but I will include it here because Lyssa is, together with Shauna from WVM, the hottest trans character in any game and also very beliveable. She feels real, she feels engaging and the MC interacts with her in such a way that it would be inconceivable for him to start treating her as just a cum dump. A beautiful romance is blossoming, MC is in no way scared of her penis (dev hints at more to come in this area), all is well with the world.
   Lunars Chosen. Sexually fantastic: MC is happy to give, happy to recieve. One trans character, one more hinted at (possible future?). I don't quite like the fact that it's ”magic”, a female that has magically aquired a cock, rather than an actual trans character, but perhaps that's a way to make it more palatable for players who are on the fence? Anyway, the switching sells it for me, Amy is fucking hawt! and the MC genuinely doesn't seem to mind Amy's penis (to put it mildly) and is generally quite likeable, so this one goes up to the top of the rankings. Only edged out by:
   Midlife Crisis. One of the most unexpected games of the year for me. Admittedly, Tracy isn't as stunningly hot as Shauna or Lyssa, but perhaps because of that she comes across as the most authentic and realistic character. Insecure at first, very enthusiastic once the really likeable MC starts to make her feel good about herself: romantically and sexually. I truly loved the scenes between the MC and Tracy, it felt like watching a sexy romcom, but in a good way. Now this is the way you do it. And it will only get better from here I think.

Did you really read all the way down here? Amazing. Well, if you did, perhaps you have something to contribute, an alternative to my ranking system for example. Perhaps this could live a bit longer if we use this this a source/guide for those looking for the good stuff but wanting to avoid the bad stuff when it comes to trans content? If not, then not. Thanks for reading anyway.

Well I read your review, I have no interest in getting into all the semantics, but I'll tell you one thing, you may have been right about the whole thing about what trans should look like in real life, but you've forgotten the really important thing. They're fucking games, they're supposed to look different from reality for humor or parody or some kind of fetish someone has ....

 

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

Well I read your review, I have no interest in getting into all the semantics, but I'll tell you one thing, you may have been right about the whole thing about what trans should look like in real life, but you've forgotten the really important thing. They're fucking games, they're supposed to look different from reality for humor or parody or some kind of fetish someone has ....

Are we talking about the futa thing? Because I'm not sure I've focused on the looks otherwise, except to praise characters I found beautiful (and they're pretty varied). In general my critique, where it was critical of something, usually concerned how the trans characters were portrayed, not so much visually as personality-wise (or usually. lack of it). And most of all how the MC related to them.
But if you mean the Futa vs trans thing: obviously that's personal - for the geese and for the gander etc - but game or not, the futas don't work for me. Part of that is sexual (and therefore personal, i.e, not to be taken as a slight if you disagree), but part of it is story telling. Even if the futa concept doesn't do much for me, I still totally accept their existence in for example Tales of the Unending Void because that's an alien race, it makes sense that aliens might have a very different set of plumbing to humans. Whereas in a "realistic" game it doesn't work for the same reason. Unless you're actually talking about an hermaphrodite - they exist and I would accept their inclusion in a game, if that was part of the story.
Absolutely these are games, designed for escapism, but all sorts of escapism requires rules of story telling, fantasy has it's own set of rules to make us accept playing loose with we conceive as "reality". If you disagree, that's fine too, I don't claim to have the only acceptable definition of "good" or "ideal" narrative structure.
How about this, meet you halfway? The tag "futa/trans" should atleast be split up into two so that everyone can make up their own minds whether the game is for them or not?
And thank you for commenting anyway, always nice to get some input.

 

[lexdoll]

As someone who enjoys trans content in adult VN, I agree with most of your input there, very good write-up. Trans characters are not often represented properly in these games, of the few ones I think that have done right, Eve(Summertime Saga) and Lyssa(Fetish Locator) are my absolute favorites. Both are well written characters with believable personalities, not just chicks with something extra between their legs ready to jump on MC's dick the first chance they get.

Amy(Lunar's Chosen) is great too but besides her cute demeanor and obvious hang-ups with her new body, which she seems to get over eventually when MC shows true affection towards her, she lacks a bit of depth compared to Eve and Lyssa, still a cool character nevertheless.

Shauna(WMV) would have been right up there with the best if MC made more effort to make her feel comfortable about her identity and her body, exactly the same reasons you mentioned. She confided to MC that she will never be able to bear MC's child but really wanted to, how she wanted MC to pretend her penis doesn't exist when they had sex. While it's indeed true that there are trans women don't want their lady dicks to be touched/played by their partners in real life (to the point some will freak out if you touch it in extreme cases) due to some psychological block(don't ask me how do I know it), Shauna's reluctance about showing her penis or not wanting it to be fondled with is clearly not the case, as it's evidenced by her showing great pleasure when MC actually started playing with her dick after some encouragement from MC's other girlfriend. So yes, MC did make some small steps to make her feel better about herself, but as one of two MC's main love interests who would do everything and anything for him, you would expect MC to do A LOT more.

Now Tracy(Midlife Crisis), I have to be honest here and say it outright: I don't like it. First, MC treated her as an easy way to get laid, there are multiple instances in the game where MC got blueballed by the chicks around him, then what's the first thing that came into his freaking mind? "Yeah, I am gonna call Tracy or her aunt, I need to get my release." He literally said it or something every similar along the line. Yes, MC did show some respect in his approach when he was with her and didn't press her into anything, but it comes off more of a pretense after his inner-monologue. Second, about Tracy herself, she appears cute but didn't show any sign of hesitation to jack off MC on their first "date"(down for anything after that). It's true she didn't do it for money like her aunt, but she left an unmistakable impression that she was way too overeager, almost desperate even to spread her legs for the first man who could accept who she is. To MC, she is a little more than a fuck-buddy at best and maybe she is cool with that, maybe she seeks no more than a physical relationship but it only makes the character feel even cheaper.

What I find most disappointing of all is the lack of exclusive trans romance option in VNs, where you can have only one romance option in the game and you can choose your option to romance a trans woman. The majority of the VNs I have seen allow you maintain a harem with as many girls as you like with absolutely zero repercussion, which is fun and all for a game, but gets monotonous and boring rather quickly.

It's also worth noting that there is a distinct lack of sexual acts in trans sex, I am not gonna list everything but there is a lot more you can do with a trans girl other than handy, fellatio and penetration, hopefully we will see more diversity in the future.

 

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

Thank you for your well written and well reasoned response. Interesting take on Midlife Crisis, I'm sure you're right in that I've romanticized MCs relation to Tracy, I honestly don't remember all the inner monologues of the MC, I just remember their actual conversations and later interactions, which I thought were caring and loving (if you chose that option), but I certainly respect your opinion about it.

I 100% agree with you when it comes to the lack of romantic interactions with trans characters, one of the major problems I think, and I totally agree that the range of sexual activities seem unnessecary limited. Let's hope for more of both in the future.

 

[Deleted member 193776]

Are we talking about the futa thing? Because I'm not sure I've focused on the looks otherwise, except to praise characters I found beautiful (and they're pretty varied). In general my critique, where it was critical of something, usually concerned how the trans characters were portrayed, not so much visually as personality-wise (or usually. lack of it). And most of all how the MC related to them.
But if you mean the Futa vs trans thing: obviously that's personal - for the geese and for the gander etc - but game or not, the futas don't work for me. Part of that is sexual (and therefore personal, i.e, not to be taken as a slight if you disagree), but part of it is story telling. Even if the futa concept doesn't do much for me, I still totally accept their existence in for example Tales of the Unending Void because that's an alien race, it makes sense that aliens might have a very different set of plumbing to humans. Whereas in a "realistic" game it doesn't work for the same reason. Unless you're actually talking about an hermaphrodite - they exist and I would accept their inclusion in a game, if that was part of the story.
Absolutely these are games, designed for escapism, but all sorts of escapism requires rules of story telling, fantasy has it's own set of rules to make us accept playing loose with we conceive as "reality". If you disagree, that's fine too, I don't claim to have the only acceptable definition of "good" or "ideal" narrative structure.
How about this, meet you halfway? The tag "futa/trans" should atleast be split up into two so that everyone can make up their own minds whether the game is for them or not?
And thank you for commenting anyway, always nice to get some input.

I agree about the separation between Trans and Futa, but not about whether the story should look real or by certain rules, if you do that you cut 80% of the gaming industry, No offense
But it seems that because of your life experience you are trying to get the characters to look or behave and live more like in reality ....
I'll give you a test.
Do you believe in pronouns?
Are you all about LGBT rights?

 

[Oldmantac]

What I find most disappointing of all is the lack of exclusive trans romance option in VNs, where you can have only one romance option in the game and you can choose your option to romance a trans woman. The majority of the VNs I have seen allow you maintain a harem with as many girls as you like with absolutely zero repercussion, which is fun and all for a game, but gets monotonous and boring rather quickly.

It's also worth noting that there is a distinct lack of sexual acts in trans sex, I am not gonna list everything but there is a lot more you can do with a trans girl other than handy, fellatio and penetration, hopefully we will see more diversity in the future.

I often feel the same way however, from a developmental standpoint it would be difficult to create enough content with only one sexual partner to keep players interested. I would certainly be interested in one however, and if I had the skills to develop a game, I would like to create just that.

IRL many trans women are uncomfortable with their penis (genital dysphoria), even more don't want to be a top because it makes them feel masculine. I personally don't believe that sexual role must be categorized as dom and sub. If it's pleasurable for you, chances are it can be equally pleasurable for your partner.

With WVM, MC I believe is trying to make Shauna more comfortable with herself, but so far doesn't know how to address it. He even says he wants to explore that side of sexuality. In the hotel he makes an attempt and she is the one who balks. I believe he should be not only more open with her, but have more in depth conversations with Penny on how to help Shauna.

I haven't played any of the recent updates of Midlife Crisis mainly because I don't like MC. He's a predator and I just can't condone the way he's seduced and fucked his own family.

While it's in the futa category (you did say you're ok with alien species though) Starship Inanna has a great futa character. She's written as strong person and absolutely badass fighter. Her role is central to the game.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Now, a word about me, without divulging too much about my private life, when I was a younger man I had a brief relationship with a trans person, and a few years later, a purely sexual encounter with another trans person (back in the days when they were still termed ”shemales”, before we twigged that that was a pretty derogatery term).

I'm not transgender either, just had a life that made me have close encounters with a lot of them, partly when I was volunteer for psychological support structures ; some of them still being my friends nowadays, one of them even being like a brother for me.

On a side note, not all shemales are effectively transgenders. A lot of them are just males that want another, or a better, body, and not females in a male body ; and yes those are two different things.

Fetish Locator. [...] She feels real, she feels engaging [...]

She's not badly wrote, but she is too superficial for a MtF (Male to Female) transgender. She is wrote like a woman character, which is a good point, but the way she treat her penis is wrong.
That she don't suffer from dysphoria, why not, it's not rare that a transgender accept his body, or start to accept it after a partial transition. But in this case, the person effectively accept it, which isn't the case here. Lyssa is comfortable enough with her dick to show it to a perfect stranger (the MC during their first encounter), and later so uncomfortable that she totally freak out when she's potentially seen at the beach. And her, "my job can suffer from this", is far to be a strong enough justification for this dichotomy.

Midlife Crisis. One of the most unexpected games of the year for me. Admittedly, Tracy isn't as stunningly hot as Shauna or Lyssa, but perhaps because of that she comes across as the most authentic and realistic character.

She is the most correctly wrote and designed MtF transgender. The only one for who the player can feel the dysphoria, and the only one that effectively have a female looking body on top of a male body structure.
She don't really reject her penis, but she don't accept it either, which make it believable.

Did you really read all the way down here? Amazing. Well, if you did, perhaps you have something to contribute, [...]

Yes I have things to add...
But before I want to remember that transgenders are like any other human being, unique. Therefore what I'll say is to be read as "globally speaking" ; it apply to almost all transgenders, but not necessarily in the same way or with the same intensity for each one of them.
I'll also mostly talk from MtF perspective, because it's what we see the most in games, but obviously the same apply to FtM transgenders.


Firstly, MtF transgender are women like any other women. The speak, think and act/react like any women, and therefore should be wrote in first intent like any other women characters.

Secondly, the main difference between a cisgender and a transgender is the dysphoria. Applied to transgenders, the dysphoria is a literal hate of your own body, partly because it's a constant reminder of the terrible fate you have to live with.
It's not "hate" at first, when you're still a young child, just a high discomfort. But obviously, when you live in discomfort 24/24, everyday of your life, come the time when you start to hate the reason of this discomfort. This especially since it's mostly a mental discomfort ; you are mentally suffering from the opposition between your body and your gender. This coming both from your own body, and from the way others see you.
Imagine being a man, and feeling deep in your organism the need to be pregnant... that's what some MtF live through. Your own body is begging for things that your own body can't give you, and you've to deal with it. And yes, it can really hurt, and hurt hard, to be constantly misgenred. You do all you can to looks like the woman you are (for a MtF), and yet everybody call you "mister" ; not just once every now and then, but every single time of your life.
This said, if most transgenders suffer from this dysphoria, they don't all deal with it in the same way. For some, having the global appearance of the correct sex is enough ; so growing breasts for MtF, or having a mastectomy for FtM, can be enough to appease the suffering. They still don't have the body they should have had, but at least they now looks like it for the others. Not being anymore misgenred ease the suffering enough to let them deal with the physical parts of their body that aren't the right ones (mostly the genitals).
But globally if a MtF character say, "I want to get rid of my dick at one time", then this character can't be effectively comfortable with it, dot. She will not necessarily hate her penis, but she want to forget about it as much as possible. This imply that, paradoxically, this person will more easily accept that her partner touch her penis (because it will be seen as the partner touching her genitals), than herself touching it (which would remind her that it's not the right genitals) ; this implying that at first she accept that her penis was touched, which isn't necessarily the case.

Thirdly, please devs, stop talking about surgery. We are in 2020, the first step of a transition is to pass through a second puberty by taking an hormonal treatment. MtF will grow natural breasts, while FtM will grow beard (my brother like best friend is a FtM with a better beard than mine and, yes, I envy him for this) ; and it's not the only thing that will change, it's literally an effective second puberty. But this hormonal treatment have a two counter parts...
At first, it will be an emotional roller coaster. In some extreme case, it can looks like bipolarity. Full of joy the few days after the monthly injection (generally, but it can have another periodicity), and a total depression the few days before the next injection.
Then after some times (between one and two years), the body will start to reject the reproductive organs. For some it's just another discomfort, this time purely physical, for others it's a constants pain ; girls, see it like the worse day of your period, every single days.
Apparently (but it's just from my own experience and people tend sometimes to minimize how much they suffer) the average is more on the side of the discomfort. But this should also be took in count. It's not because you accept your body at a partial transition state, and so keep your genitals as it, that you'll necessarily keep the reproductive organs (so the testicles for a MtF).

Fourthly, because they are rejected more than anyone else (still globally speaking), they want to talk, to share what they their suffering. So, one of the best way to write correctly a transgender person is to add small dialogs where they talk about their issues.
Not full propaganda ones, where the character will explain that transgender are human being and all. No, more things like, "shit there's a shortage on my hormonal treatment [NdA: it happen too often], I'll again have to take another one and it do shit with me", and things like that.
I said it at first, they are human being like any other... therefore, when they feel comfortable with the person they are talking to, they also talk about their day by day little problems ; it's just that they have other problems than us.

 

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

I'll give you a test.
Do you believe in pronouns?
Are you all about LGBT rights?

As in she/he/they/etc?
I belive in everyones right to use they pronoun they feel comfortable with. There has, admittedly been a case or some cases of people trying to abuse that right (vague memory of some newspaper article about that), but isn't that always the case?
Absolutely I'm all about LGBTQ rights, in the sense that I fully support them, not in the sense that it's all I'm about.

 

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

With WVM, MC I believe is trying to make Shauna more comfortable with herself, but so far doesn't know how to address it. He even says he wants to explore that side of sexuality. In the hotel he makes an attempt and she is the one who balks. I believe he should be not only more open with her, but have more in depth conversations with Penny on how to help Shauna.

While it's in the futa category (you did say you're ok with alien species though) Starship Inanna has a great futa character. She's written as strong person and absolutely badass fighter. Her role is central to the game.

I'm sure you're right and that future updates will adress this. By which point that game will definitely be a cat 1.

I have looked at Starship Innana, but not played it yet. I definitely will now. Thanks for the rec.

 

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

I'm not transgender either, just had a life that made me have close encounters with a lot of them, partly when I was volunteer for psychological support structures ; some of them still being my friends nowadays, one of them even being like a brother for me.


Yes I have things to add...
But before I want to remember that transgenders are like any other human being, unique. Therefore what I'll say is to be read as "globally speaking" ; it apply to almost all transgenders, but not necessarily in the same way or with the same intensity for each one of them.
I'll also mostly talk from MtF perspective, because it's what we see the most in games, but obviously the same apply to FtM transgenders.


Firstly, MtF transgender are women like any other women. The speak, think and act/react like any women, and therefore should be wrote in first intent like any other women characters.

Secondly, the main difference between a cisgender and a transgender is the dysphoria. Applied to transgenders, the dysphoria is a literal hate of your own body, partly because it's a constant reminder of the terrible fate you have to live with.
It's not "hate" at first, when you're still a young child, just a high discomfort. But obviously, when you live in discomfort 24/24, everyday of your life, come the time when you start to hate the reason of this discomfort. This especially since it's mostly a mental discomfort ; you are mentally suffering from the opposition between your body and your gender. This coming both from your own body, and from the way others see you.
Imagine being a man, and feeling deep in your organism the need to be pregnant... that's what some MtF live through. Your own body is begging for things that your own body can't give you, and you've to deal with it. And yes, it can really hurt, and hurt hard, to be constantly misgenred. You do all you can to looks like the woman you are (for a MtF), and yet everybody call you "mister" ; not just once every now and then, but every single time of your life.
This said, if most transgenders suffer from this dysphoria, they don't all deal with it in the same way. For some, having the global appearance of the correct sex is enough ; so growing breasts for MtF, or having a mastectomy for FtM, can be enough to appease the suffering. They still don't have the body they should have had, but at least they now looks like it for the others. Not being anymore misgenred ease the suffering enough to let them deal with the physical parts of their body that aren't the right ones (mostly the genitals).
But globally if a MtF character say, "I want to get rid of my dick at one time", then this character can't be effectively comfortable with it, dot. She will not necessarily hate her penis, but she want to forget about it as much as possible. This imply that, paradoxically, this person will more easily accept that her partner touch her penis (because it will be seen as the partner touching her genitals), than herself touching it (which would remind her that it's not the right genitals) ; this implying that at first she accept that her penis was touched, which isn't necessarily the case.

Thirdly, please devs, stop talking about surgery. We are in 2020, the first step of a transition is to pass through a second puberty by taking an hormonal treatment. MtF will grow natural breasts, while FtM will grow beard (my brother like best friend is a FtM with a better beard than mine and, yes, I envy him for this) ; and it's not the only thing that will change, it's literally an effective second puberty. But this hormonal treatment have a two counter parts...
At first, it will be an emotional roller coaster. In some extreme case, it can looks like bipolarity. Full of joy the few days after the monthly injection (generally, but it can have another periodicity), and a total depression the few days before the next injection.
Then after some times (between one and two years), the body will start to reject the reproductive organs. For some it's just another discomfort, this time purely physical, for others it's a constants pain ; girls, see it like the worse day of your period, every single days.
Apparently (but it's just from my own experience and people tend sometimes to minimize how much they suffer) the average is more on the side of the discomfort. But this should also be took in count. It's not because you accept your body at a partial transition state, and so keep your genitals as it, that you'll necessarily keep the reproductive organs (so the testicles for a MtF).

Fourthly, because they are rejected more than anyone else (still globally speaking), they want to talk, to share what they their suffering. So, one of the best way to write correctly a transgender person is to add small dialogs where they talk about their issues.
Not full propaganda ones, where the character will explain that transgender are human being and all. No, more things like, "shit there's a shortage on my hormonal treatment [NdA: it happen too often], I'll again have to take another one and it do shit with me", and things like that.
I said it at first, they are human being like any other... therefore, when they feel comfortable with the person they are talking to, they also talk about their day by day little problems ; it's just that they have other problems than us.

Wow, Anne, I'm pretty certain now that I should have left the writing of my little review to you instead. Very insightful and informative. Thank you. On the other hand, after a slow start, it seems this thread is becoming what I was hoping for: a forum for really interesting discussions about character development etc. I've read or skimmed most of the threads about trans characters, but most of them were quite a bit lacking in this. So thanks again for your input and making this thread even more interesting, hopefully some of the developers will read what you just wrote and take note for the future.

 

[RC-1138 Boss]

[...] Bad Teacher, The City of Broken Dreamers ... [...]

About City of Broken Dreamers the developer has been adding more participation for Kleo in the story. Much to the chagrin of a few bigots in the thread Kleo was turned into a hacker friend of Sonja, the ex-wife of Jake, the protagonist. She is now a recurrent character in the story.
Also he(dev) added some dialogue between Jake and Ellen(a old friend) talking about a past experience he had with another transwoman.

I think the dev also didn't want her to be just a fetish sex scene and the protagonist didn't simply look like a closet bigot.

 

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

About City of Broken Dreamers the developer has been adding more participation for Kleo in the story. Much to the chagrin of a few bigots in the thread Kleo was turned into a hacker friend of Sonja, the ex-wife of Jake, the protagonist. She is now a recurrent character in the story.
Also he(dev) added some dialogue between Jake and Ellen(a old friend) talking about a past experience he had with another transwoman.

I think the dev also didn't want her to be just a fetish sex scene and the protagonist didn't simply look like a closet bigot.

That sounds fantastic,it means that game will absolutely rise up to a higher category. Is it already implemented or is this in a coming update? Also, thanks for the info.

 

[RC-1138 Boss]

That sounds fantastic,it means that game will absolutely rise up to a higher category. Is it already implemented or is this in a coming update? Also, thanks for the info.

Already implemented. Kleo made appearances in chapter 5 and the newest chapter 7.
About the talk with Ellen, Jake mentioned he refused at the time to have sex with the transwoman that he wasn't as open minded at the time but now both end up agreeing that he should have gone for it.

 

[L7Bear]

She's not badly wrote, but she is too superficial for a MtF (Male to Female) transgender. She is wrote like a woman character, which is a good point, but the way she treat her penis is wrong.
That she don't suffer from dysphoria, why not, it's not rare that a transgender accept his body, or start to accept it after a partial transition. But in this case, the person effectively accept it, which isn't the case here. Lyssa is comfortable enough with her dick to show it to a perfect stranger (the MC during their first encounter), and later so uncomfortable that she totally freak out when she's potentially seen at the beach. And her, "my job can suffer from this", is far to be a strong enough justification for this dichotomy.

When Lyssa reveals herself to the MC, she is in control of the situation.
When she is seen on the beach, she has trusted the MC that they were in a safe & private place, then suddenly discovered that she was exposed. The MC responds rather casually to Polly's appearance and doesn't take their exposure seriously until after Lyssa freaks out. The safety and comfort she felt with the MC on that beach suddenly came crashing down and in an instant she discovered she had no control of the situation.

Spoiler: Going beyond that scene

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[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

Personally, I don't think she is in the process of transitioning from male to female or female to male. She already transitioned to become the person she always knew herself to be. She is non-binary. She is a gorgeous woman with brass balls and the biggest dick in the room. Why would she want to be anything else?

That was just beautiful, really well said. Love the discussion you two are having by the way, amazing that you can interpret the character in two so almost diametrical ways.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Note: This is not a criticism of the game, which is a relatively well wrote one, a rare thing nowadays. It's just a disagreement regarding the writing of one character in one scene.

When Lyssa reveals herself to the MC, she is in control of the situation.
When she is seen on the beach, she has trusted the MC that they were in a safe & private place, then suddenly discovered that she was exposed.

For this, I understand and agree.
But the MC never explicitly said that it was a safe or private place. He just said that it was earlier, while she know that he's just a student and here only because his studies ; which imply that "earlier" can perfectly be "the first and only time I came here before".
Therefore, her following him so easily in the water mean that she don't care this much about a possible exposure ; she just prefer to avoid it, if possible.

The MC responds rather casually to Polly's appearance and doesn't take their exposure seriously until after Lyssa freaks out.

He reacted according to Lyssa own expressed feeling about her body ; possibly coupled to the innocence of his young age.
Once told that the place was safe earlier, Lyssa don't hesitate a single second to strip naked. And she only need a, "there's just me here", to go out of the water. Once again, it's not the attitude of someone who effectively care about the exposure of her body, but the attitude of someone who just want to avoid it, if possible.
Plus, the dichotomy here is way to big, going really from one side of the spectrum to the other one ; either she should had been more hesitant to strip naked, or less to go out of the water. It make her looks like she remember that she have a penis only when she have an erection, which isn't the case, all her other scenes demonstrate that she never forgot about it.
The worse is that there's really few missing to make the scene more realistic ; a more convincing attempt from the MC and an explicit agreement from Lyssa. This both when Lyssa strip naked, and then when she go out of the water.

In top of that, she's totally naked under an almost see through sarong ; we see the curves of her boobs and that she's naked under it. This at the beach, so a place where the wind is tricky ; especially with such light clothes.
Therefore, unless it's the first time she go to the beach, which isn't believable, she know perfectly that at anytime her dick can be shown.
if she really cared, she wouldn't have worn this in the first place. So, once again, except the second where she hesitated to strip naked, and the moment where she hesitated to go out of the water, everything in this scene state that Lyssa just prefer to avoid exposure, if possible, but don't really care about it.

Personally, I don't think she is in the process of transitioning from male to female or female to male. She already transitioned to become the person she always knew herself to be. She is non-binary. She is a gorgeous woman with brass balls and the biggest dick in the room. Why would she want to be anything else?

Then, why is she afraid to expose herself ?
If she's non-binary, she's also not living with a disliking/hate of her body ; at least not now that she have breasts. Plus, she effectively have the biggest dick, know it, and shown more than once that she's proud of it... But she's hesitant to show it erected, so in all its glory ? It's the moment when she's the more proud about her dick, and also the moment when she want to hide it the most ? It make no sense.

There's just something wrong in this scene. Especially since, according to Lyssa head and eyes positions, Polly was behind her, so she never saw her dick. And it's even less believable since Lyssa heard the MC say her name. Therefore, she know that a, "can you look somewhere else will I get dressed, I'm shy with strangers", to Polly, or a, "can you distract her while I dress", to the MC, would have been enough.
Once again, the dichotomy is too big, making her pass from someone who don't really care, to someone who can die if it happen.


It doesn't mean that the game writing is bad, nor that Lyssa writing is globally bad. But this particular scene is either wrote too fast or not thought enough, and it break everything previously established regarding this character.

 

[Krynh]

He's a predator and I just can't condone the way he's seduced and fucked his own family.

Lol, what? He might be taking advantage of Jennifer's hero worship but his two daughters were every keen on seducing him. Amanda even complains that you haven't made a move on her.

 

[FormerlyknownasOlheden]

Lol, what? He might be taking advantage of Jennifer's hero worship but his two daughters were every keen on seducing him. Amanda even complains that you haven't made a move on her.

Much as I find the discussion interesting, let's not get too far off-topic please (and this is obviously not aimed at you specifically Kryhn, I meant Oldmantac as well if he was inclined to continue the discussion). Agree to disagree and all that. Unless were discussing the character Tracy, in which case this is absolutely the right forum.