Why are there less quality RPGM games when compared to VN's ?

[Adabelitoo]

First thing. If you actually think that saying "no offense" right before offensive post somehow makes it better, try to use this trick in real life, speaking with someone who can physically harm you. You'll see the truth about that thing.
Yes, I am quite offended. Like any other normal being would be.

Second, please re-read my post. You misunderstood it completely. Why in the world you decided that I was talking bad about VN devs? Are you one of them and was triggered or what?
I'll explain in simpler words since, as you said, you don't know English well (no offense dude! Cause I'm also very good at enterpriting other's words!). I was answering at topicstarter's answer "Why are there less quality RPGM games when compared to VN's?". And, in my opinion, that's because lazy meatbags who develop RPGM games want more money by doing less work. They don't study program, they don't write good stories... And not a single word about VNs, might I say. Do you understand me now? And once again, absolutely no offense!

Lol, maybe you would be surprised but I do say "no offense" IRL frecuently and nobody has hurt me. It's even better to say "no offense" IRL because people can see my face and hear the tone of my voice while I speak and realize that I'm trully not trying to offend them instead of just reading a few lines of text and assuming the worst of the internet as I feel you did.

Second, maybe this is the part where you make me think (and I still think) that you were speaking about VNs?

In VN you just need to write text and add pictures and music. In RPG Maker game you need to write texts, add pictures and music, test game mechanics, create maps... Well, you need to create full game. And it's really hard.

Idk, if you put that sentence in the middle of a bunch of insults, it makes me feel like you were talking about VNs. In any case your second post doesn't make you sound any better because now I know you're also calling all those thing to RPGM devs too, and now you're also insulting me so you really aren't giving me too much to work with...

But hey, if the words "no offense" offend you so much then: Yes offense.

 

[SubSupreme]

As an RPG dev myself, I feel like the amount of complexity for the same amount of "value" is much higher for an RPG, especially if you want to take the time to flesh it out and bring everything together. When you think about just the visual art assets, not only do you need the characters, scenes and props like in a VN, you also need the map sprites, the battle sprites/images, the tile sets, the battle environments, icon sets, animation sets and more. Then when you get to the programming there are all the additional systems to maintain, flesh out then troubleshoot. There's also all of the extra stuff like NPC dialogue/movement, shops, economy, combat balance, encounter rates, and a lot of extra enemy sprites/images.

It's takes a lot less ingredients to make an amazing and delicious cupcake (Visual Novels) than it does to make an equally amazing wedding cake (RPG/Action). At the end of the day, it's objectively better to focus on making those cupcakes because you can spend more time and resources making them look really nice and still make them a lot more quickly. Eating cupcakes are also less of a commitment than a wedding cake, so you have more people willing to support and purchase cup cakes... especially if people (and more so people who don't choose to support devs in any way) start holding wedding cakes to the same standard as cupcakes.

Based on my own observations, cupcak... err... VNs tend to be more vanilla as opposed to the kinkier RPGs so they have a more general appeal in addition to everything else.

 

[blueoktavia]

As an RPG dev myself, I feel like the amount of complexity for the same amount of "value" is much higher for an RPG, especially if you want to take the time to flesh it out and bring everything together.

As much as I'd love to see a properly made adult themed RPG, I have to agree that the development barrier is much higher than making your typical VN. I think most devs simply don't have the incentive to invest a large amount of time and effort in creating a game for a relatively niche market (compared to mainstream gaming).

 

[MrSerji]

Simply develop a game that serves both markets ^^ So a game that has NSFW content but is not based on it. So you could offer a NSFW and a SFW version and increase the profit and all games could do it. People who want something "normal", as well as those who want to play something dirty

I do that in my games too. Okay, I'll do it in my games too. I didn't get much out of it so far because I am a perfectionist and I always have something in my eye that I don't like.

 

[SubSupreme]

So a game that has NSFW content but is not based on it. So you could offer a NSFW and a SFW version and increase the profit and all games could do it.

If you are making a game like that, why do a NSFW version at all? The standards of gameplay/quality are MUCH higher for SFW games so if it is already high enough quality without NSFW content that it can survive in the normal gaming market and it has nothing to do with NSFW content or themes then just stick with SFW stuff.

 

[MrSerji]

That's a fair question. Basically, I think the idea is not a bad one, but as you say, "Why venture into the NSFW market at all when the game can survive in the normal market?"

I have no real answer to that. I just think you can do both, but you don't have to.

 

[XoXeXa]

with new RPG MZ engine there should be increasing quality of RPGM games

 

[fidless]

with new RPG MZ engine there should be increasing quality of RPGM games

It's almost identical to MV. Just an extra few features are added which already existed with a couple of pugins.

 

[Onedge]

The RPGM engine is easy to use to create a simple game ultra-fast. So if you have a bunch of h art, you can just make a map, make some events that unlock that h art, and you have a game. The assets the engine comes with are also available for commercial use! Anyway, for obvious reasons, that is going to be a bad game.

However, there is also the issue that people use the engine to create VNs, which the engine was simply not intended for. This ends up in low fps, forcing you to walk around for no reason, unable to skip (like in renpy) etc.

Last but not least, if an RPGM game has actual gameplay, there's also that some people are just not interested in having actual gameplay.

In any case, the final question is what exactly do you find appealing? I love pixel-art graphics and deep gameplay mechanics, and VNs are just not my cup of tea, so RPGM was the obvious choice for me.

 

[ImperialD]

i think i'm going with there are great games on both sides rpg's and renpy .. good examples are Harem .. harem collector .. ( RPG's) and then WVM and My New Family (renpy) so to say there are no great games on both sides is wrong i think

 

[Cokane0]

First thing. If you actually think that saying "no offense" right before offensive post somehow makes it better, try to use this trick in real life, speaking with someone who can physically harm you. You'll see the truth about that thing.
Yes, I am quite offended. Like any other normal being would be.

Watch out guys we have a badass over here.

 

[Raven Hex]

You don't drive a Ford Model T now, you don't fly a Douglas DC-3... Why? The answer is very simple: they, like RPGMs, are outdated and in museums (or in private collections). Today, games like RPGMs should look at least like Torchlight 1-2. I don't hate and if I like I play some of them, but looking at pixel animation is already disgusting (now is not the 90s)

 

[-GG-]

Hi,

In really short :

Consider exluding from your comparaison Japanese rpgm who are overrepresented here, while japanese vn are not; only include thoses made outside of japan to keep this comparison relevant.

In that case : most of the RPGM game should got similar rating and support (I assume). Even probably more in comparison ( I didn't checked).

As for your subsidiary question, yes developping a good rpgm game is super difficult - from my point of view- if you are alone.

 

[Praisejesus]

The idea of “adult games” is still a fresh idea in north America, its easier to create a shit game with RPGmaker then it is with VN, with VN you can create a basic story flow chart and text file and have a lot of your work done already pump out some garbage honey select scenes and bingo bango you got yourself a VN,the biggest issue for developing adult games is the bar is set so low due to the lack of content, people are willing to support almost anything so long as its remotely entertaining.

I’ve seen multiple RPGmaker games on here using default assets even default maps that ship with the game, games that have generic fetch quests with crippling bugs make over 3k a month on patreon.

Alright kids, just for you I created an RPG, a lot of hard work went into this!


seriously though why should a developer go the extra distance?

me?, i want to create a unique little piece of artwork that entertains... and the issue is sometimes to create something beyond generic shit is a tedious anger inducing hellscape.

heres todays mind breaking fun of development

my protagonist needs to have mulitple emotions for dialog



alright now i need to render off 28 face poses, and 28 body poses round up 60 renders, now lets say my character wears clothing, the storyboard says i am going end up with 20 outfits by the end of production 1200 renders so far...
alright lets say i want something better then default sprite animation garbage for walking around the map

nifty the tits jiggle, now that's about 40 frames per direction, flip horizontal for side view because i'm lazy chop the frames down to the lowest i can and still maintain tit jiggle, that puts me at 20 frames per direction = 60 renders... add clothing

2400 renders... BUT WAIT there's more, cant forget monsters

 

[rk-47]

rpgms are a lazy way to make games, vn require much more work, NLT is the only devs who actually work hard on their game i mean that purely from a gameplay perspective, custom assets/tiles/character models instead of that pixelated junk all other rpgms have

 

[aattss]

I think it would be pretty likely that the people who play and rate rpgm games and the people who play and rate renpy games are often different people, so I wouldn't read too much into comparing ratings between the two. And there's so much variance between games that I don't think it really makes sense to shove all the games in a genre or format into a single box in terms of effort or quality.

 

[Praisejesus]

rpgms are a lazy way to make games, vn require much more work

depends on what game you look at, i can find just as many garbage VN as i can RPGmaker trash, what makes a developer lazy? am i lazy for the engine i choose?
VN styles are mostly for that, VISUAL NOVELS, i want complex puzzles and a 3D envirment to walk around in.
i've built a couple small projects inside of unity, but the workload would require a team of people to create new content every month
RPGmaker is nothing more then a set of tools that help me best create the artwork i want to create in the timeframe i want to create it.

NLT's games contain the same basic fetch quests as any other generic VN or RPGmaker game, difference he's more of an artist and knows how to make it look good

 

[rk-47]

depends on what game you look at, i can find just as many garbage VN as i can RPGmaker trash, what makes a developer lazy? am i lazy for the engine i choose?
VN styles are mostly for that, VISUAL NOVELS, i want complex puzzles and a 3D envirment to walk around in.
i've built a couple small projects inside of unity, but the workload would require a team of people to create new content every month
RPGmaker is nothing more then a set of tools that help me best create the artwork i want to create in the timeframe i want to create it.

NLT's games contain the same basic fetch quests as any other generic VN or RPGmaker game, difference he's more of an artist and knows how to make it look good

most VNs are made with renpy which is what im really basing the op on, so it should be rpgm vs renpy instead of "game engine vs game genre" which doesnt make much sense
many renpy games have sandbox elements i.e freeroam to find side plots and extras like summertime saga, milfy city or badik
rpgms also have the same idea of freeroam but linearity depends on the dev and its story, so NLT games are pretty linear but its the custom style what makes it much more unique and more devs should try to create their own custom environments that are least more than 16x16 pixels

 

[Praisejesus]

most VNs are made with renpy which is what im really basing the op on, so it should be rpgm vs renpy instead of "game engine vs game genre" which doesnt make much sense
many renpy games have sandbox elements i.e freeroam to find side plots and extras like summertime saga, milfy city or badik
rpgms also have the same idea of freeroam but linearity depends on the dev and its story, so NLT games are pretty linear but its the custom style what makes it much more unique and more devs should try to create their own custom environments that are least more than 16x16 pixels

yeah its up to the developer to utilize the tools, i like my version of free roam more though, i want players to be able to walk down an alley and discover a whore house, or have quests that involve puzzles beyond simple fetch quests ect.

 

[rk-47]

yeah its up to the developer to utilize the tools, i like my version of free roam more though, i want players to be able to walk down an alley and discover a whore house, or have quests that involve puzzles beyond simple fetch quests ect.

View attachment 907278

woah this is yours? doesnt look rpgm so it must be unity or something right?