VN Ren'Py WVM [S2 Ch.1 Ep.13 B7] [Braindrop]

[Grif1001]

Ok, well, it's clear that you are just going to argue with anything that I say, so there's no real point in continuing to discuss anything with you. The only final comment that I will make is to refer to your mother's quote...

"You will never finish if you're too perfectionistic. What feels like a flaw now can turn out to be a beautiful detail in the finished work."

This right here is another huge part of BD's problem. On numerous ocasions he has said that the delays were due to it not being perfect for him. He also has said that he can't hire anyone to help him because he is too much of a perfectionist to let any of it out be out of his control.

I am not sugesting that he make the game perfect. I am actually sugesting that he reduce distractions so that there are less details for him to fixate his perfectionism on so that he can progress easier. You say you are willing to just let him do whatever he wants because you don't want to stifle his creativity. Unfortunantly his unbridaled creativity clashes with his perfectionism and causes him to hit a point where one stifles the other, and he is at risk of letting his need for perfection to keep him from finishing.

Anyway, good luck to you. It's obvious to everyone that you are going to pitch your tent in BD's camp and defend him regardless of anything else that anyone says. Even people who are trying to be constructive. Anyway. Hope that works out for you.

 

[RegAdd]

The only final comment that I will make is to refer to your mother

Sorry, couldn't resist

 

[Mommysbuttslut]

Ok, well, it's clear that you are just going to argue with anything that I say, so there's no real point in continuing to discuss anything with you. The only final comment that I will make is to refer to your mother's quote...

"You will never finish if you're too perfectionistic. What feels like a flaw now can turn out to be a beautiful detail in the finished work."

This right here is another huge part of BD's problem. On numerous ocasions he has said that the delays were due to it not being perfect for him. He also has said that he can't hire anyone to help him because he is too much of a perfectionist to let any of it out be out of his control.

I am not sugesting that he make the game perfect. I am actually sugesting that he reduce distractions so that there are less details for him to fixate his perfectionism on so that he can progress easier. You say you are willing to just let him do whatever he wants because you don't want to stifle his creativity. Unfortunantly his unbridaled creativity clashes with his perfectionism and causes him to hit a point where one stifles the other, and he is at risk of letting his need for perfection to keep him from finishing.

Anyway, good luck to you. It's obvious to everyone that you are going to pitch your tent in BD's camp and defend him regardless of anything else that anyone says. Even people who are trying to be constructive. Anyway. Hope that works out for you.

I mean, and I'm fully aware that I'm in no position to take shots at someone's name, but look at his name. Only thing goop does is sell jade vagina eggs, dude's just a walking kegel exercise.

 

[Akabakka]

It's obvious to everyone that you are going to pitch your tent in BD's camp and defend him regardless of anything else that anyone says. Even people who are trying to be constructive. Anyway. Hope that works out for you.

Yeah i admire your patience and still discussing things with him . but it was fairly obvious to everyone through his posts , and with his takes on storylines , especially the basket part . Did not feel worth it to discuss each of his points , as they don't feel genuine at all .

And I especially like how , despite his own protests , he ends up resulting to ad nominem jabs , however well disguised , and basically accusing you of "envy and jealousy" . You can dress poop with flowers , it's still poop

 

[Tomás Turbando]

Reductio ad absurdum often leads to fallacious arguments if you're not careful. Whilst there is a thing such as proof/refutation by contradiction in mathematics and propositional logic, you need to be able to logically derive falsehood for it to work. Put simply, if a proposition and its negation can both be derived from a premise, it proves the premise false.

My proposition is that immersive fictional worlds are built from many story lines. Rather than disproving it, your argument actually supports my proposition. You can take any of the Star Trek shows you mentioned, and you'll find a multitude of story lines in each of them. The fictional world of Star Trek is made immersive by having all these story lines, both within and across these various shows.

Let's say in the world of WVM, the creator wanted to make the world more immersive so he decided to create a spin-off. Split the story lines, like you want him to. Would that spin-off be about the same character, in the same time-span as the original? You can't extract just the basketball into one series and the charity in another, and the fights in another. All these events are related to each other, so they wouldn't feel right being separated. Each of those series would skip considerable parts of the story. But if he made a Damian spin-off that shows what happens to Damian after the events in the main series, or a prequel about how the MC got to where he is, that would be a spin-off just like we see in television.

As for "The reason that we are able to discuss, critique, and make comments and suggestions here is because BD never comes to F95."... That's utterly illogical to me. If he has said he will never come here again (probably because he got sick of people doing exactly what you're doing...), then regardless of what word you use, all you're really doing is complaining to feel better about your own frustration. It's ultimately a huge waste of your time, like shouting into the void.

And finally I wanted to say something about your art institute teachers. It exemplifies what I hate about art school. Who is the teacher to say something should be red instead of blue? Or whether something needs to be re-done? My creative development wasn't quite so limiting as the academic process. Art is in the eye of the beholder, which is why ultimately an artist should be selfish. You can't make something that everyone enjoys. An artist makes what THEY enjoy making, and they hope that other people can appreciate what they've made. An artist that cares too much about what other people think paralyzes their own creative process. Art school centers way too much on the consumer, because it's about creating "marketable" art.

My mother went to art school long long ago (she's in her 70s now). It was still a vocational school, but teachers taught techniques and skills, and didn't impose artistic focus to the degree modern schools do. I've seen her create all kinds of art in my lifetime. From wood-working to paintings, to little ceramic figures. Furniture, metal solding, the inside walls of our house, the list goes on and on. She always used to say "You will never finish if you're too perfectionistic. What feels like a flaw now can turn out to be a beautiful detail in the finished work.". I've got a talent for writing, English lit teachers always spoke very highly of me, but I write solely for myself. I just like to create stories and imagine places that don't exist. Even if I were to try to get something published, I would never write something for the sole purpose of being published. I write for me, if other people like it, good for them. If not, nobody's forcing them to read it.

I'm not going to respond to the self-plug you insert into the discussion. It makes it sound like you're more motivated by jealousy of his success than anything else. I've thus far held myself back from downloading your games and grading the writing to see if you live in a glass house. But I won't, because as I've made clear, that's not what artistic expression is about. I'm not here to judge your creativity. As long as you like what you've made, that's enough for me not to disparage it. Because it's an expression of you, and to disparage it would be to disparage you. I wonder what kind of games you would create if you let your imagination run free.

Are you using a fake profile again, Braindrop?

 

[motseer]

Reductio ad absurdum often leads to fallacious arguments if you're not careful. Whilst there is a thing such as proof/refutation by contradiction in mathematics and propositional logic, you need to be able to logically derive falsehood for it to work. Put simply, if a proposition and its negation can both be derived from a premise, it proves the premise false.

My proposition is that immersive fictional worlds are built from many story lines. Rather than disproving it, your argument actually supports my proposition. You can take any of the Star Trek shows you mentioned, and you'll find a multitude of story lines in each of them. The fictional world of Star Trek is made immersive by having all these story lines, both within and across these various shows.

Let's say in the world of WVM, the creator wanted to make the world more immersive so he decided to create a spin-off. Split the story lines, like you want him to. Would that spin-off be about the same character, in the same time-span as the original? You can't extract just the basketball into one series and the charity in another, and the fights in another. All these events are related to each other, so they wouldn't feel right being separated. Each of those series would skip considerable parts of the story. But if he made a Damian spin-off that shows what happens to Damian after the events in the main series, or a prequel about how the MC got to where he is, that would be a spin-off just like we see in television.

As for "The reason that we are able to discuss, critique, and make comments and suggestions here is because BD never comes to F95."... That's utterly illogical to me. If he has said he will never come here again (probably because he got sick of people doing exactly what you're doing...), then regardless of what word you use, all you're really doing is complaining to feel better about your own frustration. It's ultimately a huge waste of your time, like shouting into the void.

And finally I wanted to say something about your art institute teachers. It exemplifies what I hate about art school. Who is the teacher to say something should be red instead of blue? Or whether something needs to be re-done? My creative development wasn't quite so limiting as the academic process. Art is in the eye of the beholder, which is why ultimately an artist should be selfish. You can't make something that everyone enjoys. An artist makes what THEY enjoy making, and they hope that other people can appreciate what they've made. An artist that cares too much about what other people think paralyzes their own creative process. Art school centers way too much on the consumer, because it's about creating "marketable" art.

My mother went to art school long long ago (she's in her 70s now). It was still a vocational school, but teachers taught techniques and skills, and didn't impose artistic focus to the degree modern schools do. I've seen her create all kinds of art in my lifetime. From wood-working to paintings, to little ceramic figures. Furniture, metal solding, the inside walls of our house, the list goes on and on. She always used to say "You will never finish if you're too perfectionistic. What feels like a flaw now can turn out to be a beautiful detail in the finished work.". I've got a talent for writing, English lit teachers always spoke very highly of me, but I write solely for myself. I just like to create stories and imagine places that don't exist. Even if I were to try to get something published, I would never write something for the sole purpose of being published. I write for me, if other people like it, good for them. If not, nobody's forcing them to read it.

I'm not going to respond to the self-plug you insert into the discussion. It makes it sound like you're more motivated by jealousy of his success than anything else. I've thus far held myself back from downloading your games and grading the writing to see if you live in a glass house. But I won't, because as I've made clear, that's not what artistic expression is about. I'm not here to judge your creativity. As long as you like what you've made, that's enough for me not to disparage it. Because it's an expression of you, and to disparage it would be to disparage you. I wonder what kind of games you would create if you let your imagination run free.

Proof positive! If you can't dazzle 'em with brilliance, baffle 'em with bullshit.

 

[karumi56]

Are you using a fake profile again, Braindrop?

If you look at the account's post history, it definitely looks like another sock puppet. Nice of BD to drop by though...

 

[KiryuKazuma095]

Because it would be much more challenging to build the renders in such a way that the protagonist's face would be hidden by various elements (hands, arms, other people in general etc) or angles. Exactly the same with DITLO: Harper. And for what he does, he doesn't even have to go into Paint for 5 minutes to solve it. But hey, at least that allows him more time to design unnecessary birthday renders and another 12 dozen ladies who also need birthday renders. Apart from that, let's be honest: the only lady in this VN who still has her senses together is Jamie's mother, at least that was my last stand with her. Of course, she may have been duckfaced in the meantime.

No offence but where exactly did you see that Jamie's mother has her senses ??? from the fact that she stays in an unhealthy relationship with a man that does not love either her or their daughters... If she had her senses she would have pack her things and move away

 

[MrLKX]

Don't worry, no offense taken. I was actually a bit unclear/vague about what I was getting at: What I actually meant to say was that she is the lady with the most common sense in this VN. With the identical outfits and the fact that all the girls revolve around the protagonist as if brainwashed, it actually has something of a cult feel to it, which I think she referred to. The fact that his sister almost jumped at her throat didn't help either, as this is reminiscent of the behavior of certain cults that pretend to be religions, which like to try to silence critics and leavers, be it through lawsuits or more direct means. But yes, she herself is not the healthiest person mentally.

 

[KiryuKazuma095]

Don't worry, no offense taken. I was actually a bit unclear/vague about what I was getting at: What I actually meant to say was that she is the lady with the most common sense in this VN. With the identical outfits and the fact that all the girls revolve around the protagonist as if brainwashed, it actually has something of a cult feel to it, which I think she referred to. The fact that his sister almost jumped at her throat didn't help either, as this is reminiscent of the behavior of certain cults that pretend to be religions, which like to try to silence critics and leavers, be it through lawsuits or more direct means. But yes, she herself is not the healthiest person mentally.

In all movies/series i have seen with romance in college most of the girls are in love with the same guy...Jamie's mom goes to his house out of nowhere (no body invited her there,she does not even had the address,we assumed that she followed Damien)and starts insulting the MC because he came from a problematic familly, she could be a bit more reasonable...Sure the way that all the females that the MC has met so far ar acting out of the order is true....But still you do not go to a person's house and start judging his struggles in life..As for Cedey i believe that the way she reacted was because of psychological trauma she has to deal with due to everything that happened to her...

 

[Ohvidente]

Braindrop before doing the yacht scene with the rich girl

 

[MarkChadWinters]

Thought I'd drop by and catch up on all the news. And the news is....there is no news. No solid dates of when we can expect the update (though at least now BD isn't over promising/ lying about when he will be ready).

And I see the comments about having too many girls. I will be real, there are a LOT to keep track of.

As long as Jasmine, Tia, Bailey get the proper attention I'm cool with that. I haven't seen it mentioned in a bit but wasn't there a "cult of bailey" on here before?

Hopefully I'm not just making things up in lue of BD not making anything himself

 

[Badjourasmix]

The number of girls is definitely the biggest problem with this game. I don't know why he keeps adding new girls when most of the ones already in game, barely have any content. He is just making things even harder for himself for no reason.

 

[H4MPU5]

Nothing a week after his last update WOHOOOOOOO!

 

[hic86]

The number of girls is definitely the biggest problem with this game. I don't know why he keeps adding new girls when most of the ones already in game, barely have any content. He is just making things even harder for himself for no reason.

I'll agree that "too many" is a problem, but I disagree it is the biggest problem in the game. I think it is harder to keep track because updates are too insignificant and inconsistently released. If there was a set schedule with a fairly set amount of content (See Moonbox as a prime example, you could set your watch to that dude), you could have many LI's and so long as you don't go too long without an even brief appearance, they'd at least stay fresh in your mind. BD's problem is there are LI's and side girls going back to S1, that got 1 mention in S2, and you need to replay to get a refresher of who TF they are.

An ingame mini-bio of each girl may help remedy that, but consistency will make it easier.

 

[RegAdd]

As long as Jasmine, Tia, Bailey get the proper attention I'm cool with that. I haven't seen it mentioned in a bit but wasn't there a "cult of bailey" on here before?

I may be misremembering because the start of that was before my time here, but I think I read something about the Cult of Bailey founder dying.

 

[Badjourasmix]

I'll concede that "too many" is a problem, but I disagree it is the biggest problem in the game. I think it is harder to keep track because updates are too insignificant and inconsistently released. If there was a set schedule with a fairly set amount of content (See Moonbox as a prime example, you could set your watch to that dude), you could have many LI's and so long as you don't go too long without an even brief appearance, they'd at least stay fresh in your mind. BD's problem is there are LI's and side girls going back to S1, that got 1 mention in S2, and you need to replay to get a refresher of who TF they are.

An ingame mini-bio of each girl may help remedy that, but consistency will make it easier.

I think the reason why moonbox is able to release updates so often is because he doesn't have animations in his game. I think even moobox himself said in the past that if he did animations he couldn't release updates so often. Also moonbox has 34 girls in his game. If you download the character sheets from the op in this thread, there are 50 girls there and that link hasn't been updated in like 3 years. There have been at the very least, 10 more girls added since then, even with the very inconsistent release schedule. Even if he released an update every month I don't see how you can give every girl enough content.

 

[preglovr12]

I may be misremembering because the start of that was before my time here, but I think I read something about the Cult of Bailey founder dying.

He did indeed pass away.

 

[hic86]

I think the reason why moonbox is able to release updates so often is because he doesn't have animations in his game. I think even moobox himself said in the past that if he did animations he couldn't release updates so often. Also moonbox has 34 girls in his game. If you download the character sheets from the op in this thread, there are 50 girls there and that link hasn't been updated in like 3 years. There have been at the very least, 10 more girls added since then, even with the very inconsistent release schedule. Even if he released an update every month I don't see how you can give every girl enough content.

Very well could be true that he may have bloated the numbers to be too much. Consistency would certainly help in keeping characters fresh in mind, but it very well may not be enough. Still doesn't make it the biggest issue with the game, at least in my opinion.

And my point on Moonbox wasn't the speed, it was the consistency. BD has gone from 3 drops in 2 weeks, to radio silence for months, to 2 drops in a month. He is all over the place. If he was at the very least consistent, He might stand a chance at keeping some of his lesser characters relevant.

 

[benjaminsisco2024]

So the next update is April 1, April Fool's day.