VN Ren'Py Completed A Promise Best Left Unkept [Bonus S2 Ep 9-11] [Hangover Cat]

[AverageHalfwit]

Folks like to counter rape by coercion and rape by deception with slippery slope arguments that normally fall into a pit of argumentum ad absurdum but the fact remains that consent as a concept is distinct from mere acquiescence. Because someone acquiesces to sex they have not consented. Consent must be an affirmation of willingness, not an ability to comply. Laura doesn't even fully acquiesce, merely cooperates under protest. Just because Luca expresses incredulity when Laura enjoys sex doesn't mean that we must agree with him. The person who is raped by coercion's enjoyment of sexual intercourse is irrelevant to consent, which cannot be given ex post facto. Oh, and only Laura gets to decide whether what happens to her body is consensual or not and her relationship status is also an irrelevance. If we are to agree with Luca that Laura wasn't raped when she clearly stated she was (would not consent and feels that she is given no other viable option but to cooperate) means that we are adopting a deeply depraved point of view when it comes to the very concept of human agency and bodily autonomy.

So, in this specific case of Laura's first sexual interaction with Luca and not in relation with an abstract (and horrible) notion of rape - she wasn't actually cheating ? She was just doing a relationshipy social function ? Isn't that kinda blame shifting from the cheater's guidebook ( "it was only the tip", "it didn't mean much", "I was thinking about you the whole time", "he/she is just a friend", "I was feeling neglected", "I was feeling pressured"). I mean if it's rape of course cheating is excluded.
I mean when you have the option, a very valid option and at all time available, to say no to a situation, and you still go for the situation, all consequences ignored, is it right to get a "there there, you poor victim" ? Even more so, to be put on the same level with authentic abuse survivors, to receive the same empathy ?
I guess I'm not educated enough on this matter, but I just cannot see this specific interaction as being rape.

 

[NewTricks]

So, in this specific case of Laura's first sexual interaction with Luca and not in relation with an abstract (and horrible) notion of rape - she wasn't actually cheating ? She was just doing a relationshipy social function ? Isn't that kinda blame shifting from the cheater's guidebook ( "it was only the tip", "it didn't mean much", "I was thinking about you the whole time", "he/she is just a friend", "I was feeling neglected", "I was feeling pressured").
I mean when you have the option, a very valid option and at all time available, to say no to a situation, and you still go for the situation, all consequences ignored, is it right to get a "there there, you poor victim" ? Even more so, to be put on the same level with authentic abuse survivors, to receive the same empathy ?
I guess I'm not educated enough on this matter, but I just cannot see this specific interaction as being rape.

I don't think that the question is that binary whether it was cheating or rape. It is possible to be both. I will give an example of a friend I know whose wife was cheating on him, but there was a specific sex act that she begged her affair partner not to perform because of a health condition. She had recently had a child and there had been complications. I will not specify what he did to her because it was gross and terrible. Even though she did consent to sexual contact she did not consent to that sex act and the affair was discovered when she went to the hospital. Even she admitted readily that it was both cheating and rape. The affair partner was her boss, so he did have power over her, but she admitted that the rendevous itself was not coerced. And certainly, Laura does have fully consensual sex with Luca eventually, but consent is not a blanket for everything goes and even when she does consent to a specific act he regularly violates her consent for others. It is okay to be confused when it comes to these issues because a lot of them fall into gray areas that society really doesn't want to talk about. Also, it is okay to make a distinction between these sexual assaults and forcible rape where violence is used. That's why the legal system has different degrees of rape and sexual assault. Laura isn't in the right just because she was wronged. If Laura were to try to excuse her actions, for example, based on the fact that the sex was non-consensual until it wasn't I don't think a reasonable person would accept that when deciding whether or not to continue a relationship. Her actions demonstrate a lack of judgment and basic respect that makes her a deeply unsuitable partner. I don't think that anyone here is arguing that or if they do they must be taking the piss.

 

[AverageHalfwit]

I don't think that the question is that binary whether it was cheating or rape. It is possible to be both. I will give an example of a friend I know whose wife was cheating on him, but there was a specific sex act that she begged her affair partner not to perform because of a health condition. She had recently had a child and there had been complications. I will not specify what he did to her because it was gross and terrible. Even though she did consent to sexual contact she did not consent to that sex act and the affair was discovered when she went to the hospital. Even she admitted readily that it was both cheating and rape. The affair partner was her boss, so he did have power over her, but she admitted that the rendevous itself was not coerced. And certainly, Laura does have fully consensual sex with Luca eventually, but consent is not a blanket for everything goes and even when she does consent to a specific act he regularly violates her consent for others. It is okay to be confused when it comes to these issues because a lot of them fall into gray areas that society really doesn't want to talk about. Also, it is okay to make a distinction between these sexual assaults and forcible rape where violence is used. That's why the legal system has different degrees of rape and sexual assault. Laura isn't in the right just because she was wronged. If Laura were to try to excuse her actions, for example, based on the fact that the sex was non-consensual until it wasn't I don't think a reasonable person would accept that when deciding whether or not to continue a relationship. Her actions demonstrate a lack of judgment and basic respect that makes her a deeply unsuitable partner. I don't think that anyone here is arguing that or if they do they must be taking the piss.

Thank you, that's very insightful and something I can agree with.
Cheers

 

[Terix3]

It's just a conceptual question, no need to get yikesy and cringe about it. A community can decide that the word 'rape' is only to be used about physical coercion (which is historically consistent) but still take blackmail and similar situations seriously from a legal and ethical perspective. There's no factual answer to conceptual decisions like that, it's just a matter of how language is used.

How is it a conceptual question ?
In modern society rape is term describing a non-consensual sexual intercourse. No separate terms exist based on type of coercion - physical force, loss of control (drugs), blackmail , threats . Why is that ? No doubt the intent is to not create a differentiation that one act would be better than another.

Historically consistent eh ? Rape being associated with physical coercion is result of our male dominated history. Like look at the misogynistic vocabulary when it comes to describing male vs female that has multiple partners. I imagine that in old times when lord would force himself on women he wouldn't need to use force nor anyone would dare to call him rapist.

 

[Prince of Depression]

How is it a conceptual question ?
In modern society rape is term describing a non-consensual sexual intercourse. No separate terms exist for coercion through physical force, drugs, blackmail , threats . Why is that ? No doubt the intent is to not create a differentiation that one act would be better than another.

According to feminist like you all form of sex when women don't like something it's rape. Even when women, for exaple, voluntarily suck's boss dick for raise.

That's wrong and ridicilous. I feel pure soy white knight energy from this discussion.

 

[JoZEr]

According to feminist like you all form of sex when women don't like something it's rape. Even when women, for exaple, voluntarily suck's boss dick for raise.

That's wrong and ridicilous. I feel pure soy white knight energy from this discussion.

This is the best example of a strawman argument I've seen in a long time, and that's saying something.

 

[NewTricks]

This is the best example of a strawman argument I've seen in a long time, and that's saying something.

Yeah. I don't think that any steps were missed on the checklist. Well done to that lad.

 

[GiGiGus ニクヤセベ!]

According to feminist like you all form of sex when women don't like something it's rape. Even when women, for exaple, voluntarily suck's boss dick for raise.

That's wrong and ridicilous. I feel pure soy white knight energy from this discussion.

Well, that's kinda another extreme.

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So, I come to conclusion that we have somewhat misunderstanding here due to grey area of moral and laws. Yes, it it a duress. But, as it has been said by NewTricks, Laura had had a lot of other opportunities to deal with this situation. Also, there would be no game if she had refused that proposal %)

 

[mommysboiii]

too be honest I think the game should focus more on the start with romantic cuddles,devolop the relationship with his gf(bcecause the MC know his girlfriend but we as a player have no connection) ,romantic dates and than a very slow corruption I think the early scenes in the hotel and at the start and the cuddle scenes with his gf are the hottest scenes ever because the gf struggles alot because it feels so good and she betreys her boyfriend but the later scenes are too unrelistic with the videocall or all ending scenes are not as hot because she is completly corrupted .

I think ntr games really need to learn from our red string with cheracter bonding and realism not every male as enemy and so on....or some other games were we go to college meet the love of our life make a bonding going on dates everything works perfect having cuddles and beautiful picnics in the sunset MC is in heaven and than the downfall a very slow corruption from a bully because the starting scenes and hotel scenes are so damm hot we need more time build a connection and slow corruption in my opinion.

I think ntr is so hot and has so much potential but sadly every ntr game I play has way too fast corruption, no relationship build up(as a player no real romantic connection to the women the emotional connection is the most important part in ntr games!!!! otherwise ntr wont hit as hart ) and a lot of unrealistic scenes

because a game like our red string writting and cheracter bonding,realism plus the corruption/ntr at the start of this game would be my perfect dream ntr game ever I think we need a evolution of ntr games to get them on the next level

 

[matsuy]

because a game like our red string...

Yeah, too bad _that_ game died in 2021... isn't it? Quite a relief to still have developers like @HangoverCat who deliver constantly, even when coming at cost of a more "focussed"/contained/restricted project.

 

[ktez]

Yeah, too bad _that_ game died in 2021... isn't it? Quite a relief to still have developers like @HangoverCat who deliver constantly, even when coming at cost of a more "focussed"/contained/restricted project.

Yeah, I don't see the problem with this game... it's just a focused NTR game, if he tried to do as much as he's doing with multiple characters the game would be finished on 2026.

 

[mommysboiii]

Yeah, I don't see the problem with this game... it's just a focused NTR game, if he tried to do as much as he's doing with multiple characters the game would be finished on 2026.

I mean I would rather have one very good focused game that is finised 2026 or 2028 than 3 small games in that time frame that are all big tits,black neighbour corrupts the gf too fast ,no relationship build up and unrealistic scenes dont understand me wrong I LOVE NTR I think this kink is hot as hell but I really hope some devs will evolve and get ntr on the next level like other devs with other genres do at the moment change is not always bad and I think the ntr genre is in need of some changes.

and the big advantage of ntr games is that they can focus on only one love interest(I know there are some ntr games that try more but i think it makes ntr games worse to make the mc a cheater or focuse on 3-5 love interest because ntr games are about a emotional connection and the betreyal of a person that you love more than your own life) compared to other genres so ntr games have the time and could use this to their adventage and focus more on realism(no stupid mc,or huge ass tities just a normal sweet loking women),slower relationship build up that you fall in love and care about the love interest and slower corruption so I think all this changes make ntr games better and make ntr hit harder

 

[woomb]

Eh, I think more devs can learn from HangoverCat than the other way around. Big -1 to the idea that we should plan for a 5 year roadmap for a game. That's just asking for it to be abandoned.

 

[Terix3]

I mean I would rather have one very good focused game that is finised 2026 or 2028 than 3 small games in that time frame that are all big tits,black neighbour corrupts the gf too fast ,no relationship build up and unrealistic scenes dont understand me wrong I LOVE NTR I think this kink is hot as hell but I really hope some devs will evolve and get ntr on the next level like other devs with other genres do at the moment change is not always bad and I think the ntr genre is in need of some changes.

and the big advantage of ntr games is that they can focus on only one love interest(I know there are some ntr games that try more but i think it makes ntr games worse to make the mc a cheater or focuse on 3-5 love interest because ntr games are about a emotional connection and the betreyal of a person that you love more than your own life) compared to other genres so ntr games have the time to focuse more on realism(no stupid mc,or huge ass tities just a normal sweet loking women),slower relationship build up that you fall in love and care about the love interest and slower corruption so I think all this changes make ntr games better and make ntr hit harder

That is just one approach to NTR, not everyone inserts themselves.
I think that this game takes things long enough and i honestly don't want to wait 6y to play full game. The scenes are realistic enough and tbh in NTR scenes don't need to be realistic they are to convey the kink. I like to say that the scenes need to be possible not probable.

 

[ktez]

I mean I would rather have one very good focused game that is finised 2026 or 2028 than 3 small games in that time frame that are all big tits,black neighbour corrupts the gf too fast ,no relationship build up and unrealistic scenes dont understand me wrong I LOVE NTR I think this kink is hot as hell but I really hope some devs will evolve and get ntr on the next level like other devs with other genres do at the moment change is not always bad and I think the ntr genre is in need of some changes.

and the big advantage of ntr games is that they can focus on only one love interest(I know there are some ntr games that try more but i think it makes ntr games worse to make the mc a cheater or focuse on 3-5 love interest because ntr games are about a emotional connection and the betreyal of a person that you love more than your own life) compared to other genres so ntr games have the time and could use this to their adventage and focus more on realism(no stupid mc,or huge ass tities just a normal sweet loking women),slower relationship build up that you fall in love and care about the love interest and slower corruption so I think all this changes make ntr games better and make ntr hit harder

Nah, no one wants a 5 years development game.

 

[202219champion]

you can change the name of the characters?

 

[monsterqweqwe]

Can someone explain how the alternative endings differ from the main three (normal, sharp, hero), Specifically I saw screenshots where they are highlighted in yellow and there is something about the future. And also what is this bonus scene? Is it in the main game or is it a separate mini-game from the author?

 

[Kame-Sennin]

I wish we can also see Laura's mom Sandra some action damn she is a hot milf, even just a background story of her cheating

 

[ZUBiDAM]

I wish we can also see Laura's mom Sandra some action damn she is a hot milf, even just a background story of her cheating

I'm pretty sure the author said she will have action in this route, maybe even next update?
i hope there will be more backstory of harry and maya

 

[Puma1978]

I'm pretty sure the author said she will have action in this route, maybe even next update?
i hope there will be more backstory of harry and maya

At least she is now already in action in the bonus scene...bt i want to know what will go on with MC's Ex Girlfriend ( is Maya her name?) of who we just saw a picture yet.