VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.11.1] [DrPinkCake]

[Lightaces]

the mistery is the consequence

No, the consequence is the mystery!

 

[ename144]

Wait, Jill still agrees to go out with you? I really need to try getting on Bella bad side to see what are the conversations like, but like Sage, It's hard to reject her, the force is too strong!

Yes, Jill will still go out with you and for the most part it's the same as normal.

But during their conversation on the bench she will admit she was hesitant because Bella doesn't like the MC. , He can either say he's a decent guy, in which case things proceed more or less as normal (AFAIK), or admit that Bella is right and Jill should probably steer clear.

If the MC warns her off, Jill will finish the date but then leave without a kiss and the MC will comment the date wasn't the best. Come episode 5, Jill will still sleep on the couch and talk about Rusty, but won't kiss him or hold hands. When Bella asks about the date during yoga, Jill will say the MC is very different; she likes him as a friend, but is not sure there's anything more.

So admitting Bella was right definitely puts a dent in any relationship with Jill, possibly stopping it outright. Not recommended.

 

[ename144]

The problem with all that is you're forced to be with other girls. There's no real choice. I did everything to avoid Josy and she still latched on, Maya still kissed--it's all a no go you simply can't choose everything. There's still interaction you can't avoid. If you ask me, the better choice is to go after Bella as it will lead you to Jill, and Bella is someone she looks up to, always seeking her approval. I also didn't like the shower scene on their "first date," but it happens if you stick to that route anyway. In the end, it's a sex game.

I think it's fine for the MC to be railroaded into being friends with the LIs. It keeps the story from expanding out of control, justifies the time spent on all their renders, ensures certain ideas and themes will come up, and helps give the MC a certain sense of identity (rather than just being a faceless, blank slate). Plus, the MC might be friends with the girls, but that still leaves the question of whether he seeks a sexual relationship with one or more of them up to us. That seems like a good compromise that keeps the plot and characters on course while still allowing our choices to have a serious impact.

Thus far, that's largely how the game has worked. The MC is forced to fool around with Josy and Maya to a certain degree, but beyond that he can actually be pretty chaste if he puts his mind to it. Either way, however, the LIs are all clearly friends with him in some capacity.

Really, my issues with MC's relationships only come up in two cases: a) when the game offers a choice then ignores or minimizes that choice to force the story back onto the rails, and b) when the girls are forced to act out of character to keep the plot moving.

The former problem can be solved by either adding some cosmetic effect of the choice to maintain the illusion or (if that is impractical) just not offering the false choice in the first place. The latter is DPC's own fault since he's the one who wrote his own characters into a corner. Still, mistakes happen so if he realizes what he's done too late and there really is no credible way for the characters to act as needed, a brief OOC moment is probably the lesser evil. We can just hope he learns his lesson and plans ahead better in the future.

 

[AvatarStormBringer]

He can either say he's a decent guy, in which case things proceed more or less as normal (AFAIK), or admit that Bella is right and Jill should probably steer clear.

NOW I know why the walkthrough mentioned the option "If you told Jill you are a decent guy".

 

[IkarusWestwood]

We can just hope he learns his lesson and plans ahead better in the future.

Or we can see him ruining the game more and more every 4-6 months. :]

 

[Rimmer]

The problem with all that is you're forced to be with other girls. There's no real choice. I did everything to avoid Josy and she still latched on, Maya still kissed--it's all a no go you simply can't choose everything. There's still interaction you can't avoid. If you ask me, the better choice is to go after Bella as it will lead you to Jill, and Bella is someone she looks up to, always seeking her approval. I also didn't like the shower scene on their "first date," but it happens if you stick to that route anyway. In the end, it's a sex game.

It's to be expected, he did it the same way in his last game, gave you choices and then still forced you down a route, then chucked in a wtf moment that was supposed to shock and upset you, made little sense and was poor storytelling......just hope this one fares better.

 

[Holy Bacchus]

The great fallacy of this game is believing that by rejecting or not pursuing things with a certain LI that it closes them off completely, but it doesn't. Since these characters are necesssary to the overall story, they have to remain and as such are given unavoidable moments and events even when you're not on their path that seem to hint at future chances for intimacy.

It's something of a flaw in this game because if you're going to make LIs so optional then you should either not have them be so intrinsically linked to the overall plot surrounding the MC, or at least clearly establish a more friend-based relationship if they've been rejected.

It seems like DPC is trying to do a kinetic story but with lots of choices, and sometimes it feels like the merger of these two very different styles of game don't always gel together in a way that makes the story cohesive.

 

[Manuka]

It's to be expected, he did it the same way in his last game, gave you choices and then still forced you down a route, then chucked in a wtf moment that was supposed to shock and upset you, made little sense and was poor storytelling......just hope this one fares better.

Never played any of his other stuff. I have yet to play "Acting Lessons?" I have fiddled with other games where every choice actually impacts your relationship with another in the end. Being a DiK is actually the first I played where you're just hoping it goes a certain way, I guess? Idk. Either way, it's fun just playing it different ways. Once the new season/episodes come out, I'll be starting over going the Chick route--I wanna know more about Jillian than anyone else, truth be told.

 

[Wizard_Shiryuu]

The great fallacy of this game is believing that by rejecting or not pursuing things with a certain LI that it closes them off completely, but it doesn't. Since these characters are necesssary to the overall story, they have to remain and as such are given unavoidable moments and events even when you're not on their path that seem to hint at future chances for intimacy.

It's something of a flaw in this game because if you're going to make LIs so optional then you should either not have them be so intrinsically linked to the overall plot surrounding the MC, or at least clearly establish a more friend-based relationship if they've been rejected.

It seems like DPC is trying to do a kinetic story but with lots of choices, and sometimes it feels like the merger of these two very different styles of game don't always gel together in a way that makes the story cohesive.

That's kind of right but kind of not. It's true that there are some interations that are unavoidable, but that doesn't mean that those hinting future intimacy don't. Look at ep.5 Josy. If you are on her path you have sex with her when you go to her room, if you're not you have that scene that says she still has feelings for you and hints at a solo path. If they are hinting at something they are, all of those could be rewritten to something that doesn't hint anything if that's what he wants. That goes for every scene like that one, but that's an easy example.

 

[Manuka]

... and b) when the girls are forced to act out of character to keep the plot moving.

That's where I have my beef with this game the most. I mentioned it so many times I ended up starting a dispute about ""DPA" already has mentioned certain things are going to happen, bla, bla bla. You can't change anything. I hate when people get mad about things you can't change, bla bla..."

So it got to the point where people were just getting po'd at me. I can't talk with some peeps, they overlook what I was referring to and my point never got across, so I let it all go. Now I'm just keeping my mouth shut and seeing where this goes.

 

[Wizard_Shiryuu]

That's where I have my beef with this game the most. I mentioned it so many times I ended up starting a dispute about ""DPA" already has mentioned certain things are going to happen, bla, bla bla. You can't change anything. I hate when people get mad about things you can't change, bla bla..."

So it got to the point where people were just getting po'd at me. I can't talk with some peeps, they overlook what I was referring to and my point never got across, so I let it all go. Now I'm just keeping my mouth shut and seeing where this goes.

One thing I loved about Game of Thrones (or properly said A Song of Ice and Fire) is that every character acted in character and you can justify any twist, and they are all foreshadowed to some extent. The author has said that he knew some things will happen from the beginning, but he reached those organically. I'm not sure if DPA will manage to do those, considering the library scene. (Is it only me or did ep.5 seem to retcon that scene?)

 

[AvatarStormBringer]

Now I'm just keeping my mouth shut and seeing where this goes.

Down the rabbit hole...

 

[Manuka]

One thing I loved about Game of Thrones (or properly said A Song of Ice and Fire) is that every character acted in character and you can justify any twist, and they are all foreshadowed to some extent. The author has said that he knew some things will happen from the beginning, but he reached those organically. I'm not sure if DPA will manage to do those, considering the library scene. (Is it only me or did ep.5 seem to retcon that scene?)

I never watched the show but I read the entire series. But You're not alone thinking that with ep.5, it seemed like a big change in tone for me, but we'll see. RR Martin's also a "discovery" writer, not much of a consistent planner. He has a general outline where he wants to take it but ends up growing characters "organically" as you say. We'll see what happens.

 

[ename144]

One thing I loved about Game of Thrones (or properly said A Song of Ice and Fire) is that every character acted in character and you can justify any twist, and they are all foreshadowed to some extent. The author has said that he knew some things will happen from the beginning, but he reached those organically. I'm not sure if DPA will manage to do those, considering the library scene. (Is it only me or did ep.5 seem to retcon that scene?)

Episode 5 definitely changed the context of the library scene, especially if you picked the friendship route. Whether that was his intention all a long or only happened because so many people wereunhappy/confused in the wake of Episode 4 is probably something only DPC will ever know.

But either way, some followup was badly needed. The library scene just didn't work properly as written. It was the culmination of an entire episode's relentless angst, the (supposed) turning point in the MC's two most significant relationships in the game at that point. Yet it it barely addressed any of the underlying issues, put the focus on the girls instead of the MC (to the point of that infamous kiss as a friend MC walks away), and in the end it still left the relationship of the trio somewhat ambiguous no matter what you chose.

There's a reason everyone criticizes that scene (even if they like it).

EDIT:
It occurs to me that I was already worried about how long this story would be and how much time it will take DPC to tell it. Comparing it to aSoFaI is not a good omen!

 

[Cndyrvr4lf]

Episode 5 definitely changed the context of the library scene, especially if you picked the friendship route. Whether that was his intention all a long or only happened because so many people wereunhappy/confused in the wake of Episode 4 is probably something only DPC will ever know.

But either way, some followup was badly needed. The library scene just didn't work properly as written. It was the culmination of an entire episode's relentless angst, the (supposed) turning point in the MC's two most significant relationships in the game at that point. Yet it it barely addressed any of the underlying issues, put the focus on the girls instead of the MC (to the point of that infamous kiss as a friend MC walks away), and in the end it still left the relationship of the trio somewhat ambiguous no matter what you chose.

There's a reason everyone criticizes that scene (even if they like it).

EDIT:
It occurs to me that I was already worried about how long this story would be and how much time it will take DPC to tell it. Comparing it to aSoFaI is not a good omen!

Just something about the fact that based of a few choices the girls could be so cold as to make out just like that. Immediately after telling someone they both cheated on their significant other, who they loved so much, that nope it meant nothing and they just want to be friends. I know some cold blooded people but man brother THATS"S COLD!

 

[Tserriednich'sNen]

The great fallacy of this game is believing that by rejecting or not pursuing things with a certain LI that it closes them off completely, but it doesn't. Since these characters are necesssary to the overall story, they have to remain and as such are given unavoidable moments and events even when you're not on their path that seem to hint at future chances for intimacy.

It's something of a flaw in this game because if you're going to make LIs so optional then you should either not have them be so intrinsically linked to the overall plot surrounding the MC, or at least clearly establish a more friend-based relationship if they've been rejected.

It seems like DPC is trying to do a kinetic story but with lots of choices, and sometimes it feels like the merger of these two very different styles of game don't always gel together in a way that makes the story cohesive.

Which makes me wonder just how different can we realistically expect the endings to be.

 

[Manuka]

Down the rabbit hole...

Just something about the fact that based of a few choices the girls could be so cold as to make out just like that. Immediately after telling someone they both cheated on their significant other, who they loved so much, that nope it meant nothing and they just want to be friends. I know some cold blooded people but man brother THATS"S COLD!

Well, sometimes people do things in a way they did not intend for it to be hurtful. Maybe they were just caught up in the moment--future seemed bleak until certain things suddenly became possible?

 

[Manuka]

Down the rabbit hole...

You should jump in, it's where all the fun is.

 

[Cndyrvr4lf]

Well, sometimes people do things in a way they did not intend for it to be hurtful. Maybe they were just caught up in the moment--future seemed bleak until certain things suddenly became possible?

I can't see it. They had already had their reunion and their makeup.

 

[Wizard_Shiryuu]

I never watched the show but I read the entire series. But You're not alone thinking that with ep.5, it seemed like a big change in tone for me, but we'll see. RR Martin's also a "discovery" writer, not much of a consistent planner. He has a general outline where he wants to take it but ends up growing characters "organically" as you say. We'll see what happens.

I posted some time ago about DPC being a discovery or architect type of writer, and we didn't come to a consensus. AL made me thing he was the former, but BADIK looks like the might be the latter. There's lots of potential to side plotlines to explore and lots of intersting characters. I still think he is more of an architect but who knows. I hope he doesn't make characters act ooc to justify plot points he wants to make, but if we use the library scene as a reference we're screwed.

Episode 5 definitely changed the context of the library scene, especially if you picked the friendship route. Whether that was his intention all a long or only happened because so many people wereunhappy/confused in the wake of Episode 4 is probably something only DPC will ever know.

But either way, some followup was badly needed. The library scene just didn't work properly as written. It was the culmination of an entire episode's relentless angst, the (supposed) turning point in the MC's two most significant relationships in the game at that point. Yet it it barely addressed any of the underlying issues, put the focus on the girls instead of the MC (to the point of that infamous kiss as a friend MC walks away), and in the end it still left the relationship of the trio somewhat ambiguous no matter what you chose.

There's a reason everyone criticizes that scene (even if they like it).

EDIT:
It occurs to me that I was already worried about how long this story would be and how much time it will take DPC to tell it. Comparing it to aSoFaI is not a good omen!

The threeway route also changed a bit, with the "no strings to any of us" after pretty much the opposite happened the day before that. He said a lot of times (even in the intro) that he will make the story he wants to make regardless of public opinion, but it still feels like a retcon.

The problem with ASOIAF was becoming too wide and Martin being unable to stick to a deadline. DPC as for now hasn't failed one and pulls out content consistently. In that regard at least we can't criticize him

I can't see it. They had already had their reunion and their makeup.

Yeah, that scene was about the MC, not them. They've just dumped someone they both supposedly love and had cheated the other one with and they still kiss.