Java Corrupted Saviors [Release 70b] [CSDev]

[deviantartaaa]

Ugh I gotta pick between an animalistic chosen or an undead one and I don't know which one would be more useful as a forsaken
How does this stack with animalistic chosen natuarlly dealing +50% by default? Do they stack linearly or multiplicatively?
"Dissociative Identity" Forsaken Distortion trait becomes "Dissociative Identity (Perfect Pet)": Instead of dealing +50% HATE and INJU damage, deals +50% for _all_ circumstance damage

Isn't it purely better than

"Flexible Peacemaker" Forsaken Distortion trait becomes "Flexible Peacemaker (Playful Energy)": While at 100% Stamina and above, species trait upgraded from +50% damage to +100% damage; However, when using this ability, deployment costs an extra +30% Stamina

 

[aumhs]

I haven't reached undead and animalistic choosen yet, but my understanding:

Multipliers are generally multiplicative in this game.
"Dissociative Identity" affects circumstance damage, the species trait (and by extension "Flexible Peacemaker") influence all damage, so including trauma damage.

So "Dissociative Identity (Perfect Pet) " means your damage is increased by 50% twice (species and trait), becoming damage*1.5*1.5 for circumstance, wich is a 2.25 multiplier. But it's only damage*1.5 for trauma damage.
" Flexible Peacemaker (Playful Energy)" replaces the species modifier, so it's only one multiplication, for damage*2 against both trauma and circumstance damage.


EDIT: Oh wait, does "Flexible Peacemaker (Playful Energy)" keep the default +50% PLEA and INJU damage from normal "Flexible Peacemaker" on top of that?

 

[deviantartaaa]

EDIT: Oh wait, does "Flexible Peacemaker (Playful Energy)" keep the default +50% PLEA and INJU damage from normal "Flexible Peacemaker" on top of that?

I don't know, I pulled that from the wiki

 

[SuperSkippy]

Ugh I gotta pick between an animalistic chosen or an undead one and I don't know which one would be more useful as a forsaken
How does this stack with animalistic chosen natuarlly dealing +50% by default? Do they stack linearly or multiplicatively?
"Dissociative Identity" Forsaken Distortion trait becomes "Dissociative Identity (Perfect Pet)": Instead of dealing +50% HATE and INJU damage, deals +50% for _all_ circumstance damage

Isn't it purely better than

"Flexible Peacemaker" Forsaken Distortion trait becomes "Flexible Peacemaker (Playful Energy)": While at 100% Stamina and above, species trait upgraded from +50% damage to +100% damage; However, when using this ability, deployment costs an extra +30% Stamina

Which is better depends on what you need. I'm generally a fan of filling out with Undead first as the most immediate need I have is for cheap Chosen that can reliably break T2 Circumstances. Undead can retain significantly more power while being cheap.

I wait until later to pick up Animalistic, as I make those a bit beefier so they can reliably hit 2 Circumstances (and usually help with a Distortion).

As for your comparison of the two, assuming you're making a Forsaken that hits 2 Circumstances, here's some relevant information.

If you take Dissociative Identity, your multipliers will stack in the following way: (100 + 50)% for Species, (100 + 50)% for your chosen two Circumstances, for a total of (1.5)(1.5) = 2.25x in those Circumstances, which can be whatever you wish.

If you take Flexible Peacemaker on Animalistic, your multipliers at 100% Stamina would be (100 + 100)% for species, (100 + 50)% for PLEA and INJU, for a total of (2)(1.5)= 3.0x in PLEA and INJU. But the rest of the time it'll be 2.25, same as the other.

There's more to consider than that, though. A Flexible Peacemaker will have very low Disgrace, and therefore can be quite high in cost. Prohibitively so, in fact, if she's got a DIG core--you'll just have to train Disgrace to whatever level makes her cost fit into your strategy, so you might not be able to use her for a while while she builds up her Disgrace.

There's also whether or not you have good Punishers to put on them that'll buff one or more of these damages or give her something useful. And, I don't know what damage types you might still need in your roster.

 

[ApexGryphon]

I've FINALLY nearly beat a Devil Chosen, or at least am on course to.

I still couldn't figure out how the hell to fight them, despite the helpful input I've received. No matter what I do, the Devil winds up with absolutely no weakness' to trauma or circumstance, and I just have to output so much raw damage that it still hurts her regardless.

That amounts to using my Undead Rampant's at their max strength every battle, and relying on Energy Raider to recoup the cost....

I really can't imagine this is how they are meant to be fought, but I can't find any other way.

 

[aumhs]

The Loops page on the wiki says that there are currently 5 bosses in the game, the Bosses page lists only 3. The bosses page is the correct one, right?

 

[fenyx]

I've FINALLY nearly beat a Devil Chosen, or at least am on course to.

I still couldn't figure out how the hell to fight them, despite the helpful input I've received. No matter what I do, the Devil winds up with absolutely no weakness' to trauma or circumstance, and I just have to output so much raw damage that it still hurts her regardless.

That amounts to using my Undead Rampant's at their max strength every battle, and relying on Energy Raider to recoup the cost....

I really can't imagine this is how they are meant to be fought, but I can't find any other way.

Im gonna tell you how I finally did it
start a game from zero, and add custom forsaken
add a undead forsaken with this: Significant Innocence, Core Dignity
minor morality and significant confidence
why? because it will give this trait:
Notorious Publicist
Up to +200% own trauma damage per Parasitism performed"

now, when you meet this undead forsaken, tempt it, then later train it to cost between 3 and 9 EE, and to do inju and expo
when you finally meet the devils it should do around x11 trauma damage, and also it can change damage to tempt (wich does pleasure damage)
getting any chosen to 10.000 damage in whatever is a breeze

this was a tip from another guy from the forum, and it works wonders

 

[Nobody032]

Im gonna tell you how I finally did it
start a game from zero, and add custom forsaken
add a undead forsaken with this: Significant Innocence, Core Dignity
minor morality and significant confidence
why? because it will give this trait:
Notorious Publicist
Up to +200% own trauma damage per Parasitism performed"

now, when you meet this undead forsaken, tempt it, then later train it to cost between 3 and 9 EE, and to do inju and expo
when you finally meet the devils it should do around x11 trauma damage, and also it can change damage to tempt (wich does pleasure damage)
getting any chosen to 10.000 damage in whatever is a breeze

this was a tip from another guy from the forum, and it works wonders

You can also add a normal chosen with Hardworking Publicist trait(Significant Innocence and Dignity+ Core confidence). Gives +1000% trauma damage to the victim. So when you get a Notorious publicist you can have a head start on damage.

Spoiler: Here is an example(Loop 15). She is also the second in command cause of an item so +45% all damage

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[ApexGryphon]

You can also add a normal chosen with Hardworking Publicist trait(Significant Innocence and Dignity+ Core confidence). Gives +1000% trauma damage to the victim. So when you get a Notorious publicist you can have a head start on damage.

Spoiler: Here is an example(Loop 15). She is also the second in command cause of an item so +45% all damage

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Wow, yeah, that is a lot of damage potential. Honestly, I've been completely ignoring the +Trauma% punishers since I couldn't see how a few small percentages would help at all.

Clearly I was missing a step or two there.

Imma keep at my current campaign just to see how far I can get, but when it fails I'll give the trauma% Chosen a try. Have made it to loop 14 so far.

 

[fenyx]

You can also add a normal chosen with Hardworking Publicist trait(Significant Innocence and Dignity+ Core confidence). Gives +1000% trauma damage to the victim. So when you get a Notorious publicist you can have a head start on damage.

Spoiler: Here is an example(Loop 15). She is also the second in command cause of an item so +45% all damage

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That I did too, I didnt tell because I didnt think it was that important.
My tempting forsaken has only a x11 (you have a x21)and I didnt have problems until the late partjust before judgement

 

[deviantartaaa]

Please, for the love of god, let us reorder forsaken and show more than 5 per page

 

[Nobody032]

Wow, yeah, that is a lot of damage potential. Honestly, I've been completely ignoring the +Trauma% punishers since I couldn't see how a few small percentages would help at all.

Clearly I was missing a step or two there.

Imma keep at my current campaign just to see how far I can get, but when it fails I'll give the trauma% Chosen a try. Have made it to loop 14 so far.

Tempted Undead forsaken are one of the best right now because of their trait which recovers both stamina and motivation on trauma damage. With that punisher you pretty much get to deploy them every single day. That and they already cost low ee to deploy. Might be worth getting one in your current run if you can. I am thinking of trying out the Rampage ability of Angel too but I will only do it if I ever get 2 angels in one run.

That I did too, I didnt tell because I didnt think it was that important.
My tempting forsaken has only a x11 (you have a x21)and I didnt have problems until the late partjust before judgement

Yeah Notorious publicists by themselves can stack up enough. I just like to have a 3 ee undead tempted chosen which I can deploy day 1 because I get 3 energy from sacrifice achievement and focus is free with newspaper, so Hardworking Publicist helps with that. The punisher is also good if you wanna try some other species Tempt/rampage forsakens.

Btw unless I am mistaken the best self building forsaken would be a Minor Morality+ Significant Innocence+ Significant Confidence+ Core Dignity.

You get:
Notorious Publicist(200% self damage increase per parasitism)
Consuming Harvester(+10% self inju dmg increase)

I usually only add a hardworking publicist but I might add a chosen with this set up as well if I start a new game.

 

[aumhs]

Not sure if intended or bug: If you have Balance's Pantsu, then circumstance damage is still colored red or green even if the penalty from imbalanced trauma got neutralized completly.

 

[Nobody032]

So I finally got around to completing my old playthrough. Defeated Judgement with temptation and did a tempt and rampage on the angels to try out a Rampage Angel. Too bad I will have to redo this run because I don't like the temptation trait of Judgement. Will have to deal with those Rampages again.... The Angel hate punisher doesn't do any favors either.

Spoiler: Bugged Temptation trait

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Btw can Propaganda angst damage be shifted to after Angel check? The item is becomes useless against angels.

 

[Nobody032]

Somehow did Negotiation on Judgement while getting Rampage and Temptation on the angels(Both angel had pre broken stuff so locked distortions).

Even by getting a 20 turn orgy you can't get enough angst on Judgement to trigger negotiation. Angel's Plea,Hate and Expo punishers can also ruin your day(Esp hate one since they use it when surrounded) Propanda is a completely useless item against Angels(Hence why I think it needs a buff). Even the end battle needed to be retried multiple times since I only had the courage to go for one negotiation (16% Appeal dmg) since energy was scarce.

When orgies failed me I started looking for alternate strats to deal the damage needed. And I think I find the perfect way to deal with an Angel/Devil combo but it might need Newspaper Upgrade to work most effectively.

Who needs orgies when you have Meglomaniacs?

Spoiler: I think I overdid it

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Btw The Negotiation trait for Judgement is as follows:

Spoiler: Negotiation Trait

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[fenyx]

Somehow did Negotiation on Judgement while getting Rampage and Temptation on the angels(Both angel had pre broken stuff so locked distortions).

Even by getting a 20 turn orgy you can't get enough angst on Judgement to trigger negotiation. Angel's Plea,Hate and Expo punishers can also ruin your day(Esp hate one since they use it when surrounded) Propanda is a completely useless item against Angels(Hence why I think it needs a buff). Even the end battle needed to be retried multiple times since I only had the courage to go for one negotiation (16% Appeal dmg) since energy was scarce.

When orgies failed me I started looking for alternate strats to deal the damage needed. And I think I find the perfect way to deal with an Angel/Devil combo but it might need Newspaper Upgrade to work most effectively.

Who needs orgies when you have Meglomaniacs?

Spoiler: I think I overdid it

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Btw The Negotiation trait for Judgement is as follows:

Spoiler: Negotiation Trait

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Question: what happens if you do maneuver on judgement while both of the angels are captured? one of them finally escapes, or are them eternally captured?


Edit : NEVERMIND Ididnt understand what you wrote correctly at first read
Now that I did, next question: can you do this earlier enought to distort all 3 of them ?

 

[Nobody032]

Question: what happens if you do maneuver on judgement while both of the angels are captured? one of them finally escapes, or are them eternally captured?


Edit : NEVERMIND Ididnt understand what you wrote correctly at first read
Now that I did, next question: can you do this earlier enought to distort all 3 of them ?

Only one of the angel will be frozen in Judgement fight. One will escape at 2x speed andJudgement herself at 3x speed. So all orgies are 1/3 the turns they can be.

How early you can do this depends on how much energy your meglomaniac forsaken costs. I did this on day 7 or 8 because I got energy from Temptation and Rampage which allowed me to deploy a 70 energy commander + a forsaken(Newspaper upgrade). Used the commander on the two and then swapped to my Megolomaniac for max results.

You should be able to get distortions on Angels without this strat though. Using tempted undeads means free temptation for everyone. Frozen Angels are also free to break by surrounding their partners. So the main use of this strat is to get Judgement to use t3 moves and also get enough angst for Negotiation(I could tempt her just fine with undead forsakens). It also makes Victory easy to break. Victory and Judgement are the only ones who made me use this.

You can also get a good orgy going with this if you release when you have enough openings and circumstance while others are also open to surrounds.

 

[fenyx]

Only one of the angel will be frozen in Judgement fight. One will escape at 2x speed andJudgement herself at 3x speed. So all orgies are 1/3 the turns they can be.

How early you can do this depends on how much energy your meglomaniac forsaken costs. I did this on day 7 or 8 because I got energy from Temptation and Rampage which allowed me to deploy a 70 energy commander + a forsaken(Newspaper upgrade). Used the commander on the two and then swapped to my Megolomaniac for max results.

You should be able to get distortions on Angels without this strat though. Using tempted undeads means free temptation for everyone. Frozen Angels are also free to break by surrounding their partners. So the main use of this strat is to get Judgement to use t3 moves and also get enough angst for Negotiation(I could tempt her just fine with undead forsakens). It also makes Victory easy to break. Victory and Judgement are the only ones who made me use this.

You can also get a good orgy going with this if you release when you have enough openings and circumstance while others are also open to surrounds.

Yeah I think I got one of the angels with judgement and I had to kill the other I was just curious how maneuver worked exactly (later I re-read and you clearly explained it, I was just reading it wrong, english is not my language)In my mind maneuvering judgement should freeze both angels, so I went with that explanation , until I reread it.
If you did that day 8, shouldnt you have enought negotiation to get it to 50% or more? (1+2+3+4+5+6+7+8+9+10+11+12) or am I remembering negotiation wrong?

 

[Nobody032]

Yeah I think I got one of the angels with judgement and I had to kill the other I was just curious how maneuver worked exactly (later I re-read and you clearly explained it, I was just reading it wrong, english is not my language)In my mind maneuvering judgement should freeze both angels, so I went with that explanation , until I reread it.
If you did that day 8, shouldnt you have enought negotiation to get it to 50% or more? (1+2+3+4+5+6+7+8+9+10+11+12) or am I remembering negotiation wrong?

There are a few factors which make negotiation probably the second hardest to get on judgement(First being Despair).

-Angels drain majority of the angst which Judgement has. Which means unless I do this every other day I can't keep negotiating since that needs 1G angst on everybody seperately.

- Judgement has Plea punisher this round and unlocks Drain punisher after I do this. So next day she will again remove my forsaken's expertise possibly changing combat style while also drain stamina while I am trying to get openings on the angels.

- Because of Judgement being a devil, the energy generation is pathetic especially since all her angst keeps getting absorbed by Angels. This means deploying a strong commander is just not possible multiple times so I can't bypass Judgements's Stamina drain through The newspaper upgrade.

- Next day One of the angels will unlock Hate punisher which will limit this strategy by preventing me from effectively surrounding the other chosen.

I just decided to save up energy for final battle to get a good rampage and trigger tempt on Testament.
In the final battle I was saved by Rampages done by Blessing. I had to time rampages in such a way that I can get Judgement's resolve down before Rampaging can get Blessing's resolve down. Also had to use a couple of turns to tempt Testament.

 

[fenyx]

All current boss distortion traits.

Interesting
In my run, Judgement stole so much exp from my main forsaken that it (probably) rendered loop 16 unplayable