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3D-Daz Daz3d Art - Show Us Your DazSkill

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Discussion Reviews (13)
A

atheran

Member
Feb 3, 2020
355
2,759
So I was wondering for a while how to get all that awesome micronormal detail the 8.1 brings to the table. To nobody's surprise, rendering at high res is the trick. So, I imitated the camera that I used for the camera settings on the render, a Canon 90D. Problem is, with a 35.2 megapixel resolution in the APS-C sensor, that translates to a 6960x4640 image resolution in a 3x2 aspect ratio.

So I set that for the render target and started the render. About 10h in and it's at 23% of Convergence with a convergence ratio of 99.8%. While this process would result in an amazing image, that if used with the correct settings and good lighting would be as close to a photograph as possible (the quality of the assets would be the limiting factor for a photorealistic result), the render itself would take me about..5 days on a 6700HQ cpu.

So I stopped the render, dropped the image res down to 2560x1707 and did some manual denoising/bluring in photoshop. And while I /will/ do the full render once I'm happy with how it looks, for now I'll leave it at that and attempt to fix the few issues I have. One, is the classic problem with stockings. They float. Another, is that I haven't added the freckles yet (still trying to find a good product that works with 8.1 figures), and lastly, I need to do something with the nails. They look like simple black shapes right now, no surface details on them.

And for those interested, scene is lit with 1 diffuser, 90x90 cm with a 20d hex grid for directionality, set at around 3m away from the model with a 45 degree angle looking down and back to the model's face and a simple 18cm spotlight at the back for some edge definition on her right side. The rest of the light is simply reflected on a very light grey infinity cove that makes up the scene. Both lights are set with emissive surfaces at real world luminance values for the type of light they are. Shutter speed at 125 with 100 ISO and f-stop at 8 with adjusted gamma.

in_progress_highres.png

This is the downrezzed image. If someone wants I can upload the render too, but I didn't yet, since the file is about 60mb in size.

Any suggestions on how I can make it better? And I'm not talking about the model itself or the pose, but as far as lighting goes or suggestions about the rendering process to make it more in line with a real photography set. For example, I know in Blender I have the option to change the dynamic range to filmic, which takes it from 8 stops to 25 stops. That would result in a much better image, more realistic and without me having to mess with the gamma of the image. Is there such an option anywhere in iray? Whether baked into Daz or as a plugin?

Eventually in my quest for photorealism (which means exactly what the word says, not what people mean by it colloquially), I will end up rendering the final result in Blender. Most likely with Luxcore too instead of cycles, but I'm a long way away from that yet. I don't even know how to convert the materials from BSDF to whatever Luxcore uses. So until I'm 100% finished with the model and materials in Iray, I'll be sticking to Daz rendering. Then possibly cycles with the use of Diffeomorphic but that's a ways off still.

Fun fact, at the original size I'm rendering at of 4640x6960, the size of it when at 100% is really damn close to a real life size of a person.
 
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CyberW01f

Newbie
Feb 9, 2018
89
1,059
atheran said:
So I was wondering for a while how to get all that awesome micronormal detail the 8.1 brings to the table. To nobody's surprise, rendering at high res is the trick. So, I imitated the camera that I used for the camera settings on the render, a Canon 90D. Problem is, with a 35.2 megapixel resolution in the APS-C sensor, that translates to a 6960x4640 image resolution in a 3x2 aspect ratio.

So I set that for the render target and started the render. About 10h in and it's at 23% of Convergence with a convergence ratio of 99.8%. While this process would result in an amazing image, that if used with the correct settings and good lighting would be as close to a photograph as possible (the quality of the assets would be the limiting factor for a photorealistic result), the render itself would take me about..5 days on a 6700HQ cpu.

So I stopped the render, dropped the image res down to 2560x1707 and did some manual denoising/bluring in photoshop. And while I /will/ do the full render once I'm happy with how it looks, for now I'll leave it at that and attempt to fix the few issues I have. One, is the classic problem with stockings. They float. Another, is that I haven't added the freckles yet (still trying to find a good product that works with 8.1 figures), and lastly, I need to do something with the nails. They look like simple black shapes right now, no surface details on them.

And for those interested, scene is lit with 1 diffuser, 90x90 cm with a 20d hex grid for directionality, set at around 3m away from the model with a 45 degree angle looking down and back to the model's face and a simple 18cm spotlight at the back for some edge definition on her right side. The rest of the light is simply reflected on a very light grey infinity cove that makes up the scene. Both lights are set with emissive surfaces at real world luminance values for the type of light they are. Shutter speed at 125 with 100 ISO and f-stop at 8 with adjusted gamma.

View attachment 1529487

This is the downrezzed image. If someone wants I can upload the render too, but I didn't yet, since the file is about 60mb in size.

Any suggestions on how I can make it better? And I'm not talking about the model itself or the pose, but as far as lighting goes or suggestions about the rendering process to make it more in line with a real photography set. For example, I know in Blender I have the option to change the dynamic range to filmic, which takes it from 8 stops to 25 stops. That would result in a much better image, more realistic and without me having to mess with the gamma of the image. Is there such an option anywhere in iray? Whether baked into Daz or as a plugin?

Eventually in my quest for photorealism (which means exactly what the word says, not what people mean by it colloquially), I will end up rendering the final result in Blender. Most likely with Luxcore too instead of cycles, but I'm a long way away from that yet. I don't even know how to convert the materials from BSDF to whatever Luxcore uses. So until I'm 100% finished with the model and materials in Iray, I'll be sticking to Daz rendering. Then possibly cycles with the use of Diffeomorphic but that's a ways off still.

Fun fact, at the original size I'm rendering at of 4640x6960, the size of it when at 100% is really damn close to a real life size of a person.
Click to expand...
Beautiful render! So if i am following correctly, dialing up the resolution to to something like 16k or something close to a real camera's resolution bring out all the details of the model? What about the skin texture? Did you have to do anything to bring that detail? Or skin texture that high is quality? Most of the ones I have are 4k.
 
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Ricktor

Member
Jun 13, 2017
142
164
atheran said:
So I was wondering for a while how to get all that awesome micronormal detail the 8.1 brings to the table. To nobody's surprise, rendering at high res is the trick. So, I imitated the camera that I used for the camera settings on the render, a Canon 90D. Problem is, with a 35.2 megapixel resolution in the APS-C sensor, that translates to a 6960x4640 image resolution in a 3x2 aspect ratio.

So I set that for the render target and started the render. About 10h in and it's at 23% of Convergence with a convergence ratio of 99.8%. While this process would result in an amazing image, that if used with the correct settings and good lighting would be as close to a photograph as possible (the quality of the assets would be the limiting factor for a photorealistic result), the render itself would take me about..5 days on a 6700HQ cpu.

So I stopped the render, dropped the image res down to 2560x1707 and did some manual denoising/bluring in photoshop. And while I /will/ do the full render once I'm happy with how it looks, for now I'll leave it at that and attempt to fix the few issues I have. One, is the classic problem with stockings. They float. Another, is that I haven't added the freckles yet (still trying to find a good product that works with 8.1 figures), and lastly, I need to do something with the nails. They look like simple black shapes right now, no surface details on them.

And for those interested, scene is lit with 1 diffuser, 90x90 cm with a 20d hex grid for directionality, set at around 3m away from the model with a 45 degree angle looking down and back to the model's face and a simple 18cm spotlight at the back for some edge definition on her right side. The rest of the light is simply reflected on a very light grey infinity cove that makes up the scene. Both lights are set with emissive surfaces at real world luminance values for the type of light they are. Shutter speed at 125 with 100 ISO and f-stop at 8 with adjusted gamma.

View attachment 1529487

This is the downrezzed image. If someone wants I can upload the render too, but I didn't yet, since the file is about 60mb in size.

Any suggestions on how I can make it better? And I'm not talking about the model itself or the pose, but as far as lighting goes or suggestions about the rendering process to make it more in line with a real photography set. For example, I know in Blender I have the option to change the dynamic range to filmic, which takes it from 8 stops to 25 stops. That would result in a much better image, more realistic and without me having to mess with the gamma of the image. Is there such an option anywhere in iray? Whether baked into Daz or as a plugin?

Eventually in my quest for photorealism (which means exactly what the word says, not what people mean by it colloquially), I will end up rendering the final result in Blender. Most likely with Luxcore too instead of cycles, but I'm a long way away from that yet. I don't even know how to convert the materials from BSDF to whatever Luxcore uses. So until I'm 100% finished with the model and materials in Iray, I'll be sticking to Daz rendering. Then possibly cycles with the use of Diffeomorphic but that's a ways off still.

Fun fact, at the original size I'm rendering at of 4640x6960, the size of it when at 100% is really damn close to a real life size of a person.
Click to expand...
Looks good, you could try some micro pressure on the stockings for extra realism but other than that, that's pretty damn close.
 
A

atheran

Member
Feb 3, 2020
355
2,759
CyberW01f said:
Beautiful render! So if i am following correctly, dialing up the resolution to to something like 16k or something close to a real camera's resolution bring out all the details of the model? What about the skin texture? Did you have to do anything to bring that detail? Or skin texture that high is quality? Most of the ones I have are 4k.
Click to expand...
Here I used the maps provided with Vic 8.1. I think these are 4k but I'm at work right now and can't check. For now, the high resolution render brings out those microdetails like pores or wrinkles under the eye. I am not sure if they exist in the downsample.

But once I am happy with all the rest, I'm going to take the UVs of the model and project skin with micro details from TexturingXYZ. Those can be up to 16k or more depending on which one you buy. Use micronormals for pores etc and for larger details like wrinkles or potential zits etc I plan to use height maps and tessellate them. I am not a fan of the perfectly smooth and spotless Daz skin. For extra realism I'll be making vellus hair in Blender because Daz ones are hot garbage (face ones. For abdomen and back they are good and I use them in this render already).

But if you don't want to go through all this effort, the Daz 4k skin shades are good enough (the 8.1 PBR ones, I don't know how to use Iray uber shader yet).

Also keep in mind that skin is not everything. For this, I went through the spec manual of a D90 and emulated the sensor/prime lens of 85mm in the camera settings too. IGPT is a great plugin that fixes a lot of the issues with Daz camera (like DoF) and it gets you halfway there to simulate a real camera in Daz. Also for the lighting I used proper methods like diffusers, instead of the basic Iray lights and while it adds a lot to the rendering time since light has to scatter through a thin mesh and get diffused properly and THEN pass through a grid to be focused, it adds some more realism to bring it closer to what a studio setup lighting would be.

I hope this answers any questions without going too technical. If not, feel free to ask about any specifics.
 
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Krosos

Krosos

Engaged Member
Dec 1, 2018
2,169
2,089
atheran said:
Here I used the maps provided with Vic 8.1. I think these are 4k but I'm at work right now and can't check. For now, the high resolution render brings out those microdetails like pores or wrinkles under the eye. I am not sure if they exist in the downsample.

But once I am happy with all the rest, I'm going to take the UVs of the model and project skin with micro details from TexturingXYZ. Those can be up to 16k or more depending on which one you buy. Use micronormals for pores etc and for larger details like wrinkles or potential zits etc I plan to use height maps and tessellate them. I am not a fan of the perfectly smooth and spotless Daz skin. For extra realism I'll be making vellus hair in Blender because Daz ones are hot garbage (face ones. For abdomen and back they are good and I use them in this render already).

But if you don't want to go through all this effort, the Daz 4k skin shades are good enough (the 8.1 PBR ones, I don't know how to use Iray uber shader yet).

Also keep in mind that skin is not everything. For this, I went through the spec manual of a D90 and emulated the sensor/prime lens of 85mm in the camera settings too. IGPT is a great plugin that fixes a lot of the issues with Daz camera (like DoF) and it gets you halfway there to simulate a real camera in Daz. Also for the lighting I used proper methods like diffusers, instead of the basic Iray lights and while it adds a lot to the rendering time since light has to scatter through a thin mesh and get diffused properly and THEN pass through a grid to be focused, it adds some more realism to bring it closer to what a studio setup lighting would be.

I hope this answers any questions without going too technical. If not, feel free to ask about any specifics.
Click to expand...
You can be really happy now that I-ray at least got out of memory functionality good luck in your endevour keep on :)
 
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atheran

Member
Feb 3, 2020
355
2,759
Krosos said:
You can be really happy now that I-ray at least got out of memory functionality good luck in your endevour keep on :)
Click to expand...
I'm not crashing on test renders, so that's true. But the final render is going to happen on Blender, either Luxcore if I figure out the material conversion, or a modded Cycles with spectral rendering functionality added in.
 
DitaVonTease

DitaVonTease

Active Member
Jul 25, 2021
603
1,274
atheran said:
So I was wondering for a while how to get all that awesome micronormal detail the 8.1 brings to the table. To nobody's surprise, rendering at high res is the trick. So, I imitated the camera that I used for the camera settings on the render, a Canon 90D. Problem is, with a 35.2 megapixel resolution in the APS-C sensor, that translates to a 6960x4640 image resolution in a 3x2 aspect ratio.

So I set that for the render target and started the render. About 10h in and it's at 23% of Convergence with a convergence ratio of 99.8%. While this process would result in an amazing image, that if used with the correct settings and good lighting would be as close to a photograph as possible (the quality of the assets would be the limiting factor for a photorealistic result), the render itself would take me about..5 days on a 6700HQ cpu.

So I stopped the render, dropped the image res down to 2560x1707 and did some manual denoising/bluring in photoshop. And while I /will/ do the full render once I'm happy with how it looks, for now I'll leave it at that and attempt to fix the few issues I have. One, is the classic problem with stockings. They float. Another, is that I haven't added the freckles yet (still trying to find a good product that works with 8.1 figures), and lastly, I need to do something with the nails. They look like simple black shapes right now, no surface details on them.

And for those interested, scene is lit with 1 diffuser, 90x90 cm with a 20d hex grid for directionality, set at around 3m away from the model with a 45 degree angle looking down and back to the model's face and a simple 18cm spotlight at the back for some edge definition on her right side. The rest of the light is simply reflected on a very light grey infinity cove that makes up the scene. Both lights are set with emissive surfaces at real world luminance values for the type of light they are. Shutter speed at 125 with 100 ISO and f-stop at 8 with adjusted gamma.

View attachment 1529487

This is the downrezzed image. If someone wants I can upload the render too, but I didn't yet, since the file is about 60mb in size.

Any suggestions on how I can make it better? And I'm not talking about the model itself or the pose, but as far as lighting goes or suggestions about the rendering process to make it more in line with a real photography set. For example, I know in Blender I have the option to change the dynamic range to filmic, which takes it from 8 stops to 25 stops. That would result in a much better image, more realistic and without me having to mess with the gamma of the image. Is there such an option anywhere in iray? Whether baked into Daz or as a plugin?

Eventually in my quest for photorealism (which means exactly what the word says, not what people mean by it colloquially), I will end up rendering the final result in Blender. Most likely with Luxcore too instead of cycles, but I'm a long way away from that yet. I don't even know how to convert the materials from BSDF to whatever Luxcore uses. So until I'm 100% finished with the model and materials in Iray, I'll be sticking to Daz rendering. Then possibly cycles with the use of Diffeomorphic but that's a ways off still.

Fun fact, at the original size I'm rendering at of 4640x6960, the size of it when at 100% is really damn close to a real life size of a person.
Click to expand...

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. You'll find pressure settings in Parameters as well as within the items....
 
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5.00 star(s) 13 Votes