VN Ren'Py Eternum [v0.9.2] [Caribdis]

[ChipLecsap]

*sigh*.... this eternal debate "is she a virgin or not a virgin" will never end...
But, no one mentioned one thing - Alex has the best ass too!
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[MAGO-DAG]

I think there's some merit in the argument that Alex could be a virgin due to how she's characterized, tho. Like, Cari wouldn't add the traits that she's unapproachable and "waiting for her Prince Charming" (the last one being a big deal for her given her flashback with her Nana) if she was someone getting back on her parents by sleeping around. Especially given how anal Cari is when it comes to his character's traits...

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Like people arguing that Nan should've shown more panic and Cari be like "my brothers in Christ she is the ADULT in the group, she's not gonna be like Nova."

I never had any doubts that Alex was a "virgin" before Orion, purely theoretically. But you put it better, because that's what I had in my head!
The thing is, after seeing the flashback scene with her grandmother, it would be weird to know that she would give up her virginity to someone so easily, waiting for her normal prince...

and it's partly out of character, the most I can say is [Maybe] maybe she tried to date some guys and nothing good came of it... also, no one has cancelled the idea that she could also enjoy herself with toys or a dildo

 

[Dorfnutter]

Realistically I can definitely see her sleeping around as a fuck you to William. I dont think that would be out of character.

I'd argue it would be given how important her Nana was to her, so having her do that would only make sense if, say, at some point in her life she kinda faltered in that love because her hatred for her family is stronger (in which case that would likely be shown in a flashback while she was having a heart-to-heart with Orion during the Ulysses party, but that never happened so...). But given that it's shown that she likes to talk to her Nana via her cross, I don't think there ever was a case like that in the past.

 

[MAGO-DAG]

There really was no debate, just ChipLecsap thinking it was.

My brother Chip just hung out too much in badik, that's why he sees the world like that, but for him it's forgivable. I'll have to create something hot with Nova to calm him down

 

[Julius Kingsley]

or may be along the ride as Alex grown up, that fairy tale faded away , but now that The Guy showed up it reminded her to that memory and to that dream, and may be it was not a fairy tale.

Whether she had sex with someone before Orion or not, does not change any of this. He not became any less special, in fact this makes him more special , if he Arrived when Alex was long has given up on that dream , what I belive would been more fitting and mature for her character anyway.
and Frankly this was the vibe I get.

Finally an argument that really makes some sense and actually made me rethink. Well, that actually does make him and the whole thing more special.

 

[agrdtcwa]

I'd argue it would be given how important her Nana was to her, so having her do that would only make sense if, say, at some point in her life she kinda faltered in that love because her hatred for her family is stronger (in which case that would likely be shown in a flashback while she was having a heart-to-heart with Orion during the Ulysses party, but that never happened so...). But given that it's shown that she likes to talk to her Nana via her cross, I don't think there ever was a case like that in the past.

I guess its a culture thing. From my perspective, I dont think having casual sex is a big deal - you can bang people without being in love with them. Just because you sleep with someone does not mean its going to stop you from finding your prince charming or whatever in the future. Similarly just sleeping with a couple of people as a one off no strings attached sort of thing for whatever reason does not necessarily mean that it suddenly turns you into a slut who sleeps around every single day with strangers like some people here make it out to be.

And the idea of 'saving your virginity' for your prince charming does not make much sense to me either because its not like losing your virginity will prevent you from finding love in the future. In my playthrough Orion lost his virginity to Eva and he fucked Maat as well. But I dont think his I love you confessions to Annie, Alex, Nova etc are fake just because he slept with side girls with no strings attached in the past - it was just casual sex. Its no big deal and does not prevent him from finding true love in the future.

To me this is just one of those things that is going to be ambiguous and left to the player's imagination. Just make up your headcanon and go with what you want.

 

[Julius Kingsley]

Finally an argument that really makes some sense and actually made me rethink. Well, that actually does make him and the whole thing more special.

But again, she doesn't need to get pounded to realize they’re not what she was waiting for. So yeah, she’s still a virgin after all.

 

[agrdtcwa]

or may be along the ride as Alex grown up, that fairy tale faded away , but now that The Guy showed up it reminded her to that memory and to that dream, and may be it was not a fairy tale.

Whether she had sex with someone before Orion or not, does not change any of this. He not became any less special, in fact this makes him more special , if he Arrived when Alex was long has given up on that dream , what I belive would been more fitting and mature for her character anyway.
and Frankly this was the vibe I get.

This is exactly my thoughts about it. Except you explained it in a way thats significantly better

 

[Finuee]

See Dorfnutter's post just above, maybe he expressed it better.
Of course you can have casual sex without any emotional baggage or whatever. But probably not for your first time. Even if so, I'm not saying there'd be anything wrong with that, I just don't think picking up a random dude and letting him deflower her fits Alex' character. If she lost her virginity before Orion, I'm totally fine with that, my guess is just she didn't.

I understand where you come from and what you mean. And I see Dorfnutter 's point, too. I'm just saying that she can be waiting for the right man to open to, and be emotionally unavailable, and still have sex.

You also don't need to be promiscuous to have sex without being emotionally intimate, either. You can have a boyfriend, and still be emotionally closed to him.

Though I understand neither of you were making the point that she has to be either a virgin or promiscuous. I'm just saying it as an addendum, not aimed at your points.

 

[Julius Kingsley]

I guess its a culture thing. From my perspective, I dont think having casual sex is a big deal - you can bang people without being in love with them. Just because you sleep with someone does not mean its going to stop you from finding your prince charming or whatever in the future. Similarly just sleeping with a couple of people does not necessarily mean that magically turns you into a slut who sleeps around every single day - I can definitely see her sleep with someone, come to regret it or become disillusioned with the idea of love until she meets orion.

And the idea of 'saving your virginity' for your prince charming does not make much sense to me either because its not like losing your virginity will prevent you from finding love in the future. In my playthrough Orion lost his virginity to Eva and he fucked Maat as well. But I dont think his I love you confessions to Annie, Alex, Nova etc are fake just because he slept with side girls with no strings attached in the past - it was just casual sex. Its no big deal and does not prevent him from finding true love in the future.

To me this is just one of those things that is going to be ambiguous and left to the player's imagination. Just make up your headcanon and go with what you want.

I totally get you bro, but that’s the thing. You kinda answered yourself without realizing it. They’re still 18. The MC didn’t lose his virginity until the whole plot started, which makes sense given his age and situation. So we can say the same for Alex, and she’s way more guarded than any of the other girls. Again, these are just arguments, and everyone’s free to think what they want.

 

[Dorfnutter]

or may be along the ride as Alex grown up, that fairy tale faded away , but now that The Guy showed up it reminded her to that memory and to that dream, and may be it was not a fairy tale.

Whether she had sex with someone before Orion or not, does not change any of this. He not became any less special, in fact this makes him more special , if he Arrived when Alex was long has given up on that dream , what I belive would been more fitting and mature for her character anyway.
and Frankly this was the vibe I get.

Again, if she did that then that should've been shown in a flashback where, say, she threw off her cross at some point (which would be a strong indicator of her rebelling against her grandma or her "growing up" from her Nana's teachings/memories, the Prince Charming tale included). But at no point did that ever show up, even during an opportune moment (the Ulysses party heart-to-heart).

Also, no. The previews regarding Alex back before Eternum launched was something along the lines of her being a rebel as a facade, but underneath that is something else entirely. I would argue that young girl that we saw being nurtured by her Nana IS her true character, and that never really faded away (which is what your argument seems to suggest). Orion simply chipped away that tough exterior to get to that, rather than him making her remember (otherwise we wouldn't get that hug from her, which I would argue would definitely be out of character for a pure rebel).

 

[Julius Kingsley]

Again, if she did that then that should've been shown in a flashback where, say, she threw off her cross at some point (which would be a strong indicator of her rebelling against her grandma or her "growing up" from her Nana's teachings/memories, the Prince Charming tale included). But at no point did that ever show up, even during an opportune moment (the Ulysses party heart-to-heart).

Also, no. The previews regarding Alex back before Eternum launched was something along the lines of her being a rebel as a facade, but underneath that is something else entirely. I would argue that young girl that we saw being nurtured by her Nana IS her true character, and that never really faded away (which is what your argument seems to suggest). Orion simply chipped away that tough exterior to get to that, rather than him making her remember (otherwise we wouldn't get that hug from her, which I would argue would definitely be out of character for a pure rebel).

 

[ChipLecsap]

But again, she doesn't need to get pounded to realize they’re not what she was waiting for. So yeah, she’s still a virgin after all.

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And yet you say Virginity not what matters to you huh ?

All Joke aside, what I said, is 100% fitting for Alex personality and Character, than her being a Tattooed Rebel Nun.

What you are claiming is perfectly fitting for Annie, and we actually witnessed it .

Alex on the other hand perfectly believable that at some point she slept with 1 or 2 guy , not because she was searching for Prince Charming , but because she had long given up on Prince Charming.

May be that is why Cari did not make a big deal about it.

 

[ChipLecsap]

Again, if she did that then that should've been shown in a flashback where, say, she threw off her cross at some point (which would be a strong indicator of her rebelling against her grandma or her "growing up" from her Nana's teachings/memories, the Prince Charming tale included). But at no point did that ever show up, even during an opportune moment (the Ulysses party heart-to-heart).

Also, no. The previews regarding Alex back before Eternum launched was something along the lines of her being a rebel as a facade, but underneath that is something else entirely. I would argue that young girl that we saw being nurtured by her Nana IS her true character, and that never really faded away (which is what your argument seems to suggest). Orion simply chipped away that tough exterior to get to that, rather than him making her remember (otherwise we wouldn't get that hug from her, which I would argue would definitely be out of character for a pure rebel).

that's your interpretation.

 

[Julius Kingsley]

And yet you say Virginity not what matters to you huh ?

All Joke aside, what I said, is 100% fitting for Alex personality and Character, than her being a Tattooed Rebel Nun.

What you are claiming is perfectly fitting for Annie, and we actually witnessed it .

Alex on the other hand perfectly believable that at some point she slept with 1 or 2 guy , not because she was searching for Prince Charming , but because she had long given up on Prince Charming.

May be that is why Cari did not make a big deal about it.

It makes some sense. But nah, my virgin pussy worshipping cult has a doctrine and I have to follow it.

that's your interpretation.

Glad you could finally join us, Chip. That’s the whole damn point. You're the one who started this needless bicker.. i mean debate.

 

[Finuee]

I wouldn't call it "bicker", everyone's being mostly civil. A debate about a game's characters feels rather on point for a game's thread.

 

[Dorfnutter]

that's your interpretation.

It is what I inferred based on the evidence provided. I could say the same to you, given how you seem to think that Alex's exterior persona is her true self rather than something of a facade or a shell that Orion has to break.

 

[agrdtcwa]

Again, if she did that then that should've been shown in a flashback where, say, she threw off her cross at some point (which would be a strong indicator of her rebelling against her grandma or her "growing up" from her Nana's teachings/memories, the Prince Charming tale included). But at no point did that ever show up, even during an opportune moment (the Ulysses party heart-to-heart).

I dont think this argument makes much sense to me. Her grandmother was there for her and she loved her. That alone is reason enough to keep a memento of her. You dont need to dramatically throw away something that reminds you about a dead family member just because your opinions come to differ over time. Even if she ended up being disillusioned with the idea of finding true love, her grandmother's words were made with good intentions and were filled with love and she was a family member Alex cherished. So I see no reason for her to have that flashback rebelling against her grandma being all dramatic if she naturally came to disagree with an opinion her grandmother had over time as Alex grew older.

As a real life example, my opinions on certain political topics differ from that of my parents. But I still love them - its not an act of rebellion just because our perspectives are slightly different.

 

[agrdtcwa]

I wouldn't call it "bicker", everyone's being mostly civil. A debate about a game's characters feels rather on point for a game's thread.

Yeah the conversation so far has been civil and respectful. It is fun talking about the game with others that appreciate it who have different opinions from you.

If it becomes a shitshow then its time to abandon the thread - no point being hostile with strangers.

 

[Finuee]

Yeah the conversation so far has been civil and respectful. It is fun talking about the game with others that appreciate it who have different opinions from you.

If it becomes a shitshow then its time to abandon the thread - no point being hostile with strangers.

I fully agree. I enjoy discussing stuff with people with different opinions. It broadens my mind.