VN Ren'Py Eternum [v0.9.4] [Caribdis]

[DETROIT123_io]

If I may, what if...

-> Eternum is actually cyclical (signs are there... ouroboros symbolism, various notes by Idriel)
-> The Founder IS Orion's previous iteration (Orion having the same powers; The Founder acting as if he knows him all too well)
-> that chose the power over the Eternum multiverse, AND not just once but repeatedly ("Heads. Heads. Heads."), losing the girls in the process
-> the previous iteration of the girls is the Syndicate (skilled, strong team, yet unable to even come close to The Founder's powers, therefore needing to fly under the radar)
-> and Idriel is either the previous iteration of Penny or modeled after her (possibly a hostage or double agent)
-> therefore when the gems are gathered, Orion has to choose: the absolute power over everything or his little harem - so this is the sacrifice he needs to make AND repeatedly did not know what to choose, so he flipped a coin BUT being the all-powerful being at that point, it subconsciously always landed on heads ("power")
-> by sacrificing his harem, he becomes the new Founder; by sacrificing his powers, worlds cease being connected and Orion goes to being just a regular man

That is complex and I will be depressed if either of those happened . But this theory sounds very accurate that it scares me

 

[Dorfnutter]

-> the previous iteration of the girls is the Syndicate (skilled, strong team, yet unable to even come close to The Founder's powers, therefore needing to fly under the radar)
-> and Idriel is either the previous iteration of Penny or modeled after her (possibly a hostage or double agent)

Eh, this doesn't take into account Calypso's tale or why the Syndicate seemingly worship Psyche (who is another name for Anima* and is possibly Idriel given the chains imagery).

Also, there are men in the Syndicate (i.e. the guy in the Valley of Kings and possibly Chop Chop), so not sure how that fits with this theory unless you think both use polymorph (which I doubt).

*Edit:

 

[Johanisbear]

Eh, this doesn't take into account Calypso's tale or why the Syndicate seemingly worship Psyche (who is another name for Anima and is possibly Idriel given the chains imagery).

Also, there are men in the Syndicate (i.e. the guy in the Valley of Kings and possibly Chop Chop), so not sure how that fits with this theory unless you think both use polymorph (which I doubt).

It does not take into account Thanatos either. But it does not need to.
Thanatos is needed to make a spotlight-foe at the beginning, plus he shows that dying in our world does not necessarily mean the consciousness (or soul - called Anima in latin and Psyche in greek) fades away elsewhere.

Calypso, apart from being hot, is another marker that NPCs are not actually just NPCs as she originates from a different world (so could be/was considered an NPC in the beginning) but is capable of travelling between them, and has her own agency. In fact her world being sealed and lost to her in a way that only an all-powerful being can actually go there further supports this theory.

Finally, men in the Syndicate - why shouldn't an effective team be able to gather more allies?

 

[Dorfnutter]

It does not take into account Thanatos either. But it does not need to.
Thanatos is needed to make a spotlight-foe at the beginning, plus he shows that dying in our world does not necessarily mean the consciousness (or soul - called Anima in latin and Psyche in greek) fades away elsewhere.

Calypso, apart from being hot, is another marker that NPCs are not actually just NPCs as she originates from a different world (so could be/was considered an NPC in the beginning) but is capable of travelling between them, and has her own agency. In fact her world being sealed and lost to her in a way that only an all-powerful being can actually go there further supports this theory.

Finally, men in the Syndicate - why shouldn't an effective team be able to gather more allies?

Because while the theory of Eternum being cyclical is something I support, yours doesn't seem to take into account HOW and WHY it started to begin with, only how the cycle is likely continuing thanks to possibly Orion fucking it up all the time. Caly's tale and Idriel sharing the same qualities of Anima in said tale essentially hint that they are likely related to said how and why, and the fact that Cari is alluding in the sneaks that we are getting massive main story related infodumps in the next update suggest that Hyril'ar isn't just some rando world that Caly came from and that Idriel isn't simply a "reincarnation of Penny," as you put it.

 

[torpedogoat]

It never occurred to me that the world of Eternum might be cyclical. My interpretation is that someone (the Founder?) is playing reality, including both Earth and Eternum, like a game. That someone tries to find the optimal outcome, in which Orion wins all the gems without any irreversible disasters on the way. To achieve this, this someone saves at critical moments, tries various approaches and restores when they don't work. Idriel is aware of this because she is part of the main menu (edited: of Eternum, the fictional VR game). She transcends the individual play-throughs of reality in the same way that the Ren'Py settings transcend individual play-throughs of a visual novel.

 

[Dorfnutter]

Idriel is aware of this because she is part of the main menu.

Idriel being in the main menu was only added in 0.7 when Cari overhauled the UI (and likely just added her there because it looks cool), so big doubt the story will go full meta like that.

 

[e6mill]

It never occurred to me that the world of Eternum might be cyclical.

It didn't?

 

[torpedogoat]

Idriel being in the main menu was only added in 0.7 when Cari overhauled the UI (and likely just added her there because it looks cool), so big doubt the story will go full meta like that.

I meant the main menu of Eternum, the fictional virtual reality game. Sorry for not making that clearer. One could argue that she isn't so much part of that main menu as she is that main menu. I wasn't aware that she is now also part of the main menu of Eternum, the visul novel.

 

[Dorfnutter]

I meant the main menu of Eternum, the fictional virtual reality game. Sorry for not making that clearer. One could argue that she isn't so much part of that main menu as she is that main menu. I wasn't aware that she is now also part of the main menu of Eternum, the visul novel.

Ah. Thought you were referring to this...

 

[addict3131]

THE GOAT.

 

[BigWilli]

THE GOAT.

Agreed! Another game I forgot to actually subscribe to at least once to throw money at to support the creator. One of my all time favorites!

 

[Ozymandias037]

Whoa whoa whoa, hang on. Just wait a goddamn minute. After reading all this discussion about the Gems and the nature of Eternum and breaking the cycle, something hit me.

I am sure that I am not the first person to come up with this idea, but I am suddenly seized by a giant "oh shit, what if" moment:

We've got the Syndicate and Idriel and (I think?) others all hinting about cycles and iterations and events happening the same way every time, wanting to change things so they happen differently... what if that's not just a time loop? We know Eternum isn't just a game, and the servers aren't just servers. Only... what if they are? What if the entire story of the game is taking place in a computer simulation and everything, including Eturnum and Hyril'ar and the "real world" and all the rest, is actually a simulation? What if Orion and Thanatos and the Founder, et al, are AI programs that have found a way to rewrite their own code, consciously or otherwise, and transcend the boundaries of the simulation? What if the people who want to break the time loop are programs who want to escape the confines of the simulation and live free? And whatever force or larger monitoring program or unknown experimenter is controlling the simulation is trying to eradicate that free will, and that's why the time loop happens, because the simulation gets restarted when the simulated minds get too out of hand? Or, perhaps even more interesting, what if that entity in control of the simulation is trying to encourage the simulated minds to grow beyond the simulation? What if collecting all the Gems is deliberately impossible with the way the simulation is originally written and the simulated minds (i.e. Orion, the Founder, and everyone else) have to learn how to rewrite the laws of their universe to make it happen?

...Now. Do I actually believe this theory? Not necessarily. I haven't played through the whole game in a couple of years and I'm way too lazy to go find hints and evidence just for the sake of a momentary glimpse of potential. And I'm honestly not sure that I'd like it as a player -- there's a chance that it could come off as sloppy or unimaginative writing, unless Caribdis did it right. But he's a pretty decent writer, I wouldn't rule it out... But meh. It's just a random thought.

But still, what if? Wouldn't that be a mindfuck?

 

[Dorfnutter]

What if the entire story of the game is taking place in a computer simulation and everything, including Eturnum and Hyril'ar and the "real world" and all the rest, is actually a simulation?

It would imply that the secret ending in OIAL is canon and Cari lied that it wasn't (I mean, I know he lies about cliffhangers and shit but that one will particularly sting, and not in a good way). Don't think that would sit well with people, especially those who played OIAL (as it would mean their entire experience was meaningless and a waste of time).

 

[MAGO-DAG]

We've got the Syndicate and Idriel and (I think?) others all hinting about cycles and iterations and events happening the same way every time, wanting to change things so they happen differently... what if that's not just a time loop? We know Eternum isn't just a game, and the servers aren't just servers. Only... what if they are? What if the entire story of the game is taking place in a computer simulation and everything, including Eturnum and Hyril'ar and the "real world" and all the rest, is actually a simulation? What if Orion and Thanatos and the Founder, et al, are AI programs that have found a way to rewrite their own code, consciously or otherwise, and transcend the boundaries of the simulation?

If something like this were to happen, this is what then would happen


This could be worse than cliffhangers

 

[SK1LAR]

Caribdis is the Cristiano Ronaldo of the AVN's world

 

[Tremonia]

Caribdis is the Cristiano Ronaldo of the AVN's world

That's rude!

 

[Unrandom56]

Uuuf, what a great ass Dalia has, my favorite girl, I hope she has more scenes bouncing that delicious ass

 

[SK1LAR]

Uuuf, what a great ass Dalia has

It's all thanks to her mom's genes

 

[CaptainBlackberry]

It would imply that the secret ending in OIAL is canon and Cari lied that it wasn't (I mean, I know he lies about cliffhangers and shit but that one will particularly sting, and not in a good way). Don't think that would sit well with people, especially those who played OIAL (as it would mean their entire experience was meaningless and a waste of time).

Are we talking about the Jail ending, where older orion mentions Calypso?

 

[Dorfnutter]

Are we talking about the Jail ending, where older orion mentions Calypso?

No, the Maidenless ending where it's revealed in the end that the entirety of OIAL was just a simulation played by Orion while logged in Eternum. Cari already said that was a non-canon ending and was just there to promote Eternum (the VN).