VN Ren'Py Eternum [v0.9.4] [Caribdis]

[kanenas49]

I'm not talking about him almost dying as being the part I don't like (even though I still believe that some aspects of it could have been handled much better), I'm talking about Orion seemingly dying as a cliffhanger felt very cliché and quite cheap, but it was just an example to show that excessive reliance on cliffhangers is a sign of poor writing.

Don't get me wrong though, I love the game, and Cari is, at least according to F95's standard, a fantastic writer, and I don't want to complain about some relatively minor issue; let's instead focus on the good stuff about this game, that is... practically everything else!

Of course, the way he was shot was cheap, but when you have powers, you think you can become a god too, forgetting that you are also mortal with powers perhaps but still mortal.
So the best way is to die cheaply and be more careful than to fight and die in battle from where you will still be careless.

Another secret he revealed is that when you die and come back you can have access to the world you were in when you died.
The "mistake" here that the founder makes but I don't take it seriously is that in the other world where you died you can't go with your body but only with the spirit, that is, the body stays here.
However, because the founder combines mythological elements, as let's say the protagonist could be a guardian who was born into a human body and something shocking happened in order to activate his powers, it is something that even mistakes make it look good and end perfectly in the aesthetics of the game.

 

[FuckMe1234567890]

There is nothing else that could be written about harem game to not be cliche. I think Caribdis is doing suprisingly good wtih the writing - it is not stale despite 4 years of development. It is the worst thing to happen to AVN so I am glad we don't have it here.
About Orion "dying" - I think, that with him getting 8 super hot women (and also becoming demigod on his way to real godhood) "death" scene was needed - we, the players, needed something grounded and some failure, because at this point everything was looking too good. This time, with 0.9 cliffhanger it is the same - without cliffhangers Orion is already on his way to 5th gem (with 8 hot girls and demigod status). There is need for anticipation and failure to have good story. Again, I would say that Caribdis love for cliffhangers helps with overall structure of game pretty well.

 

[LDEMGqNhTZVT]

The point is that Orion "dying" did not need to be a cliffhanger; rather, it could have been an extremely important plot point in the overall arc of the episode. I appreciate the cliffhangers that aren't as predictable. In this example, we felt 99% sure Orion wouldn't die. It blunts the edge of the cliffhanger.

As a contrast, the end of 0.8 in Hyril'ar was a better cliffhanger. We get a sense that Calypso is out of commission, at least for a while. Are we sure she'll make it? Again, 99% sure the answer is yes, so that's not it. The cliffhanger here has more mystery: we are in Hyril'ar, we know the elves don't like humans, we probably we will not be treated well, but what exactly does that look like? What the heck is even happening in Hyril'ar? What shenanigans might we get involved in? What might we learn about Anima or others? We're confident we'll need Calypso or some other method to get us back to realms / servers in in Eternum, but how long will we be stuck there? Will Calypso be able to help us get back in the episode, or might we have to wait longer?

By comparison to Orion "dying", there are many more questions and much less certainty.

 

[kanenas49]

Everyone understands that he is the protagonist and he will not die and he does not need a cheap death.
However, what no one understands but attracted me to the game is that when someone has a special gift and maybe more than one strange power, he cannot die until he completes his mission.
This means if he dies but he has not reached his goal something will happen and he will turn back.
It's just (and here's the nice thing) that he'll do something that hasn't been said, something that no one has seen, and that will change the course of time.

 

[Muffinking61]

where are the answers to the elf questions?? it's getting frustrating trying to answer these

 

[diegoBigdih]

People hating about the cliffhangers and not recognizing that at first at least one of them got them at the edge of their seats

 

[e6mill]

got them at the edge of their seats

Sounds uncomfortable.

 

[FuckMe1234567890]

The point is that Orion "dying" did not need to be a cliffhanger; rather, it could have been an extremely important plot point in the overall arc of the episode. I appreciate the cliffhangers that aren't as predictable. In this example, we felt 99% sure Orion wouldn't die. It blunts the edge of the cliffhanger.

As a contrast, the end of 0.8 in Hyril'ar was a better cliffhanger. We get a sense that Calypso is out of commission, at least for a while. Are we sure she'll make it? Again, 99% sure the answer is yes, so that's not it. The cliffhanger here has more mystery: we are in Hyril'ar, we know the elves don't like humans, we probably we will not be treated well, but what exactly does that look like? What the heck is even happening in Hyril'ar? What shenanigans might we get involved in? What might we learn about Anima or others? We're confident we'll need Calypso or some other method to get us back to realms / servers in in Eternum, but how long will we be stuck there? Will Calypso be able to help us get back in the episode, or might we have to wait longer?

By comparison to Orion "dying", there are many more questions and much less certainty.

But it was extremely important plot point - in next episode Orion started saying to everybody that he loves them, because he almost died. Granted, it isn't some incredible writing, but it gets the job done. We, the players, needed some reasons why harem is possible (other than being demigod) and now we have one - certainty of death changed Orions thought process about his women.
I agree that Hyril'ar is nicely written arc, but I think that 0.7 just gets too much hate for nothing. It was important part in the story that Carbidis wrote and I think it is integral to the game - it doesn't stick out in my opinion. You can say that it could be done better but it will always be subjective. By the virtue of you being here I think it worked even on yourself.

 

[Impetu]

PLEASE it would be amazing if Cari would make it happen!

 

[venteron]

I'm not sure,but I'll try to come up with a theory
And it's based on butterflies It's not the first time we see them during Luna's scene,and I keep bringing them because they look exactly like butterflies from Life is strange
Eternum

Life is strange
View attachment 5616807

If you never played life is strange - long story short: The mc had an ability to roll back in time,and she abused it to always get the best outcome. Every time she did it,butterfly appeared - reference to butterfly effect. In the end, it reveals that her abuse creates a time distortion and a time paradox,so,everything is absolutely fucked. And here's the ending: A huge storm comes to city that was caused by this abuse. So,she can reset all her previous rolls to remove the paradox and let her friends die,or everything stays the same and her city gets destroyed
Now,how it's connected to Eternum. There is a small parallel to Luna and Orion. For example,during Luna's train trip, we abuse her power to change the future and fate. And another parallel to Idriel - all those question about coin flips are definitely hints, we need to change the fate and it's kinda what Orion does
In the end,I assume there might something like in the ending of LiS,Orion will need to pay for this,so he would need to loss something(maybe Kredon will get destroyed) to save his girls
Maybe there is a different connection,or it's just a coincidence that butterflies look similar

Yes, that is a coincidence, outside of being a direct game reference. The butterfly effect has been a thing in the popular understanding of chaos theory since forever, and monarch butterflies, which are what these are called, are just pretty. They're blue because of the Kredonian tall tale of them being made of rainwater.

 

[venteron]

Pity as too many cliffhangers is a glaring sign of bad & lazy writing

It's a Discord meme, you're welcome

 

[LDEMGqNhTZVT]

But it was extremely important plot point - in next episode Orion started saying to everybody that he loves them, because he almost died. Granted, it isn't some incredible writing, but it gets the job done. We, the players, needed some reasons why harem is possible (other than being demigod) and now we have one - certainty of death changed Orions thought process about his women.

I agree, it was a very important plot beat! But it didn't need to be a cliffhanger. Could be a slow fadeout with a transition to some other story sequence for a short time, like a "Meanwhile..." type of thing. Then come back to it later in the same episode. That gives us the "WTF happened?" feeling (knowing it won't be his end), some tension while we wait, and a resolution to it, that we sort of expected. Then leave us with a more mysterious cliffhanger.

I'm not really complaining, by the way. Cliffhangers are fine! I'm saying that within the construct of this story, that particular cliffhanger could have been better.

 

[Little Penguin]

I don't know if it's because I was too distracted watching the two of them in bikinis in Paradox, but it's thanks to Nancy that the harem with all the girls will be possible, so I'm really sorry Alex but my new favorite from now on is the Empress of WRE, the conqueror, the crucifier, the sexiest Cheeto in the whole bag, the friend's mother we'd all love to fuck!

Long live the Empress!

 

[FuckMe1234567890]

I don't know if it's because I was too distracted watching the two of them in bikinis in Paradox, but it's thanks to Nancy that the harem with all the girls will be possible, so I'm really sorry Alex but my new favorite from now on is the Empress of WRE, the conqueror, the crucifier, the sexiest Cheeto in the whole bag, the friend's mother we'd all love to fuck!

Long live the Empress!

View attachment 5621713

Preposterous. "The sexiest Cheeto in the whole bag" is Chang, get your facts checked.

 

[gino.pilotino]

I'm not too worried about this cliffhanger. In the worst-case scenario, we can ask Chang to share Micaela.

 

[Master Peter Raven]

It's a Discord meme, you're welcome

Actually, no, it really isn't. A good cliffhanger will bring back "viewers" time and time again. As long as the cliffhanger has a payoff, it will work. Hell, the concept, and the name, goes all the way back to the start of films, where the hero would literally be hanging from a cliff when that episode of the serial ended. As far as the lazy writing...to do a good cliffhanger, and have it payoff well actually makes the writing more difficult, not easier. If you think of the releases making AVN's serials, using cliffangers makes total sense. story-wise.

 

[e6mill]

the concept, and the name, goes all the way back to the start of films

Betcha it was yet (much) earlier than even that. Magazines and even radio programs ("Who knows what evil lurks in the hearts of men?") used to have serial releases...

 

[BreastLover]

damn the animator is amazing

 

[friedkeenan]

We also got a headache immediately upon meeting the Founder, strikingly similar to the one we got when we encountered Calypso for the first time. I had interpreted the first headache from Calypso as being connected to our powers being unlocked, since our power seems connected to hers, and we were unable to use it before we were near to her. Could our powers be connected to the Founder as well? It is after this that we start slipping into Eternum and whatnot. In the latest update, when we're in Hyril'ar, we can't use our demon powers until Calypso has recovered, but even then we still can't teleport. Maybe it's because we were cut off from the Founder while in Hyril'ar? The moment we're back in Eternum, we're good to go. But we didn't make any remark of feeling cut off from our demon powers once we were out of Hyril'ar. Hmm. I guess we're not cut off from Caly's magic in Eternum, since she can create portals there, so maybe the magic only passes through one way, out of Hyril'ar. That would be symmetric with being able to use our teleporting powers when we're in Earth, but not our demon powers.

Damn, I'm reading this back now and I think I probably cooked the most with this paragraph. Being able to teleport through Eternum also definitely seems like a Founder-ish power. I'm not sure how our demon powers would relate to Calypso in particular, though. Maybe because she likes that we're a beast in bed? lol.

But it'll be interesting to see what kind of relationship the MC has with the Founder, he did also stare at us when we first joined Eternum, so he knows something about us presumably. Maybe he's our real dad or something trope-y like that.

 

[Little Penguin]

Preposterous. "The sexiest Cheeto in the whole bag" is Chang, get your facts checked.

But he's not even red-haired!