Explain this fetish: Man to female transformation

[itshowyoumetme]

I saw the title of the thread and I must admit that I was scared to open it XD. Instead most of the posts are respectful and interesting.
Kudos

Hah, yeah I realized afterwards that this might have potentially been a touchy subject for some and my wording might have been a bit unclear but it seems like a fairly good natured discussion.

Right well fair enough, from what I've gathered I guess for some it's the self insert for transitioning fantasies, and others are there to experience extreme levels of humiliation/domination fantasies and for others it's not a self-insert fantasy but a "let's dominate/humiliate this character" type thing, similar to other games where you start with a female protagonist. That about sum it up?

I'm still surprised to see a relatively large community for something that at least seems to be pretty niche, but hey all power to ya. Although as mentioned in the thread earlier, I'd be happy to see some more html based games that weren't focused on that genre as well

 

[itshowyoumetme]

But my guess is that this stuff is also popular among those who do actually want to hurt real people, and that worries me.

This i strongly disagree with. This is veering really closely to "video games cause violence" and similar rhetoric. I can certainly see why you're not into it, as mentioned this isn't my genre either but I think we should be real careful about comparing real life actions and pixels/images on a screen.

 

[n0b0dy]

I don't think you can speak for everybody's relationship to their fetishes. Considering how common rape and torture are in the real world, I would imagine that for some it stays in the realm of fiction only because they haven't yet had the opportunity to make it real in a way that they feel is safe for them. On the other hand, I'm sure there are some who can compartmentalize their fetishes perfectly fine. If you're in the latter group, that's wonderful.

But my guess is that this stuff is also popular among those who do actually want to hurt real people, and that worries me. I don't advocate censorship or shaming people for what they like, because I don't think that solves the problem, but the popularity of the genre itself is my concern for this reason.

Well of course 'real' rape and abuse are awful things and I wish for no human to experience those things. Rape is bad and those who rape should feel shitty about it and removed from society.

There is however (I assume) a large group of people like me who do get off on suffering but do not seek to really make others suffer because we genuinely care about others. I know it can be hard to empathize with people who have this fetish but we are humans too and in many ways just like you. I have not chosen to be the way I am and like the things I like but I am and I do. Why should I not be able to enjoy something I find beauty in when it does not inflict harm on others? People can play shooters without feeling the need to actually shoot someone and rape games without feeling the need to rape someone.

I have accepted my fetish for suffering but it pains me when people say it is a sickness and treat us like some kind of monsters or subhumans. We are not. If you do not truly understand something please try not to be too quick to pass judgement how hard it may be.

 

[gunderson]

Really, no worries. We're all here because we like stuff out of the ordinary. And since it sounds like you're dealing with your fetish in a healthy way, as I try to do with my love of fictional incest (fun fact: we get dumped on too!), it sounds like you're doing the right stuff. The people who worry me are the ones who can't tell fact from fiction.

 

[9thCrux]

First off, this thread isn't meant to kink shame and what not, it's just one (of many) niche fetishes that I just don't understand. And given that we see games based around that theme, especially text based ones, popping up every so often, I thought I'd ask what people got out of it. Usually porn games tries to sell you a fantasy, you're irresistible, you're able to break taboos, bend people to your will and what have you.

But what is the fantasy meant to be here?
Is the fantasy meant that you're supposed to identify as the character you're playing and getting off on 'you' being un-manned or are you not supposed to self-insert? Is this a gay fetish, transgender fetish, or are straight people into it as well?

I'm curious what the target audience is.

Homosexual fantasies, trying to be something you're not and will never be no matter how many costumes or cosmetic surgeries you get.

Or the fantasy of complete control over a female body for personal entertainment.

 

[greyelf]

Homosexual fantasies...

I think you may be confusing Sexual Orientation with Sexual Identity.
eg.
Sexual Orientation - the biological gender a person wants to have sex with.
Sexual Identity - the psychological / physical gender a person wants to be.

There are those that wish to be a different gender psychologically / physically than their (actual) biological one but aren't interested in having sex with someone of the same biological gender as themselves.
eg.
A biological male that wish to be a psychological / physical female but still wants to have sex with a biological female.

This subject matter is very complex, as are most subjects when human's wants/needs become involved.

 

[Lynn]

Considering how common rape and torture are in the real world

Sorry, but this is definitely not true, atleast for the audience of this website, which I assume is mostly constituted of people from the "westernized world". In our society, rape and torture are very uncommon, and are severely looked down upon on top of being very important crimes. Our society has decided for quite some time now that both consent and human rights are capital things in the life of every individual, and anyone going against that will be considered the deviant individual and "corrected". To me it's really telling that rape and attempting to rape are both crimes that are punished equally.

Maybe it speaks more to me because I don't belong to any social group ever (yeah look at me I'm so special). Trying to write an exhaustive list of my fetishes/labels as a sexual individual (so, I'm a "bisexual woman - but with a clear preference for women - who can also be attracted to well-portrayed furry characters depending on the situation they are in and also--") would be near impossible and needlessly long. Fact is I just consider sex/porn to be a part of life, just like I enjoy searching for new music genres to listen to or movies to watch, I'm simply curious. But does that mean I would want to act out the totality of the fetishes I came across? I hope not, some are very disturbing.

You could say I'm the exception but that simply seems unlikely. To me it sounds like medias trying to paint GTA as the game that is actively producing mass shooters. It's coincidental in some cases involving specific players, but for the rest of them, that's plain silly. I do believe most people can tell the difference between what they see on a television screen and the real world, and if they can't, it's their own problem. Certainly not Rockstar's.
Fact is, if those people feel those urges and have the ability to do it for realsies, they'll - probably - eventually do it, regardless of what games they've been playing. I don't see why it should be any different when it comes to porn, which was, by the way, often presented to me as something that is "definitely not similar to real life".


At any rate, to come back to the main topic, I agree with the people mentionning humiliation, as it is often paired with the "bimbofication" and all the variants. I find the fetish exciting when the character feels great pleasure from that situation - being forced into joining the other team - even though that's something they did not expect before. In Perverted Education, the character is initally reluctant when it comes to suck some cocks, but does it more willingly later in the game (atleast that's how I remembered it).
Basically, it's a big mix of humiliation, shame, and unadmitted pleasure. But I can't speak for the castration stuff, that really doesn't speak to me at all.

 

[9thCrux]

I think you may be confusing Sexual Orientation with Sexual Identity.
eg.
Sexual Orientation - the biological gender a person wants to have sex with.
Sexual Identity - the psychological / physical gender a person wants to be.

There are those that wish to be a different gender psychologically / physically than their (actual) biological one but aren't interested in having sex with someone of the same biological gender as themselves.
eg.
A biological male that wish to be a psychological / physical female but still wants to have sex with a biological female.

This subject matter is very complex, as are most subjects when human's wants/needs become involved.

You're putting to much flowers and nonsense to something very simple:
You either are a man or a woman and that's it, it doesn't matter if you force people around to call you something you're not and want to believe that you're something you're not, it doesn't matter if you disguise and cut and implant things to your body, you still being a man or a woman no matter how hard you try to think you're not.
All other things people want to attach to that is just unrealistic wishful thinking and apologetic babbling that people have made up to try to justify deviant, weird, freaky, aberrant, and sick fantasies that fall into the realm of compulsions and mental illness.

Some people try games with gender bender content to get the girls to do anything they want and that maybe the case for most males using female characters in that kind of games, transforming into a female to have unlimited access to a female body can be an attractive thing for some.

Other people play them because they have homosexual tendencies. Simple as that.

 

[GravGrav]

I wasn't expecting this thread to have transgender denialists in it, like the above post. Hmm, i've always wondered what it's like to be anti-science. Since transgender people are a biological reality that have reams of scientific evidence showing their genetic differences and differences in brain structure and other biological features that match their gender identity. Here's some examples of that science.


"Androgen Receptor Repeat Length Polymorphism Associated with Male-to-Female Transsexualism"

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"A polymorphism of the CYP17 gene related to sex steroid metabolism is associated with female-to-male but not male-to-female transsexualism"

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"White matter microstructure in female to male transsexuals before cross-sex hormonal treatment. A diffusion tensor imaging study"

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And that's all without discussing intersex people, obviously, which is a whole other subject involving people who biologically aren't male or female (either by having something other than XY or XX chromosomes or having things like mosaicism or hormone insensitivity resulting in the opposite biological sex physically than their chromosomes would imply)

 

[n0b0dy]

You're putting to much flowers and nonsense to something very simple:
You either are a man or a woman and that's it, it doesn't matter if you force people around to call you something you're not and want to believe that you're something you're not, it doesn't matter if you disguise and cut and implant things to your body, you still being a man or a woman no matter how hard you try to think you're not.
All other things people want to attach to that is just unrealistic wishful thinking and apologetic babbling that people have made up to try to justify deviant, weird, freaky, aberrant, and sick fantasies that fall into the realm of compulsions and mental illness.

Some people try games with gender bender content to get the girls to do anything they want and that maybe the case for most males using female characters in that kind of games, transforming into a female to have unlimited access to a female body can be an attractive thing for some.

Other people play them because they have homosexual tendencies. Simple as that.

I believe if you would read up on the subject you would change your mind. Us humans use language to categorize the universe and 'objects' in all sort of ways and by doing it we often greatly simplify that what really is. We act like people are 'male' or 'female' but gender is really a complicated spectrum. An extreme example are people who are born with both male and female genitals. By them it is for everybody easy to see the categories of man and female are not sufficient. The German court acknowledged this fact this month and has ordered for the German congress they must pass a bill so these people do not have to be registered as male or female anymore but they can be registered as something in between. Others are born with just one set of genitalia but do really have many (biological) characteristics of the other gender. For them these labels of man and female also do not work and they often have to endure suffering from early age because their environment projects something upon them they are not. Using word like 'sickness' to describe them is really hurtful and just plain wrong. If you do not truly understand something please try not to be too quick to pass judgement how hard it may be.

 

[dudebroman]

I believe if you would read up on the subject you would change your mind. Us humans use language to categorize the universe and 'objects' in all sort of ways and by doing it we often greatly simplify that what really is. We act like people are 'male' or 'female' but gender is really a complicated spectrum. An extreme example are people who are born with both male and female genitals. By them it is for everybody easy to see the categories of man and female are not sufficient. The German court acknowledged this fact this month and has ordered for the German congress they must pass a bill so these people do not have to be registered as male or female anymore but they can be registered as something in between. Others are born with just one set of genitalia but do really have many (biological) characteristics of the other gender. For them these labels of man and female also do not work and they often have to endure suffering from early age because their environment projects something upon them they are not. Using word like 'sickness' to describe them is really hurtful and just plain wrong. If you do not truly understand something please try not to be too quick to pass judgement how hard it may be.

Butting in here, but I believe that the actual answer lies somewhere in between those two points It would appear that for many species, humans included, sexual reproduction is a fact of life. As such, in order for that to take place, two members of a species with different genitals must copulate. Which in turn suggests that anything mediating from that norm is anomalous. That includes sexual identification etc. But that's just the physical aspect of the situation. Due our extreme social and emotional intelligence, humans transcend many natural norms. This allows us to by-pass certain barriers that other species would find hard to deal with, such as a gay couple adopting a child. Now, that doesn't help propagate the species (which is the sole point of our existence, at least imo) BUT that's no longer the most important aspect of our lives. Instead, things such as being happy and other (in reality) trivial aspects have become dominant. Unfortunately, it's only now after a bumpy ride through history that alternative sexualities and physical traits are becoming almost universally accepted, which is wonderful But I would imagine that certain stigmas, especially ones associated with homosexuality (we can thank the Catholic church for that one :L) will take a while to sizzle out.
In conclusion, it's important to realise that alternative sexualities etc. can only exist because of our social norms. While I believe such traits are anomalies and would have no place in many species, humans have found a way to exist and even prosper with them And that's what makes it totally cool! It has very little to do with mental illness or anything of the sort, as mentioned above...

 

[n0b0dy]

Butting in here, but I believe that the actual answer lies somewhere in between those two points It would appear that for many species, humans included, sexual reproduction is a fact of life. As such, in order for that to take place, two members of a species with different genitals must copulate. Which in turn suggests that anything mediating from that norm is anomalous.

Well anything that mediates from any norm is (or could be seen as) anomalous.

(Almost) everybody deviates from some kind of norm and that makes them anomalous or abnormal. So you could conclude that because most people are abnormal it is actually normal to abnormal and abnormal to be normal :closedeyesmile:

Now, that doesn't help propagate the species (which is the sole point of our existence, at least imo) BUT that's no longer the most important aspect of our lives.

I will not pretend I know what the point of our existence is but am sure a species life can have meaning even if it's bloodline is not continued. For me the meaning of life is just life itself, this moment right here and if it it does not lead to anything substantial there can be still value in experiencing it. This is just my point of view of course.

Unfortunately, it's only now after a bumpy ride through history that alternative sexualities and physical traits are becoming almost universally accepted, which is wonderful

Humanity still has a very long way to go in accepting alternative traits. Even in the western world there are many who project there pain and hatred on those who are (perceived) different in all kinds of nasty ways and I fear this will never fully change. This is just the western world, in many other cultures it is still a lot worse with no signs of 'improvement'.

 

[dudebroman]

Well anything that mediates from any norm is (or could be seen as) anomalous.

(Almost) everybody deviates from some kind of norm and that makes them anomalous or abnormal. So you could conclude that because most people are abnormal it is actually normal to abnormal and abnormal to be normal :closedeyesmile:

True :L BUT Anything that strays from an evolutionary norm is definitely anomalous But I suppose who's to say that cave men didn't have gay couples etc. xD So I suppose it's all down to personal opinion and observation :L In the end, it doesn't really matter. We're just a tiny speck in the universe What's important here is that we try to curb aggression when talking about sticky topics such as this :')

 

[anne O'nymous]

What confuses me is why there's such a popular trend of having really nasty rape and genital mutilation scenes in transformation porn games. Is that what people want to see? Are they...okay? Like, they might literally not be okay.

Because it's part of some fantasy, but it doesn't mean that it's part of the fantasy behind transformation. It's just two fantasies put together and for some reason you see them more often when they are together than when they are separated.
After, about the fact that these people are or not okay, for me they are. But it's mostly because I've already seen way worse, like...

Spoiler: If you are sensible, you REALLY should NOT read this

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So, people loving genital mutilation, well, they aren't this insane...

 

[greyelf]

It would appear that for many species, humans included, sexual reproduction is a fact of life.

While it is true (for the relevant species) for a species to continue they need to reproduce, and that therefore members of that species need to have the correct configuration / combination of genitals to do that reproducing.
This is not true at an individual member of a species level because not all members get (or want) to participate in the physical act of reproduction.

eg.
In some animal species only the strongest (whatever that means for the species) males get to participate in reproduction, which mean that the large majority of the males in those specials have no real reproductive use for their genitals. So in these species the statistical norm for males would be to never have reproductive sex, therefor the males that do get to reproduce would be considered the anomalous.

...humans transcend many natural norms

It is not uncommon for male members of the above animal species to 'practices' the act of reproduction on other males, thus it is difficult to state what exactly 'natural norms' are.

...after a bumpy ride through history...

I'm not sure if you're aware that examples of non male-with-female sexual activity and non binary sexual identity can be found through out most of recorded (written, pictures, etc...) history, so this is not a 'recent' thing caused by 'our' social norms.

 

[doidera]

Someone can explain me that fetish to put dick on girls?? Is a girl with dick or a guy with boobs?
And if you wanna see a dick, why don't play gay games?
Stop put dick on girls, please!!

 

[muttdoggy]

We are all different. A dev here put it best when they said your sexuality is a sliding scale. I agree.
Put it this way...
Picture a pool of water. It's fluid like a pond is. Each of us has our own "pool of water" that defines our sexuality. Towards the edges and the bottom and pictures of various sexual acts that you enjoy or would consider. You are somewhere in that pool and over time, you're swimming around your pool. Some days, you might really want pregnant chicks so you're swimming in the "preggo" area. But the next day, you're wading in the ass part cuz you're thinking about buttsex. It's fluid and changes slightly or even greatly from day to day. Sometimes, it's minutes.
You have to understand that it's fluid. It changes from day to day. You have your own kinks in that pond and you will go back and forth and around. Sometimes the pond will get bigger cuz you discovered another dimension to your sexuality or you no longer enjoy giving buttsex so that pool can also shrink. It's the same for everybody. Even me. Some days I'll wonder if a girl with a vagina AND a dick would be a good lay but that's as far as I'll go for now. I can't predict what I'll be into next year.. it might be legs or even llamas! It's gotta be a combination of curiosity, morbid desire, confusion, and a whole host of other shit so explaining it is never gonna be easy. Just do what I do. I accept your sexuality even if you're a combat toaster!
IMHO, getting a scientist to figure out how this is so fluid is worse than asking him to explain exactly why 42 is the answer to the universe.

 

[Lynn]

Someone can explain me that fetish to put dick on girls?? Is a girl with dick or a guy with boobs?
And if you wanna see a dick, why don't play gay games?
Stop put dick on girls, please!!

Usually, it's a penis on a girl. I don't think I have ever seen hentai with a dude (with a dude's body) who has a vagina.
It's the best of both worlds, really. You get everything with one person. A woman's body and curve with the addition of a working, biological cock? That's the dream. Those are "funataris", delivered to us by the greatest country in the world, Japan.

Not to be confused with "traps" or "femboys", which are what is discussed on the topic. Those are "feminine dudes", so men with no added vagina, but they are made to look like women on the outside. They do it so well that they "trap" you into thinking they are women, but are actually regular dudes. In real life, it'd be crossdressing and the likes.

 

[CuriousG08]

This was at times a very high-minded discussion. I read the whole thread and it was worth it. I agree that sometimes people just fantasize what it would be like as the opposite gender. Would life be better? Would sex be better? The clothes are certainly much prettier and cuter, etc.

Sometimes it has to do with an anomaly such as chemical imbalances and other physical or mental differences. I have to agree that the natural order of things is for us to be attracted to the opposite sex, else gay. On the other hand, everyone on Earth is a normal Human, yes everyone. It's just some of us are further away from the average or statistical norm.

Sometimes it is just a closet gay person who cannot imagine having sex with another man unless he was first turned into a woman, which would fulfill the fantasy.

Personally, I don't want to see masculine male on masculine male, but masculine male on a pretty feminine male dressed like a girl turns me on. Some times us girls just want to turn out all the pretty boys and get them to love and take dicks & cum like the sissies they are! LOL just kidding. OR AM I!??

P.S. I dislike any of the torture, rape, mutilations, etc. It is disturbing to me. Voluntary feminization is best even if fighting it the whole way while reflecting and changing slowly mentally and physically, eventually coming to acceptance and joy of fulfillment. Involuntary is also good as long as the person eventually comes around to seeing it as awesome and loving it. That's just me. The instant transformation games are boring. Except for that instance, it's just another normal game playing as a female protagonist which is good too, but that kind of transformation is not very satisfying. It is the male's journey to joyful womanhood that is the most fascinating to me. A slow transformation is amazing to behold.

 

[215303j]

It's called transitioning not transforming. Transgender isn't a fetish, it's an identity. Hard Timesand cross-dressing are not exclusive to gay people, there are many motivations - some non-sexual - behind both.

That's what I thought at first as well, but I think the topic of these games, let's call it "sissyfication" is something completely different from transgender, even though both are about changing (parts of) your gender.

But I now believe that sissyfication is actually more about humiliation and is in some ways linked to cuckolding / NTR fetish.
If you are a man, then "losing your manhood" (not necessarily literally) by acting like a woman and having (being "forced" into) sexual relations with other men, is a form of "losing control", similar to the feeling of "losing your wife". Which can be a turn on for some and quite unbearable for others.

A real transgender, on the other hand, will probably want to be in control of his/her transition into his/her chosen gender.

Actually, I do think that a game about the sex life of a real transgender during his/her transition would be very neat and interesting. Probably more so than these sissyfication games.

Also I am not sure where to put games which feature a male who somehow "magically" transformed into a woman without his consent, e.g.

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