HTML Female Agent [v1.20.1p] [Crushstation]

[aifgamer]

I can understand that scene. We're used to this page's game standard of unlocking oral sex before vaginal sex. It happens in almost all trainers, and we assume it's easier to ask for it than full on sex. But that's the thing, it's not, specially if there's no previous relationship or even attraction. Sex is pretty standard, while oral is an extra for a lot of people, that's where the stereotype about vanilla people only having missionary comes from.

The protagonist has a similar experience. She may be used to fucking Connor,, even given blowjobs to people she cares about, but then she had to not only suck a guy she doesn't know nor care for, but also act like she loves it, all while continuously thinking about getting recorded and watched by her colleagues.
It can be traumatising, a cock down your throat really drives it home that you're going to be a prostitute.

Yep. I thought it was a totally realistic, believable scene. Real people don't act like adult game characters, where every sex act is part of a straight line progression toward more depravity.

A woman could totally have drunken hookup sex with strangers on the regular, and still completely freak out if she was coerced into blowing a gross dude by her boss. Women can be totally turned on or totally turned off depending on the context of the situation they're in.

You could quibble about whether the writing conveyed this idea as well as it could have, but the concept for the scene was very good I think. I was disappointed if not surprised by the negative reaction it got.

 

[rockstarme]

thnx

 

[ZebCaff]

Yep. I thought it was a totally realistic, believable scene. Real people don't act like adult game characters, where every sex act is part of a straight line progression toward more depravity.

A woman could totally have drunken hookup sex with strangers on the regular, and still completely freak out if she was coerced into blowing a gross dude by her boss. Women can be totally turned on or totally turned off depending on the context of the situation they're in.

You could quibble about whether the writing conveyed this idea as well as it could have, but the concept for the scene was very good I think. I was disappointed if not surprised by the negative reaction it got.

It *is* a necessary scene. We have to see Kate realizing what she's got herself into and having a major wobble. The problem essentially was that Kate was railroaded into a course of action that didn't fit with the way many players saw her. In addition to the 'refuse point blank until threatened' route 'reluctantly persuaded' and 'bite the bullet for the good of the mission' routes were needed (also, IMO, a bad ending of some kind).

 

[Vibesy]

Yep. I thought it was a totally realistic, believable scene. Real people don't act like adult game characters, where every sex act is part of a straight line progression toward more depravity.

A woman could totally have drunken hookup sex with strangers on the regular, and still completely freak out if she was coerced into blowing a gross dude by her boss. Women can be totally turned on or totally turned off depending on the context of the situation they're in.

You could quibble about whether the writing conveyed this idea as well as it could have, but the concept for the scene was very good I think. I was disappointed if not surprised by the negative reaction it got.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but by the time of her BJ nuclear meltdown, Kate has been repeatedly raped by her manager, including during the job interview. She has been forced to give the club owner a BJ in his car while his driver watched and then been forced to fuck him in her room within earshot of the other residents. She has given a drug dealer head to score dope while he filmed her. She has flashed her tits to save $2 on tuktuk fares. She has been groped, spanked and objectified by 100s of customers in the bar..

Her reaction to having to blow the good looking & nice drinks teacher therefore might be viewed as a tad overdone. It's a bit late in the day to have a mental breakdown over this and the overwrought writing of her inner monologue doesn't help matters. There is a good reason that many readers consider this to be the worst scene in FA and a serious warning sign that Crush is losing the plot in this game.

 

[vicaddict]

There is a good reason that many readers consider this to be the worst scene in FA and a serious warning sign that Crush is losing the plot in this game.

You can't lose what was never in your grasp.

Then again, Crush has achieved the impossible. The story feels rushed, yet at the same time you have the feeling that nothing happens. The fact that there is little to no input required makes it look like nothing is happening. All you do is read and click continue. Well, you pick some clothes and make up every now and then, but that is it. It is hardly a game, but more of a novel and while that in itself is not an issue, the lack of progress is.

 

[Aillor Nailo]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but by the time of her BJ nuclear meltdown, Kate has been repeatedly raped by her manager, including during the job interview. She has been forced to give the club owner a BJ in his car while his driver watched and then been forced to fuck him in her room within earshot of the other residents. She has given a drug dealer head to score dope while he filmed her. She has flashed her tits to save $2 on tuktuk fares. She has been groped, spanked and objectified by 100s of customers in the bar..

Her reaction to having to blow the good looking & nice drinks teacher therefore might be viewed as a tad overdone. It's a bit late in the day to have a mental breakdown over this and the overwrought writing of her inner monologue doesn't help matters. There is a good reason that many readers consider this to be the worst scene in FA and a serious warning sign that Crush is losing the plot in this game.

It is that reason I am now reluctant abut this game. The casting rape and the sex with the owner is totally unrealistic. She's an agent with a LOT of resources, why would she allow that? They would find other avenues. She would break his dick and then blackmail HIM. Otherwise she is the worst agent in history.

In the club however, it is more difficult for her to avoid everything without breaking cover. If she is treated differently it might raise suspicions. So those parts (again without the sex with the casting guy) are more believable.

So if you would rewrite the story removing the casting rape and the manager sex, her reaction to the blowjob is totally realistic. She understands that the cameras are on and she might have to cross some boundaries if she wants success.

What she does on her own time, outside work is up to her (or you as a player). If she wants to flash the tuktuk driver or have sex with someone she meets, that is private time.

How would you start if you wanted to make a rewrite? What software? Is it even remotely doable without rewriting everything every update?

 

[ffive]

It is that reason I am now reluctant abut this game. The casting rape and the sex with the owner is totally unrealistic. She's an agent with a LOT of resources, why would she allow that? They would find other avenues. She would break his dick and then blackmail HIM. Otherwise she is the worst agent in history.

Sigh. "Blackmail him" with what? "I'll report you to the HR of your criminal organization for sexual harassment"? or maybe "I'll reveal myself as an undercover agent, threaten you and totally won't expect to wind up dead in a ditch after my first shift, if not simply pulled out for having blown my cover like a retard"? Please be real. It's especially hilarious in the context of complaints about lack of realism.

 

[Senor Smut]

It is that reason I am now reluctant abut this game. The casting rape and the sex with the owner is totally unrealistic. She's an agent with a LOT of resources, why would she allow that? They would find other avenues. She would break his dick and then blackmail HIM. Otherwise she is the worst agent in history.

In the club however, it is more difficult for her to avoid everything without breaking cover. If she is treated differently it might raise suspicions. So those parts (again without the sex with the casting guy) are more believable.

So if you would rewrite the story removing the casting rape and the manager sex, her reaction to the blowjob is totally realistic. She understands that the cameras are on and she might have to cross some boundaries if she wants success.

What she does on her own time, outside work is up to her (or you as a player). If she wants to flash the tuktuk driver or have sex with someone she meets, that is private time.

How would you start if you wanted to make a rewrite? What software? Is it even remotely doable without rewriting everything every update?

I can't speak to which software to use, but as far as writing goes, it entirely depends what you want to achieve as the creator.

Crush says he wants it to be an RPG, and if that's really what he wants then yes, absolutely everything except the introductory scene where she accepts the mission needs to be rewritten from the ground up to incorporate the RPG mechanics he's introduced and then never once used. If this was (or ever would become) an RPG, then there would have been multiple consequential choices by now instead of the zero consequential choices that are currently present, so every one of those choices and their consequences have to be written in a way that allows for future development.

However, we're now in year six of this game and it's obvious that it's never going to be anything but a kinetic novel with a few cosmetic choices that impact nothing, so if that's what you want then it still has to be redone to remove all references to RPG mechanics and provide Kate with a single consistent personality and approach. This would not require as big a rewrite as making it an RPG, but it would call for streamlining.

But why should he do any of that when he's making a comfortable living doing what he's doing now?

 

[Senor Smut]

Sigh. "Blackmail him" with what? "I'll report you to the HR of your criminal organization for sexual harassment"? or maybe "I'll reveal myself as an undercover agent, threaten you and totally won't expect to wind up dead in a ditch after my first shift, if not simply pulled out for having blown my cover like a retard"? Please be real. It's especially hilarious in the context of complaints about lack of realism.

How about, "You're going to serve me DEVILFISH on a platter or a squad of SAC/SOG guys will disappear you and you'll spend the last few years of your life slowly being peeled like an orange at a CIA black site?" Kriangsak works for a criminal organization, and criminial organizations want to make lots of money, not deal with the paramilitary capabilites of the Five Eyes nations.

The fact is that the game is unrealistic -- no intelligence agency in the history of the world would authorize this crackbrained scheme. Realistic would be if Kate was a real backpacker recruited to go into the club by one of the agencies. But given that we're all swallowing that absurdity, other complaints about realism seem a little ridiculous.

 

[Aillor Nailo]

Sigh. "Blackmail him" with what? "I'll report you to the HR of your criminal organization for sexual harassment"? or maybe "I'll reveal myself as an undercover agent, threaten you and totally won't expect to wind up dead in a ditch after my first shift, if not simply pulled out for having blown my cover like a retard"? Please be real. It's especially hilarious in the context of complaints about lack of realism.

If you want to place an agent into a club, you do a little bit of research first don't you? You don't just go to a casting without any information. You collect intel and when you find anything usable you try to use that. Probably should have been done by the others or by the team as soon as they were assembled. They did the break-in mission so other missions could have preceded it. So Kate shouldn't even have been to the "casting" so anything that happened there should never have happened.

That is MY view and MY view is that I would have had the story better written from that context. That is why I asked how I could possibly alter the current version making my own version. My version would remove those parts and my reluctant Kate would therefore be more in line with her dilemmas when the club bj happens. It makes more sense, at least to me.

Everyone else are entitled to their views and I have no intention to push my view as the sole truth, the right view or anything like that. I respect people liking the game as is, and I respect people that don't.

 

[ffive]

How about, "You're going to serve me DEVILFISH on a platter or a squad of SAC/SOG guys will disappear you and you'll spend the last few years of your life slowly being peeled like an orange at a CIA black site?" Kriangsak works for a criminal organization, and criminial organizations want to make lots of money, not deal with the paramilitary capabilites of the Five Eyes nations.

Yes, this is totally how it works. A random young woman spouting inane shit to a low-rung mafia guy and bam, you have a world-class terrorist all bagged and ready for delivery. They'll even add fries.

Why do you think the intelligence agencies even bother with the undercover approach if things are this simple?

 

[Senor Smut]

Yes, this is totally how it works. A random young woman spouting inane shit to a low-rung mafia guy and bam, you have a world-class terrorist all bagged and ready for delivery. They'll even add fries.

Why do you think the intelligence agencies even bother with the undercover approach if things are this simple?

My point was that if they were going to threaten Kriangsak, it wouldn't BE a lone girl "threatening to take him to the HR department," it would be a much more credible and overwhelming threat that would be believed. My point was not that they would necessarily handle it that way.

That said, intelligence agencies have special forces components for a reason, and sometimes they handle situations in exactly that way -- they strive to have the right tool for the job at hand, and sometimes the right tool is the threat of a horrific human rights violation backed up by a pack of stone-cold killers.

But if we're still continuing this bizarre "realism" discussion, then them handling the situation that way is infinitely more realistic than the situation in the game where an intelligence agency would send one of their own agents, who knows actual top secret shit and would pose a massive security risk if discovered, to shake her tits in a Bangkok bar, whether or not prostitution is involved. Once you accept the game's premise that an intelligence agency would actually do that, you've gone off into fantasyland and any discussion of "realism" is as nonsensical as the original premise. The argument should center around verisimilitude -- the willingness of the creator to color inside the lines of the fantasy world and characters he created -- rather than realism, which means what would happen in our world.

 

[asdfasdf12341234ACSACA]

My point was that if they were going to threaten Kriangsak, it wouldn't BE a lone girl "threatening to take him to the HR department," it would be a much more credible and overwhelming threat that would be believed. My point was not that they would necessarily handle it that way.

That said, intelligence agencies have special forces components for a reason, and sometimes they handle situations in exactly that way -- they strive to have the right tool for the job at hand, and sometimes the right tool is the threat of a horrific human rights violation backed up by a pack of stone-cold killers.

But if we're still continuing this bizarre "realism" discussion, then them handling the situation that way is infinitely more realistic than the situation in the game where an intelligence agency would send one of their own agents, who knows actual top secret shit and would pose a massive security risk if discovered, to shake her tits in a Bangkok bar, whether or not prostitution is involved. Once you accept the game's premise that an intelligence agency would actually do that, you've gone off into fantasyland and any discussion of "realism" is as nonsensical as the original premise. The argument should center around verisimilitude -- the willingness of the creator to color inside the lines of the fantasy world and characters he created -- rather than realism, which means what would happen in our world.

If you want to talk about realism/verisimilitude in this story, the thing is, there's no point in sending an international agent there to go straight to the club without knowing much about it. The more realistic scenario is basically: Those other bargirls/coworkers? Yeah, go meet one of them alone (ideally at the end of their shift). Offer her money/drugs in exchange for information about the place. Be subtle about it, make a point about it being a non-binding opportunity (girl can meet an agent somewhere else during the day). Rinse and repeat with the rest of the bargirls

 

[Senor Smut]

If you want to talk about realism/verisimilitude in this story, the thing is, there's no point in sending an international agent there to go straight to the club without knowing much about it. The more realistic scenario is basically: Those other bargirls/coworkers? Yeah, go meet one of them alone (ideally at the end of their shift). Offer her money/drugs in exchange for information about the place. Be subtle about it, make a point about it being a non-binding opportunity (girl can meet an agent somewhere else during the day). Rinse and repeat with the rest of the bargirls

That is the realistic approach, along with electronic surveillance. But having established right from the start that we aren't dealing with the real world, Crush can ignore realism as long as verisimilitude is maintained. And the thing is, verisimilitude has higher standards than reality because reality is under no obligation to be either believable or consistent; when Kate suffered her breakdown after giving the drinks guy a beejay, that was absolutely, completely realistic because you never know what straw will break the proverbial; however, it violated verisimilitude because it did not match how Kate had been portrayed up until that time. That's why people were mad: Crush drew the lines and then colored outside of them. The real world does that constantly, but we won't put up with that shit in our fiction.

 

[MrAnarchy]

That is the realistic approach, along with electronic surveillance. But having established right from the start that we aren't dealing with the real world, Crush can ignore realism as long as verisimilitude is maintained. And the thing is, verisimilitude has higher standards than reality because reality is under no obligation to be either believable or consistent; when Kate suffered her breakdown after giving the drinks guy a beejay, that was absolutely, completely realistic because you never know what straw will break the proverbial; however, it violated verisimilitude because it did not match how Kate had been portrayed up until that time. That's why people were mad: Crush drew the lines and then colored outside of them. The real world does that constantly, but we won't put up with that shit in our fiction.

You were able to put into words the problem I had with that scene

 

[aifgamer]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but by the time of her BJ nuclear meltdown, Kate has been repeatedly raped by her manager, including during the job interview. She has been forced to give the club owner a BJ in his car while his driver watched and then been forced to fuck him in her room within earshot of the other residents. She has given a drug dealer head to score dope while he filmed her. She has flashed her tits to save $2 on tuktuk fares. She has been groped, spanked and objectified by 100s of customers in the bar..

I'll try to explain more because I do understand why some people see it as dissonant. But for one thing, she isn't ever raped by the manager. Everything she does with him is consensual. It's pretty clear from the context that she likes the manager and likes having sex with him. She isn't forced to do anything with the club owner, either. She could refuse and back out at any time. She goes through with it because it's advancing the mission.

Blowing the cocktail guy doesn't advance the mission at all, he's just some random guy. And it means that she might have to give sexual favors to more random guys, with no immediate end in sight, and with the sunk cost where if she backs out, all the other stuff she did was pointless.

Think about a Hollywood actress who has sex with a producer to get a role, has an ongoing fling with her co-star, takes her top off in some scenes, does objectifying photo shoots and sometimes has promiscuous sex while she's drunk or high at parties. That's still a far cry from being told by the director that she has to give a blowjob to the stunt coordinator just because.

 

[ffive]

when Kate suffered her breakdown after giving the drinks guy a beejay, that was absolutely, completely realistic because you never know what straw will break the proverbial; however, it violated verisimilitude because it did not match how Kate had been portrayed up until that time.

Have you noticed you're contradicting yourself here? You are right: a person can act in certain way for a period of time, but a proverbial straw might eventually break their back, and their facade comes undone. This is indeed realistic, and the very fact that it's a realistic reaction makes the argument "but she was acting differently until now, so this doesn't match" pretty much hollow.

The MC had enough of mental fortitude to carry on through something she wasn't comfortable with. It doesn't mean she'd be comfortable with it infinitely, nor that she'd have to face even more drastic situation to break down. Sometimes it's the small things.

If it doesn't fit your personal idea of what's "believable" which exceeds the reality... well, then it's unfortunate, but i don't feel like the writer is at any real fault here if they didn't meet those expectations.

But this is very much the repeat of the same tired argument that this thread went over multiple times by now, i don't think there's any real merit in dragging it on.

 

[MrAnarchy]

I'll try to explain more because I do understand why some people see it as dissonant. But for one thing, she isn't ever raped by the manager. Everything she does with him is consensual. It's pretty clear from the context that she likes the manager and likes having sex with him. She isn't forced to do anything with the club owner, either. She could refuse and back out at any time. She goes through with it because it's advancing the mission.

Blowing the cocktail guy doesn't advance the mission at all, he's just some random guy. And it means that she might have to give sexual favors to more random guys, with no immediate end in sight, and with the sunk cost where if she backs out, all the other stuff she did was pointless.

Think about a Hollywood actress who has sex with a producer to get a role, has an ongoing fling with her co-star, takes her top off in some scenes, does objectifying photo shoots and sometimes has promiscuous sex while she's drunk or high at parties. That's still a far cry from being told by the director that she has to give a blowjob to the stunt coordinator just because.

The first time she has sex with Connor is during the interview in his apartment where he pins her to the wall and sticks it in her without warning.

 

[MrAnarchy]

Have you noticed you're contradicting yourself here? You are right: a person can act in certain way for a period of time, but a proverbial straw might eventually break their back, and their facade comes undone. This is indeed realistic, and the very fact that it's a realistic reaction makes the argument "but she was acting differently until now, so this doesn't match" pretty much hollow.

The MC had enough of mental fortitude to carry on through something she wasn't comfortable with. It doesn't mean she'd be comfortable with it infinitely, nor that she'd have to face even more drastic situation to break down. Sometimes it's the small things.

If it doesn't fit your personal idea of what's "believable" which exceeds the reality... well, then it's unfortunate, but i don't feel like the writer is at any real fault here if they didn't meet those expectations.

But this is very much the repeat of the same tired argument that this thread went over multiple times by now, i don't think there's any real merit in dragging it on.

Because her reaction ISN’T the “straw breaking the camel’s back” or her realizing what she’s been doing. It’s very clearly her having a meltdown because she’s shocked they are asking her to do something sexual.

Ultimately it’s a scene that should have been much much earlier in the story. Because in the end, that’s what this is, a story and when you are writing a story you have to make sure your scenes flow together with the natural progression of the narrative.
While this scene might have been “realistic” it has totally fucked up the flow of the story because it is so out of place with where we’re at in the plot by this point.

On its own, yeah, the scene is good. But placed where it is the story now? It’s as if the editor made a mistake and placed Chapter 4 after Chapter 7.

 

[MrAnarchy]

What makes this scene even more frustrating is there was already a scene in the story that was PERFECT for a emotional breakdown moment.

The chapter where she goes on a date with the Big Boss( I forgot how to spell his name, it starts with a K)

during the whole date with her, he’s basically treating her like the high class escort they want her to become.

Picks her up in a nice car.

Wines and dines her.

Then she’s made to give him a blowjob in the backseat in full view of the driver WHILE he’s on the phone treating her sucking his dick like an afterthought.

Then he takes her back to HER place and fucks her hard enough for her fellow guests to hear.

And to top it off, he demeans her during the sex and calls her lazy.

Then after cumming inside her, he just leaves and she’s left having to decide whether to go downstairs and face her fellow tourists or stay in her room.

That should have been when she broke down. That should have been when she threw up. That should have been where she wonders if she could really do this.

Because now, her hostel, her one sorta “safe space” where she can decompress and be a normal pert with her roommates has been shattered. Her hostel buddies will never look at her the same way again and now she has be “HCC” all the time.

In fact, if I remember correctly, she doesn’t come out of her room at all the next day because she’s so embarrassed. The foundations for an emotional crisis scene were there, but they were passed over and then just plopped into this random bj scene with no build up or context.