Ren'Py Is The World Ready for Guro and Snuff Games?

[Hidalgo Liguini Calamari]

Ren'Py based games have given a platform, and a big one at that, to games and stories of the taboo nature. Incest, pee, scat and NTR have flourished so much via this medium. With each game being produced, some incredibly good and others incredibly shitty, the genre seems all but played out. So what could possibly be next you may ask? I feel these games will become more extreme as time passes. Although there have been games that have alluded to the subjects, there has yet to be a universally known game, that has been liked, hated, or made with the intentions of going all out on the subject of snuff or guro.
Snuff games are usually games that cater to the fetish of the MC/player in which he/she can kill people (usually in a way for sexual gratification.). Guro takes it one step further. It is very extreme, very violent, very very bloody. Think of the franchise movies of SAW. Now give it two Viagras and chase it down with RedBull and a sixpack of 4Loco. As you might've guess, it's SuperNightmareFuel for the faint of heart.
My question I pose is this... Is there or will there be a demand for games of this nature? For now, at least, it seems that the governing bodies of Patreon are restricting creators' content. How? We all know how they feel about games like the famous "Big Brother". The game was rock solid. Loved by many (and I do mean many}. Yet, Patreon restricted its creator/s from being funded for the continuation of the game because its stance of incest.
Games that would explore snuff or guro would probably be met by the same restrictions.
Sound off and let me know how you feel or share your thoughts. Just remember, let's be kind to one another in our replies. Thanks!

 

[WICKEDp4th]

I'm definetly not ready for this kind of adult content (and never will be).

 

[jamdan]

Not a chance. I think that kind of stuff goes beyond taboo and into a much darker and disturbing realm. If there is a market for that stuff, its a tiny one on the fringe.

I also dont agree with the idea that games will get more extreme. Most of the top games are quite vanilla, even stuff like pee and scat are more gross than extreme.

 

[Hidalgo Liguini Calamari]

Not a chance. I think that kind of stuff goes beyond taboo and into a much darker and disturbing realm. If there is a market for that stuff, its a tiny one on the fringe.

I also dont agree with the idea that games will get more extreme. Most of the top games are quite vanilla, even stuff like pee and scat are more gross than extreme.

Thanks for the reply! Extreme is kind of a broad word. When I say extreme in Ren'py I was thinking about the subject matter in games like Dokie Dokie Literature Club.(suicide, decomposition, etc...). That game made me wonder is it possible that this might be the future. I agree with your take on it being darker and disturbing. Yet, we have to admit that controversial games and stories are the ones that get a lot of attention.(even if it's negative.)

 

[Avaron1974]

I don't think games will get more extreme, as popular as people find some of the more niche fetishes the vanilla dating sim/romance game are still incredibly popular.

There are some niches that will never be mainstream and that's your snuff and guro.

Snuff has been around for a very long time and still never managed to break out of it's very niche corner. There are some things that are never going to be enjoyed by the masses.

Rape is probably one of the big extremes that borders on mainstream and that puts a lot of people off.

Getting attention isn't the same as popular. Take that rape game that came out not so long ago that got banned from Steam, that made the media and managed to piss off a lot of people. Some people were happy a game like that came out and got on Steam but Steam was slowly changing it's stance on adult games and that game stopped that. So those people happy with the game were happy it completely ruined all the work adult devs had done up to that point and set the H game industry back several years.

That also had snuff in it ... and necrophila.

Some things will always be niche and that's not a bad thing.

 

[anne O'nymous]

Why stop at snuff and guro ? I don't know if it have a name (and in fact don't want to know) but there's people who like porn content where you don't do barbaric things like killing girls for the pleasure to kill them. Those people are way more sophisticated, they prefer to slowly cock them, then eat them...

More seriously, I have nothing with others' fetishes, but there's a moment when it stop to be something you can include in a game. Water sports isn't a fetish shared by many people, but everyone can stand a scene or two in a game they like. Which isn't the case with scatology by example. Put one (unavoidable) scat scene in your game, and you'll loose the majority of your players. And it's the same for really extreme fetishes like guro or snuff.
It doesn't mean that nobody can make a game with this kind of content, but those people need to be aware that their game will only touch a really small niche, and so only have really few players.

 

[Hidalgo Liguini Calamari]

Why stop at snuff and guro ? I don't know if it have a name (and in fact don't want to know) but there's people who like porn content where you don't do barbaric things like killing girls for the pleasure to kill them. Those people are way more sophisticated, they prefer to slowly cock them, then eat them...

More seriously, I have nothing with others' fetishes, but there's a moment when it stop to be something you can include in a game. Water sports isn't a fetish shared by many people, but everyone can stand a scene or two in a game they like. Which isn't the case with scatology by example. Put one (unavoidable) scat scene in your game, and you'll loose the majority of your players. And it's the same for really extreme fetishes like guro or snuff.
It doesn't mean that nobody can make a game with this kind of content, but those people need to be aware that their game will only touch a really small niche, and so only have really few players.

You brought up an interesting point when you said that some games may have a scene or two that may be considered to be "extreme" (water sports). I agree with you when you say most people would tolerate it. I'm one that believes that a scene that involves some niche item should not be put there just for the sake of it, but rather to help move the story along. With that being said, if there were a game to come out where the player plays the part of a serial killer and the game has a solid story line, would it be more acceptable to have these types of scenes rather than just have them for the sake of having them?

 

[Ataios]

In one word: NO!

In a broader sense: I don't mind games containing both sex and murder, but I do mind, if you combine them. Killing and mutilating may be part of a game but it should never be a fetish. Example for a story that contains both, but is still valid: Villain and his minions kidnap princess. Female knight comes to her rescue, kills all the minions in a bloody way and finally rips the villain's belly open, to strangle him with his guts. Lady knight frees princess, they have a lesbian romance. Happy end. Though this scenario involves a fair share of bloodshed, the bloodshed is never fetishized. What would not be acceptable would be a game with a Jack the Ripper like protagonist, where the protagonist gains lust from the killing.

For the well-being of our species both on an individual and on a collective level, most people abhor such fetishes. After all, a species that makes a fetish out of killing those they lust after, would very soon die out. So in short, you will never have a large audience, if you include them in a game.

 

[Thickgravy49]

God, I cetainly hope we don't see this kind of thing appearing on here!

Some things should be censored and these you mention, fall into that category, imo.

It's beyond what's acceptable, as far as I'm concerned and I definitely wouldn't play it.
EVER!

Just because this is a pirate and a porn forum, does not mean that we shouldn't have any standards or moral values.

 

[anne O'nymous]

With that being said, if there were a game to come out where the player plays the part of a serial killer and the game has a solid story line, would it be more acceptable to have these types of scenes rather than just have them for the sake of having them?

Honestly, I think that the answer is no, whatever how solid and well wrote the story can be, because it fall on the wrong side of fetishes. Unlike "regular" fetishes, that you basically like or dislike, the reaction to those fetishes are more decided. Either you like them, or they totally disgust you. And games supposed to give you some sexual excitement can difficultly deal with disgust.

Just because this is a pirate and a porn forum, does not mean that we shouldn't have any standards or moral values.

I'm not sure that drugging all the females in your family, to sleep rape them with the intent to turn them into your personal cum bucket, really represent higher moral values than guro or snuff.
I agree that we have moral values, (almost) none of us would to such things in real life. But why should guro or snuff be different ? Why should it be moral to sleep rape your drugged mother in a game, and immoral to sexually torture her to death, still just in a game ?
There's absolutely no reason for this difference. Both are "immoral practices", both endanger the victim, and both are illegal practices. If one have its place in adult games, then the second should also have it. It doesn't meant that you have to play the games with those fetishes, nor that you have agree with them, but you've to tolerate them like ourselves tolerate the games that feature your own fetishes.

 

[Hidalgo Liguini Calamari]

Honestly, I think that the answer is no, whatever how solid and well wrote the story can be, because it fall on the wrong side of fetishes. Unlike "regular" fetishes, that you basically like or dislike, the reaction to those fetishes are more decided. Either you like them, or they totally disgust you. And games supposed to give you some sexual excitement can difficultly deal with disgust.




I'm not sure that drugging all the females in your family, to sleep rape them with the intent to turn them into your personal cum bucket, really represent higher moral values than guro or snuff.
I agree that we have moral values, (almost) none of us would to such things in real life. But why should guro or snuff be different ? Why should it be moral to sleep rape your drugged mother in a game, and immoral to sexually torture her to death, still just in a game ?
There's absolutely no reason for this difference. Both are "immoral practices", both endanger the victim, and both are illegal practices. If one have its place in adult games, then the second should also have it. It doesn't meant that you have to play the games with those fetishes, nor that you have agree with them, but you've to tolerate them like ourselves tolerate the games that feature your own fetishes.

I like that you've expressed the idea of free to chose. Some people may like games that feature NTR, or scat, or rape, or s&m. Yet snuff/ guro does seem to sit uneasy on people's minds. Even though we understand it's just a game, it still turns people in a wrong way. The idea of turning all of the females in one's family into sexual slaves or lovers is more acceptable. I'm not pro or against guro/snuff games. I'm more of a "let's see if this story is different and fresh from all the others". I'm one that believes that the whole incest thing is reaching it's end. How many more ways can you tell the same story? For me a game should be entertaining, thought provoking, illicit some type of emotion and leave you satisfied at its conclusion. The topic is pretty much irrelevant, if the story is superb. Yet, I don't know how I feel about snuff/guro. I guess I will hold my own judgement until I play one.

 

[Ataios]

Aside from moral issues and the fact, that the vast majority of people are disgusted by these kinds of "fetishes", there is also a reason in game design, why they are not included in major games: Why would someone want to kill or mutilate the NPC, they want to fuck? Imagine a GTA variant about destroying all your cars or a WoW expansion where you get to destroy all your legendary armor and weapons. Doesn't sound too exciting, does it?

 

[Hidalgo Liguini Calamari]

Aside from moral issues and the fact, that the vast majority of people are disgusted by these kinds of "fetishes", there is also a reason in game design, why they are not included in major games: Why would someone want to kill or mutilate the NPC, they want to fuck? Imagine a GTA variant about destroying all your cars or a WoW expansion where you get to destroy all your legendary armor and weapons. Doesn't sound too exciting, does it?

Good point. However, let's say (playing devil's advocate) that it's a story in which the MC is the one who has to find out who the murderer is or has to escape from the killer. Would that make it less creepy or is it still the same. From what I've noticed in this thread, people are totally against the idea of being the one who does the killings. Or is it just way too effed up to even have it in a game?

 

[Thickgravy49]

Honestly, I think that the answer is no, whatever how solid and well wrote the story can be, because it fall on the wrong side of fetishes. Unlike "regular" fetishes, that you basically like or dislike, the reaction to those fetishes are more decided. Either you like them, or they totally disgust you. And games supposed to give you some sexual excitement can difficultly deal with disgust.




I'm not sure that drugging all the females in your family, to sleep rape them with the intent to turn them into your personal cum bucket, really represent higher moral values than guro or snuff.
I agree that we have moral values, (almost) none of us would to such things in real life. But why should guro or snuff be different ? Why should it be moral to sleep rape your drugged mother in a game, and immoral to sexually torture her to death, still just in a game ?
There's absolutely no reason for this difference. Both are "immoral practices", both endanger the victim, and both are illegal practices. If one have its place in adult games, then the second should also have it. It doesn't meant that you have to play the games with those fetishes, nor that you have agree with them, but you've to tolerate them like ourselves tolerate the games that feature your own fetishes.

I've never played a game where I 'drugged' and 'sleep-raped' all the females in my family.
I find rape a vile practice and I don't think it should be trivialised in any way, nor would I play any games that contain it.

I'm not entirely sure why you've taken umbridge at what I posted, but I simply can't be bothered to go 'back and forth' arguing with you.
Let's just do it your way and let anything be on here, no matter how distasteful it is.
Happy?

 

[Hidalgo Liguini Calamari]

I've never played a game where I 'drugged' and 'sleep-raped' all the females in my family.
I find rape a vile practice and I don't think it should be trivialised in any way, nor would I play any games that contain it.

I'm not entirely sure why you've taken umbridge at what I posted, but I simply can't be bothered to go 'back and forth' arguing with you.
Let's just do it your way and let anything be on here, no matter how distasteful it is.
Happy?

My apologies if you were offended Thickgravy49. I'm just trying to engage in some thought provoking conversations with the forum members. I was in no way trying to start a problem. As a matter of fact, because of the feedback on here, I have learned quite a bit. Thank you for your opinion. Just know that I respect it and will continue to respect everyone.

 

[Thickgravy49]

My apologies if you were offended Thickgravy49. I'm just trying to engage in some thought provoking conversations with the forum members. I was in no way trying to start a problem. As a matter of fact, because of the feedback on here, I have learned quite a bit. Thank you for your opinion. Just know that I respect it and will continue to respect everyone.

No apologies are necessary, my friend.
I was referring to the AON guy's reply, not yours.
Please accept MY apology for the lack of clarification.

 

[83wulf]

There was this thread this weekend, in which I weighed in. I was maybe a bit heavy-handed (hung-over). But I would want sites like this to survive. And the last thing we need is another RapeLay scandal. If we stick our head up out of the trench, it will get blown or bitten off. And there would be "collateral damage".

The most Virtue-Signalling and Moral Order of the Radiant Vanilla is always going to prevail. Deus Vult, and all that.

 

[anne O'nymous]

I'm not entirely sure why you've taken umbridge at what I posted,

I haven't take umbridge at what you said, I just found it totally hypocritical and said it.
90% of the games available here figure content like rape, blackmail, drugs, mind control, coercion, incest, humiliation, and so on. There's really few games that don't have, in a way or another, "immoral content". So, putting a limit at what is acceptable immoralities and what is unacceptable ones, like I said, I found it totally hypocritical.

I find rape a vile practice and I don't think it should be trivialised in any way, nor would I play any games that contain it.

I was curious, so decided statement generally hide something. So, I took a look at your posting activity and... What can I say, except asking you how you've been able to write a fan fiction for Katie's Corruption without playing the game ? I mean, the whole game is trivialisation of rape. The boss of Katie use coercion and blackmail to have sex with her, then share her with his friends, still by using coercion and blackmail. Same for her father, who use his paternal position to force her into sexual activities. As far as I remember it, there's almost not a single sex scene where the dialogs don't make clear that Katie feel like she have no other choice than to consent against her will.

Let's just do it your way and let anything be on here, no matter how distasteful it is.
Happy?

How can't I be happy that you don't try to force your own taste on others ? As I said, we let you have access to the fetishes you like, without complaining. This whatever how distasteful they can seem for us. Therefore, it's fair that you do the same, whatever how distasteful our own fetishes can seem to your eyes.

 

[Hidalgo Liguini Calamari]

Are there any good DAZ assets for a guro/snuff game though? I am not into these fetishes, but instead of playing a western game with bad renders, I guess I would probably choose some twisted game from Japan.
I mean, for this niche market the quality bar is already set high. A western dev must also fight against censorship, both on Patreon and on boards (as other people have already said).

Fighting censorship would be the biggest problem. Even now, many games have had to side step the Patreon censorship by offering patches, through other means, to restore their taboo content (whatever it may be).
As for assets for programs, DAZ isn't the only solution. Poser and of course Blender offer alternatives in finding the needed material. A quick search on the ole interwebs will produce some adequate results. I myself have come across some of these assets. Also, if it can't be found, there's always making it in Blender. Needless to say, it is out there...but does the public want it?

 

[eosar]

Sex and death/boobs and gore are how trashy horror movies thrive.
I don't really know many horror games, but i do know that Resident Evil ones with a female character have nude mods, The Forest's cannibals were all naked at some point (i saw boobs and got interested in the game, so... :shrug: eh) and there was this one guy on reddit (i think) who exploited a dismembered NPC resurrection bug + prostitution mod in Fallout 3 or NV just because.

The fascination with death and eroticism has a very long history. They even made a documentary about it (or a couple), which i don't really remember, but i think they talked about the meaning behind sexualizing vampires, witches, the Inquisition, necromancy, self-flagellation and other stuff (or i'm just mixing up my documentaries). So, it's not that weird a fetish in actuality as it is quite widespread, regardless of culture or belief, but simply not well liked.

Remember Firefly? There was a group of space cannibals that raped, killed and ate their victims - not necessarily in that order. Or Warhammer and its Chaos.

The fetish exists and is used quite a lot in media, but i think it needs to be used in a certain way in order to avoid the wrong type of attention. I don't know what that way is, but while few people will admit it, sex and death used properly can and will attract a crowd - even if just to look from afar, in the shadows, covered up by 50 shades of gray clothing.

I remember a random Firefly topic and they talked about the cancelled Season 2 Inara death scene. They said it was planned for her to be captured by the space cannibals. The crew would then track down the ship and board it to mount a rescue. Instead they would find everyone already dead, with Inara having used a rape-revenge kind of poison that kills a rapist painfully. So it would have suggested that she was raped to death by the entire ship crew, but still got the last laugh in the end.


Everyone (the loudest voice) said it sounded like a cool death scene, a "fuck you" from beyond the grave. While it falls in the "sex and death" category, it has what most porn games most definitely lack: a proper story, a likeable multi-faceted character, a unique feat of legendary acomplishment.

With that stuff being said, i simply can't see porn games that focus on this particular fetish both multiply and succeed in drawing enough popularity to make it a standard genre. And yet, the "Similar threads" box below this shows me recommendation requests for guro and ryona...