QSP Jack-o-Nine-Tails [v2.3] [ImperatorAugustusTertius / qwertyu12359]

[Max&Chloe]

Do you like the changes since 2.2.0 outside of the training system?

I am sorry that these days I spent all my time trying to meet the ends as Johny, thus I do not spare much time in other part of the game.

I gave several examples earlier of how she can be tamed even in the current version.

That is right. I really found some ways to prevent her taming losing by myself these days, just like wearing a noble garlia or using a Magna Magnifika or combining both of them. However, when taking those methods to practice use, you have to take these cost to consideration, it is unwise for Johny to save so many sparks for Isabella, since you can not make profits from these aisde from her assisting.

Johny has a high libido so he can gain multiple strength points each day either from sex or from physical punishments (if sex is refused).

This may work, though I do not know punishment can do something good to strengh improvement. But here comes the same problem, if you spent too much energy in trainning assistant, you can not train your slave well at the same time. C+ Strength does not allow you to too many things in one day.

Isabella's mood and put a wedding dress on her

Same problem, wedding dress is too costly and I do not know wedding dress itself can increase devotion overnight.

Above are my feedback to your replies.

Here I will share an another interesting slave. Since I found it not financially beneficial to focus on trainning Isabella alone after several trials, I decided to buy another slave in the market and train them at the same time. Then I brought Forest in the market. Everything looked perfect except for her physique which I found it a disaster later.

After several days' trainning, I found one trait of her: Torpid, at the begining this did not catch my attention.

I am so confident that I have so much sparks and enough time certainly I can train another B+ slave, so I spent 50 days and made her fully obedience. In this course, I borrow 2000 sparks again.


It looked everything went well in that time, then I thought up that to sell her as a B+ slave you have to increase her style and exoticism, meaning it necessary for her to lose some weight. However since her is torpid, only when her mood is ecstatic she will do gymnastics happily and gains some merits, otherwise she will refuse or do poorly in gymnastics and feel guilty. Of course, mood losing is also inevitable. All factors above combined makes it very diffcult to achieve my goal, since I have to give her another job after Sententia Vertias. Then an award is needed to boost her mood. Only after all above steps she will do dynamics happily and thus lose some weight. Restricted to slaver and slave strength, it is impossible to lose much weight at the same time, not mention the trouble caused by too much calories in one day. After all, I found it impossible to sell her as a B+ slave before DDL. In these case I have spent too much time (in real life), you know, I have to pay attention Isabella's taming everyday. I have to admit this slave is a trap and her tortured me a lot of time.

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Fine. Just I guessed, she has weakened Metabolism. Torpid, Corpulent, Weakened Metabolism, 3 IN 1! It is a tortue to help her lose some weight. I sold my B+ Isabella for 4460 in this course.

 

[Max&Chloe]

Emergency BUG!
Vegetable 25 in day 132, 10 in day 133.

 

[BliniKot]

Honestly yeah, we should flesh out existing npcs more. One of the thing I suggested recently was selling slaves to shops should increase your reputation with said shop and open up new options/items/commisions from them
just like how selling to a house increases your reputation with that house to allow you to rent/be a patrician of that house

 

[Max&Chloe]

And I have to say, the price of slave is unbalanced at all. In version 2.2.0, M'Lord starts the game with 2500 sparks, the standard price of C+ slave is 1000, B+ 2000. In version 2.2.6.10 and later, M'Lord starts with 8000 sparks, the price of slave is C+ 850, B+ 3500 accordingly. How can we percive this changes ? The increase in M'Lord's origin money show us this city is in inflation, everything in this city needs more money. It really happened. The cost of house rental did increase. If this is right, how can we understand the decrease of slave price in C+ and lower level ?
As it shows below, the obedience comes harder in latest version (2.2.6.16). A slave with 2 fear, 3 awareness, 2 taming, 4 habbits, 0 devotion only has 2 obedience. This means whatever other skills are, she can only get D- level or less. If you want to get her level up to D+ or higher, her must have at least 1 devotion. As you know, the form of devotion is time-cost. The followed day, Kate got 1 devotion and her obedience became 7 accordingly. Her level reached D+ at the same time. This kind of JUMP in slave's level happened many times in latest versions (2.2.6.10, 2.2.6.13, 2.2.6.16), and I do not think this design is reasonable, since it makes many middle levels meaningless. Slaves will not stand in those levels too long or ignore them completely. In Kate's case I spent 40 days to get her level D- and once she got 1 devotion in day 41 she became D+ in version 2.2.6.16. In a earlier case, I spent 19 days to get Beata's level to D- and once she got 1 devotion in day 20 she became C-, She compleletly ignored D+ level. What's more, it just need 1 more day to get Beate to C+ level, which I have mentioned in one of before replies. I trainned Beata in version 2.2.6.10 and due to the changes of taming clothes, I am not sure whether I can a slave so fast in lastest version. These cases above show that you greatly increased the difficulty of trainning a low level slave and at the same time, what did you do ? You reduced the price of low level slave! That is ridiculous, how can you decrease the reward while increasing the cost ? As I account these days the cost of a D+ level is about 600 sparks and her price is only 750, if you sell her to resident. The cost of a B+ slave is about 2000 sparks and her price is 3500 in same condtion. This is another unreasonable point, the hard part of trainning slave is to get her obedient. Once obedient, the left things are just a matter of time. In conclusions, my opinion about slave price is opposite of yours. I think you should increase the price of low level slave instead of decreasing. The price of high level slave can remain current situation due to the inflation in this city. In this version, I found the only profitable way to train slave is to just train B+ level slave. Trainning low level slave is only a waste of time both in game and in reality. I trainned a D+ witch doctor kate and my profit is -700 sparks.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

However, when taking those methods to practice use, you have to take these cost to consideration, it is unwise for Johny to save so many sparks for Isabella, since you can not make profits from these aisde from her assisting.

Although her rating dropped to F- and she refused sex with a Repulsive slaver, she was still useful as an assistant. If not intending to sell her, agree it’s a waste to invest in her.

This may work, though I do not know punishment can do something good to strengh improvement.

If you click the slaver’s strength characteristic it tells you this.

But here comes the same problem, if you spent too much energy in trainning assistant, you can not train your slave well at the same time. C+ Strength does not allow you to too many things in one day.

Isabella can spend her energy on the slave while Johny works on his strength.

Same problem, wedding dress is too costly and I do not know wedding dress itself can increase devotion overnight.

Taking Isabella on dates / giving erotic rewards works too. Point here was to say that if you are training her for sale you can improve her obedience even without raising taming. Admittedly not as quickly, which is why it would be better to use her as an assistant.

it necessary for her to lose some weight. However since her is torpid, only when her mood is ecstatic she will do gymnastics happily and gains some merits, otherwise she will refuse or do poorly in gymnastics and feel guilty. Of course, mood losing is also inevitable.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Fine. Just I guessed, she has weakened Metabolism. Torpid, Corpulent, Weakened Metabolism, 3 IN 1! It is a tortue to help her lose some weight. I sold my B+ Isabella for 4460 in this course.

That is an unlucky combination of traits, but losing weight in JONT does not require doing gymnastics. Just ending the day with low enough calories. In this case -500 because she has low metabolism. The “nutritionist” diet would automate lowering her weight. A restricted diet would limit her calories, making it easy to achieve -500 each day.

Clicking on her physique or the calculator next to her calories display tells you how to lower physique:

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

Emergency BUG!
Vegetable 25 in day 132, 10 in day 133.

Thanks. This happened because cryostorage was full. Latest dev build moves threshold for ingredient discard to over 100% instead of exactly 100%.

And I have to say, the price of slave is unbalanced at all. In version 2.2.0, M'Lord starts the game with 2500 sparks, the standard price of C+ slave is 1000, B+ 2000. In version 2.2.6.10 and later, M'Lord starts with 8000 sparks, the price of slave is C+ 850, B+ 3500 accordingly. How can we percive this changes ? The increase in M'Lord's origin money show us this city is in inflation, everything in this city needs more money. It really happened. The cost of house rental did increase. If this is right, how can we understand the decrease of slave price in C+ and lower level ?

We increased starting sparks not only to compensate for increased rental costs but also to provide more room for error for new players learning the game.

The adjustments to slave prices were made to reflect the small gap in training time between the lower ratings. Producing slaves of D rating can be very quick, even quicker with the aid of a dungeon to accelerate fear development.

As it shows below, the obedience comes harder in latest version (2.2.6.16). A slave with 2 fear, 3 awareness, 2 taming, 4 habbits, 0 devotion only has 2 obedience. This means whatever other skills are, she can only get D- level or less. If you want to get her level up to D+ or higher, her must have at least 1 devotion.

You can achieve up to C- rating without devotion:


With your example, adding 1 fear or 1 taming would reach D+ without devotion:


Notice her mood here is Optimistic, whereas in your screenshots she was Pessimistic. There are a couple of points of obedience tied to mood.

As you know, the form of devotion is time-cost. The followed day, Kate got 1 devotion and her obedience became 7 accordingly. Her level reached D+ at the same time. This kind of JUMP in slave's level happened many times in latest versions (2.2.6.10, 2.2.6.13, 2.2.6.16), and I do not think this design is reasonable, since it makes many middle levels meaningless. Slaves will not stand in those levels too long or ignore them completely. In Kate's case I spent 40 days to get her level D- and once she got 1 devotion in day 41 she became D+ in version 2.2.6.16. In an earlier case, I spent 19 days to get Beata's level to D- and once she got 1 devotion in day 20 she became C-, She compleletly ignored D+ level. What's more, it just need 1 more day to get Beate to C+ level

A slave that is Haughty or Arrogant takes longer to build devotion. In this case fear can substitute up to C- as shown above. The requirements for the ratings are legacy. C- adds only a little bit of sexual training, common skill training and slightly higher obedience.

I trainned Beata in version 2.2.6.10 and due to the changes of taming clothes, I am not sure whether I can a slave so fast in lastest version. These cases above show that you greatly increased the difficulty of trainning a low level slave and at the same time, what did you do ? You reduced the price of low level slave! That is ridiculous, how can you decrease the reward while increasing the cost ? As I account these days the cost of a D+ level is about 600 sparks and her price is only 750, if you sell her to resident. The cost of a B+ slave is about 2000 sparks and her price is 3500 in same condtion. This is another unreasonable point, the hard part of trainning slave is to get her obedient. Once obedient, the left things are just a matter of time. In conclusions, my opinion about slave price is opposite of yours. I think you should increase the price of low level slave instead of decreasing. The price of high level slave can remain current situation due to the inflation in this city. In this version, I found the only profitable way to train slave is to just train B+ level slave. Trainning low level slave is only a waste of time both in game and in reality. I trainned a D+ witch doctor kate and my profit is -700 sparks.

What were your biggest costs for kate?

Since D slaves can be produced so quickly, their value is lower. Supply/demand.

They can also be sold for more if you improve their charm.

Why is it taking 40 days to reach D-? That seems to be the crux of your profitability problem. To achieve 1 devotion the day after achieving D- implies that you are focusing on raising her devotion before she has achieved positive obedience. Which is a valid strategy if your goal is a higher rating, but unnecessary if D+ is your target.

Look at that example I posted above, D+ in 25 days playing inefficiently and disregarding tutorial advice: https://f95zone.to/threads/jack-o-n...tsman-community-development.390/post-13847552

Admittedly this was with a better slaver than Johny, but if you choose a start labeled high difficulty is it unreasonable to expect that you know what you are doing?

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

Day 5 with Johny on normal (oral rape on day 1, used gag/pear to enforce silence and deny toileting, then eased off as her despair kept rising, started using alcohol to raise mood to lower despair, and spanked her with a slipper a few times to raise her fear, and have not maintained aura supremacy):


Day 12:


Day 14 (recovered sanity via arena battle):


Day 18 (D- because physique dropped):


Day 20 (D+ because refused sex, was punished, gained fear):


Day 22 (gained 1 star of devotion, now limited by beauty):


One possible outcome: Day 31, dressed to increase charm, sold at guild auction for 575$, resulting in 215$ profit after debt repayment.

Another possible outcome: Day 31, dressed to increase charm, sold with bargaining to Don Castilo for 907$, resulting in 458$ profit after debt.

During this experiment, noticed that taming items were not providing any benefit whatsoever (unintentionally). Fixed on latest dev build.

 

[Flying Geaser]

instead of restrictions just achievements: ex: sell your first rank B slave.. etc

 

[Flying Geaser]

What affects guild rank? Does a higher quality or speed award make a difference or is it just a fixed number of points per rank of slave trained?

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

What affects guild rank? Does a higher quality or speed award make a difference or is it just a fixed number of points per rank of slave trained?

Quality yes, speed no. Quality is judged by slave rating compared to slaver guild rank.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

instead of restrictions just achievements: ex: sell your first rank B slave.. etc

We already have this in a way with objectives (raising reputation with factions requires progressively higher ratings).

 

[qwertyu12359]

We already have this in a way with objectives (raising reputation with factions requires progressively higher ratings).

I get what he's saying though, and it's different.

Achievements are more of an "instant gratification" thing that talks to your reptilian brain's sense of reward, and desire for completion.

A non-intrusive notification when completing a first contract can feel like a little reward to keep a new player going. They can also be used to make people realize the game is not really finished after Patrician ("Get all trophies from the fog", "Sell a slave to the Pope"). And in the end, platinum trophies for achievements and challenges: "Raise a perfect slave with S+ rating on every stats", "complete a 0 start playthrough with Johnny".

However, a game ideally doesn't need that, as it cheapens emergent gameplay and ruins easter eggs. There's no place for "oh I discovered some unique way of playing" as its own reward, if developers thought about every way of playing and gave you an intimidating list of what to do. I feel that JONT is a "retro game" in spirit, achievements are an anachronic trend to force into it. Besides, it already pleases beginners with sexual content and completionists with difficulty and a clear social ladder to climb.

 

[Max&Chloe]

Thanks. This happened because cryostorage was full. Latest dev build moves threshold for ingredient discard to over 100% instead of exactly 100%.

Another BUG ?
Wielding Whip and Lash in the same time, six (2+1+3) attack selections appear instead of four (2+2).

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

A non-intrusive notification when completing a first contract can feel like a little reward to keep a new player going.

I’d like to see more conversation with NPCs in the game that is informed by the history of what the player has done. Like how in Skyrim there are comments made in passing that you overhear or addressed to you.

“Isn’t that the new slaver Angelika recruited? I saw on the guild board that he finished his first contract already.

Gaudete, [slaver name]! Good luck with your training!”

or

“That new slaver is rising fast. Did you hear he won the arena championship? Everyone wants to buy from him now.”

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

So the note in the slaver skills says A+ outcome, but the results of the lesson dont specify the outcome.

Even if not all of them state an explicit letter grade, there's always an indication of how diligent the slave was.

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

Another BUG ?
Wielding Whip and Lash in the same time, six (2+1+3) attack selections appear instead of four (2+2).

That's working as intended. You get the two attacks of the primary (first chosen) weapon and one attack from the secondary weapon, plus kick/push/sweep.

 

[Max&Chloe]

That's working as intended. You get the two attacks of the primary (first chosen) weapon and one attack from the secondary weapon, plus kick/push/sweep.

So strange.
And my Johny's fight skill derease as time goes. Is this intended?
If Yes, Why?

 

[ImperatorAugustusTertius]

So strange.
And my Johny's fight skill derease as time goes. Is this intended?
If Yes, Why?

Yes, in 2.2.6.2 we added soft caps and slaver skill decay for story mode, and optionally for custom starts. Depending which slaver you pick, you’ll encounter different soft caps. To distinguish the gameplay experience when choosing different normal starts, aligned to the back-story. Master of some, not all, or at least not easily.

We also added a few unique perks for flavor: Maestro gets free theater tickets; Doc gets free medical exams; Silk Daddy gets a bargaining bonus.

For example, try playing Butler: S+ meals from day 1 (with an apartment) for extra energy and passive strength gain, and he doesn’t mind cooking for himself in the early game.

 

[Max&Chloe]

Yes, in 2.2.6.2 we added soft caps and slaver skill decay for story mode, and optionally for custom starts. Depending which slaver you pick, you’ll encounter different soft caps. To distinguish the gameplay experience when choosing different normal starts, aligned to the back-story. Master of some, not all, or at least not easily.

We also added a few unique perks for flavor: Maestro gets free theater tickets; Doc gets free medical exams; Silk Daddy gets a bargaining bonus.

For example, try playing Butler: S+ meals from day 1 (with an apartment) for extra energy and passive strength gain, and he doesn’t mind cooking for himself in the early game.

Ok, my Johny fighted fog everyday and managed to become a S++ Fighter.
Another question, the Lord Specture disappeared, any clues or hints?

 

[the_sexiton]

Pride rises when a slave is unhappy. The best thing to do with pride in most cases is ignore it. It will resolve over the course of training.


If you had a capable assistant supervising, the death could have been prevented.


Sometimes it's best to be patient while aura stats develop further. Train her in what she's able to learn.


When this happens, please share a saved game.


One will sleep in the dungeon, which certainly doesn't help her mood, but you can compensate for that. Even one action per day is better than being iced and making no progress. Yes, there is an increased feeding cost, but you can increase your profits accordingly.


The farm is not required for prisoner + slave parallel training, and brings its own benefits and costs.


Isabella can train common skills to B+ at least, and will over time level up her cleaning and cooking skills if given those duties even without additional training. Acting as a teacher will also train her own common skills, albeit at a slower rate vs. taking lessons herself. So there is no requirement to focus and invest significantly on Isabella's training. Even if her pride did rise, as long as she still does her job, what's the issue with that?


Unless you are training her for immediate sale, why waste time and money training her instead of a slave that you do plan to sell?


Indeed ... tunnel vision is risky in this game. There are many interacting factors to balance. If you allow despair or spoiling to accumulate then they may undo gains made elsewhere.


Once you have enough funds to cover a few decades of rent, it's usually better to rent an apartment. The Slums are cheap in rent but costly in other ways.

So I took out loans and completed two D+ class slaves in the slums with Johnny. After that I completed a C+ slave without the need for a loan, also in the slums. Then I trained a gladiator champion for the bull ring. Next I trained a B+ class slave with loans. At that point I had about 3000 sparks and moved into the outcasts house. I took on Isabella and followed your advice to not focus on her. We trained two A+ slaves, the first with loans and the second without. Now I'm working on my first S+ slave and then I will focus on getting the cow and egg layer setup. After that I will start training two slaves at a time but I'm holding off for the moment because it takes alot of energy to do. With the bull ring Johnny can push pretty hard but Isabella is a bit weak. She has moved up to A- on her own with a few tweaks from me. I just let her train as much as she can and I train her sexually and she has been rising up pretty nice.

I did run into another impossible slave that I had to ditch and you asked me to upload it if it did it again. She has great stats and no negative traits when I bought her however, she has multiple negative traits that show up over time and I couldn't find a way to work around them. She is basically incapable of being affected by shame or pain. I can improve her mood but her obedience is very stubborn. I managed to get her down to 6 globes of resistance before I just stopped messing with her. It was taking way too long and would have bankrupted me for sure.