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slandy

Newbie
Apr 9, 2019
49
14
86
i haven't played the old versions, but the only way for a slave to go from D+ to F- is to drop from 5 obedience points (or more) to 0 obedience points (or less) in a day, which should be very difficult. it's easy to lose 2 points from mood (if your slave's mood cap is above optimistic during early stages of training, you're definitely doing something wrong), and accidentally gaining a level of spoilage takes away another 2, but how do you lose the fifth one? if you're gaining 2 levels of spoilage in a day you're clearly rewarding her way too much, and if you managed to lose an entire level of taming, habit, or awareness... i have no idea what you're doing. or a level of fear, for that matter, when your slave doesn't have a single level of devotion yet. maybe your slave has a stat distribution that allows her to lose obedience by gaining a level of pride or temperament or something? but unless you let her disobey too much or she has incredibly low starting temperament, both of those things should be really unlikely (and gaining a level of nature or intelligence should be downright impossible that early).

what exactly are you doing to bring a slave from D+ to F- in a day? do you have a save with the D+ save?
I also had this happen in the Yasmin tutorial, and the problem is *I don't know* what I did to cause it.

I actually had it happen twice, the first time I just gave up and quit out of frustration. The second time I decided to try and fix her, which I did and passed the tutorial. But I passed it without knowing what I was doing wrong, which kind of felt like fumbling around in the dark randomly.
 

aumhs

Member
Dec 5, 2022
118
24
94
i haven't played the old versions, but the only way for a slave to go from D+ to F- is to drop from 5 obedience points (or more) to 0 obedience points (or less) in a day, which should be very difficult.
There's a second way to drop from D+ to F-, by going from 8 or more basic attributes to below 6 (according to the wiki).
That would require a slave with extremly bad stats to begin with, but it is technically possible to drop one in let's say pride, endurance and temperament in a single day.


EDIT: Oh wait, even easier, both D- and D+ require endurance 2+. So loosing endurance can drop her to F-.
EDIT EDIT: and both ranks have a beauty requirement, so heavy bruising or injuries can drop her in rank until it's healed as well.
 

slandy

Newbie
Apr 9, 2019
49
14
86
Having trouble with Wilhelmine tutorial. I have her up to C- and it says I need to increase her sex skills to advance, but they are not increasing no mater how many times I train her.

Edit: I found a skill that I could get to increase, but it's hard to tell the difference because the message at the end of training implies repetition will have an effect, but I'm pretty sure for some skills it absolutely does not (no change after 20 plus days of spamming it until out of stamina vs. getting another skill within a few days)

Edit: I finally completed her after bashing my head against the wall all day long. It seems like the issue was Pride, but it was entirely unclear if I was making progress or not because the messages never really changed regardless of what her pride level was. It eventually just brute forced itself down I think. It took 71 days and a lot of reloading saves due to things getting out of hand from trying random things out of desperation.
 
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There's a second way to drop from D+ to F-, by going from 8 or more basic attributes to below 6 (according to the wiki).
That would require a slave with extremly bad stats to begin with, but it is technically possible to drop one in let's say pride, endurance and temperament in a single day.


EDIT: Oh wait, even easier, both D- and D+ require endurance 2+. So loosing endurance can drop her to F-.
EDIT EDIT: and both ranks have a beauty requirement, so heavy bruising or injuries can drop her in rank until it's healed as well.
oh yeah, those are good points - endurance drops and bruising/scarring are fast ways to drop rank. but those shouldn't prevent you from training the slave and reversing those issues as long as her obedience is still high. especially with bruising, it's very easy to continue to make progress with the slave while she heals from the bruises over time.
 
May 5, 2020
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Having trouble with Wilhelmine tutorial. I have her up to C- and it says I need to increase her sex skills to advance, but they are not increasing no mater how many times I train her.

Edit: I found a skill that I could get to increase, but it's hard to tell the difference because the message at the end of training implies repetition will have an effect, but I'm pretty sure for some skills it absolutely does not (no change after 20 plus days of spamming it until out of stamina vs. getting another skill within a few days)
wilhelmine is frigid, so it's a lot harder to train her sex skills. some things to look out for:
- frigid slaves' sex acceptance is decreased by their empathy, impacting diligence
- make sure she's wearing clothes that increase her sex skill learn bonus as much as possible
- make sure your mood and her mood are as high as possible
- make sure she's not depressed and has unashamed pride
- make sure she has decent endurance -- at least B+, preferably higher
- start with the lowest resistance sex skills -- kissing, seduction, and masturbation
- you can use the console to check her skill experience rates if you want to see how good a lesson was even if it didn't give a whole level. typing slave['sub_kiss_xp'] will tell you what the slave's kissing xp progression is, for example. (resets to 0 when the skill levels up btw.) sometimes, a particularly bad lesson will increase xp by 0, which is why even repeated lessons don't do anything.



i do think it would be nice if in future versions of the game, there was special text that told you if a slave got 0 xp from a sex lesson. currently it always says "<<$dynslave_name>> was not able to fully fulfill what you were trying to teach her. It will be necessary to repeat this lesson again, but practice makes perfect; next time this should be easier." i think it would be nice if it instead said something like "<<$dynslave_name>> didn't learn a single thing from this lesson. if she's going to make any progress, something has to give. " would be nice. it shouldn't be too hard to implement, just store the subskill xp before calling dyn_advance_sex_skills and compare it to the result. it also could be a bug though -- looking at the code, it looks like subskill xp is supposed to increase by a minimum of 2 each time, but from the console i can see that it's possible for a lesson to result in no change (i tried it on the slave in my dungeon, who had enough taming and fear to obey but too much despair to have any diligence, and it looked like their sub_hj_xp stat was 0 both before and after the first handjob lesson i made them do, but increased to 2 after the second -- maybe the guilt made the difference?)
 

slandy

Newbie
Apr 9, 2019
49
14
86
wilhelmine is frigid, so it's a lot harder to train her sex skills. some things to look out for:
- frigid slaves' sex acceptance is decreased by their empathy, impacting diligence
- make sure she's wearing clothes that increase her sex skill learn bonus as much as possible
- make sure your mood and her mood are as high as possible
- make sure she's not depressed and has unashamed pride
- make sure she has decent endurance -- at least B+, preferably higher
- start with the lowest resistance sex skills -- kissing, seduction, and masturbation
- you can use the console to check her skill experience rates if you want to see how good a lesson was even if it didn't give a whole level. typing slave['sub_kiss_xp'] will tell you what the slave's kissing xp progression is, for example. (resets to 0 when the skill levels up btw.) sometimes, a particularly bad lesson will increase xp by 0, which is why even repeated lessons don't do anything.



i do think it would be nice if in future versions of the game, there was special text that told you if a slave got 0 xp from a sex lesson. currently it always says "<<$dynslave_name>> was not able to fully fulfill what you were trying to teach her. It will be necessary to repeat this lesson again, but practice makes perfect; next time this should be easier." i think it would be nice if it instead said something like "<<$dynslave_name>> didn't learn a single thing from this lesson. if she's going to make any progress, something has to give. " would be nice. it shouldn't be too hard to implement, just store the subskill xp before calling dyn_advance_sex_skills and compare it to the result. it also could be a bug though -- looking at the code, it looks like subskill xp is supposed to increase by a minimum of 2 each time, but from the console i can see that it's possible for a lesson to result in no change (i tried it on the slave in my dungeon, who had enough taming and fear to obey but too much despair to have any diligence, and it looked like their sub_hj_xp stat was 0 both before and after the first handjob lesson i made them do, but increased to 2 after the second -- maybe the guilt made the difference?)
I'm looking for a list of console commands but am unable to find one. I'm also not sure how much xp is required for a level, if it's something like 100 then even 2 xp would seem to take too long.

I'm testing kissing since I have that command and it does increase by 2 and then falls back to 0 presumably when it gains a level, but gaining a level doesn't seem to be raising the main skill, even though I've raised the level with a sub skill for other things (handjob raised petting by itself for example)

Edit: yeah kissing is one of the weird ones that wouldn't increase the skill, I had to get her to accept irrumatio and use that to increase oral instead, which seems a bit crazy to me. Also it's not that irrumatio finally pushed her over after getting xp with kissing or whatever, because whenever I felt it was taking way too long to raise something, I reloaded to a save before the training to try other things.
 
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I'm testing kissing since I have that command and it does increase by 2 and then falls back to 0 presumably when it gains a level, but gaining a level doesn't seem to be raising the main skill, even though I've raised the level with a sub skill for other things (handjob raised petting by itself for example)

Edit: yeah kissing is one of the weird ones that wouldn't increase the skill, I had to get her to accept irrumatio and use that to increase oral instead, which seems a bit crazy to me. Also it's not that irrumatio finally pushed her over after getting xp with kissing or whatever, because whenever I felt it was taking way too long to raise something, I reloaded to a save before the training to try other things.
kissing increases the skill, just like every other subskill in the skill. sex skill level is the average of all of the subskills. oral just has 5 subskills, so the skill would only get from F- to D- when kissing reached S+ (or, perhaps, kissing reached B+ and irrumatio reached C-?). handjob, on the other hand, would only need to reach A+ to increase petting from F- to D-, because that skill only has 4 subskills.


I'm also not sure how much xp is required for a level, if it's something like 100 then even 2 xp would seem to take too long.
there's no strict number -- the xp is added to the 'success' level during each training session. eg, if the success level was 15 but the difficulty of raising the skill was 30, then you get 15 xp instead of raising the skill. during the next session, if you have a success level of 10 but the difficulty of raising the skill was 23, you'd succeed in raising the skill because 15+10>23. no idea if any of those numbers are possible, but the point is that both the success level (based primarily on diligence) and the difficulty of raising a skill (proportional to a skill's level) are dynamically calculated each session.


I'm looking for a list of console commands but am unable to find one.
also, there's no list of console commands, the console basically runs code through the engine directly. i don't understand it, but i think i understand how variables are stored so i use it to read variable values. you have to prefix a command with @ to have it actually run code instead of read a variable, and if you're not running code you can't use whitespace. but something like slave['temper']+slave['ego'] will still read the sum of temperament and nature. it's nice if you're a dirty little cheater like me who wants to know how much skill experience a slave has, but you have to be comfortable reading the code to figure out what the variable is called. in case you're curious, here's some code that tells you what all the sex skills are called
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slandy

Newbie
Apr 9, 2019
49
14
86
kissing increases the skill, just like every other subskill in the skill. sex skill level is the average of all of the subskills. oral just has 5 subskills, so the skill would only get from F- to D- when kissing reached S+ (or, perhaps, kissing reached B+ and irrumatio reached C-?). handjob, on the other hand, would only need to reach A+ to increase petting from F- to D-, because that skill only has 4 subskills.



there's no strict number -- the xp is added to the 'success' level during each training session. eg, if the success level was 15 but the difficulty of raising the skill was 30, then you get 15 xp instead of raising the skill. during the next session, if you have a success level of 10 but the difficulty of raising the skill was 23, you'd succeed in raising the skill because 15+10>23. no idea if any of those numbers are possible, but the point is that both the success level (based primarily on diligence) and the difficulty of raising a skill (proportional to a skill's level) are dynamically calculated each session.



also, there's no list of console commands, the console basically runs code through the engine directly. i don't understand it, but i think i understand how variables are stored so i use it to read variable values. you have to prefix a command with @ to have it actually run code instead of read a variable, and if you're not running code you can't use whitespace. but something like slave['temper']+slave['ego'] will still read the sum of temperament and nature. it's nice if you're a dirty little cheater like me who wants to know how much skill experience a slave has, but you have to be comfortable reading the code to figure out what the variable is called. in case you're curious, here's some code that tells you what all the sex skills are called
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Thanks, it all makes sense now. I feel like this sort of thing should at least be on the wiki. I immediately started looking for info on how training skills works when things felt wrong, but couldn't find anything.

Edit: and lol, I finally found where the sub skill levels are shown so I can keep track of them. I just never thought to click on that book because I thought everything was available on the slave's page. :FacePalm: I might have been able to solve this a lot sooner.
 
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House of Rahl

New Member
May 10, 2025
10
0
10
they're both 'always liked', so they both grant the pos_clothes mood buff for +1 mood (looking at the code, it looks like it doesn't actually stack, so you only need one... oops, learn something new every day). the sundress also neutralizes the nakedness debuff, but anything will do that. if a slave has an affinity, of course it's more cost effective to give them liked clothes relevant to that affinity, but unless you savescum you're not gonna find out until you start training them (which requires them to already be obeying orders, a few days in... so it's especially not cost effective).


the problem is most of the useful main clothes are revealing, which causes a negative moodlet until they get their first exhibitionism level. sneakers is almost certainly a good strategy though, thinking about it. i should try sneakers+sundress next time. or maybe even just sundress and no shoes at all, to save $5


why? it has the same effect as the leather collar except it gives extra style and exoticism. even if the slave has the hidden trait that makes it grant a positive moodlet, i don't think it's worth the extra $17. it's worth it for when you start selling slaves at auction or to consumers (because then style has an effect, since it's one of the only ways to max out style), but not for the guild contracts at all, especially not when every spark counts.


this also makes sense for higher level slave training, but definitely not the first two slaves. you shouldn't be getting their endurance above B+ anyway, there's not nearly enough time for that and higher endurance = higher food costs. the gloves and headband are also, in my opinion, not worth the cost with the early game margins.


the reason i use heavy rings instead of the nipple chain is that they bypass the clothing taming cap. the nipple chain is just an item that has +taming as an attribute (so it's subject to the cap, which is almost certainly going to be 2 at the start of the game since you have no aura), but the heavy rings add taming after the cap is applied, so with them you can get +5 taming per day (though i usually just get +4, since any +taming other than the collar and heavy rings have too big a negative impact on mood for their price).

also, the reason i dont buy the vaginal beads at first is you need the chastity belt to force the rule. that's why i usually buy them together for the second slave, after selling the first.


i'd recommend just doing the net and trident option for slave gladiators, that way you don't have to buy armor. i've never had difficulty winning the fights, the net is just really strong with the debuffs it inflicts. also, the lash/cat-o-nine-tails allows you to grind whip experience too, for a whole $40 less, so get that instead (but i only get the lash after my first slave, i get the dagger first to grind regular combat experience -- maybe i should try just doing the lash instead one day). come to think of it, i probably shouldn't be getting the dagger at all -- you can get combat experience up to D- even from losing, so i should just throw myself at the arena until i get there.


this type of thing works after the first three slaves, but before then you can't really hope to train up an assistant like that without going broke. isabella is never a factor for me in this routing since you only get her after you move out of the slums. also, it only really works temporarily -- once the moneylender starts charging you slum rent, it's way less effective so you have to refocus slave training again.



that's because of the daily limit on taming (the exact formula is dynslave_rate['instinct'] += max(0, min(6 - slave['ego'], max(2, master_supermacy/2), daily_bonus['instinct']))), but like i said, the thick rings should bypass that. the code looks like this:
Code:
        ! Heavy rings instinct bonus and mood penalty
        tmp = 0
        !if $dynslave['earrings'] = 'heavy_gauge_rings': tmp += 0
        if $dynslave['tongue'] = 'heavy_gauge_rings': tmp += 2 &! no effect alone; combine with navel, clit or nose ring for +1 instinct
        if $dynslave['nipplerings'] = 'heavy_gauge_rings': tmp += 3 &! +1 instinct alone; inferior to nipple chain which gives +1; slot uses 2 rings (slightly cheaper than nipple chain)
        if $dynslave['navel'] = 'heavy_gauge_rings': tmp += 1 &! no effect alone; combine with tongue or clit for +1 instinct
        if $dynslave['clitring'] = 'heavy_gauge_rings': tmp += 2 &! no effect alone; combine with navel, tongue or nose ring for +1 instinct
        if dynslave['nose_piercing'] = 1: tmp += 1 &! no effect alone; combine with tongue or clit for +1 instinct
        dynslave_rate['instinct'] += tmp / 3 &! up to +3 instinct rate if 5 rings are worn in tongue, nipples, navel, clitoris and slave has a nose ring
        dynslave_rate['mood'] -= tmp &! at most -0.9 mood (at most -0.8 without nose piercing)
        killvar 'tmp'
note that the code increases instinct rate directly, instead of contributing to daily_bonus['instinct']. instinct is the in-code internal variable name for taming.


oh, shoot, i didn't realize you were starting with stats -- all my routing is around a 0-stat 200-spark start. starting with 400 sparks instead of 200 is huge, so i'd prioritize that. gives you way more wiggle room with the first two slaves, or maybe even lets you get away with just training a D+ gladiatrix for bullhorn from the very start. i don't think you should start in any of the great houses, it's not hard to build up reputation and join a house once you move out of the slums. slummaxxing is an extremely powerful strategy for the first 200 days, because the moneylender doesn't charge you slum rent until day 200. don't invest anything in libido, you'll lose it from not having sex and being pent up gives you a mood penalty. i'd probably invest in B+ strength and B+ dominance first and foremost, you can maintain B+ strength with $5 pub food and B+ dominance would be huge for early-game aura. A+ magic seems pointless to me, spells are way too expensive early game and it's one of the easiest skills to grind. getting from F- to D- just costs $30 once you can afford it (15 failed auspex casts), and after that magna magnifika will let you grind mage experience over time. i don't think i'd invest in torture skill either, it's not too hard to grind and having low torture skill doesn't really have any major detriments if you're careful with bruising. i'd probably keep B+ teaching, B+ stewardship, and B+ artistry -- that's a lot of skill training you wouldn't otherwise have access to, and it lets you train the assistant and artist specializations even from the slums. there's 3 minor residents looking for a D+ assistant, which would be massive early game (and possibly easier than training a gladiatrix, since there's no requirements on temperament or nature for the specialization). i might even bump medic skill from A+ to S+ -- it seems really powerful to just have that from the start, since you could get away with not healing slave wounds at the medical center, and you could use calculated portions from the start to save on food. if there's any points left you could get B+ hand skill, for the synergy that allows you to heal bruises by medic skill through the sensual massage reward (though that doesn't really impact D- slave training, since slaves only accept massages as a reward when they have enough obedience to reach D+)



edit: i decided to play around with the custom start to see how many points there actually were, and i think i'd distribute them like this: View attachment 4833820
instead of increasing medic skill to S+, i decided it would be better to increase dominance and teaching to A+, since that would have much more early-game impact. i might try a run like this, just to see how it compares to a 0-stat start.
Wouldn’t the extra $17 be worth it on the collar? The extra style and exoticism boost the sale price right? Is this not how I should be trying to sell early game? If not who should I be targeting? The dozen people in the residence sections of the different districts? Selling directly to shops? Or maybe taking the guild contracts. I haven’t done any of those because the offered value was so low. I have heard the guild offered bonuses for quick completion of the task, but I’m dubious about just how large the boost is and if it’s enough to make it worth it over selling on the auction. Do the shops or residents offer bonuses like that, or is it just the flat rate they mention when you talk to them? Is there ever a situation where selling to the auction doesn’t net you more than selling to the guild, shop, or resident?

I noticed adding more and more taming things didn’t actually seem to help but had no idea how to increase it. If the heavy rings help get around this then great. Also you mentioned that the cap would normally be 2 early on, does that mean it would increase over the course of the game? I’m pretty sure starting with f dominance and charisma and such has me limited to 1 per day. What affects the taming rate cap, just dominance maybe or others? I saw you posted the code except for the formula but I don’t know how to read it. I do have minimal coding experience with c#’s predecessor visual basic. But even if I understand an if than else statement i don’t know the terminology like dynaslave, tmp, instinct, killvar that the programmer of this game uses.

my general plan was to start with the first house since it’s only 5 points. On day 9 I revoke the contract and get sent to the slums and I don’t have to pay for rent that week. I duno what that does to the 1 or 200 day timer till you start getting charged in the slums. I actually haven’t done any house rep grinding or fully understand it. I read on the wiki I believe that if you become a patrician of one of the houses it locks out the others, but I duno what it means by that vs just getting enough rep to rent a home. Do I get a say in this, or is it something where if I keep selling slaves to the camera guys after the last slave that pushes me over I just auto lock out everything else without even a popup warning me? The fear of that happening has kept me from touching faction rep in my first play through. In my first playthrough I started in the outcasts and stopped there after getting the bull ring, snake necklace and around 40k in currency. At that point I figured it was time to bump the difficulty but there are still mechanics I didn’t engage with at all.

What even does torcher affect? My understanding was it prevented injuries from punishments but I duno which specific punishments it applies to. The torcher unit seems a give but I’ve never used it. Would it affect the injuries you get from teaching the slave stuff outa the fetishism tab? What about basic punishments like spanking, flogging, battering, or bondage? Don’t recall bondage or spanking ever inflicting injuries though. I figured if it was tied only to the torcher unit and torcher instruments that I’ve never used I might as well level it up as high as I can so it won’t be stuck at F-C forever. if I’m wrong here I’m open to totally changing my view on that. You’ve mostly changed my view on the magic stat though I’m still on the fence about burning $5 a day for casting the aura boosting spell to level it up. Duno how long this would have to go on till it went from D to S. maybe a few hundred days? Is 2 habit a day instead of 1 the only boost a magic brand has over a ink one? Normally I don’t ink brand the slave for a while for the same reason I avoid piercings. The mood debuff is rough in the first 10 days or so when you’re already fighting the mood debuff from trying to get them to accept their new life. Finally the wiki mentioned iron branding helps with cow training but didn’t go into any details of the consequences for majorly scarring your slave with that brand.

I never fully understood the medic stat for the slaver. Intuitively I would expect it to help me heal up slaves, but I duno if that’s true or not and if so what it even works on. I’m pretty sure I’ve noticed a difference in how long bruises take to recover, but I duno about injuries or illnesses. Normally I pay the $3 for the spa after a gladiator match to get the stamina a bit closer to zero instead of deep in the negative, and I read on the wiki messages help with healing. Beyond that… duno. Also does it do anything to help with healing the slavers injuries after fighting in the fog? The strength lost per day from that seemed so large I always just paid for the medical center to fix me up in my first play through.

had a lot of stuff come up so haven’t had time to sit down and play in the last week. Appreciate the pointers as I theory craft through this to understand how these actually affect the behind the scenes mechanics.
 
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Wouldn’t the extra $17 be worth it on the collar? The extra style and exoticism boost the sale price right? Is this not how I should be trying to sell early game? If not who should I be targeting? The dozen people in the residence sections of the different districts? Selling directly to shops? Or maybe taking the guild contracts. I haven’t done any of those because the offered value was so low. I have heard the guild offered bonuses for quick completion of the task, but I’m dubious about just how large the boost is and if it’s enough to make it worth it over selling on the auction. Do the shops or residents offer bonuses like that, or is it just the flat rate they mention when you talk to them? Is there ever a situation where selling to the auction doesn’t net you more than selling to the guild, shop, or resident?
the $17 is worth it if you’re going to sell the slave to anyone other than the guild -- the reason i said it wasn’t worth it was because in my routing (from 0 stats and 200 sparks), the first slave 100% has to be a guild contract. if you’re going to make your first slave a D+ slave to be sold to a minor resident, it could be worth it if you can manage your finances well. to be completely honest, i don’t really sell slaves to shopkeepers at all because they all have custom requirements, but i might look through them more carefully some time to see if any of them would be viable early.

as for the auction question, i think it’s more worth selling to minor residents directly when the rank matches (ie D+, C+, and B+), because it usually lets you have higher throughput -- training a slave with a particular customer in mind means you don’t have to waste time on any of the skills/stats they aren’t looking for, which allows you to sell them faster and get your money faster. it also allows you to work towards getting a house. once you start making S+ slaves though, the auction is generally better (and there’s a very limited number of npcs buying slaves directly at A- and above anyway)

I noticed adding more and more taming things didn’t actually seem to help but had no idea how to increase it. If the heavy rings help get around this then great. Also you mentioned that the cap would normally be 2 early on, does that mean it would increase over the course of the game? I’m pretty sure starting with f dominance and charisma and such has me limited to 1 per day. What affects the taming rate cap, just dominance maybe or others? I saw you posted the code except for the formula but I don’t know how to read it. I do have minimal coding experience with c#’s predecessor visual basic. But even if I understand an if than else statement i don’t know the terminology like dynaslave, tmp, instinct, killvar that the programmer of this game uses.
the exact code isn’t too important, it’s basically just saying that you can get up to +3 taming if you have heavy rings in every piercing slot (except earrings, which don’t make a difference) and the nose ring piercing.
as for the regular cap from clothing, two things impact it: the slave’s nature, and your aura (master_supremacy is aura). if a slave has S+ nature, their taming cap is 0, A+ it’s 1, B+ it’s 2, C+ it’s 3… you get the idea. however, you can only take advantage of caps above 2 if your aura is high enough. you need at least 6 aura for C-, 8 for D-, and 10 for F-. a lot of things affect aura, including dominance, personality, strength, and what artifacts you’re wearing (bull ring, snake talisman, dragon fire staff, etc). it’ll raise over time, so not worth worrying about explicitly. 2 is usually more than enough if you use the heavy rings anyway.

my general plan was to start with the first house since it’s only 5 points. On day 9 I revoke the contract and get sent to the slums and I don’t have to pay for rent that week. I duno what that does to the 1 or 200 day timer till you start getting charged in the slums. I actually haven’t done any house rep grinding or fully understand it. I read on the wiki I believe that if you become a patrician of one of the houses it locks out the others, but I duno what it means by that vs just getting enough rep to rent a home. Do I get a say in this, or is it something where if I keep selling slaves to the camera guys after the last slave that pushes me over I just auto lock out everything else without even a popup warning me? The fear of that happening has kept me from touching faction rep in my first play through. In my first playthrough I started in the outcasts and stopped there after getting the bull ring, snake necklace and around 40k in currency. At that point I figured it was time to bump the difficulty but there are still mechanics I didn’t engage with at all.
oh, leaving on day 9 is a good idea, that way you could get isabella too. it won’t affect the 200 day timer, it triggers based on the game day rather than how much time you’ve spent in the slums. as for faction rep, you only become a patrician if you sell a slave to the head of the great house. the way reputation works is it ranges from 0 to 5, and to go up a level you have to sell a slave to a resident of the area one level higher than the previous reputation level. at the start, selling any slave to any resident increases rep to 1, then selling a C+ or B+ slave increases it to 2, then a B+ slave increases it to 3. after that, you’ll be reputable enough to enter that quarter’s big scary private area that you were never able to enter before, and see like 3 more people who want higher rank slaves with more specific requirements. you have to sell a slave to one of them to reach rank 4 reputation, and only then are you allowed to talk to the leader of the house and get a chance to sell a slave to them. selling a slave to them allows you to become a patrician of that house, but this doesn’t lock you out of much. you can still gain reputation up to 4 in other districts (except maybe the rival district of the one you became a patrician of? i haven’t played around with that much so i’m not sure), and you can even sell slaves to the leaders of other great houses -- you just can’t become a patrician twice, so all you’ll get is money from them.

What even does torcher affect? My understanding was it prevented injuries from punishments but I duno which specific punishments it applies to. The torcher unit seems a give but I’ve never used it. Would it affect the injuries you get from teaching the slave stuff outa the fetishism tab? What about basic punishments like spanking, flogging, battering, or bondage? Don’t recall bondage or spanking ever inflicting injuries though. I figured if it was tied only to the torcher unit and torcher instruments that I’ve never used I might as well level it up as high as I can so it won’t be stuck at F-C forever. if I’m wrong here I’m open to totally changing my view on that. You’ve mostly changed my view on the magic stat though I’m still on the fence about burning $5 a day for casting the aura boosting spell to level it up. Duno how long this would have to go on till it went from D to S. maybe a few hundred days? Is 2 habit a day instead of 1 the only boost a magic brand has over a ink one? Normally I don’t ink brand the slave for a while for the same reason I avoid piercings. The mood debuff is rough in the first 10 days or so when you’re already fighting the mood debuff from trying to get them to accept their new life. Finally the wiki mentioned iron branding helps with cow training but didn’t go into any details of the consequences for majorly scarring your slave with that brand.
looking through the code, the main thing the torture skill does as far as i can tell is make it so torture punishments take less energy from you. the way to increase torture skill is unintuitive -- you have to do tortures of greater severity than your skill level. so, if you have B+ torture skill, you have to do tortures of severity 4 or 5 to gain more experience. bondage is the same in this regard (and seems to have similar effects, mainly impacting energy use). they also both make certain sexual activities more effective at increasing arousal for the girls, but that’s a minor benefit. whipping skill, on the other hand, actually decreases the bruises slaves get from flagellation punishments, so it’s much more significant. it’s also much easier to raise, since you can grind it in the coliseum.

for the magic question - max level requires 600 magic exp, or 600 spells cast. that would be 600 days of magna magnifika, but in the mid game and late game you’re also going to be casting spells like domini dictum, sententia veritas, and delikacia, which will make it go faster.

as for the brand, casting adverto servili has some benefits in and of itself (cures parasites, gives a big boost to energy, boosts devotion) but the brand itself only doubles the daily habit increase compared to other brands. it also allows you to track down an escaped slave that isn’t wearing a collar, but that’s a fringe benefit (why wouldn’t you have all your slaves collared by the time you have A+ magic skill?). there’s not much difference between the other types of brands -- as mentioned, a fire brand decreases resistance to cow training but that’s a fringe benefit. fire brand is free but costs energy, tattoo brand doesn’t cost energy but is $20. the tattoo brand decreases mood less than the fire brand, but both mood decreases are ultimately temporary and are (in my opinion) worth tanking while the slave is disobedient and gaining despair regardless. there are no long term consequences to any kind of brand other than what i’ve mentioned here (in fact, it’s even possible to cast adverto servili on a slave with a tattoo brand or fire brand to upgrade their brand).

I never fully understood the medic stat for the slaver. Intuitively I would expect it to help me heal up slaves, but I duno if that’s true or not and if so what it even works on. I’m pretty sure I’ve noticed a difference in how long bruises take to recover, but I duno about injuries or illnesses. Normally I pay the $3 for the spa after a gladiator match to get the stamina a bit closer to zero instead of deep in the negative, and I read on the wiki messages help with healing. Beyond that… duno. Also does it do anything to help with healing the slavers injuries after fighting in the fog? The strength lost per day from that seemed so large I always just paid for the medical center to fix me up in my first play through.
basically, the medic stat speeds up most forms of natural healing. if you give a slave a sensual massage when your hand skill is B+ or higher, medic skill partially heals her bruises. if your medic skill is A+ or higher, you can use the ‘calculated’ diet portion for no additional cost (otherwise it’s the ‘nutritionist’ diet portion and costs 5 extra sparks per day). if you have S+ medic skill, your slaves have no chance of dying when at F- endurance (but why would you let them get to that point anyway?). medic skill increases the natural recovery of your wounds, and your slaves’ wounds. if your medic skill is B+ or higher, you have a chance to detect pregnancy early if you own a stethoscope. if your medic skill is A+ or higher, fainted slaves with F- endurance or F- (bony) physique will recover endurance slightly faster (+1 endurance rate per day). if you have A+ medic skill or higher, a slave’s level of starvation will show on her traits. if you have B+ medic skill or higher, you can tell when you or a slave is ill or pregnant with a parasite (if you own a stethoscope) (the illness checking is particularly useful for training coprophagia). as far as i can tell, this is an exhaustive list based on using ctrl+f to find all occurrences of master_medic in the code. notably, the medic skill does not increase the rate at which bruises heal (it only helps actively heal them faster with a sensual massage).

also, i usually just heal myself and the slaves at the technosphere. natural healing causes scarring in slaves, and being injured decreases daily energy recovery and mood. once you’re past the early game, i think it’s worth just paying to avoid those drawbacks, especially the drawback of reduced energy recovery, since it’s also worth paying for things that increase energy per day (like drugs and the spa).

had a lot of stuff come up so haven’t had time to sit down and play in the last week. Appreciate the pointers as I theory craft through this to understand how these actually affect the behind the scenes mechanics.
thanks, i really like doing these writeups. i think i’ve probably spent more time looking through this game’s code and theorycrafting than actually playing the game. the more i look at it, the more i can tell how much thought went into balancing these numbers.
 
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House of Rahl

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May 10, 2025
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i never understood slaver aura. yeah it did seems to go up over time but even if i rush to S in every stat i'll get a brand new slave and it will tell me the slave has similar aura to me or in come cases even slightly more. and i'm just like, how is that even possible? i can't raise my stats any higher. what do you want me to do about it game?

here's an example of my slaver on day 420.
1747308204286.png


and here is a brand new slave with a stronger aura than me
1747308445144.png

and finally here's isabella who's been around for 400ish days and has basically S rank in everything i had access to at the time. also has a stronger aura.
1747308872003.png

finally picked up a random 3rd slave same day just to have a day 0 slave to show off and this was the first offered in the auction.
1747308945061.png

everyone of them is weaker than me objectively, except maybe isabella who is a solid S rank. yet the game is convinced they just all have stronger aura's than me. not considerably stronger, but still stronger. id argue if these random untrained slaves are stronger, isabella should be considerably stronger than me but on that specific save file i'm already at an A+ average with multiple aura boosting pieces of equipment. i've read through the aura section in the wiki several times but just boosting the slavers skills seems insufficient.
 
May 5, 2020
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i never understood slaver aura. yeah it did seems to go up over time but even if i rush to S in every stat i'll get a brand new slave and it will tell me the slave has similar aura to me or in come cases even slightly more. and i'm just like, how is that even possible? i can't raise my stats any higher. what do you want me to do about it game?

here's an example of my slaver on day 420.
View attachment 4840726


and here is a brand new slave with a stronger aura than me
View attachment 4840740

and finally here's isabella who's been around for 400ish days and has basically S rank in everything i had access to at the time. also has a stronger aura.
View attachment 4840751

finally picked up a random 3rd slave same day just to have a day 0 slave to show off and this was the first offered in the auction.
View attachment 4840756

everyone of them is weaker than me objectively, except maybe isabella who is a solid S rank. yet the game is convinced they just all have stronger aura's than me. not considerably stronger, but still stronger. id argue if these random untrained slaves are stronger, isabella should be considerably stronger than me but on that specific save file i'm already at an A+ average with multiple aura boosting pieces of equipment. i've read through the aura section in the wiki several times but just boosting the slavers skills seems insufficient.
so, here's what the aura calculation code is:
Code:
dynamic $replace("
    master_supermacy = (master_cha + master_domination + master_style + master_str + dynslave['beaten_ever'] + magna_magnifika + item_supermacy_bonus) - (dynslave['temper'] + dynslave['ego'] + dynslave['pride'] + dynslave['stamina'] + (dynslave['intellect'] - 3))
    if $master_cloth = 'regal_suit': master_supermacy += 1
    if $master_cloth = 'comfy_robes': master_supermacy -= 1
    if $master_back_wpn = 'посох_огня': master_supermacy += 2

    ! lolis are easier to dominate.  Uncle Tom is particularly good at it, and it’s easier for Johny to pick on someone smaller than him
    if dynslave['age'] = CONST_INT['loli_age']:
        master_supermacy += 2
        if hero_select = 5:  master_supermacy += 3  &! Teacher
        if hero_select = 9:  master_supermacy += 8  &! Old Man
        if hero_select = 10: master_supermacy += 1  &! Kid
    end
    if dynslave['age'] = CONST_INT['milf_age']:
        if hero_select = 8:  master_supermacy += 2  &! Butler
        if hero_select = 9:  master_supermacy -= 1  &! Old Man
    end
    if dynslave['age'] = CONST_INT['young_age']:
        if hero_select = 5:  master_supermacy += 2  &! Teacher
    end
", 'dyn'+'slave', iif(slave_state > CONST_INT['no_slave'], 'slave', 'assistant'))
let's calculate your slaver's aura based on the screenshot. 'base aura' is your personality + domination + allure + strength, which, based on your screenshot, is 2 + 5 + 3 + 3 = 13. you're also wearing the snake talisman and bull ring, each of which give +1 aura, bringing you to 15 aura. i'll assume you've beaten your slave before, and aren't using magna magnifika, which would put your aura at 16. i'll also assume you're not playing as any of the slavers that get aura bonuses for specific ages of slave.

now, the slave's aura is subtracted from this. slave aura is based on temperament, nature, pride, endurance, and intelligence, and it starts at -3 compared to your base of 0. this new slave, 'emily', has pretty high stats in that regard -- her aura is 4 + 4 + 4 + 4 + 5 - 3 = 18, which is greater than yours. isabella about the same -- 5 + 5 + 0 + 5 + 5 - 3 = 17. and that brand new slave? 4 + 4 + 5 + 4 + 5 - 3 = 19, the highest of all of them. the key here is that your aura is based on your slave's stats, not their skills or devotion or anything. confusingly, it's also completely unrelated to the "aura" line showed in anatomy (which is based on your slave's devotion, despair, and spoilage, none of which impact the calculation of if your aura is stronger than or weaker than your slave's). for emily, the aura difference is -2, for isabella it's -1, for the brand new slave it's -3. this explains why, for example, your slaves' taming from items is stuck at 2, and why it's harder for them to gain and keep taming (if they have more aura than you, they lose taming every night proportional to their nature, unless they're scared enough (eg a slave with A+ nature needs at least 2 fear to not lose taming overnight).

if you want to get your aura up, here's what i'd recommend. the most important thing is casting magna magnifika -- you have A+ mage skill, so it'll give you +8 aura. it's worth it even at D+ mage skill when it gives +2 aura in my opinion, and it's relatively cheap (50 sparks per week) once you get enough money per slave that you can afford to make no sales for a few decades to get the bull ring and snake talisman. you should basically be casting magna magnifika every day once you can afford it, until you get the raven crown (which does it automatically for free). when your mage skill is low, though, there are a few other things you should be doing. mainly, you should have irresistible allure at basically all times. the spa can help with this, you want to get cosmetic procedures every 10 days and a haircut every 30 days (average of 6 sparks per week, very affordable). you also want to generally be wearing the fashionable attire when you aren't skill training, fighting, or casting a spell. if you can, you should also get your strength up to A+ -- this is the least convenient option, but it will increase both your allure (+1 when strictly above B+, i believe) and your aura, and it shouldnt be too hard to maintain in the slums (one combat in the coliseum per day to counteract the lacking B+ pub food, which will only cost half a spark of energy with the bull ring).
 
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Okjjnk

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May 14, 2025
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Hey, I have a few questions about slave training mechanics. Should the training approach completely change depending on the slaves’ temperament and personality? Also, is it always a good idea to turn both Pride and Nature green, no matter what? What’s the best way to handle Temperament when it’s high vs when it’s low? And I honestly have no clue how Empathy works — any tips? Thanks!
 
May 5, 2020
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Hey, I have a few questions about slave training mechanics. Should the training approach completely change depending on the slaves’ temperament and personality? Also, is it always a good idea to turn both Pride and Nature green, no matter what? What’s the best way to handle Temperament when it’s high vs when it’s low? And I honestly have no clue how Empathy works — any tips? Thanks!
nature and temperament both affect how resistant/defiant slaves are in general, so it's good to have them low at the start of training, but high when you want to sell. nature also impacts resistance to spells (higher nature = more resistance). pride you want to have low no matter what, though. empathy impacts how much despair, fear, and taming slaves get from punishments (lower empathy = less despair/fear/taming), and how much arousal they generally get (higher empathy = more arousal, which often means easier sex skill training). slaves with less empathy have more 'stable' moods (it's harder to make their mood go down from punishments, but also harder to raise it with rewards)

what your 'training approach' should be depends on your slaver's stats and resources, not just the slave's stats. if you have a high aura you can get away with training a disobedient slave that has high temperament and nature, but it'll be harder/slower than training a slave with lower mind stats.
 
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Okjjnk

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nature and temperament both affect how resistant/defiant slaves are in general, so it's good to have them low at the start of training, but high when you want to sell. nature also impacts resistance to spells (higher nature = more resistance). pride you want to have low no matter what, though. empathy impacts how much despair, fear, and taming slaves get from punishments (lower empathy = less despair/fear/taming), and how much arousal they generally get (higher empathy = more arousal, which often means easier sex skill training). slaves with less empathy have more 'stable' moods (it's harder to make their mood go down from punishments, but also harder to raise it with rewards)

what your 'training approach' should be depends on your slaver's stats and resources, not just the slave's stats. if you have a high aura you can get away with training a disobedient slave that has high temperament and nature, but it'll be harder/slower than training a slave with lower mind stats.
Ah, thanks.
So for quick selling, I should buy slaves with low nature, temperament, and pride.
As for empathy... hmm, it's a bit tricky.
Maybe I should just adjust my training method based on whatever value they have?
 
May 5, 2020
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Ah, thanks.
So for quick selling, I should buy slaves with low nature, temperament, and pride.
As for empathy... hmm, it's a bit tricky.
Maybe I should just adjust my training method based on whatever value they have?
yeah, in the early game low stats are preferable. high endurance and high intelligence are still good (more endurance = more energy per day = more training per day, more intelligence = less training sessions to level up skills), but the others aren't very valuable/important when you're training slaves between D- and C+. at B- and above, when you're focusing more heavily on devotion, that's when you wanna have high temperament and nature again. nature can be hard to raise above B+, but temperament is easy.

do note, however, that if a slave's nature, temperament, and pride are all very low, they will be mindbroken, which is generally bad as the only way to fix that is by increasing their nature (the hardest stat to increase). the game will warn you in the slave's traits if they're at risk for this though ('at risk' meaning if they lose a level on any of those stats they'll be mindbroken)
 
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aumhs

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Dec 5, 2022
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To add to the mindbroken risk: I recommend only buying slaves that would not break if their pride goes to 0, meaning nature and temperament should add to at least 3 (but not much more for easy early training in early game).
 
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House of Rahl

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May 10, 2025
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any tips on charisma? i know the snake necklace helped me a ton when i finally got that on my first and second play throughs. but the first one, i held steady around C or B for awhile. maybe 200+ days? and then outa nowhere it just tanked to F. at the time i was on normal difficulty and in the outskirts renting.

reading through the wiki i think it might have been tied to me bumping up my brand rank inadvertently by finding the slave fights and races as the only supplemental income and going all in on those. beyond just moving to better apartments and paying more to offset the increased fame is there an easy answer to this, especially if you happen to be living in the slums where that's just not feasible.

To add to the mindbroken risk: I recommend only buying slaves that would not break if their pride goes to 0, meaning nature and temperament should add to at least 3 (but not much more for easy early training in early game).
i've mostly stuck to slaves with temperament B+ so i could throw the boots on em to keep it from ever falling. so long as temperament remains at S or maybe A they can't mind break even if the other two stats hit F.
 
May 5, 2020
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any tips on charisma? i know the snake necklace helped me a ton when i finally got that on my first and second play throughs. but the first one, i held steady around C or B for awhile. maybe 200+ days? and then outa nowhere it just tanked to F. at the time i was on normal difficulty and in the outskirts renting.

reading through the wiki i think it might have been tied to me bumping up my brand rank inadvertently by finding the slave fights and races as the only supplemental income and going all in on those. beyond just moving to better apartments and paying more to offset the increased fame is there an easy answer to this, especially if you happen to be living in the slums where that's just not feasible.
so, here's what the personality code looks like:
Code:
if min(estate_quality_modifier, master_wealth) > master_cha + house_mess: master_cha_rate += 1 &! estate_quality_modifier is calculated in $newloc, house_mess will be zero if someone cleaned
if master_cha > min(master_wealth - 1, estate_quality_modifier): master_cha_rate -= 1 &! personality diminishes if standard of living [0,6] or estate quality is inadequate - ImperatorAugustus
if snake_amulet_on = 1 and master_cha < 3: master_cha_rate += 1 &! quest artifact passively raises personality up to B+, countering the penalty for low standard of living or estate quality
the snake amulet comment is a bit misleading because it actually only raises personality to 39, which is still C- (but one point below B+). the key thing, however, is that the estate quality modifier is calculated like this:
Code:
estate_quality = estate_prestige[$estate] + interior_prestige[$study] + interior_prestige[$bed] + interior_prestige[$bath] + interior_prestige[$kitchen] + interior_prestige[$boudoir] + interior_prestige[$dungeon] + interior_prestige[$lab]
estate_quality_modifier = estate_quality - brand_reputation
this means that you can only have S+ personality and S+ brand reputation if you live in korvus or white town with full luxury decorations (that's the only way to get estate quality to 10, with the cap being 11 if you live in white town). but if you do have B+ brand reputation (which i thiiiink is the max you can get from winning races, after that it stops increasing from wins), that means you need to have at least 6 estate quality to maintain B+ personality instead of C-, so it's possible your apartment didn't have enough luxury decorations and that's why your personality started to decrease.


i've mostly stuck to slaves with temperament B+ so i could throw the boots on em to keep it from ever falling. so long as temperament remains at S or maybe A they can't mind break even if the other two stats hit F.
you can get away with temperament at B+ and pride/nature at 0 (you get the sanity warning but she doesn't mindbreak unless temperament goes to C-), which is convenient for keeping a cow
 

RedGreen3

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Apr 13, 2020
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Why does rubbing have no images? I always get the same default image. I know there was some debate about it being too close to titjob, but I think it might be closer to massaging. One of the later lesson texts mentions oil slipping.
 
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