- May 25, 2022
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Who do I see about reserving a seat at the dunces table?For every theorycrafter there are 20 of us dunces, you're in good company friend. Feel free to join us over at the dunce table.
Who do I see about reserving a seat at the dunces table?For every theorycrafter there are 20 of us dunces, you're in good company friend. Feel free to join us over at the dunce table.
Hmmm.Not sure if joking, but let's go down that rabbit hole.
The Persona series has been cited by Selebus as an influence on the game. For anyone who was unaware, the modern Persona games feature high school students in their second year going through some form of rite of passage into adulthood. They use the Tarot Arcana to symbolize the stages of passage from the innocence of youth (The Fool) to the maturity of adulthood, and each of the people the The Fool meets on his journey symbolizes a step on that passage. There are usually 20 Arcana in the initial version of the game, though the enhanced release may add some additional Arcana. But 20 Arcana for 20 Main Girls may be relevant.
Persona 3 is a game about accepting your own mortality. Persona 4 is a story about overcoming your insecurities. Persona 5 is a game about moving past your personal trauma -- which seems particularly appropriate for LiL.
The game takes place in both the "normal" and "shadow" world, though the nature of the shadow world varies by game. In 3, the shadow world is a localized distortion centered around a single location that only exists in a period of time that most cannot percieve (the 25th hour), in 4, it is a "TV Realm" literally entered by passing through a TV screen (note: thsi game came out before TVs got as large as they are today, and finding a TV large enough to fit a person through was still a bit of a challenge), and in 5 the shadow world is the world of cognition-- or Perception, but as it exists in a collective sense.
When a character is in the shadow world, they might awaken a Persona -- a spiritual being (drawn from religion or literature, usually) who grants them incredible power. at this moment, their outfit changes to reflect their awakened state. Ayane is wearing the costume of Ann Takamaki, a model who is being sexually harassed by a teacher at her school. Her refusal of his advances causes the teacher to rape her best friend, who then tries to kill herself by jumping off the roof of the school. Ann's arc is driven by her sense of guilt towards what happens to her friend, her dealing with rumors (spread by the teacher) that she was sleeping with said teacher, and a desire to not be seen as just a model anymore.
A whole lot of that is really, REALLY on the nose.
Ann is the Lover Arcana, which seems appropriate for Ayane as well.
Other characters in the game include:
Futaba Sakura, a redheaded Otaku recluse who blames herself for her mother's death (Molly?). She is the Hermit Arcana, which is less appropriate for Molly (Yumi would be a better candidate)
Makoto Niijima, a studious Student Council President who blames herself for not seeing what was happening at her school sooner. Her Arcana is Priestess, which doesn't feel like a good fit for our Makoto (Noriko is a better fit), but the name and role overlapping likely isn't coincidence.
Haru Nokumura, an heiress who is slated to be married to the son of a company executive who is also an abusive prick, who feels abandoned by her father (Touka). Her Arcana is Empress, which also fits Touka (one of the first things listed on the Megami Tensei wiki for Empress is that it's associated with mothers, and we know how Akira feels about Touka)
Kinda just punching the nose over and over again, honestly.
I've known that Sel has cited Persona as an influence for some time, but I hadn't actually thought that much about LiL in terms of Persona or the Arcana.
An accurate representation of the amount of people in each:For every theorycrafter there are 20 of us dunces, you're in good company friend. Feel free to join us over at the dunce table.
Come to think of it, when reading a really interesting theory or the discussion of such a theory, I feel like during the scenes with the potted plants discussing what's happening and giving a few insights here and there. Like it's aAn accurate representation of the amount of people in each:
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I have yet to replay the game, I might do so during the next bigger break when Sel is having his vacation period.I skipped most of Chika's events and hated Yasu's "nonsense" during my first time. I barely knew who Chinami was as well: "why the hell is there a kid (with a dog mask) in this porn game?slipskip". And now I can quote random obscure lore fragments by heart![]()
Perhaps I should start wearing denim.
I only played Persona 4 but the whole tarot thing makes a lot of sense, actually, especially with Sel confirming he used the games as inspiration.So many possibilities. Who is Justice, or the Blasted Tower? Who is the Fool, or Death?
wheel of fortune is so cute oh my god! Death is funny, moon is creepy and temperance is accurate. The hanged man looks like it's an actual thing that might happenThe Tarot Card concept was tackled in the LiL Discord awhile back actually. Some really cool fanart spawned as a result of it:
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Strength is peak and may it someday happen.Also prince Miku is a thing i never expected yet would like to now seeThe Tarot Card concept was tackled in the LiL Discord awhile back actually. Some really cool fanart spawned as a result of it:
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We can only hopeThe hanged man looks like it's an actual thing that might happen![]()
Prince Miku is actually a reference to her costume from the second Halloween party:Also prince Miku is a thing i never expected yet would like to now see
The thing about the tarot is, more than anything, it’s basically a collection of symbols to meditate on. Like Rorsharch’s ink blots, they’re not so much about what they mean as what you see in them. So I guess it’s as red a herring as you think it is.Yeah, pretty sure that whole tarot card stick is just another red herring to confuse people.
The interpretation part is what let me believe it is. And also the thing that it is not really a thing inside of the game. Didnt read much off your discussion here, but it looks like this is something from discord? Pretty sure not even Sel is such an arse that he would hide important information in his discord. Inside the game? Inside the code? Inside the soundtrack? Oh yes, that would be pretty much on point. But not more.The thing about the tarot is, more than anything, it’s basically a collection of symbols to meditate on. Like Rorsharch’s ink blots, they’re not so much about what they mean as what you see in them. So I guess it’s as red a herring as you think it is.
It's more of a thought experiment than anything else. In the persona series, each character is tied to a Tarot Arcana that helps contextualize their character archetype and narrative arc, and Sel has indicated that Persona is one of the game's influences, and we now have a preview of Ayane dressed as a Persona character.The interpretation part is what let me believe it is. And also the thing that it is not really a thing inside of the game. Didnt read much off your discussion here, but it looks like this is something from discord? Pretty sure not even Sel is such an arse that he would hide important information in his discord. Inside the game? Inside the code? Inside the soundtrack? Oh yes, that would be pretty much on point. But not more.
I just like funny looking picture cards.Man i have to replay the old persona games huh.The thing about the tarot is, more than anything, it’s basically a collection of symbols to meditate on. Like Rorsharch’s ink blots, they’re not so much about what they mean as what you see in them. So I guess it’s as red a herring as you think it is.
I 100%’d it, and comparing it to the other versions of P3, I say go for it. It’s by far the definitive way to play Persona 3. There’s no FeMC or The Answer expansion, but apparently the latter is coming as DLC? I dunno, I haven’t kept up with that.Off-topic but has any of you guys played the remaster of P3?Ive been thinking of buying it recently and im curious to know if it holds up(I also dont trust reddit)
The Answer is being added in the form of a DLC pack called Episode Aigis, and the release date is (does some googling)....tomorrow.I 100%’d it, and comparing it to the other versions of P3, I say go for it. It’s by far the definitive way to play Persona 3. There’s no FeMC or The Answer expansion, but apparently the latter is coming as DLC? I dunno, I haven’t kept up with that.
But yeah. It’s a solid experience.
I 100%’d it, and comparing it to the other versions of P3, I say go for it. It’s by far the definitive way to play Persona 3. There’s no FeMC or The Answer expansion, but apparently the latter is coming as DLC? I dunno, I haven’t kept up with that.
But yeah. It’s a solid experience.
Much loveThe Answer is being added in the form of a DLC pack called Episode Aigis, and the release date is (does some googling)....tomorrow.