- Jun 16, 2018
- 150
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Me playing the Halloween update
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Is there a way to step a ren'py game forward scene by scene, ignore auto-advance commands?
There's a lot of flash scenes that I'd like to 'pause' on, then advance to the next scene, similar to how you can advance a video frame-by-frame.
There's a lot of flash scenes that I'd like to 'pause' on, then advance to the next scene, similar to how you can advance a video frame-by-frame.
I don't see how Tsuneyo was acting out of character. "Tsuneyo is deeply protective of people and willing to enact violence in their defense" is something we've seen in her dialogue many times, and in just the last patch she confronted Sensei and Yuki with a knife in her hand. Is it because Tsuneyo shouldn't know about sex? Cause, like, yeah, she started out ignorant about sex, but it has been established in multiple events that other people have told her about it and she knows how it works now. Here's an excerpt from Blackout, for instance:
Like, forget the Denpa thing, I just straight up have no problem accepting that this is the Tsuneyo we've seen and gotten to know for a long time now.
(I also don't think any of Ami/Ayane/Noriko are one-dimensional or interchangeable with one another, but that's an argument that's harder to have because it's about impressions built up over the course of the game, whereas the Tsuneyo thing is very specific and clear-cut from my perspective.)
Like, forget the Denpa thing, I just straight up have no problem accepting that this is the Tsuneyo we've seen and gotten to know for a long time now.
(I also don't think any of Ami/Ayane/Noriko are one-dimensional or interchangeable with one another, but that's an argument that's harder to have because it's about impressions built up over the course of the game, whereas the Tsuneyo thing is very specific and clear-cut from my perspective.)
- Jan 16, 2018
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Alot of interesting discussion these last couple pages.
I agree with most of what Coar73 and DonTirri have said.
Most of the characters are very shallow, but the quality of the writing of the interactions themselves, and the atmosphere, has made up for it for most of the game's life.
(And this game could be half as good as it is and still be the best written "porn game" I have played by far)
I say 'atmosphere' and not just writing/humor because the special effects (both visual and auditory) and especially the better music pieces add so much it carries the story in places.
Whilst replaying this game the past few days I have also been reading the renpy script and it gives a totally different feel.
You start to see just how 'accommodating' to Sensei even a character like Yumi is.
(Perhaps this will change after this Halloween and Tsuneyo can be the first person who truly hates Sensei)
...
Yeah, Maya, Yumi and Sana have been my favs. I like Yasu too but yes she is very one note.
Chika is more believable than Sana. So that's Sensei, Maya, Yumi, and Chika as the most human characters.
...
In regards to 'desensitization' it is more or less the biggest threat to the game.
I have heard people in the thread say this game is going to go on for years more. How?
You can only have dramatic situations happen so many times before they have no effect
(or worse; a negative "oh this again" effect).
Already, I am surprisingly desensitized and surely this is affecting others.
That's part of the reason I am replaying; to see if the writing was different around the time I thought the game was 'at its best' (around 13.0 if I remember correctly) or if it is just me getting desensitized/bored.
Thankfully this doesn't have to be solved by just shortening the game and keeping the action rising in a more dramatic way.
This game is "about being happy" and has said many surface level things in regard to that.
They are over the range from "there is nothing" to how great it is to be alive (though usually negative).
Perhaps things could start slowly settling in on an 'answer', or at least getting some new meat in that area.
Anyway, point is that things can advance in regards to plot, the philosophy, or the horror.
It'd give the greatest effect if they all rose together playing off each other and working together towards a great and horrible payoff with well written unique charactherswe can't get enough of...
but really my biggest concern with this game is that it just keeps doing 'this', spoiling the momentum.
(Shit, if I were Selebus that's what I'd do. Can't fault anyone for taking that kind of cheddar over making a story work out faster and more dramatically. Still, if it is too slow those supporters will lose interest.)
This is not an immediate threat. I'm a 'crack head' so I'd say others probably have a couple months left before they start feeling the same.
I agree with most of what Coar73 and DonTirri have said.
Most of the characters are very shallow, but the quality of the writing of the interactions themselves, and the atmosphere, has made up for it for most of the game's life.
(And this game could be half as good as it is and still be the best written "porn game" I have played by far)
I say 'atmosphere' and not just writing/humor because the special effects (both visual and auditory) and especially the better music pieces add so much it carries the story in places.
Whilst replaying this game the past few days I have also been reading the renpy script and it gives a totally different feel.
You start to see just how 'accommodating' to Sensei even a character like Yumi is.
(Perhaps this will change after this Halloween and Tsuneyo can be the first person who truly hates Sensei)
...
Yeah, Maya, Yumi and Sana have been my favs. I like Yasu too but yes she is very one note.
Chika is more believable than Sana. So that's Sensei, Maya, Yumi, and Chika as the most human characters.
...
In regards to 'desensitization' it is more or less the biggest threat to the game.
I have heard people in the thread say this game is going to go on for years more. How?
You can only have dramatic situations happen so many times before they have no effect
(or worse; a negative "oh this again" effect).
Already, I am surprisingly desensitized and surely this is affecting others.
That's part of the reason I am replaying; to see if the writing was different around the time I thought the game was 'at its best' (around 13.0 if I remember correctly) or if it is just me getting desensitized/bored.
Thankfully this doesn't have to be solved by just shortening the game and keeping the action rising in a more dramatic way.
This game is "about being happy" and has said many surface level things in regard to that.
They are over the range from "there is nothing" to how great it is to be alive (though usually negative).
Perhaps things could start slowly settling in on an 'answer', or at least getting some new meat in that area.
Anyway, point is that things can advance in regards to plot, the philosophy, or the horror.
It'd give the greatest effect if they all rose together playing off each other and working together towards a great and horrible payoff with well written unique charactherswe can't get enough of...
but really my biggest concern with this game is that it just keeps doing 'this', spoiling the momentum.
(Shit, if I were Selebus that's what I'd do. Can't fault anyone for taking that kind of cheddar over making a story work out faster and more dramatically. Still, if it is too slow those supporters will lose interest.)
This is not an immediate threat. I'm a 'crack head' so I'd say others probably have a couple months left before they start feeling the same.
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- Feb 25, 2020
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Man dealing with this many girls is actually becoming mentally exhausting to play/read through. Sensei is being pulled in several directions now It doesn't surprise me that he is starting to lose it more and more. On a side note I almost didn't recognize Makoto in her Halloween costume she looked completely different...and hot
We know that Tsuneyo is repressing memories of sexual abuse; she was active in the Japanese kendo scene.
Yo if you're not having fun just quit. The last few updates have been me at my fuckin' PEAK and if you aren't feeling it just stop playing the game. I literally do not care about what you want and I never will. I'm having the time of my life and have not been happier with the state of this game since development started.
0.23.0 Part 1 Changelog:
- 87+ New Internal Monologues
- 16 New One Dimensional Characters
- 0 New Story Developments
- 1 Weird Religious Horror Event With No Ties To The Plot
- Maybe A Sex Scene Or Two Idk
- 14 Immersion Ruining Fourth Wall Breaks
- Ami Tries To Fuck Sensei Or Something
- 8,247,652,436,346 Words
- Raid Shadow Legends Joke
- Something Something Mental Illness
- Fixes/Changes For Older Content
0.23.0 Part 1 Changelog:
- 87+ New Internal Monologues
- 16 New One Dimensional Characters
- 0 New Story Developments
- 1 Weird Religious Horror Event With No Ties To The Plot
- Maybe A Sex Scene Or Two Idk
- 14 Immersion Ruining Fourth Wall Breaks
- Ami Tries To Fuck Sensei Or Something
- 8,247,652,436,346 Words
- Raid Shadow Legends Joke
- Something Something Mental Illness
- Fixes/Changes For Older Content
- Feb 10, 2021
- 741
- 1,359
What I want to know is why Tsuneyo knew the exact words sensei said on his "first day" meeting everyone.
Maybe there's something that explained it early on, but I'm not one of those people that have an eidetic memory and retains absolutely every last detail. I try to capture the frames from the flickering scenes and such to see what they say, but after a while of pressing page up and space a million times to see what is said in them, it just gets old. I'd very much like for there to be a new tool in renpy that lets you frame advance but I doubt there will ever be anything such as that. Honestly though, we see sensei really confront his emotions for the first time this update. I just wish I understood more what's going on in the background. I have my gripes with a lot of what happens honestly, but there's no doubt about the quality of the writing. It's cracked. The content is more or less the issue. But I'm capable of separating the two. I'm honestly just playing for the story more than anything. But I can see how others would have an issue with some of the things, going into this expecting a fap. This kinda thing isn't going to be something you can just swallow expecting a pure smut vn.
Maybe there's something that explained it early on, but I'm not one of those people that have an eidetic memory and retains absolutely every last detail. I try to capture the frames from the flickering scenes and such to see what they say, but after a while of pressing page up and space a million times to see what is said in them, it just gets old. I'd very much like for there to be a new tool in renpy that lets you frame advance but I doubt there will ever be anything such as that. Honestly though, we see sensei really confront his emotions for the first time this update. I just wish I understood more what's going on in the background. I have my gripes with a lot of what happens honestly, but there's no doubt about the quality of the writing. It's cracked. The content is more or less the issue. But I'm capable of separating the two. I'm honestly just playing for the story more than anything. But I can see how others would have an issue with some of the things, going into this expecting a fap. This kinda thing isn't going to be something you can just swallow expecting a pure smut vn.
It's not explained. It's a mystery to the player as well as to Sensei. There are some obvious explanations (like the resets memory editing people so that they think they've been in his class from the start) but nothing has been definitively established. You're meant to notice that and go "hey, that's weird."
Just open up the \game\images\misc folder, most of the shit that flashes up when there's static is there.
It really was like watching an oncoming head on collision and it was too late to do anything about it wasn't it?
I never play or read any denpa games/books are going haves different endings i like story don't get me wrong i just wondering if we going have happy ending after the first ending which i guess going be horrifying
I think most people, while being disgusted with the MC as a character, are still having fun, we kind of signed up for something twisted, that much was clear from the getgo.
We can't expect happy endings for any of these girls.
That's just not what this story is.. afterall. something in these time cycles drives the MC, like Makoto, to suicide.
- Sep 5, 2020
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Eventually, there will be a path for each girl, which should have a better outcome for that girl than the game's current trajectory would imply. After that, I think there were plans for a "true" ending (which in the fashion of most games with "true" endings, can only be unlocked after all the other endings).
A happy harem ending is not in the cards.
(multiple thoughts incoming, fair warning)
I don't really agree with your opinion on that. The scene starts off with a clear denial of a choice, and even before that his inner monologue had already "devolved" into way more.... not sure what the right word would be? instinctual? base?
Anyways even at the start of their conversation after the non-choice the game keeps breaking to "happy" type moments. Which I've always taken as one or more of the "gods" directly affecting things, or at least influencing them. So I find it odd that you say he's in control and not the gods. The things he talks about are things he probably wouldn't in any normal conversation, admitting stuff with Makoto for example.
What is your thoughts on the crossed out lines? Are they his own and he just decided to say something else instead?
I do think he's at least "present" in the scene, some of the lines are like his usual self, when he's giving advice for example.
Do you think the "Alterations" are from Sensei or the God/Gods? I honestly thought it was either another of the gods or Sensei being the "unknown force" that was stopping the costume being removed completely. At this point his speech is mostly shifting between whole sentences and that instinctual/base speech from before.
After the.... crash screen? whatever it ends up getting called. Sensei seems to legitimately be himself again. He seems confused but still connects the dots. "MOLLY LEAVES THE ROOM" seems to be another attempt to take control of the scene, only this time it doesn't work, Sensei is speaking regularly at this point too.
Not feeling things normally actually doesn't seem too out of the ordinary for Sensei, but him realizing it is a bit different at least. Is this the most .... "emotional?" we've seen Sensei at this point? The biggest part for me is the whole "I don't touch girls that don't want me to touch them" and yes I understand Miku's scenes, but this whole scenario had several differences to it.
I do find it interesting that Molly was talking about "..." dialogue choices in the games she plays and its at this point that's all Sensei has for the most part once Tsuneyo shows up. She even mentioned how it isn't an option.
If this scene was ALL Sensei, then yes all the hate is warranted and i'll join the torch/pitchfork line at the store. My own opinion though is that this wasn't all him, I still think it's more likely that one god caused him to act more impulsively, and another tried to undo things (with only some success). I don't think Sensei redressed her, I think it was rewound/reset to before it happened. Yes Molly was drunk, but her dialogue would still make sense if the scene was rewound/reset.
*note to alex* I do genuinely like some of your theories and agree with many, we just seem to have a different opinion on this one lol. It is a bit fun to debate things like this.
(sidenote that the negative image sure had the word "eyeball" alot, and one of the gods supposedly sees through the eyes of others. That's the one Yasu believes in right?)
- Jan 16, 2018
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I get you are responding to alot of people with this post,
and that some of them were toxic af and that colors your perception of anyone making any critique of your game,
but I feel the need to say/clarify some things anyway:
1. I love your game and wish you the best in regards to its development. Truly.
This is one of the few stories I currently give a shit about.
That being said, the kind of story you are writing is like threading a needle and there are alot of people that care deeply
if it drops in quality or 'JJ Abrams' them. This is a great thing!
I certainly cannot speak to everyone, but anything I wrote was intended in a spirit of help, discovery, or mere theorizing
(which is half the fun for a game like this) with others.
There are very few people shitting on your game.
I don't particularly care at the moment that some of the characters are one dimensional because the ones I do care about are not.
That doesn't mean I'm not going to agree with the people that say Ami is, to date, one dimensional because its just fucking true.
2. I will continue playing your game and theorizing/critiquing here as I see fit. It's like a second game
3. If you actually don't care then don't say anything to your critics (whom I am not one of at present).
It sends the exact opposite message, and it feeds them.
Not exactly Streisand effect, but uh... its an extant effect for sure.
Not really, but the images are available outside the game if you want to try that.
That is true, very nicely done on the evidence. I completely forgot "Blackout" mentioned that. I think it is safe to say this wasn't a case of the Denpa aspect nor was it a case of being out of character.
Chika is also easily the single most naive character in the game, willing to think a guy like Sensei could ever be exclusively hers. Boy is she going to be surprised if and when she discovers the rest of the girls he's active with. I REALLY don't want to know what Yumi is going to do if that happens.
As for the 'shallow and 'porn game' parts, I do have to disagree because there are many aspects that people here in this specific conversation have seemingly not taken into account, except the one comment by me where I began to address those aspects that were seemingly ignored. I say seemingly because they may not have been and just weren't brought up. The porn game thing doesn't quite fit this game, not everything with sex is a porn game. This is more like "Game of Thrones" since the focus is not on the sex, but the story. Porn games are almost entirely based around the sex, but the sex here is practically an afterthought.
Desensitization is a threat, or at least it is as long as a game is relying solely on things a person can be desensitized to. The Denpa aspect isn't all this game has going. The game obviously can't get rid of the Denpa aspect without changing drastically, but it could have been written entirely without it and the quality of writing alone is good enough to carry it.
It will go on for several years because the developer wills it, this is mostly a passion project, not a profit project, so the only real factor that could ever stop this game is burn out, which Selebus has taken precautions against.
That's the thing, things like this have been going on gradually for a while now and it still takes some people by surprise, not including new players.
The game is having the opposite effect on me, I normally can get through any horror, even other Denpa games, without even a single emotional response, but this one is keeping me on my toes and forcing me to respond in ways only one other game has. I would guess that your issue is desensitization.
I think we are already starting to hone in on that answer, but we are a long way out from it even with signs of hitting some truly dark territory in the near future.
The momentum isn't being spoiled, it is being heightened. We are heading into something worse than we have seen before in this game at an increasingly rapid pace.
I can't say the same, I cannot see myself losing interest in this game any time soon and I defiinitely cannot see myself pulling my patronage for lost interest, either.
Lose it? He'd already lost it with one girl.
Seriously, though, I don't think that's what's making him lose it because it wasn't until one girl in particular showed up that he really started going downhill.Wait, I don't remember specifically seeing anything about sexual abuse, though considering she was actively in Kendo, she might have been under insane pressure from her family. I think we all know that trope, the girl does well in something, the family latches onto that thing and pressures the girl so bad that it hurts her, the girl has some sort of fall from grace in the family's eyes due to the pressure, acts out, stops working so hard, stuff like that.
Some families, espcially the more traditional ones, tend to put more pressue on the younger generations. At least in fiction, though I am sure this happened in the past in real life if it isn't still happening today.
I have to agree, the last few updates have seen the single most severe and most frequent emotional outbursts from me, someone who purposely tries to repress emotion when dealing with fiction.
I have to agree that these complaints, even if they state the person is enjoying the game, are just a result of the person not enjoying the game or at least not enjoying it enough. That's not your fault, you're doing the best you can and your best is truly amazing.
I'm still shocked you broke through my attempts to keep my emotions in check and are continuing to not allow me to start back up with that. I didn't raise my patron tier just because I wanted to and finally had the means, though there was that. Your last few updates earned that raised tier.
I'm happy to see you're enjoying yourself, it really shows in your writing over the last few updates.
Nope, people coming here for a fap are setting themselves up for disappointment, not the game, them.
Yes, I believe that to be a perfect description of what we witnessed this update, though less in the sense that it happened and people got hurt in it, the accident, and more in the sense that it's so horrifying we can't even bring ourselves to look away. I am in no way referring to any part of the quality of the update, just so that's clear, but instead the events themselves and what happens in them. We are truly getting into the messed up stuff and I can't look away even if I wanted to.
Happier maybe, but truly happy is EXTREMELY questionable at best as to whether it is going to happen. Denpa games aren't known for having happy endings and the ones that do have happy endings make you unlock the other, not so happy endings first.
I think he was referring to the comments regarding characters being "one dimensional" and other things regarding writing quality that simply aren't true.
And to add to this to make it clear, better DOES NOT mean it will be positive. I can still be extremely bad, just less so than the other endings, and it will still qualify as better.
That's the thing, denial of choice is one of the themes in this game, for both the player and player Sensei. The Yumi kiss should have made that one pretty clear.
It MIGHT be one of the gods doing things, it might just be Sensei devolving into lunacy. In the case of the event in question, I see no evidence he is not in control, just like I saw no evidence in the Miku event. The counterpoint to that is the forced kiss with Yumi, where even he admits he wasn't in control and some theories say it was one of the gods.
I do believe the crossed out lines to be his thoughts, however, I do not believe they are being crossed at by him. I believe these are minor cases, compared to the Yumi kiss, of the god messing with him.
I'm not even sure what his 'usual self' is anymore, there are even some theories that this is the way he has always been, just not to this extent. Evidence being pointed out for this includes the student guide at the beginning which Maya admitted to making, not him.
Definitely not Sensei on the alterations, I don't even think Sensei is capable of such a thing.
I don't believe the entire scene was Sensei, but I still believe he was in control at the most crucial points of it, where he could have stopped the whole thing. That is why I fault him. If it had been like the Yumi kiss or he had not been in control at crucial points of the event, I would agree.
To be fair, and I know I might be in the minority here, JJ's movies aren't as bad as some would have me believe. His Star Trek movies suffered the thing this would if Selebus didn't do what he is now, they are good movies, but they aren't good Star Trek movies. They are fine in general, but they don't really fit that well into the Star Trek franchise as established before those movies.I get you are responding to alot of people with this post,
and that some of them were toxic af and that colors your perception of anyone making any critique of your game,
but I feel the need to say/clarify some things anyway:
1. I love your game and wish you the best in regards to its development. Truly.
This is one of the few stories I currently give a shit about.
That being said, the kind of story you are writing is like threading a needle and there are alot of people that care deeply
if it drops in quality or 'JJ Abrams' them. This is a great thing!
I certainly cannot speak to everyone, but anything I wrote was intended in a spirit of help, discovery, or mere theorizing
(which is half the fun for a game like this) with others.
There are very few people shitting on your game.
I don't particularly care at the moment that some of the characters are one dimensional because the ones I do care about are not.
That doesn't mean I'm not going to agree with the people that say Ami is, to date, one dimensional because its just fucking true.
2. I will continue playing your game and theorizing/critiquing here as I see fit. It's like a second game
3. If you actually don't care then don't say anything to your critics (whom I am not one of at present).
It sends the exact opposite message, and it feeds them.
Not exactly Streisand effect, but uh... its an extant effect for sure.
I don't think you were really in the target audience here, maybe getting caught some crossfire, so to speak, but not being aimed at specifically with Selebus's comment. His comment was more a genreal statement, which is why it covered so many people.
I most definitely agree here, though the fact that I care about all of them would make me concerned if they were one dimensional. I care about Rin more than the others, but I do care about the whole cast enough that one dimensional character writing would be an issue. As far as the ones being considered one dimensional, I believe those to be characters that have been on a bot of a content drought. Each update, Selebus chooses something like five of the girls to write for instead of writing some for all of them. This leaves some girls without content being added and sometimes means multiple updates of that. They aren't one dimensional, but I can see where one might think that, it's because they haven't gotten as much attention as ones not considered one dimensional. That's the risk of writing only a portion of the cast's content at any given time, but it is a risk Selebus is taking to prevent burn out.
As far as not saying anything, it doesn't matter if Selebus comments on it or not, nothing changed when he didn't comment. I have one thing to say to those people, they might want to find a different game, this one isn't for them and it is becoming pretty clear.
You're free to say whatever you want, man! I'm really glad you're playing and I'm glad you treat the critique and theorizing as a second game.
Like many others on the Internet, I honestly just love being sarcastic and argumentative- and I don't think it's particularly harmful for developers to push back on critique if they adamantly disagree with it. There is plenty of stuff in the game that's been improved based on player feedback and I'm even setting aside two months of development time to rework most of the early game in Q1 of 2022 because the quality just...kinda sucks.
I've said and done many things that have caused various people to drop their support in the past. But if that's the cost for expressing myself, so be it. Hell, I lost a $100 patron just last week for calling them out on something they said in the Discord. If someone says something I think is silly, I'm gonna fuckin' let 'em know I think it's silly. I've got no obligation to listen to anyone, and they have no obligation to listen to me when I reply.
I'm proud of what I make and anyone who thinks I should just shut up and agree with all critique can touch my wiener.
- Jan 16, 2018
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Nah, I'm not saying people will lose interest Alex, I'm saying it is possible a mass of people may get concerned over the pacing in a few months in my hypothetical 'pace stagnates' scenario.
You talk alot of the traits of Denpa- what is more Denpa than disorientation?
This requires a certain level of rising action and trauma.
That's why the very first thing I said was that the Halloween update was a good update and "a step in the right direction imo".
I'm just trying to be helpful to avoid a potential situation. For all I know things are about to go off the rails.
They very well could depending on the consequences of what happened with Molly!
But... on the alternative... just imagine things go back to normal.
It would have a certain dampening effect. The reader may ask themselves: 'what are the actual stakes' when another event inevitably happens.
That's all I'm saying.
And look, even if it keeps the current pace or even slows it is still great in the dating sim department and plenty entertaining and more than a 'good' game.
Perhaps I sounded more negative than intended.
I was merely sharing my thoughts on a hypothetical 'best' and most dramatic future.
As I said in another post the pace can also be changed by metering out meaningful information about the world of the story.
It is not necessarily the case that things just have to go off the rails more and more all the time, but things do need to be more or less moving for things to be at their most interesting.
That's my opinion anyways, and it is not a problem yet I am just stating my opinion because... that is what a forum is for.
You talk alot of the traits of Denpa- what is more Denpa than disorientation?
This requires a certain level of rising action and trauma.
That's why the very first thing I said was that the Halloween update was a good update and "a step in the right direction imo".
I'm just trying to be helpful to avoid a potential situation. For all I know things are about to go off the rails.
They very well could depending on the consequences of what happened with Molly!
But... on the alternative... just imagine things go back to normal.
It would have a certain dampening effect. The reader may ask themselves: 'what are the actual stakes' when another event inevitably happens.
That's all I'm saying.
And look, even if it keeps the current pace or even slows it is still great in the dating sim department and plenty entertaining and more than a 'good' game.
Perhaps I sounded more negative than intended.
I was merely sharing my thoughts on a hypothetical 'best' and most dramatic future.
As I said in another post the pace can also be changed by metering out meaningful information about the world of the story.
It is not necessarily the case that things just have to go off the rails more and more all the time, but things do need to be more or less moving for things to be at their most interesting.
That's my opinion anyways, and it is not a problem yet I am just stating my opinion because... that is what a forum is for.
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- Feb 25, 2020
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I meant as when it started Sensei was just kind going with the flow without too much worry...now however he has multiple girls vying for his attention all of whom have serious issues of their own. Sensei when this started "Man this life is perfect!" Sensei now "Oh myLose it? He'd already lost it with one girl.