Let's push forward, your opinion matters.

[Xol]

• Would you like to have deeper stories with sex-scenes who rather act as a side-activity instead of being the main focus?

Not really, no. In fact, for x-games, I'd prefer the opposite. There's a glut of VNs around here, and I'd much rather have games with sexuality involved in the actual gameplay somehow- not some big cut-scene between chapters/levels/etc. In regular mainstream games I may prefer more story, but when it comes to these kinds of games, I sometimes like to prefer to fill in the blanks in my imagination, and I'm a lot more interested in the actual gameplay and h-elements.

• Would you like to see more common gameplay approaches like having First Person or Third Person games, something in the line of Mass Effect or The Witcher?

That'd be interesting. Personally, when it comes to h-games, I tend to prefer sprite/pixel graphics and lots of different animations, which means sidescrollers/platformers/etc. are the most ideal. But I'm not averse to good 3D porn games if they're done well.

• Do you prefer a god or a bad protagonist as the main character?

How do you define those terms? Honestly most of the games I play have you as the "good guy/girl" character anyway and I do tend to enjoy that overall, I think. I wouldn't be averse to playing the other side occasionally. Pretty Warrior May Cry was an interesting (if imperfectly put-together) concept, for example.

• How about Character Customization? Going a bit further how about NPC Customization, settings presets (small boobs, big boobs, thick, thin etc.) for the characters you will meet throughout the game (in a non-spoiler way ofc).

As a general rule, even outside of h-games, I'm a huge slut for customization. That said, with these kinds of games, it's not super necessary- especially in those 2d games I mentioned enjoying so much.

• Since most developers use DAZ for their characters, how important are custom DAZ characters for you? Do you dislike seeing the same character in multiple games or do you don't mind?

Well, like I said, I don't see them a lot since I mostly stick to those 2d games and avoid VNs and such like the plague. So.... I guess this one isn't really relevant to me.

• Would you like to see larger game areas and have the possibility of exploring these areas to your hearts content?

Sure. So long as it's not too difficult to navigate and there is a good map system. I'm all for exploring and having a lot to find- not so keen on getting lost and frustrated trying to find my way back to where I need to go next.

• How important is a good looking environment for you?

It's important to a degree, but takes a backseat to the actual gameplay, as well as the character designs, animations, etc.

• What's your favorite game of all time? (You can name a lewd game or a regular game)

Oh god don't ask me that. I couldn't possibly pick. Even narrowing down to just h-games makes it virtually impossible to choose. I will say that Anthophobia, Kurovadis, Crisis Point: Extinction, and Eroico are some great examples of the kinds of games I enjoy. Don't get the wrong idea though: I'm not strictly about platformers and metroidvania-type games; those just happen to be some of the best in the h-game world that I've played. I should mention that, despite their simplistic gameplay, I also enjoy J-girl clones like Demon Girl, etc. And I'm all for more diverse gameplay styles, and even have some ideas of my own that I haven't seen used in the porn game world yet.

• Which game had the best gameplay in your opinion? (You can name a lewd game or a regular game)

See previous question. But again, I can also appreciate gameplay diversity. Even if they're more flawed, I do like the idea of other game genres being brought to the h-game world, like how Pricia Defense brought in tower defense AND shooter action. Heck, I'd love to see more strategy-type games in general besides just harem/brothel-manager type things. (Nothing against those, they can be kind of fun even, but they currently dominate the strat-world in h-games)

• Which game was the most impressive from a purely visual standpoint? (Let's stick to regular games here please)

You can probably guess I can't pick a single example here either. Just to list more noteworthy games: Barrage! is an example of a game that had somewhat frenetic, hard-for-me-to-get-into gameplay but had amazing sprite animations. I should also give a shoutout to Rack 2 for 3d games because I'm furry trash and I honestly do really love its style. I could probably go on, but I think I've spammed these answers enough.

• What is the answer to the question of life, the universe, and everything?

Ah, more importantly, what is the question?



Just thought I'd give a quick response to those bulletpoints for now- I have more to say in general on this subject, potentially from both a player AND wannabe-dev's perspective, but I'll have to do that later when I have more time. Good discussion though![/QUOTE]

 

[Pilluah]

1. Would you like to have deeper stories with sex-scenes who rather act as a side-activity instead of being the main focus?
2. Would you like to see more common gameplay approaches like having First Person or Third Person games, something in the line of Mass Effect or The Witcher?
3.Do you prefer a god or a bad protagonist as the main character?
4.How about Character Customization? Going a bit further how about NPC Customization, settings presets (small boobs, big boobs, thick, thin etc.) for the characters you will meet throughout the game (in a non-spoiler way ofc).
5.Since most developers use DAZ for their characters, how important are custom DAZ characters for you? Do you dislike seeing the same character in multiple games or do you don't mind?
6. Would you like to see larger game areas and have the possibility of exploring these areas to your hearts content?
7.How important is a good looking environment for you?
8 .What's your favorite game of all time? (You can name a lewd game or a regular game)
9 Which game had the best gameplay in your opinion? (You can name a lewd game or a regular game)
10 Which game was the most impressive from a purely visual standpoint? (Let's stick to regular games here please)
11 What is the answer to the question of life, the universe, and everything?

1. In general i prefer gameplay over story. Bad gameplay can mean that i don't enjoy good story and thus i won't play, but good gameplay can make me play the game even with bad story. Mass Effect 3 is example of game where gameplay was enjoyable enough but i mostly played it for story. In Star Wars Old Republic i really want skip button to enjoy the story, it usually means i don't play it at all and i would not have played it as much if it would not be Star wars.

2. Depends entirely on execution. Camera angles are hugely important in porn games, they can make or break otherwise good scenes.

3. If story is touching and great, i might prefer to be the good guy. But in porn games in general bad guy, even evil one, is what i prefer.

4. Would be great. Graphical style and execution matters more, but in porn games what characters look like is big reason if i will enjoy them or not. In more realistic graphical styles i have often seen very weird vaginas. Not talking about "design" of vaginas which can vary in real life, i mean how what ever is done looks like in game. It is one reason why i prefer real pictures/videos rather than 3d animations, though in games where vaginas look great i might prefer that. Its really difficult to make good detailed vagina in games, i wonder if it is something equilevant to uncanny valley or something.

5. I don't mind. As long as i like the model, its fine to use it. Vaginas are extremely tricky to get right for me, see #4

6. Only if it means sex that i enjoy.

7. Not important at all. Its a plus ofc but its not important and does not affect my enjoyment of porn games. In story heavy games it matters more, but still not that much in porn games.

8. Mass Effect 3 but i hate ending. Its because it was so emotional, story was so immersive and somehow became really personal. No other game has gotten me attached to characters like that, at least before ME3. I don't play ME3 anymore because i have already experienced story the way i like it, as much as i could influence it.

9. No idea. Gameplay is important but i have no idea, Mass Effect 3 only had gameplay that did not bother me or stop me from enjoying the story, but its not why i liked ME3. If i could get Mass Effect sequel with same gameplay as ME3 but new story that is just as good, i would definetly enjoy it. Good gameplay allows me to enjoy games that have bad story, but bad gameplay can stop me from playing games with great story.

10. i have absolutely no idea. Enviroment and lighting and effects in Planetside 2 look gorgerous and i like art style in Star Wars the Old republic. But i don't know what game would have stunned me because of how good it looks, there are so many that i can't remember and i have no idea what is best.

11. Crisps and milk shakes

 

[Xol]

To add to my previous thoughts:

The problem with development for h-games is that so many try to tackle them solo- for understandable reasons, of course. But there's a lot more that goes into games than most realize. I think this is why so many end up being relatively bland things that use the simplest possible free engines available. It also explains the prevalence of VNs and stock 3d model usage. I should know, I've tried toying with pretty much every easily-accessible engine or tool I could find over the years, but never ended up getting far with any of them.

Text games are arguably the most basic and easy to develop, in theory anyway; unfortunately, for many, they're also not as interesting. Trouble is, very few people have significant skill in both the artistic AND coding side of things to do much else. (To say nothing of the sound/music aspect, which its whole other ballpark as well) Stock resources can help a good bit, but to really make something worthwhile, you still have to produce at least some of your own material and edits to those materials. Same goes for code- "Don't reinvent the wheel!" may be a cardinal rule of programming, but even so, there's a limit to how much you can use code others have come up with before you have to start getting your digital hands dirty and working things out yourself, no matter how many tutorials you read.

For text games, I've dabbled with Twine, RAGS, Adrift, and a couple other programs/engines. I've also used Game Maker many years ago (in its early days, no less), and RPGMaker (again, ages ago, and unfortunately chunks of it were untranslated). In more recent years I've dabbled with both C++ libraries and Python modules- including, most recently, Pygame. Suffice to say I've toyed with a lot of different things over the years. Its dizzying enough even for those of us that've had actual programming classes and studied up on things on our own, so I can imagine what it's like for those that barely know anything about coding.

On the art side, there are a lot of great free resources out there, but a lot of it, especially in the 2d world is very.... well, family-friendly. Not exactly geared towards h-games.

I was thinking it might be nice if the broader h-game community would collaborate to make some kind of plug-and-play basic game creator, with preset modules for different mechanics, and stripped-down (no pun intended) basic graphics sets with characters in basic poses that others could modify to suit their needs. Kind of a pipe dream, but I think it'd be neat.

In any case, I think the bottom line is that while some very noteworthy individuals out there make some great games, it usually takes a team to make good games all the way through, that have real gameplay and aren't just mildly-interactive stories with uninteresting stock art/models. I know I have a lot of different ideas for games myself, including plenty that involve mechanics I've yet to see put into h-games; but trying to approach making them a reality always ends up being very, very overwhelming. And I'm sure that's a common sentiment.

There's also the consideration of time and money- a lot of people end up opening a Patreon or some other crowd-funding type deal for their projects. But when that doesn't make enough money for people to avoid having a day-job, they understandably have limited time to work on those projects. And what funding they do get tends to evaporate when backers get tired of waiting around for what ends up being very slow updates. So it's kind of a vicious cycle. And all the more reason projects end up needing multiple collaborators. Without them, people get burnt out fast. And yes, I'm sure a few of them are just con jobs looking to make a quick buck off peoples' expectations; but I think burn-out is by far the bigger problem. It doesn't help that anyone that wants to get into the professional world won't exactly be able to list such games on their resume when they ultimately do move onto bigger, more mainstream things. (Try explaining "worked on <porn game>" to a potential future employer in this very stuffy, prudish society!)

So what's the solution? Well, if you want to see more fully developed games, its going to take a lot more collaboration and/or money pumped into the market. Both have their obstacles. Collaboration is difficult for these kinds of things simply because people have such diverse interests. I don't just mean kinks, either. I mean, for example, just look at my post and the OP- if I'm understanding correctly, OP is mainly focused on 3D games, whereas I'm much more interested in 2D games.

And money isn't something people go throwing around lightly, especially these days. I know I, for one, am more or less dirt broke. Between the two, I'd rather participate in the former, especially if it was involved in designing something that could easily be reusable in the future. But that's just me.

I think I'm rambling now though so I'll stop.

PS. sorry if I repeated sentiments stated by anyone else- I haven't read others' posts in the thread yet. I just wanted to get my thoughts out there.

-edit-

Just a random thought, but for a good 2d game of the type I personally tend to enjoy, I imagine a good team would be comething like this:

1-2 programmers to write the code to make the game function. Possibly as many as 3, depending on how complex the project is, and whether any of them also works on other aspects of the game.

2 artists; one to produce the character sprites and animations, as well as scenery and obstacles; and one to do any splash screens, cutscenes, backgrounds, UI design, etc. You could have one artist to do it all, but without heavy usage of stock resources, that's putting a lot of work on just one person.

1 sound/music specialist. Easily overlooked, I feel, but potentially important. Don't get me wrong, there's good stock music and sound effects out there, and such things admittedly aren't likely to be as noticed in h-games, but it can make a big difference having someone around that knows how to edit and create those things professionally or pseudo-professionally.

And, optionally (depending on how much of a role the story plays) one person to write any dialogue and/or background story. But most importantly, it'd have to be someone who is both fluent in the language its being written in, AND someone willing to take the time to watch out for and correct mistakes. I've seen a lot of really sloppy text in games, and personally I find it very jarring and annoying. Can also overlap with one of the other roles, if it's light enough. (Personally, if I were in this team, I'd probably try and take this role and one of the coding roles, but that's me)

 

[gunderson]

I initially had a big long post here, about 3D games and porn, etc., then I realized I could say it much more simply.

I want RAGS games again. Specifically, I want the sort of games that you can most easily make in RAGS: adventure-type games with a straightforward movement system that you can control with a mouse, a picture window, a big box for text, and an easy ability to add things like combat or item interactions. They tended to leverage IRL pictures of porn stars as well as longer written story elements, and that was great.

So, I want an engine that does that. That's the kind of gameplay that I think best suits porn games, at least in terms of my experience of them. See Evil Inc, Mindshift, Tales of the Drunken Cowboy, the early version of SuperPowered, etc. I'm not looking for Mass Effect 3 but porn, or CoD but porn. I want an engine optimally designed for easily-expandable adventures with a clear box for images and text that a novice author doesn't have to go mucking around in the guts of an engine like Twine to make. But, preferably, I want one that's more platform agnostic and doesn't fuck with devs like RAGS does.

 

[Xol]

I initially had a big long post here, about 3D games and porn, etc., then I realized I could say it much more simply.

I want RAGS games again. Specifically, I want the sort of games that you can most easily make in RAGS: adventure-type games with a straightforward movement system that you can control with a mouse, a picture window, a big box for text, and an easy ability to add things like combat or item interactions. They tended to leverage IRL pictures of porn stars as well as longer written story elements, and that was great.

So, I want an engine that does that. That's the kind of gameplay that I think best suits porn games, at least in terms of my experience of them. See Evil Inc, Mindshift, Tales of the Drunken Cowboy, the early version of SuperPowered, etc. I'm not looking for Mass Effect 3 but porn, or CoD but porn. I want an engine optimally designed for easily-expandable adventures with a clear box for images and text that a novice author doesn't have to go mucking around in the guts of an engine like Twine to make. But, preferably, I want one that's more platform agnostic and doesn't fuck with devs like RAGS does.

Adrift and Quest are decent, from what I recall. Of course, it's been a while since I used them, so my memory of them is hazy. But as I recall, they weren't too complicated, especially for basic things like that.

 

[gunderson]

Adrift and Quest are decent, from what I recall. Of course, it's been a while since I used them, so my memory of them is hazy. But as I recall, they weren't too complicated, especially for basic things like that.

Ultimately, I think Adrift is a decent choice. It's annoying that certain virus scanners (I'm looking at you, Avast) don't play nice with the executable files it makes, but it's a pretty robust system with a good suite of features and I've definitely considered trying to make a game in that engine before. Of course, it doesn't hurt that one of my favorite current adult game series (the Himeros trilogy) is being developed in Adrift, as far as my support of that engine.

Qsp (Quest)...well, I think the question there comes down to whether or not you understand Russian. In theory, the engine seems fine and can make some decent games, but the fact is that the help files are all natively in Russian and there's only a machine translation of them available in English from f95 (took some searching even to dig that one out) makes it a little problematic if you want to make anything more than a basic game and primarily speak English.

Still, I think there's definitely a hole in the market where something like RAGS with documentation in English and which also plays nice with modern operating systems would fit. Maybe somebody's making something like that, but if so I'm not aware of it.

 

[Xol]

Qsp (Quest)...well, I think the question there comes down to whether or not you understand Russian. In theory, the engine seems fine and can make some decent games, but the fact is that the help files are all natively in Russian and there's only a machine translation of them available in English from f95 (took some searching even to dig that one out) makes it a little problematic if you want to make anything more than a basic game and primarily speak English.

I don't think we're talking about the same "Quest" here...? I don't think I've seen the one I'm talking about referred to as Qsp. And nothing on its website indicates anything Russian to me:

You must be registered to see the links

The documentation is all in perfectly clear, probably-native English.

 

[caLTD]

As a person who sinks last year's entire free time in developing 3d Adult game.

Programming is your last concern.

Creating adult content is hard especially realtime 3d adult content is hard.

Creating 3d Sexual animation is hard and I believe Motion capture is best work here.

Getting game engine 3d material, shader, lightning experience is hard.

Even when you complete all of those steps, having GTA5 grade look like.

You still need a good game design and good script with good dialogs.

As all of you know writing good script is HARD.

AND making all of those in your spare time is hard.

My best regards

 

[Xol]

Heh, am I the only one here that generally much prefers 2d sprites to 3d games?

Also,

As a person who sinks last year's entire free time in developing 3d Adult game.

Programming is your last concern.

It all depends on your skillset. I'd say someone who is used to doing the relevant kind of art (in this case, 3d modelling and animations) but never touched code in their life will have a much bigger problem with that aspect than someone who's more familiar with programming.

Like I mentioned in my own bigger post above, this is why specialization and collaboration are so useful and important. So the coders can focus on coding, the artists can focus on art, etc.

 

[Joshua Tree]

Heh, am I the only one here that generally much prefers 2d sprites to 3d games?

Also,



It all depends on your skillset. I'd say someone who is used to doing the relevant kind of art (in this case, 3d modelling and animations) but never touched code in their life will have a much bigger problem with that aspect than someone who's more familiar with programming.

Like I mentioned in my own bigger post above, this is why specialization and collaboration are so useful and important. So the coders can focus on coding, the artists can focus on art, etc.

Collaboration probably work best if a) no money involved and/or b) creators already established. Things tend to get messy when money get involved. If you want to step up from it being a hobby thing, its probably better to just try build a proper dev team and set it up as a small business.

 

[Xol]

Collaboration probably work best if a) no money involved and/or b) creators already established. Things tend to get messy when money get involved. If you want to step up from it being a hobby thing, its probably better to just try build a proper dev team and set it up as a small business.

That's a fair point- but unfortunately, regardless of money issues, it's very difficult to do an entire game on one's own, giving the wide variety of skills necessary to make a good one.

 

[Zippity]

I get the desire for games to innovate, but you have to remember, even the AAA-gaming scene doesn't innovate. FIFA, Madden, Call of Duty, Battlefield, etc, etc. Innovating and pushing forward usually requires money, which a lot of us creators don't have. What's more, it's quite a risk, as people often say they want innovation, but then they do things like give the new Aladdin movie almost $90 million in the opening weekend.

Not that it has anything to do with this thread, so forgive me... But I'm really not thrilled with Disney's desire to keep remaking their animated films into live action ones... It detracts from their history and ruins their traditions... If they want to make live action movies, or even hybrid's of live action with animations, then do it with original films or remakes of old live actions/hybrids... I want kids to see and know the Disney I grew up on, not this CGI filled live action non-sense, that many of the times is only a shadow of the original animated movies... Like with the Aladdin movie taking some of the same jokes and commentary that Robin Williams did so brilliantly, and using it in this new take with a different actor of Will Smith... Don't get me wrong, I love Will Smith in most movies he does... But the live action doesn't have the same quirky flair as the animated movie does...

Sorry, you may now return to your regular scheduled thread subject...

Zip

 

[Canto Forte]

We have here successful devs - one got on steam - the holy grail of gaming with distribution network reaching as far as electronics stores and pretty much any supermarket. The other 2 have finished games with community applauded runs - they have stepped to another level of pretty much everything - VN with game play and sand box elements that DO NOT LEAVE THE PLAYER CLUELESS IN DESPAIR (

Not that it has anything to do with this thread, so forgive me... But I'm really not thrilled with Disney's desire to keep remaking their animated films into live action ones... It detracts from their history and ruins their traditions... If they want to make live action movies, or even hybrid's of live action with animations, then do it with original films or remakes of old live actions/hybrids... I want kids to see and know the Disney I grew up on, not this CGI filled live action non-sense, that many of the times is only a shadow of the original animated movies... Like with the Aladdin movie taking some of the same jokes and commentary that Robin Williams did so brilliantly, and using it in this new take with a different actor of Will Smith... Don't get me wrong, I love Will Smith in most movies he does... But the live action doesn't have the same quirky flair as the animated movie does...

Sorry, you may now return to your regular scheduled thread subject...

Zip

It is all built around will prince of bell air smith and the holier than thou children appeal. Like Obama - they could not possibly go wrong!

 

[Holy Bacchus]

• (Directed at Game-Devs) The very first thing is the lack of advancement. 8 out of 10 games are either RenPy VN's or GameMaker RPG's.
  Now don't get me wrong, i got nothing but love for everyone who creates games with those solutions and no doubt every once in a while we get extremely solid projects who were made with RenPy or RPGM. But unfortunately it doesn't change the fact that we stagnate, both in terms of general game-design and in terms of technical progression.

The thing about this is that both of those programs are free to use and whilst it is possible to pirate a version of software such as Unity, most people aren't probably willing to do that or aren't proficient enough to feel confident taking the necessary steps to activate their pirated version. If you're an amateur or even someone with a rudimentary knowledge of programming, etc, you're going to stick with what's easiest and currently that's Ren'py and GameMaker.

This is also a factor in why so many games made with these programs feel the same because they also provide lots of assets to be able to quickly knock-out an adult game with relatively simple functions rather than having to spend a lot of time making your own assets for HUDs and the like.

• (Directed at Players & Game-Devs) Another thing i noticed is that players and developers sometimes seem disconnected from another. Often times when i read a thread about a game i stumble upon players who provide their honest feedback (good feedback without flame) or request certain features but way to often this feedback is either rejected with the words "If you don't like it, don't play it" or it goes completely ignored because the developer itself is either not active on F95 or simply just don't care.
  I know that some developers are not particular happy about F95 but ignoring it will lead to nothing, if you engage in the community you can show your passion about your project and who knows it might resonate with someone who then decides to support you directly.
  
  BUT i don't want to blame just the developers here, also players need to understand a few things. It's not uncommon that i see players who ask for a certain feature that would totally change the direction of the game or questions about certain design decisions. The always famous question about NTR comes to mind. You have to understand that every game, be it a lewd game or regular game, has predefined boundaries. Boundaries like the general theme, story, mechanics, world-design etc. and changing one of those boundaries almost always leads to a fail. Try to suggest additions and not radical changes.

With this, I always feel like the devs should stand firm. If you're a dev who has a firm vision of what you want your game to be and how you want the story to play out, stick to it and don't let others dictate what you do. Community involvement can still happen, but only in so far as deciding which aspect of the story you wish to see expanded upon in a future update, i.e. a certain character. In this regard, the dev knows what the character's story will be, they're just asking their patrons which one they would like to see developed first, but I do not think devs should change their stories based on feedback. However, having to option to avoid certain controversial aspects, such as NTR, would be the better way to go as it satisfies all parties.

• Would you like to have deeper stories with sex-scenes who rather act as a side-activity instead of being the main focus?
• Would you like to see more common gameplay approaches like having First Person or Third Person games, something in the line of Mass Effect or The Witcher?
• Do you prefer a god or a bad protagonist as the main character?
• How about Character Customization? Going a bit further how about NPC Customization, settings presets (small boobs, big boobs, thick, thin etc.) for the characters you will meet throughout the game (in a non-spoiler way ofc).
• Since most developers use DAZ for their characters, how important are custom DAZ characters for you? Do you dislike seeing the same character in multiple games or do you don't mind?
• Would you like to see larger game areas and have the possibility of exploring these areas to your hearts content?
• How important is a good looking environment for you?
• What's your favorite game of all time? (You can name a lewd game or a regular game)
• Which game had the best gameplay in your opinion? (You can name a lewd game or a regular game)
• Which game was the most impressive from a purely visual standpoint? (Let's stick to regular games here please)
• What is the answer to the question of life, the universe, and everything?

1. I think both. Sometimes sex can be the main goal of a game but it can also be a side-aspect. For example, let's say you have a game where the MC is trying to get a date with a hot girl, then that would be the main goal of the game, but a game where the MC's goal is to become an actor, then sex can happen along the way and can move the story along in some respects. I think what's really needed is more diversity in terms of the stories being told in these games; less "horny guys screws all insanely horny girls just 'cus" and more "ordinary guy living ordinary life ends up in plausible sexual encounters".
2. I'd like to see more 3rd person games. First person kissing scenes where it's just a woman's face pursing her lips and sticking out her tongue always looks weird to me. Even if you don't show the guy's whole face, at least just show the lips mashing together.
3. Definitely the good protagonist, the bad protagonist who's deviantly trying to corrupt every woman around him doesn't do it for me. I much prefer a male protagontist who just finds himself in sexual situations without using any manipulation or subterfuge.
4. For customisation, you need to buy a licence in order to do that when using non free-use models such as Daz models so this is why we don't see a lot of this.
5. I do often dislike seeing the same models over and over again, especially when it comes to hair styles and environments. With regards to character models, there are so many out there for female models. I myself have 132 female Gen 8 models (all obtained for free) but of this 132 I usually only see the same dozen or so in many of the games. I know most devs are probably making these games on the cheap with free models, but if I can get 132 official Daz models, then so can they, and same with all the other assets.
6. Open-world games are tricky if you don't have really good game developer knowledge and if you're just one person, so this isn't much of a concern.
7. I think I just want different environments now and again. I'm tired of seeing the same bedrooms, kitchens, cafes, etc. I realise there's a limited supply of many of these pre-made environments, but perhaps if more devs were to create more custom home environments that could help, but don't leave them empty. Put in book cases, ornaments, pictures on the wall, etc, and make it look it properly lived in.
8. Well, since this is F95 I'll name my favourite lewd game; My Sister My Roommate. It's a very linear game and graphically it's not the greatest out there, but I really enjoy the story as the progression between Taylor and his sister Nikki feels very natural and genuine, which is not something you often get in these types of games.
9. Best gameplay is probably Man of the House. It's so very different from every other game out there especially when travelling between destinations as it actually takes certain lengths of in-game to get there via different modes of transport. I also like that it gives very detailed hints and instructions on how to proceed with each character via the phone menu.
10. I know you said stick to regular games, but I'll say that Lewdlab games have the most impressive visuals of any adult games I've played.
11. "The purpose of life is to end." - Agent Smith, 2003

 

[Canto Forte]

There is no firm, concrete, stone wall, perfect script or visual or narrative. All the movies in the world are on months development, pretty much like any par te non supported game and there will always be cuts and pieces on the editing floor no matter the caliber, time, money or expertise of the creator.

 

[desmosome]

Not that it has anything to do with this thread, so forgive me... But I'm really not thrilled with Disney's desire to keep remaking their animated films into live action ones... It detracts from their history and ruins their traditions... If they want to make live action movies, or even hybrid's of live action with animations, then do it with original films or remakes of old live actions/hybrids... I want kids to see and know the Disney I grew up on, not this CGI filled live action non-sense, that many of the times is only a shadow of the original animated movies... Like with the Aladdin movie taking some of the same jokes and commentary that Robin Williams did so brilliantly, and using it in this new take with a different actor of Will Smith... Don't get me wrong, I love Will Smith in most movies he does... But the live action doesn't have the same quirky flair as the animated movie does...

Sorry, you may now return to your regular scheduled thread subject...

Zip

True that. Old Disney is best Disney. I dare you to watch "The Fox and the Hound" and not cry like a baby.

 

[Zippity]

The thing about this is that both of those programs are free to use and whilst it is possible to pirate a version of software such as Unity, most people aren't probably willing to do that or aren't proficient enough to feel confident taking the necessary steps to activate their pirated version. If you're an amateur or even someone with a rudimentary knowledge of programming, etc, you're going to stick with what's easiest and currently that's Ren'py and GameMaker.

This is also a factor in why so many games made with these programs feel the same because they also provide lots of assets to be able to quickly knock-out an adult game with relatively simple functions rather than having to spend a lot of time making your own assets for HUDs and the like.

This is extremely true... Although, I've messed around with Ren'py a short bit, just to get a better understanding of it's defaults and how it's basics function... And although I'm not a coder, the basic defaults are not highly complex... So when you see those VN/Games with all the navigations maps and glowing clickables and intensely complex user interfaces... Those require some more advanced coding skills... Ren'py is mostly setup for very basic Visual Novel style game mechanics... Most everything else either requires copying code someone else designed that is made available, or doing the hard work yourself or through someone with more coding knowledge... Beyond basic Visual Novel game play, I really do think the copy cat stuff we tend to see, was either gained from a commonly used 3rd party, or was designed to copy what others have done that inspired the developer... Something they experienced and liked, therefore wanted to incorporate that same (or similar) functionality in their own project/s...

With this, I always feel like the devs should stand firm. If you're a dev who has a firm vision of what you want your game to be and how you want the story to play out, stick to it and don't let others dictate what you do. Community involvement can still happen, but only in so far as deciding which aspect of the story you wish to see expanded upon in a future update, i.e. a certain character. In this regard, the dev knows what the character's story will be, they're just asking their patrons which one they would like to see developed first, but I do not think devs should change their stories based on feedback. However, having to option to avoid certain controversial aspects, such as NTR, would be the better way to go as it satisfies all parties.

Again, totally agree... I really feel that Developers should stick to their plans, and not let too much (if any) outside influence, especially paying fans, alter those plans... Offering up rewards in the form of cosmetic polls and such isn't as big a deal, as long as the choices for the poll were already pre-generated by the developers... Things like hair colors, pre-made character models, character names, some predetermined clothing styles, and all those cosmetic things that have no bearing on the story, progression, scenes, events, fetishes, relationships, etc... Allowing too much control by outside forces, has a very large tendency to cause the project to derail and/or degrade... Listening to folks, taking suggestions, fixing issues people point out is all fine and dandy, until it begins to move your project in unintended directions...

An example might be starting off as a project focused on good story telling... But then a bunch of paying fans begin beating down on your door to add less story and more sexual content... And the developer capitulates, either because they don't want to lose funding or because they think that is what the majority of player/readers want... You then suddenly watch those initial and expanding fans begin to dwindle away, due to the harsh change of direction your product made... Of course, the highly hopeful fans may stick around longer, hoping it will get back on track, but even they may eventually give up...

Developers should always remember, because of the way Patreon and sites like those operate, only paying fans can speak out on the developers pages, located on those sites... And most readers/developers never even speak their minds or give opinions or do reviews on sites like these... So you will never get a full and realistic view of what people like or dislike about your product, unless it goes to the extreme where no one donates and no one likes it at all, on any site, including Patreon and it's ilk... That is really the harsh reality of offering up any product to the public for consumption... Even more so in this niche of the porn market, as most players/readers never say anything at all...

Of course, there are also some developers who start with only a very basic concept and let their paying fans control everything else from there... While the developer just fills in the blanks... But most of those projects rarely become highly successful... They will have a fan base that sticks around primarily because the developer panders to them... Usually this method is used, out of the developers desire for greed and/or ego stroking... Not due to a great sense of creativity, artistry, story writing, etc...

Zip

 

[Emoon]

Ok i finally have the time to get back to you guys, unfortunately it's already too much to get back to. So i will just pick up what randomly stuck to my mind so far.

Influence of players/fans on project:
I already said to anne O'nymous a bit earlier that i did not meant changing the whole genre of a game, what i meant was small feature requests like "Can we get an inventory system" or "Reenable the Skip/Auto/Rollback function" etc. Any fundamental change of the games core is a no go in my books too, no matter if you are supporting the Dev through Patreon or not.

The Elephant in the Room:
I often see the argument that something is to hard to realize/implement, to expensive or a matter of time. Now this is an argument hat i let slide for people who are real hobbyist or those who do this purely for fun. But let's be honest here a lot of developers are also on Patreon and no matter if they make good money or not i have to question their commitment if i'd hear statements like "Yeah no, to do this i'd have to learn how to do it" or "No, i use RPGM because it already ships with all the assets i need."
One more reason why i can't let an argument like that slide is because many devs have multiple projects running at once. How many times have i seen multiple people saying that the author abandoned a project or startet a new one despite the first one hasn't even been finished. Again that's cool with me for those who do this purely for fun but those who are on Patreon taking money from people for months after months and then dropping the project to start something new is not cool at all!

The thing about this is that both of those programs are free to use and whilst it is possible to pirate a version of software such as Unity, most people aren't probably willing to do that or aren't proficient enough to feel confident taking the necessary steps to activate their pirated version.

Is Unity's Free version still a stripped down Pro version? I don't use Unity so that's why i'm asking.

It all depends on your skillset. I'd say someone who is used to doing the relevant kind of art (in this case, 3d modelling and animations) but never touched code in their life will have a much bigger problem with that aspect than someone who's more familiar with programming.

Like I mentioned in my own bigger post above, this is why specialization and collaboration are so useful and important. So the coders can focus on coding, the artists can focus on art, etc.

Just to put this out there. Yes to everything you said! Making a proper game as a single person is next to impossible (scope depended). Once your game get's serious (post conceptual stage) a team becomes pretty much a necessity.

As a person who sinks last year's entire free time in developing 3d Adult game.

- Programming is your last concern.
- Creating adult content is hard especially realtime 3d adult content is hard.
- Creating 3d Sexual animation is hard and I believe Motion capture is best work here.
- Getting game engine 3d material, shader, lightning experience is hard.
- Even when you complete all of those steps, having GTA5 grade look like.
- You still need a good game design and good script with good dialogs.
- As all of you know writing good script is HARD.
- AND making all of those in your spare time is hard.

Yes making Games is hard, i don't dispute that. But it pretty much boils down to what i said in the "The Elephant in the Room:" part. I'm cool with that statement when it's made by Hobbyist or people who are in it for the fun but not when it comes to people who take money from others. If you take money from others then it's your obligation to deliver the best possible result in the context you set your game to be.
Well ok that sounds wrong, i'm not expecting you to be the next Rockstar Games because setting a bar so high for an amateur would be ridiculous but i want you to deliver the best you can and i want to see that. But if you come around with mix and match assets from all over the place you can be sure that i'll criticise you for that (not through public channels tho) or i simply cancel my support.


One more last thing before i hit post reply. There was a reason why i said that you don't have to worry about any technical limitations or if something is doable or not.
I wanted to hear what people would like to see in a game without a certain concern about time, tech, resources or money.
I thought it might be worth for other developers who may need some ideas, if something is doable or not would be up to the developer anyway. Well that failed but nevermind.

Thank you all for your input i really enjoy reading through this!
Have nice day.

 

[Joshua Tree]

The Elephant in the Room:
I often see the argument that something is to hard to realize/implement, to expensive or a matter of time. Now this is an argument hat i let slide for people who are real hobbyist or those who do this purely for fun. But let's be honest here a lot of developers are also on Patreon and no matter if they make good money or not i have to question their commitment if i'd hear statements like "Yeah no, to do this i'd have to learn how to do it" or "No, i use RPGM because it already ships with all the assets i need."

One more reason why i can't let an argument like that slide is because many devs have multiple projects running at once. How many times have i seen multiple people saying that the author abandoned a project or startet a new one despite the first one hasn't even been finished. Again that's cool with me for those who do this purely for fun but those who are on Patreon taking money from people for months after months and then dropping the project to start something new is not cool at all!

I wonder back in the day (way back in the day), Patreon's of the arts.. If they would demand of painters, composers, sculptors, inventors (list goes on), if the backers was standing over them demanding they would always complete a painting once started a new canvas or god forbid that stone is expensive so if your sculpture fail, off with your head!.

No one "taking" money from anyone. It's backers choice if they want to support a creator or not. It's not a retail store nor a subscribing service. Those that want to step it up to another level does try to branch outside of Patreon. Such as "House Party" that found it's way to steam and similar. Then we can start talk about hold creators more accountable for not deliver, but as long as they are on Patreon, and know what Patreon is about, it get to silly imho.

A creator can start with his hobby project, maybe end up with the start of something real good and gain traction. His/her patreon might start blow up and once it reach a certain stage, you will always have people start stab at "oh, they make so much money" and then start lay down demands etc. Just because a creator end up earn X on Patreon doesn't mean they become professional, or ready to give up whatever commitment's real life have and go 24/7 game developer. I see some have posted on their pages that if they reach X they will give up their rl job, school whatever and focus full time. Now that is bollocks, unless you stuck flipping burgers at McDonalds or similar (This is NOT a stab at people working there or similar places).

Everyone if they could, would try earn a buck on their hobby if that was a possibility. Many years ago, before internet was a thing. I liked to write stories, for my own benefit. Not because I hoped to become some sort of author or publish any of it. It was a form of escape into fantasy I guess. Thing is, over time I ended up with many incomplete stories, lost interest, train of thoughts and so on. I would expect much of the same can/will happen to creators of these adult games as well. So if some get abandoned half way through, re-worked, etc. I don't really care. It's not like I did commission a certain work from them.

 

[Emoon]

I wonder back in the day (way back in the day), Patreon's of the arts.. If they would demand of painters, composers, sculptors, inventors (list goes on), if the backers was standing over them demanding they would always complete a painting once started a new canvas or god forbid that stone is expensive so if your sculpture fail, off with your head!.

Man looks like i'm walking on eggs here. I do not demand from developers that they follow what their patreons say, all i did was questioning their commitment! You can mangle my words as much as you like, but when i decide to move my game up on Patreon or even Steam i would feel obligated to deliver the best i can, especially in a genre like this where you can get the same thing a couple of hours or days later for free through other channels. We may see Patreon or Steam differently but that's how i would approach it or feel about it.