RPGM Lisa [v3.1.5] [PaleGrass]

[SevenCostanza]

I feel you man and I think you're right in thinking Danny's being used mostly as a plot device. It wasn't intended to be this way out of the gate which is apparent given the amount of content with him present in the first release. It all stemmed from the public outcry about his character after Episode 1 went public, it really was one of the major talking points when I first posted the game and I just figured as he isn't in any way pivotal to the actual story of the game that I'd simply focus more of my efforts elsewhere. I think honestly I need to give him some more content but simply make it optional because where he is currently isn't appeasing either side of the aisle the way I want to x

I think it's the cost of doing business in the NTR/corruption genre. I play quite a few and almost every game falls into the same dilemma. It's kind of a catch 22. You need to depict the bf as sort of an inadequate weakling with a small penis and who is unaware of what's happening. They are meant to be unlikeable so the female MC doesn't come off as a total heartless bitch and what she does becomes more palatable. Before you know it she's slept with half the city and only verbalizes her guilt but doesn't hesitate to jump on the next available dick whether they're old/young/fat/ugly/homeless/an animal/dirty/etc. The bf is kept around, as you said, merely as a plot device to allow the 'cheating' aspect to continue. Often times the game will have a faithful or love route but even in those routes the FMC cheats and whores around making it difficult to actually complete that route in a way that makes sense. I'm not sure if you've played them but The Adventurous couple, Anna's Exciting Affection, Lily of the Valley, Angelica's Temptation From the Beginning just to name a few other NTR/Corruption games that fall victim to the exact same issue. For many the problem was they didn't have a coherent story laid out and just catered to the biggest donating subscribers and just kept adding more and more to the point where nothing really makes sense and it's just about introducing new people and kinks for the FMC with no actual resolution or end in sight. I wish the stakes could be higher. Like in Anna's exciting affection one of the guys she sleeps with is some gangster who is jealous and possessive. If she started a relationship with him and kept sleeping around and got caught, what ensues would likely be very entertaining. Instead they keep her in a relationship with the original boyfriend who is in a coma for the remainder of the game while she sleeps with anyone and everyone else. Yes. A coma. Just to be able to say she's technically cheating still despite her having admitted she resents him and having sex with his dad on top of him while he's in a coma. The boyfriend in this game falls asleep so often it's almost like he's half way to comatose himself lol.

 

[Caninenappe]

Attention, I am well aware that if I like this game it is also for the sex scenes and I will not be there if not. I just think if Danny is OK with sharing, even reluctantly, he can definitely have a place in the story and it can open up some other really interesting scenes. He would be like Lisa's good conscience between 2 unbridled gang bangs where he would hold her hand while she sucks an NTRS-style cock.

 

[jam44]

i cannot opened for MAC.
chmod +x ?

 

[TheLecher]

The language used during sex scenes isn't directly representative of what's actually real, it's heated dialogue intended to increase the eroticism so mentioning about becoming his slut is exciting to Lisa but never comes to fruition outside of that scenario. I do get what you mean entirely, when I put that scene together I was quite happy with it but as I grow and learn and feel a lot more confident writing in particular I've come to like it less. I am getting better

I don't think that a changing opinion about what you've written in the past is necessarily an indication of growth or improvement as a writer. I don't doubt that the experience of writing this game has made you a better writer, but it doesn't follow that your own assessment of what you've written in the past will therefore be infallible, or even that it will correctly indicate the ways in which you've improved. Lots of people, including some of the most popular writers of fiction, wrongly judge their own past work.

I quite enjoyed the writing in that scene, and I saw no problems with the dirty talk. I think that writing that scene differently would make it less enjoyable and less effective as a piece of storytelling. The way it was written is not only quite erotic, but also effectively advances the storyline and further illustrates the characters of all three participants.

He just doesn't bring anything of substance to the game except her requiring someone to cheat on.

I don't agree. He doesn't add much, at this point, but that's perhaps partly due to the character and relationship having been neglected in the storytelling. But the little which he does add is of substance for the character of Lisa. And the potential for the character of Danny and his relationship with Lisa still remains, in spite of the current neglect of that storyline.

I find all the same that it is a pity to neglect Danny in the road of sharing. If she loves him and they agree that she is sexually free, he has his place in the game.

I agree.

I like the idea that she still remains attached to a normal life with her boyfriend.

I'm not sure about "a normal life", but I do advocate for the idea that they can have their adventures without abandoning the relationship.

 

[JaxMan]

At this point they barely have a relationship at all lol. He's mostly just there to be cheated on. I don't think any of the relationships will get straightened out with rules or limits especially at this point where she's too far gone to be able to stop. Any agreement made would just end up being broken. Seems most likely the game will just follow the cheating path or cheating/sharing path and throw in as many different people/places/pets/positions/etc as possible to check off the list of kinks and keep the game going.

Except they have been together since start of the school year and he proclaimed his love. Lisa hasn't said she loves him, but she does like him and considers it a serious relationship. If she wants to have sex without him she should break up or it's a cheating route. She wasn't too far gone in my game as the only thing I had done was the Danny date and the swim trip. Picking the share route lead to cheating, not what I expected for that route. Plus if she gets "too far gone to be able to stop" that leaves her/player without choices to make. I don't mind a female protag that is slutty and/or kinky, but I like to be able to determine if they do or do not act on it and not be a brain dead bimbo who gets forced into situations not of her choosing. I know a lot of players like that and that's fine, I just thought the sharing route was different. Also, I don't think it was a cheating/sharing path given, it was sharing/hot wife if I remember correctly.

 

[SevenCostanza]

Except they have been together since start of the school year and he proclaimed his love. Lisa hasn't said she loves him, but she does like him and considers it a serious relationship. If she wants to have sex without him she should break up or it's a cheating route. She wasn't too far gone in my game as the only thing I had done was the Danny date and the swim trip. Picking the share route lead to cheating, not what I expected for that route. Plus if she gets "too far gone to be able to stop" that leaves her/player without choices to make. I don't mind a female protag that is slutty and/or kinky, but I like to be able to determine if they do or do not act on it and not be a brain dead bimbo who gets forced into situations not of her choosing. I know a lot of players like that and that's fine, I just thought the sharing route was different. Also, I don't think it was a cheating/sharing path given, it was sharing/hot wife if I remember correctly.

When I say too far gone I guess I'm referring to how whether it's sharing or cheating, her inner monologue doesn't really reflect that much remorse or guilt both while it's happening and after the fact. Well it's never strong enough for her to stop or slow things down even if the boyfriend is right beside them (sleeping and clueless of course) or if she's with multiple other guys at the same time. She's not able to fight back those feelings once they start, and interesting to note, feelings she doesn't seem to have for or with the boyfriend. As you mentioned the sharing path just becomes the cheating/cuck path. She will cheat and even during the sharing scenes the boyfriend guy is like a side actor. Watching while jerking off or busting a nut early and then falling asleep while the other guy and his girl emasculate him and his girl gets dominated and satisfied much better sexualy by the other guy. The 'sharing' lasts about half a scene before it becomes cheating/cuck for the rest of the game. I imagine the faithful route will be her only cheating with a few guys instead of every guy. I kid I kid.

 

[RedGlow]

Attached is a file that will open the scene in the recollection room after the camping trip has been completed (it's unavailable after the hot tub is installed)

Will it affect my future gameplay since that scene never happened in my playthrough? I don't wanna miss a scene because of this. I think it was about pervert neighbour.

 

[neronwtf]

The swinging/sharing route doesn't really feel any different then the cheating route except the boyfriend guy is present until he inevitably falls asleep of course

It feels more and more that the sharing path became a cucking path (foursome in the camping, the scene with his boyfriend's boss) and then you have the straight forward cheating path.

You need to depict the bf as sort of an inadequate weakling with a small penis and who is unaware of what's happening.

Why it has to be like that? I mean, you can have the classic cheating/corruption path as every FMC, but you can also have a real sharing path where both members of the couple are on a discovery path together. It's what Illegible Mink is trying to do in his game, or at least I think so because it just on the starting phase.
At the beginning it's what I thought it will happen here, even if the hotwife idea didn't fit completely. His boyfriend didn't seem the bland one. Maybe Palegrass had to change because of the feedback he received once he already developed this part of the game and didn't want to rewrite it (totally understandable, by the way). Maybe Lisa and his boyfriend can have a honest discussion where they agree to have an open relationship -that will allow Lisa to explore all kind of fetishes- or the break up (on the sharing path) and you can still have it around for the NTR path.

but it's just how I wrote Calvin's character, it's exampled again during the Camping Trip.

This doesn't match his behavior when he was rejected by Lisa (in the faithful path) at the beginning nor his behavior in general with her. He didn't seem like a bad guy, but then in the foursome he's the dominant one and the bad guy.

There is little difference in Lisa's behaviour between the Sharing & Cheating routes

So why the two paths? It will be easier for you to write only two paths, and let's be honest the cheating path will be the bigger one, as it happen with every female MC game.
Don't get me wrong. Your game is sexually arousing AF, Lisa is very hot and you have an history behind. It's just that when you give the player the chance to have a cheating path and a sharing path, he/she may expect different outcomes. Right now is like a cucking path and it doesn't match with Lisa's personality nor the relation between the two of them.

 

[SevenCostanza]

It feels more and more that the sharing path became a cucking path (foursome in the camping, the scene with his boyfriend's boss) and then you have the straight forward cheating path.


Why it has to be like that? I mean, you can have the classic cheating/corruption path as every FMC, but you can also have a real sharing path where both members of the couple are on a discovery path together. It's what Illegible Mink is trying to do in his game, or at least I think so because it just on the starting phase.
At the beginning it's what I thought it will happen here, even if the hotwife idea didn't fit completely. His boyfriend didn't seem the bland one. Maybe Palegrass had to change because of the feedback he received once he already developed this part of the game and didn't want to rewrite it (totally understandable, by the way). Maybe Lisa and his boyfriend can have a honest discussion where they agree to have an open relationship -that will allow Lisa to explore all kind of fetishes- or the break up (on the sharing path) and you can still have it around for the NTR path.


This doesn't match his behavior when he was rejected by Lisa (in the faithful path) at the beginning nor his behavior in general with her. He didn't seem like a bad guy, but then in the foursome he's the dominant one and the bad guy.



So why the two paths? It will be easier for you to write only two paths, and let's be honest the cheating path will be the bigger one, as it happen with every female MC game.
Don't get me wrong. Your game is sexually arousing AF, Lisa is very hot and you have an history behind. It's just that when you give the player the chance to have a cheating path and a sharing path, he/she may expect different outcomes. Right now is like a cucking path and it doesn't match with Lisa's personality nor the relation between the two of them.

I agree with pretty much everything you said.
As for why the boyfriend has to be depicted as inadequate, I think the reasons are two fold. Firstly it's so the player doesn't feel like the female MC is just a cruel cold heartless bitch and that there are parts of the relationship she isn't satisfied with so in some way it's kind of justified that she strays and sees if she can be happier with someone else. Second I think if the boyfriend is competent with big dick and satisfies her sexually and emotionally, she has no real reason to cheat in the first place.
I also agree with you on the sharing path and that it should be portrayed more as something they do together and the priority is each other even with another person there. You are right it is basically a cuck path given all the things that have happened during the sharing scenes with the way she acts and what she says and her behaviour in general.
I would probably agree that the feedback from supporters was what kind of nudged things in that direction. I think another part of the problem was that the faithful path hasn't been represented in so long and we've had so much of the cheating/sharing/ntr/cuck paths that it's hard to imagine a faithful path at all. Especially since it would seem most supporters are pushing for the opposite of faithful.
I think with Calvin it's all part of the cheating/ntr/cuck kink and him being the more dominant one who satisfies her more plays into those kinks. I agree sometimes it feels like a departure and the characters personalities often seem to change depending on the scene. One minute the boyfriend is their best friend the next they're balls deep inside his girlfriend or one minute someone is shown to be meek and the next they're a sadist dom alpha giant dick superman. Any remorse or guilt they feel is temporary and only lasts until the next time they have the chance to get inside her. I think for the camping trip cheating threesome scene the dev wanted to show like a devil/angel on the shoulder type thing. One voice of reason, one voice of depravity and then show her internal struggle and how she grapples with what's happening and ultimately choosing depravity. I believe it's a big part of the cheating/cuck/ntr kink to show the corruption and how she prefers the pleasure over loyalty. As for the foursome yea I'd say it feels similar to the previous Calvin sharing scene where he's the dominant one and the boyfriend is kind of an afterthought and she pretty much submits to Calvin and seems to prefer him sexually. The mechanic sharing scene as well. I agree it feels more like cucking then sharing when the other partner is always superior to the boyfriend and she is vocal about how much more she enjoys it and seems to love being treated disrespectfully like a slut by other guys. It's also odd that the boyfriend seems to get emasculated to some degree in each sharing scene as well.
Again not complaining, as I do enjoy the game and the renders are nice. I also appreciate that the lewd scenes are on the longer side and the characters are vocal with the dirty talk. Hopefully the sharing route can be salvaged and get back on course or split the sharing or cheating route off into a separate cuck route for those that want that.

 

[Caninenappe]

I just finished the 2 paths with moody and both are beautiful. Bravo for the writing and for the graphic rendering.
However, I remain convinced that the way of sharing is much more interesting and this road gives more interesting and more exciting situations. But that's just my opinion. I hope pale grass will not abandon this path. Once again congratulations for your wonderful work.

 

[sguru]

Can someone please provide me saves from start of Chapter 2. Thanks

 

[L7Bear]

As someone who lost a dear, close relative this part really got to me.
Half my family got tattoos to mark his passing. I've wanted to, but never really been sure what would be appropriate perfect.
I know that to a LOT of people these AVNs are nothing more than "porn games", but damn. You really nailed this emotion.

(I'm not crying... but it's close.)

Anyway, I found a few more possible typos.
(from the Unofficial Ren'Py edition... which should probably have a separate thread.)

Spoiler: corrections, suggestions, etc

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

btw. Generally, I'm content with (or even prefer) still images, but GODDAMN this deserves an animation (and then some!)

 

[neronwtf]

it's kind of justified that she strays and sees if she can be happier with someone else.

I get what you're saying, but I think as a couple you can be completely satisfied and even in this situation you want to explore other things: threesome, swinging, hotwifing,etc... That's the difference with a cheating path where the female is fucking left and right. You can explore outside even if your partner (female or male) satisfies you.
It's a shame that devs that take the FMC route must do this way to become financially sustainable.

I also appreciate that the lewd scenes are on the longer side and the characters are vocal with the dirty talk. Hopefully the sharing route can be salvaged and get back on course or split the sharing or cheating route off into a separate cuck route for those that want that.

Couldn't agree more with you.

 

[SevenCostanza]

I get what you're saying, but I think as a couple you can be completely satisfied and even in this situation you want to explore other things: threesome, swinging, hotwifing,etc... That's the difference with a cheating path where the female is fucking left and right. You can explore outside even if your partner (female or male) satisfies you.
It's a shame that devs that take the FMC route must do this way to become financially sustainable.


Couldn't agree more with you.

Yea I get what you mean. I'm not sure if you've tried the game "The Adventurous Couple" but it kind of falls victim to the same thing. The original premise was a couple trying to spice up their sex life by experiencing adventures.. as a couple. However as soon as it's established that they can include others in their play (whether together or alone), the female character basically just sleeps with everyone and anyone and lies to the husband about it. The game doesn't even have separate routes for cheating/sharing/cuck etc it just has routes for specific men that she sleeps with (since almost all of them are cheating/cuck). There is no sharing or hotwifing or even doing anything as a couple anymore and the game has devolved into her just sleeping with any old/young/fat/ugly/animal/homeless person that she encounters and trying to jam as many different fetishes and kinks into the scenes. If you try to tell her no or slow down or want to do things just the two of you she gets upset and goes off to cheat more lol. They go on vacation to celebrate their anniversary but she spends the entire time sleeping with other people and lying to the husband about being tired lol. No matter how you play the game, she cheats and lies to the MC. Don't get me wrong the husband is no saint either as he sleeps around too but he tends to follow the rules they laid out while she shits all over them. I don't think I've seen a game that does the sharing in a realistic logical way. They always end up just being cheating/cucks in the end. It's clear at some point the dev changed the story based on the supporters suggestions and so much of the game doesn't make sense and the routes are all a jumbled mess. I'm hopeful this game won't end up the same way.

 

[sguru]

Can someone please provide me saves from start of Chapter 2. Thanks

Anyone?

 

[neronwtf]

'm not sure if you've tried the game "The Adventurous Couple"

Yes, it's the perfect example of a supposedly sharing game turned into a fucking fest without any kind of story behind. Besides, it escalated very quick, so now you have very few fetishes to explore except for the really extreme. In it defense, Anna's character was bolder than your typical shy beauty.

I don't think I've seen a game that does the sharing in a realistic logical way.

I have my hopes with Watching my wife, but let's see.

 

[L7Bear]

Anyone?

So, this is going to be a stupid question, but this is a sandbox game where events happen (or don't) at each possible location for the release... so how does one know if they even have a save that did 100% of Chapter 1 and is thus ready for all the content in Chapter 2?

That said, I'm attaching 14-4-LT1.save which was as far as I got in the Ren'Py version on 18 March ... which was while they were on the bus before the camping trip.
So, it's almost certainly NOT what you are looking for, but maybe it gets you close-ish to what you are looking for? Maybe not.

note: I haven't checked the developer notes for where Ch 1 ended and where Ch 1 began.

 

[PaleGrass]

Will it affect my future gameplay since that scene never happened in my playthrough? I don't wanna miss a scene because of this. I think it was about pervert neighbour.

No, no of course not mate I wouldn't do that to you ^_^

It feels more and more that the sharing path became a cucking path (foursome in the camping, the scene with his boyfriend's boss) and then you have the straight forward cheating path.

It's definitely leaning that way, I mentioned way back months ago and it's referenced in game during the swim trip about the fourth of Lisa's relationship routes. The fourth route actually is a cuck path. I have a good idea how to better frame the relationship paths going into Episode 3, a short scene where the lines are drawn between both parties

This doesn't match his behavior when he was rejected by Lisa (in the faithful path) at the beginning nor his behavior in general with her. He didn't seem like a bad guy, but then in the foursome he's the dominant one and the bad guy.

That's before anything happened between them though, once that was established Calvin becomes jealous and the weak side of jealous at that where it shows in how frustrated he gets.

So why the two paths? It will be easier for you to write only two paths, and let's be honest the cheating path will be the bigger one, as it happen with every female MC game.
Don't get me wrong. Your game is sexually arousing AF, Lisa is very hot and you have an history behind. It's just that when you give the player the chance to have a cheating path and a sharing path, he/she may expect different outcomes. Right now is like a cucking path and it doesn't match with Lisa's personality nor the relation between the two of them.

Because they're two completely separate sets of events and "kinks" I suppose. Lisa's relationship with Danny is only a slice of the game as a whole. Lisa's experiences outside of her relationship are mostly unchanged by it.

I just finished the 2 paths with moody and both are beautiful. Bravo for the writing and for the graphic rendering.
However, I remain convinced that the way of sharing is much more interesting and this road gives more interesting and more exciting situations. But that's just my opinion. I hope pale grass will not abandon this path. Once again congratulations for your wonderful work.

Nice man, glad you liked em ^_^

I'm definitely not abandoning any path, only trying to make them individually better

As someone who lost a dear, close relative this part really got to me.
Half my family got tattoos to mark his passing. I've wanted to, but never really been sure what would be appropriate perfect.
I know that to a LOT of people these AVNs are nothing more than "porn games", but damn. You really nailed this emotion.
View attachment 1761578 View attachment 1761598
(I'm not crying... but it's close.)

Bless you L7Bear, I'm sorry for your loss mate

Anyway, I found a few more possible typos.
(from the Unofficial Ren'Py edition... which should probably have a separate thread.)

Spoiler: corrections, suggestions, etc

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Yeah "let's get stuck in" is probably a very local term to my country now that I think about it, I have been known to use language that doesn't suit the setting ^_^

the "i" and "I" thing is always something I'm conscious of but actually do intentionally when it's preceeded by ".."

I dunno what it is but it just feels like it's a build up or that it's slightly meeker using the lower case after the .. even though it's grammatically incorrect. Aesthetically it looks nicer to my eyes, it's a weird one with me

Much love mate x

Yea I get what you mean. I'm not sure if you've tried the game "The Adventurous Couple" but it kind of falls victim to the same thing. The original premise was a couple trying to spice up their sex life by experiencing adventures.. as a couple. However as soon as it's established that they can include others in their play (whether together or alone), the female character basically just sleeps with everyone and anyone and lies to the husband about it. The game doesn't even have separate routes for cheating/sharing/cuck etc it just has routes for specific men that she sleeps with (since almost all of them are cheating/cuck). There is no sharing or hotwifing or even doing anything as a couple anymore and the game has devolved into her just sleeping with any old/young/fat/ugly/animal/homeless person that she encounters and trying to jam as many different fetishes and kinks into the scenes. If you try to tell her no or slow down or want to do things just the two of you she gets upset and goes off to cheat more lol. They go on vacation to celebrate their anniversary but she spends the entire time sleeping with other people and lying to the husband about being tired lol. No matter how you play the game, she cheats and lies to the MC. Don't get me wrong the husband is no saint either as he sleeps around too but he tends to follow the rules they laid out while she shits all over them. I don't think I've seen a game that does the sharing in a realistic logical way. They always end up just being cheating/cucks in the end. It's clear at some point the dev changed the story based on the supporters suggestions and so much of the game doesn't make sense and the routes are all a jumbled mess. I'm hopeful this game won't end up the same way.

I think the format is entirely different between our games, I haven't played TAC in a very long time but I imagine it's difficult to continue popping out original content when the premise is so restrictive. I don't really see that being a problem here given that the game is functionally an RPG that lives within a city wide story.

The four routes for the Lisa's relationship with Danny are: Faithful, Sharing, Cheating, Cuckolding. The choice between Sharing & Cuckolding is made at the party in Ch3 as noted during the swim trip.

The story itself being centered around the Deloitte family and Lisa's involvement with it is only majorly affected by one relationship path and that is the Faithful route. This is only important as it brings Danny closer to that side of the city where he "changes" things (avoiding spoilers)

This whole convo has given me an idea like I mentioned above though, it's not the ideal scenario (ideally I'd have done it better from the start) but I think it'll better clarify and identify each of the relationship paths

 

[Runner17]

If I could throw my worthless two cents in.

Would've like to seen a stronger Danny that wanted to explore the various sexual boundaries out there. This included multiple types of bondage play.

Rape and blackmail could have stayed out of the story and never missed it. The in house byplay between Lisa and Paul, I was hoping of more of a love/hate relationship. In other words they love to screw each other brains out, but hate each other.

Just personal preferences.

 

[neronwtf]

Lisa's experiences outside of her relationship are mostly unchanged by it.

Sorry if I'm being annoying, but the sharing route it's affected by her relation with her boyfriend. Otherwise it's cheating/ntr or whatever tag it's appropriate.
However I'm glad to hear that those two routes will be differentiated in next updates, because until now cucking route and sharing route were the same.

I don't really see that being a problem here given that the game is functionally an RPG that lives within a city wide story.

Because compared to the other game you have an interesting story and you developed the relations between the characters, in relation with Lisa but also between them. And your MC and your renders in general are outstanding.