- Mar 13, 2020
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- Thread starter Ryahn
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- Mar 13, 2020
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AFAIK Shigeo Hamashima is a woman, not a man.This time it's master Hamashima Shigeo's workYou must be registered to see the linksHe wasn't only working with Clock Up, but yeah, he did art for some of the most famous Clock Up's games like Euphoria and he's really really good.
- Mar 13, 2020
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- Aug 22, 2018
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I'd dispute that. Unless you mean "good" very strictly, I think there are several characters who have this feature --
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- Mar 13, 2020
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I think after you get ending 2 you have to replay the game, but not by reinstalling it or anything, just going back to the title page and starting again. This time, if you make the same choice that took you to ending 2, the same path will start, but at some point you will get several new questions having to do with the level of empathy of the main character for the witches. If you select low-empathy choices, then you'll get ending 2 again. If you select high-empathy choices, you'll get ending 3.
- Mar 13, 2020
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Personally, I find them equivalent, morally speaking. But since I am more of a romantic and believe individuality (eros) is deeper than abstract love (agape), I feel better with the Ashes and Diamonds ending. (Besides, Ashes and Diamonds fills certain gaps -- What did that girl really say to Shogo? What was the true depth of Shimon's interest in Jane Doe? -- that the other endings don't.)
- Mar 13, 2020
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I'm not sure this is the right forum for this kind of discussion, but the lockdown means I have tons of free time right now, so...
This is ONE way of using violence in art. There are others. I don't deny the validity of what you're saying, I just think you're excluding many things that do interest us and that are an important part of art in general.
MOST people where I come from even think sex should only happen after marriage. And also think science fiction, one of my favorite genres, is a total waste of time. So--what's your point? The tastes of MOST people do not define the limits of art, or even of human taste in all its facets. And, as I say below, MOST people still pay good money to see horror movies with graphic violence. The real question here is, why?
But you've just named a big problem with your argument. Why is there a whole genre ("horror") dedicated to the violence you claim most people are revolted by? Considering how much money all the violent horror movies make, can you really say there is no interest in violence for violence's sake in fiction? (I think it would be more interesting to ask why there is such an interest than simply trying to deny that it even exists.)
But violence IS prototypically the application of power (rape is, after all, a form of violence), because it -- prototypically -- has to go against the consent of the violated party, or else there is no violation, no violence. (Or do you consider, say, helping someone commit suicide also violence?)
Yes, but, especially in the B and D parts, violence is its language. You really need the language of chains and whips to make it work. It has to be pretend violence for today's sane-safe-consensual paradigm to apply, but the aesthetics of violence has to be there, or else you go back to vanilla.
That is true. A kink, after all -- by definition! -- is not a mainstream interest. Yet... considering the success of violence on screen (see "Seven," "Saw," etc.) or in book format, I think you need some nuance there. The US seems fascinated by serial killers (there's even a deck of cards with them, and shows that humanize them like Dexter). Most people may be revolted by violence, or so they say, but a surprisingly high number of them pays good money to see it or read descriptions of it.
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- Jun 6, 2017
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Interesting, didn't know that. That honestly surprised me. Thanks for the info.
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Here's an interview with her at the Mangagamer site, if you're interested.Interesting, didn't know that. That honestly surprised me. Thanks for the info.
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The exclusion was intentional. This comment was a refutation of another comment about the use of violence in Action Movies being enjoyable because violence itself is enjoyable.
This is a false premise. You are comparing a cultural stigma relating to sex, to a generalized human reaction that exists entirely outside that context. Learning it isn't required. Empathy takes care of it.
The comment you quoted was refuting the idea that most people ENJOY violence. Whether something is or is not art was not part of the question.
It is exactly the opposite of this actually. Bondage requires only a form of restraint. Domination only requires the acceptance of power. Telling someone to "Sit in this chair facing the corner. Listen to what I'm doing. Don't move. And don't make a sound." qualifies as both B and D (Though it does stretch the Bondage part pretty far.)
Sadism and Masochism on the other hand DO require violence. Of a sort at least. Though the question of violence and consent still applies. If violence cannot exist alongside consent, then S&M is just the giving/receiving of pain.
The horror genre is not about violence. It is about the removal of power, and the helplessness that the main characters and audience feel as a result of it. There IS a sub-genre of horror that is dedicated to violence though. And in my comment above I specifically talk about how the whole point of the sub-genre itself is to provoke disgust.
As you say a few lines up. Art. Or, at the very least, an intentional application of something to provoke a feeling. People pay good money to be disgusted, because they WANT to be disgusted. Just like people paying to go see a sad movie. They want the experience.
I like the other ClockUp games I've played, but I'm not super into hard guro. Can anyone who's finished this give me an idea of what percentage of the scenes in this are guro? For the record I'm not counting shit like ryona, I mean shit as serious as screenshot 4 in the OP.
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Pretty much every H scene (with a few significant exceptions) is quite disturbing. If you mean "guro" as in bodily mutiliation or destruction (including piercing through organs, burning, etc.), then about 1/3 of the scenes (i.e., some 4-5 per route) have it, the others having more "normal" amounts of body violence and more emphasis on disgusting things like brain-fucking or all kinds of interactions between maggots/tentacles/baby maggots and body parts). In my personal experience, if you're not into guro and extreme violence, 3/4 of all H-scenes are to be CTRL-ed through as quickly as possible (though in some scenes there are some character development bits -- you'll miss those if you go too fast).
- Mar 22, 2018
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Ooook, I was maybe thinking of giving this one a try if it was only the mutilation(guro is a hard no-go for me, but I was willing to overlook the sexual aspect of the scenes as much as possible), but hearing about brain fucking and maggots is making me not want to touch this game with a 20 foot pole. Thanks for the detailed warning!
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Always ready to help!
Honestly, though, the story is interesting enough that I would still recommend it, at least to those who can tolerate violence (or are good at CTRL-ing through scenes), if you are interested in some deep philosophical and moral questions. Maybe you've seen MangaGamer's two videos on Maggot Baits? I'm adding the links below in case you haven't. They try to make this point. MB is also a rather well-written story on the human condition and the nature of love.
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You must be registered to see the links
- Mar 22, 2018
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That's a compelling argument and the videos were a worthwhile watch. Alright, I'll be putting it back on my bucket list. Thanks for the recommendation!Always ready to help!
Honestly, though, the story is interesting enough that I would still recommend it, at least to those who can tolerate violence (or are good at CTRL-ing through scenes), if you are interested in some deep philosophical and moral questions. Maybe you've seen MangaGamer's two videos on Maggot Baits? I'm adding the links below in case you haven't. They try to make this point. MB is also a rather well-written story on the human condition and the nature of love.
You must be registered to see the links
You must be registered to see the links
Can somebody please help me with this error message? It´s the only thing appearing after trying to play the novel.
- Mar 13, 2020
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Did you try Japanese localization before running, via e.g. Locale Emulator?
I downloaded a paid copy from the MangaGamer website, and it worked well.