Comics Collection Melissa N. Collection [2024-06-23] [Melissa N.]

[Thalantyr]

The "too deep method acting" combined with the memory loss could come from a heavy trauma Andrew experience, which should technically be right after leaving the hospital. If we try to stay more medical/"realistic" here then it must have been so bad that his mind escaped into the Elena persona as a defensive mechanism. I'm unsure if just being full in makeup and seeing the new Elena-disguise is what caused the memory loss alone.

I was thinking that the trauma in this case is Andrew seeing himself in the mirror and realizing that he really is Elena now and there's no going back. His life as a man is truly gone forever.

I'm curious to hear what type of endings the rest of you are hoping for.

For me, Andrew chooses to stay as Elena. Reality is altered so that Elena has always existed. Nikos has always been the loving husband of Elena. Elena is the real mother of Eva and Sofia. Marina never married Andrew since he never existed, so James can be turned into her real husband without us fans hating on Marina and feeling like the story went too NTR-ish (not that I have any problems with NTR).

I want bad endings for bad people and good endings for good people. The problem is I can't tell who is good and who is bad yet!

Because of the whole "forced/unhappy marriage" thing, there's still the possibility that even Andrew and/or Marina are bad. If Andrew is bad, I'm fine with him being trapped as Nikos' sex slave. If he's good, I want him to accept/enjoy being Elena and to find happiness with someone else who's good. Maybe Nikos, maybe Marina, maybe Seferi. If Marina is bad, I'm fine with her uncle stealing her husband from her. If she's good, I want her to end up with either Elena or James. If Nikos is good, I want him to finally find happiness with Elena. If he's bad, he should go to jail. Or get killed by Toska or something. In order for me to feel like this is a well-written story, the mafia subplot definitely needs to be heavy integrated into the ending, which your ending doesn't account for at all. Can you find a way to integrate Toska/Seferi/Joel/Gjoka into your ideal ending somehow?

 

[LadyBoyJay]

Because of the whole "forced/unhappy marriage" thing, there's still the possibility that even Andrew and/or Marina are bad. If Andrew is bad, I'm fine with him being trapped as Nikos' sex slave. If he's good, I want him to accept/enjoy being Elena and to find happiness with someone else who's good. Maybe Nikos, maybe Marina, maybe Seferi. If Marina is bad, I'm fine with her uncle stealing her husband from her. If she's good, I want her to end up with either Elena or James. If Nikos is good, I want him to finally find happiness with Elena. If he's bad, he should go to jail. Or get killed by Toska or something. In order for me to feel like this is a well-written story, the mafia subplot definitely needs to be heavy integrated into the ending, which your ending doesn't account for at all. Can you find a way to integrate Toska/Seferi/Joel/Gjoka into your ideal ending somehow?

For me, it is too late to "reveal" or "retcon" Andrew (our beloved protagonist) as a bad guy. I simply wouldn't find that to be believable. Maybe I could believe Marina being a secret villain, but I really wouldn't enjoy that. Other than her willingness to get James involved into a dangerous situation, she has seemed like a decent person (who just needs to learn how to become a better listener ).

In order for me to feel like this is a well-written story, the mafia subplot definitely needs to be heavy integrated into the ending, which your ending doesn't account for at all. Can you find a way to integrate Toska/Seferi/Joel/Gjoka into your ideal ending somehow?

Nope, because I haven't seen Melissa start to account for them either. That whole subplot has felt strange from the very beginning. I have no idea where Melissa is going with it. If James had turned out to be a secret undercover agent, I could have seen some possible endings involving that. If Aphrodite were to get involved and rewrite history, the whole mafia subplot would basically disappear.

 

[Stevedore100]

Only Marina, I believe, and only at the hospital during the flashback. Other than that, the only indication we have that Marina knows that Elena is really Andrew is when she kept trying to use the 'earrings' code word. We didn't hear Sofia's side of the phone conversation, and Marina refers to him as "Aunt Elena" during that call.

Nikos has even gone as far to say he's never heard of Andrew Woods:
View attachment 3466260

Angeliki denied having met Andrew when he still looked like a man:
View attachment 3466272 View attachment 3466275

The one time Nikos seems to drop the act is when he says "this isn't a game anymore" and he wants to be with Elena forever, for real:
View attachment 3466312

This line doesn't make any sense if they've really been together for 30 years, as Nikos had been pretending up to that point.


Yes. Sophia could have responded with "what are you talking about" to Marina, though Marina seems to reference some details that indicates Sofia is aware of what's going on post surgery. It's hazy.

Back early in in the first salon visit, one of the daughters yells Andrew that the other workers will be assisting, sine if them should know, not sure if that includes Angeliki or not. In any event they seem insignificant to anything. I doubt Angeliki has much of a role here.

I'm also thinking about Elena's response to Marina's question at the end of the last segment. So far I've come up with:

"Define sex"
Or
"If you could see what your uncle has under his pants, you wouldn't be asking this"
Or
"Did I just hear a gunshot!"

 

[Stevedore100]

For me, it is too late to "reveal" or "retcon" Andrew (our beloved protagonist) as a bad guy. I simply wouldn't find that to be believable. Maybe I could believe Marina being a secret villain, but I really wouldn't enjoy that. Other than her willingness to get James involved into a dangerous situation, she has seemed like a decent person (who just needs to learn how to become a better listener ).



Nope, because I haven't seen Melissa start to account for them either. That whole subplot has felt strange from the very beginning. I have no idea where Melissa is going with it. If James had turned out to be a secret undercover agent, I could have seen some possible endings involving that. If Aphrodite were to get involved and rewrite history, the whole mafia subplot would basically disappear.

I kinda agree here because so much of this has been Andrews internal monologue and he seems generally mystified with what's going on and wanting to get back with Marina, at least nothing to indicate he's a heel. If he is bad, it would seem to mean he has blocked off a bunch of his past from himself. In this story that doesn't seem impossible, but still seems unlikely.

As far as the underworld plot goes,maybe we will get more if an idea when we find out what Seferi was up to by shooting Joel. He had some plan apparently.

 

[MyraTSF]

I kinda agree here because so much of this has been Andrews internal monologue and he seems generally mystified with what's going on and wanting to get back with Marina, at least nothing to indicate he's a heel. If he is bad, it would seem to mean he has blocked off a bunch of his past from himself. In this story that doesn't seem impossible, but still seems unlikely.

As far as the underworld plot goes,maybe we will get more if an idea when we find out what Seferi was up to by shooting Joel. He had some plan apparently.

Joel will end up as a MILF too

 

[Thalantyr]

I'm also thinking about Elena's response to Marina's question at the end of the last segment. So far I've come up with:

"Define sex"
Or
"If you could see what your uncle has under his pants, you wouldn't be asking this"
Or
"Did I just hear a gunshot!"

That's why I was so frustrated with the ending of this part, because I can picture the stupid cliche line already:
"Wait, I can explain!"
And then Marina storms off and they never talk about it again so the argument goes unresolved for another 1000 pages. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Joel will end up as a MILF too

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. Keep the glasses as part of his wardrobe.

 

[MyraTSF]

Nah for real. Imagine if we have 2 transformations into the same thing in 1 story. If Melissa would do that (chance close to 0) it would be insane but also quite brave.

 

[MyraTSF]

That's why I was so frustrated with the ending of this part, because I can picture the stupid cliche line already:
"Wait, I can explain!"
And then Marina storms off and they never talk about it again so the argument goes unresolved for another 1000 pages. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

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. Keep the glasses as part of his wardrobe.

Sounds like your average anime rom-com drama were literally nobody takes 1 minute to hear the other ones side of the story and most misinformations get solved instantly

 

[MyraTSF]

I'm curious to hear what type of endings the rest of you are hoping for.

My theory is:
It will be somewhat of a bittersweet ending.

Marina: I don't think she will end up with James. James is too conveniently placed. He's tall, he's handsome, good looking. He's everything Andrew was (or wasn't depends whom you ask), and this is one of the reasons I think she won't end up with him. This whole vacation can't leave her unaffected. Her husband became her uncles wife and she jumps INSTANTLY into the arms of someone else, but having the audacity to have the moral authority of "one has to keep their word" which would also apply to her as she's still married technically. Too much character breaking. You can say what you want about what happened to Andrew, this wouldn't justify her making a 180 and just jump into he arms of someone else. On top of that he hides her greek language knowledge from James for a reason. Who's chesspiece James is, not sure but wouldn't matter for my theory.

Toska: I think Toska is the least evil. This whole story about him could be made up or just misinformation. It's easy to fabricate fakenews nowdays or read about things that are blown out of proportion. Seferi and one of the daughters fed Andrew and Marina all the information that they are all in danger. Meanwhile the daughters, Nikos, Seferis and even Joels goals align way too much against Toska that I can't see that these 2 camps work independently. Toska could find many other business partner in greece without going through all the CIA observation shit just to make sure his business partners wife is really his wife (or even a woman). I think Toska will be important to the story later on, but in terms of assisting Elena and Marina.

Elena: Andrew will most likely accept there no way back as the surgery were way too brutal to be undone. Legally being married to Nikos will provide a good financial safety net when Nikos and his "daughters" downfall comes. Marinas mother may speak highly of her brother, but lets be honest most serial killers were charming people no one saw the signs. A bit extreme comparison but you get the picture.

Elana will probably end up as a TV soap actress in greece or goes back to the US and become an actress there finally being successfull in her profession, just not the way expected and Marina will just move on with her life. Probably a bit heartbroken and scarred but it is what it is.

 

[rebirth095]

That's why I was so frustrated with the ending of this part, because I can picture the stupid cliche line already:
"Wait, I can explain!"
And then Marina storms off and they never talk about it again so the argument goes unresolved for another 1000 pages. AAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

Nah, we'd cut to a flashback of the sex, and then go into the dream sequence, so we can have another flashback in our flashback.

I'm curious to hear what type of endings the rest of you are hoping for.

Ending would have to depend on the story, so I think if I had to say where I am/was hoping the story would go:

Eva will be revealed to have been a son that had been feminized to be married for alliances with different mob families. Sofia was Nikos's favorite daughter, and Sofia herself didn't want to be offered up, and so they feminized the useless younger son to fit the role. Normally, this involves drugs to alter the mental state for compliance, hence Eva's more passive role, generally speaking.

This has been a trap more for Marina, as Nikos and Sofia planned to offer her up as a bride. But for that, they wanted to get Andrew out of the way. Plus, Nikos is a perverse man. So they cooked up a story and drugged him using the mind altering drugs they'd used on Eva. However, what they didn't count on was Andrew having a split personality. He thinks its method acting, but it's not. As such, when he seems to fall completely into the role, they assume their brainwashing has been successful, unaware that the other personality has interfered with the drugs.

The real reason why Marina was being followed is that they're just looking into their new bride. Maybe making evaluations of what changes they wish to have done to her.

I'd have it where Elena, who they now believe is fully brainwashed, is instructed to drug Marina and start her brainwashing. Since Andrew is still in there, he's able to fake it with his acting skills, and they're able to set up Nikos and Seferi to be arrested. Joel manages to escape, but due to his failures, Toska has Sofia feminize him. Sofia has "escaped" justice, but she's stuck doing the bidding of a powerful crime family, the fate she was trying to avoid in the first place.

Andrew is too far gone to be Andrew again, but reverses some of the aging so that Elena can have some of her youth back. Having survived their ordeal, but not quite able to go "back to normal", Elena and Marina are more like sisters, having their freedom, and just as importantly, still having each other.

TLDR: More feminization in my feminization story, please!

 

[Thalantyr]

Her husband became her uncles wife and she jumps INSTANTLY into the arms of someone else, but having the audacity to have the moral authority of "one has to keep their word" which would also apply to her as she's still married technically. Too much character breaking. You can say what you want about what happened to Andrew, this wouldn't justify her making a 180 and just jump into he arms of someone else.

You'd really blame Marina for pursuing another relationship after her husband abandoned her and married her uncle? That's cold.

Toska: I think Toska is the least evil. This whole story about him could be made up or just misinformation. It's easy to fabricate fakenews nowdays or read about things that are blown out of proportion. Seferi and one of the daughters fed Andrew and Marina all the information that they are all in danger. Meanwhile the daughters, Nikos, Seferis and even Joels goals align way too much against Toska that I can't see that these 2 camps work independently. Toska could find many other business partner in greece without going through all the CIA observation shit just to make sure his business partners wife is really his wife (or even a woman). I think Toska will be important to the story later on, but in terms of assisting Elena and Marina.

This would not surprise me at all. There's very little evidence of Toska being a bad guy at all other than the word of a few shady people.

Ending would have to depend on the story, so I think if I had to say where I am/was hoping the story would go:

Eva will be revealed to have been a son that had been feminized to be married for alliances with different mob families. Sofia was Nikos's favorite daughter, and Sofia herself didn't want to be offered up, and so they feminized the useless younger son to fit the role. Normally, this involves drugs to alter the mental state for compliance, hence Eva's more passive role, generally speaking.

This has been a trap more for Marina, as Nikos and Sofia planned to offer her up as a bride. But for that, they wanted to get Andrew out of the way. Plus, Nikos is a perverse man. So they cooked up a story and drugged him using the mind altering drugs they'd used on Eva. However, what they didn't count on was Andrew having a split personality. He thinks its method acting, but it's not. As such, when he seems to fall completely into the role, they assume their brainwashing has been successful, unaware that the other personality has interfered with the drugs.

The real reason why Marina was being followed is that they're just looking into their new bride. Maybe making evaluations of what changes they wish to have done to her.

I'd have it where Elena, who they now believe is fully brainwashed, is instructed to drug Marina and start her brainwashing. Since Andrew is still in there, he's able to fake it with his acting skills, and they're able to set up Nikos and Seferi to be arrested. Joel manages to escape, but due to his failures, Toska has Sofia feminize him. Sofia has "escaped" justice, but she's stuck doing the bidding of a powerful crime family, the fate she was trying to avoid in the first place.

Andrew is too far gone to be Andrew again, but reverses some of the aging so that Elena can have some of her youth back. Having survived their ordeal, but not quite able to go "back to normal", Elena and Marina are more like sisters, having their freedom, and just as importantly, still having each other.

TLDR: More feminization in my feminization story, please!

That all sounds great (especially the part about Eva- I keep holding out hope for that ), except that Melissa specifically said no hypnosis, no mind control. That's why it has to be method acting/dissociative identity. And from what we've seen, Joanna's drug is just something like rohypnol, basically a similar effect to drinking a shitload of alcohol (which also seems to cause problems for Andrew). If there are going to be other feminized characters, they'd need to be physically forced (Joel) or perhaps coerced/threatened/blackmailed (Eva). Or Eva could even be voluntary. She seemed pretty damn happy to see Stefanos again when he was first introduced.

 

[MyraTSF]

You'd really blame Marina for pursuing another relationship after her husband abandoned her and married her uncle? That's cold.

Just the timing. If she falls into someone elses arms WHILE shit is still going on then, yeah I would blame her.

That all sounds great (especially the part about Eva- I keep holding out hope for that ), except that Melissa specifically said no hypnosis, no mind control. That's why it has to be method acting/dissociative identity. And from what we've seen, Joanna's drug is just something like rohypnol, basically a similar effect to drinking a shitload of alcohol (which also seems to cause problems for Andrew). If there are going to be other feminized characters, they'd need to be physically forced (Joel) or perhaps coerced/threatened/blackmailed (Eva). Or Eva could even be voluntary. She seemed pretty damn happy to see Stefanos again when he was first introduced.

Wouldn't the doctor notice signs of a patient being under some kind of influence? Or maybe it's just a bad doctor

 

[rebirth095]

That all sounds great (especially the part about Eva- I keep holding out hope for that ), except that Melissa specifically said no hypnosis, no mind control. That's why it has to be method acting/dissociative identity. And from what we've seen, Joanna's drug is just something like rohypnol, basically a similar effect to drinking a shitload of alcohol (which also seems to cause problems for Andrew). If there are going to be other feminized characters, they'd need to be physically forced (Joel) or perhaps coerced/threatened/blackmailed (Eva). Or Eva could even be voluntary. She seemed pretty damn happy to see Stefanos again when he was first introduced.

You're right, of course. But this is my pitch of what I'm hoping for/what I'd do to "salvage" the story. Because without some kind of brainwashing, or at least being drugged up to be compliant, I really can't reconcile how Nikos could possibly have anticipated that Andrew just accepts being Elena. Even if Andrew had an episode before where he got lost in a role, that's an absurd gamble. I don't find the answer that it's method acting satisfying at all, as it requires loads of contrivances and coincidences to occur for it to "work". I accept that this is the direction Melissa is taking the story (and the plan all a long), but it sure wouldn't be a plot point I would personally commit to if I were the one writing the story.

Wouldn't the doctor notice signs of a patient being under some kind of influence? Or maybe it's just a bad doctor

I mean, the easiest answer would be if Nikos is part of these criminal organizations, he might have the doctor in his pocket. Alternatively, he's just really into testing out these procedures

 

[Thalantyr]

Just the timing. If she falls into someone elses arms WHILE shit is still going on then, yeah I would blame her.

Even if Andrew sat down with Marina and told her directly, "I'm leaving you for Nikos. This is not part of the act. I'm in love with him"? If so, why is he allowed to leave the marriage and she's not?

Wouldn't the doctor notice signs of a patient being under some kind of influence? Or maybe it's just a bad doctor

You kind of already have to assume he's terrible (or just ignore a minor plot hole) based on what we've seen already. Elena was totally zonked out during that consultation, fuzzy vision, not listening to him. He even had to ask if she was paying attention. And then she basically just smiled and nodded through the rest of the consultation. Plus many of those procedures are highly unethical (paralyzing the tongue, irradiating the skin, etc) and doctors in most parts of the world would lose their license for attempting them. But you have to sacrifice realism if you're going to write about a fetish that would be nearly impossible in real life.

 

[Thalantyr]

You're right, of course. But this is my pitch of what I'm hoping for/what I'd do to "salvage" the story. Because without some kind of brainwashing, or at least being drugged up to be compliant, I really can't reconcile how Nikos could possibly have anticipated that Andrew just accepts being Elena. Even if Andrew had an episode before where he got lost in a role, that's an absurd gamble. I don't find the answer that it's method acting satisfying at all, as it requires loads of contrivances and coincidences to occur for it to "work". I accept that this is the direction Melissa is taking the story (and the plan all a long), but it sure wouldn't be a plot point I would personally commit to if I were the one writing the story.

Ahh, I see. Yeah that makes sense. Just because she said earlier that there's no mind control, that doesn't mean she couldn't change her mind and now introduce mind control to explain parts of the story that don't make sense.

I'm still holding out hope that Nikos is somehow a good guy, or at worst a weak-willed horny old man, who never intended to transform Andrew when he first invited him and Marina to stay with them in Greece. I still don't know how to explain his treatment of Marina, but it's hard to explain him being evil too, as you've said, without mind control.

 

[MyraTSF]

Even if Andrew sat down with Marina and told her directly, "I'm leaving you for Nikos. This is not part of the act. I'm in love with him"? If so, why is he allowed to leave the marriage and she's not?

Well Andrew never made some kind of moral rules like "keep your word" like Marina at the start of the story which led to his transformation. But if she still goes over to James so quick then I wonder how much she even loved Andrew in the first place

 

[Thalantyr]

Well Andrew never made some kind of moral rules like "keep your word" like Marina at the start of the story which led to his transformation. But if she still goes over to James so quick then I wonder how much she even loved Andrew in the first place

O_O

So even though he cheated on her, and he effectively ended their marriage by falling in love with someone else, somehow she's at fault if she pursues James after Andrew has already left her?!?!?

I don't understand that logic even a tiny little bit.

Edit: Oh, I just realized what you were talking about when you referenced "keep your word". I'm pretty sure Marina is angrily describing what Andrew is going to do based on his past actions (the incident from a few months ago), she's not telling him what he should do and certainly not what she wants him to do. But no matter how you interpret this scene, it certainly doesn't excuse him cheating on her IMO.

Here's the scene if anyone else wants to weigh in:


She says "You won't give up," like she knows what he's going to do, not "You can't give up," like she's giving him an order.

 

[MyraTSF]

O_O

So even though he cheated on her, and he effectively ended their marriage by falling in love with someone else, somehow she's at fault if she pursues James after Andrew has already left her?!?!?

I don't understand that logic even a tiny little bit.

Edit: Oh, I just realized what you were talking about when you referenced "keep your word". I'm pretty sure Marina is angrily describing what Andrew is going to do based on his past actions (the incident from a few months ago), she's not telling him what he should do and certainly not what she wants him to do. But no matter how you interpret this scene, it certainly doesn't excuse him cheating on her IMO.

Here's the scene if anyone else wants to weigh in:
View attachment 3467027

Nothing excuses his cheating, but she would be kind of a hypocrite saying this, and jumping to James next best chance (assuming this is where it's heading). Just because Andrew is morally bankrupt doesn't mean she has to follow that path as well.

 

[Thalantyr]

Nothing excuses his cheating, but she would be kind of a hypocrite saying this, and jumping to James next best chance (assuming this is where it's heading). Just because Andrew is morally bankrupt doesn't mean she has to follow that path as well.

What is hypocritical about a single woman, who has just been dumped and heartbroken, seeking out new companionship? Do you think she's breaking her word? If so, what word? Her marriage vows would already be nullified by that point because Andrew chose to end the marriage.

 

[LadyBoyJay]

Here's the scene if anyone else wants to weigh in:
View attachment 3467027

She says "You won't give up," like she knows what he's going to do, not "You can't give up," like she's giving him an order.

I interpret that as a demanding order. Especially with the preceding exclamation point and the emphasis on "Aunt Elena". If Marina had said, "You're not going to give up, are you?", then it would be more of a statement about what she expected him to do regardless of how she felt about it.

What is hypocritical about a single woman, who has just been dumped and heartbroken, seeking out new companionship? Do you think she's breaking her word? If so, what word? Her marriage vows would already be nullified by that point because Andrew chose to end the marriage.

Marina is arguably the most responsible for pushing Andrew/Elena into the arms of her Uncle. Her actions and inactions shoulder much of the blame for the entire situation spiraling out of control. Was she dumped? Officially, not yet, but it sure seems that way. Did she unintentionally push her husband away? Yes, she did.

She does appear to be a victim in this. The marriage is not technically over unless Andrew has somehow been declared dead or was magically erased from history. Remember, Andrew could literally go to a US Embassy, get fingerprinted and submit to a DNA test to re-establish his identity. Having a sex change operation in the "real world", does not delete your legal identity.