xapican
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DaFinker
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MarsUltor
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DaFinker
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True enough (upon reflection); however, the number of people that would use "myself" versus "me" in an actual spoken-language situation makes it a distinction that is probably moving towards extinction.
We all know that language evolves, and that what is spoken may often vary from what is written with technical correctness (the reason for the caveat in my post). This is one of those things that seems to have nearly evolved out of the spoken language - for better or worse, it just doesn't "sound" right to people and is usually associated with a bit of narcissism. It's one of the reasons that, when I put my editor hat on, the suggested corrections vary depending upon whether it is a legal brief/professional whitepaper, or a script for spoken dialogue. When it's the latter, the character's age, education, ethnicity, regionality and first language all come into play when figuring out "how" they would say something. Very few people speak with the formality of correctly written language, and those that do probably know the nuances of the inside of their HS locker door quite well.
xapican
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Oh that not only happens in English language, same situation in German, and Spanish.True enough (upon reflection); however, the number of people that would use "myself" versus "me" in an actual spoken-language situation makes it a distinction that is probably moving towards extinction.
We all know that language evolves, and that what is spoken may often vary from what is written with technical correctness (the reason for the caveat in my post). This is one of those things that seems to have nearly evolved out of the spoken language - for better or worse, it just doesn't "sound" right to people and is usually associated with a bit of narcissism. It's one of the reasons that, when I put my editor hat on, the suggested corrections vary depending upon whether it is a legal brief/professional whitepaper, or a script for spoken dialogue. When it's the latter, the character's age, education, ethnicity, regionality and first language all come into play when figuring out "how" they would say something. Very few people speak with the formality of correctly written language, and those that do probably know the nuances of the inside of their HS locker door quite well.
The Germans even have a saying "Der Esel nennt sich immer zuerst!" (the dunce names himself first)
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I agree. Spoken language and written language is very different, especially in English. Most people in Spain talk (or try to talk) like they would write (and yes, that includes young people talking weirdly because they write weirdly because of cell phones). Slang, non-accepted contractions, etc. are related to low-culture people here, sometimes wrongly, so most people (beyond 30) try to avoid them.True enough (upon reflection); however, the number of people that would use "myself" versus "me" in an actual spoken-language situation makes it a distinction that is probably moving towards extinction.
We all know that language evolves, and that what is spoken may often vary from what is written with technical correctness (the reason for the caveat in my post). This is one of those things that seems to have nearly evolved out of the spoken language - for better or worse, it just doesn't "sound" right to people and is usually associated with a bit of narcissism. It's one of the reasons that, when I put my editor hat on, the suggested corrections vary depending upon whether it is a legal brief/professional whitepaper, or a script for spoken dialogue. When it's the latter, the character's age, education, ethnicity, regionality and first language all come into play when figuring out "how" they would say something. Very few people speak with the formality of correctly written language, and those that do probably know the nuances of the inside of their HS locker door quite well.
Remember that, in Spanish, we have the "el burro delante para que no se espante" (the donkey first so he doesn't get scared; donkey has a negative component in Spanish, like saying someone is a fool) when someone says something like "I and you" (incorrect in Spanish, the "I" should be always at the end).
xapican
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Damn, right I forgot totally ! sounds even better in spanish, since it rimes
which I always wondered why in Spanish this kind of sayings rime.
I guess the Donkey is associated in all cultures unfairly as dumb (actually they are smarter than horses or dogs)
DaFinker
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"You and I" is also the proper "ordering" for English. As for "donkey" - I think in the US we simply use "ass" (we love dual meanings), but "donkey" also pops up, though I think it may be moreso for British English than US (well, I've heard Gordon Ramsay use it often enough..."speaking" of someone who has a tendency to be an ass
). I suppose it could be used regionally, but it isn't something you hear around my way. Considering how hard working of a beast a donkey is, at least in a farming community, it might be more likely to be held in reverence, so long as it isn't stubborn as a mule. Since this arrived while I was posting.... Another oddity of English: the word is spelled "rhyme". Don't ask - I didn't make the rules!
And rhyming is fun because it has rhythm.
Just had to throw that in - they both use that "rhy" and both evoke a "lyrical/musical" feel.
blkcrow20
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I do hear ass used more often than donkey, but I have heard donkey used often enough in the US. Probably a regional thing.
xapican
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xapican
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Ohh big thank you ! and also for the "bridge" I as so often wrote again Spanglish"You and I" is also the proper "ordering" for English. As for "donkey" - I think in the US we simply use "ass" (we love dual meanings), but "donkey" also pops up, though I think it may be moreso for British English than US (well, I've heard Gordon Ramsay use it often enough..."speaking" of someone who has a tendency to be an ass
Since this arrived while I was posting.... Another oddity of English: the word is spelled "rhyme". Don't ask - I didn't make the rules!
And rhyming is fun because it has rhythm.
Just had to throw that in - they both use that "rhy" and both evoke a "lyrical/musical" feel.
rhyme = rima in Spanishfunny detail : the "bridge" is called "Eselsbrücke" in German (lit. Donkeybridge; although applying the new learnd coloquialism "Assbridge"
DaFinker
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Since Trope is on (or was), I had also just finished the Day 21 scene with Norah and had observations - yeah, one was grammar. "Speaking" of grammar, if Olivia had been an English teacher, instead of "Meemaw" they could have called her "Grammar". Yeah, yeah, groan all you like.
The last is first:
I know - you want to give people a choice, but I think, given MC's nature, he might have come up with this, and told her "With a 'ph' because you are always pretty, hot and tempting to me!" So, keeping the nickname, but giving it new meaning.
Or ,in this universe, did that arrogant Austrian try to change American colloquialisms along with measures and mores?
"Speaking" of grammar, if Olivia had been an English teacher, instead of "Meemaw" they could have called her "Grammar". Yeah, yeah, groan all you like. The last is first:
I know - you want to give people a choice, but I think, given MC's nature, he might have come up with this, and told her "With a 'ph' because you are always pretty, hot and tempting to me!" So, keeping the nickname, but giving it new meaning.
Or ,in this universe, did that arrogant Austrian try to change American colloquialisms along with measures and mores?
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blkcrow20
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Trop probably went and changed it after I proofread it.
j/k I do the proofreading but I'm only human. I miss some of them, some of the time.
DaFinker
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In the last few companies I worked for (independent now), I was usually the guy they gave things to AFTER everyone else said it was perfect - business & legal stuff. And, yeah - they all hated me.Trop probably went and changed it after I proofread it.
j/k I do the proofreading but I'm only human. I miss some of them, some of the time.
Though, if I had been the first proofreader and handed it off to someone else, they would have found things as well - just the nature of the beast. And I did always have a couple of folks that I gave my own stuff to after doing two or three reads of it myself, and usually had something come back to me.
And, for JayDub47: I used it. Of course, it isn't part of a string and is a slightly different grammatical context.
snakeplisskin
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Props for being able to focus on grammer during a Nora scene.Since Trope is on (or was), I had also just finished the Day 21 scene with Norah and had observations - yeah, one was grammar.
The last is first:
View attachment 4817610
I know - you want to give people a choice, but I think, given MC's nature, he might have come up with this, and told her "With a 'ph' because you are always pretty, hot and tempting to me!" So, keeping the nickname, but giving it new meaning.
Or ,in this universe, did that arrogant Austrian try to change American colloquialisms along with measures and mores?
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xapican
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I know right the girls are so hot that your reading glasses and monitor always are foggy ......Trop probably went and changed it after I proofread it.
j/k I do the proofreading but I'm only human. I miss some of them, some of the time.
Elhemeer
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Regardless of region, "donkey" tends to be used more than "ass" by fans of a particular movie franchise named after it's green-skinned protagonist ..."You and I" is also the proper "ordering" for English. As for "donkey" - I think in the US we simply use "ass" (we love dual meanings), but "donkey" also pops up, though I think it may be moreso for British English than US (well, I've heard Gordon Ramsay use it often enough..."speaking" of someone who has a tendency to be an ass
Since this arrived while I was posting.... Another oddity of English: the word is spelled "rhyme". Don't ask - I didn't make the rules!
And rhyming is fun because it has rhythm.
Just had to throw that in - they both use that "rhy" and both evoke a "lyrical/musical" feel.
e6mill
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If you can't tell the difference between a burro and a burrow you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground.
Elhemeer
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johnpouljones
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I have heard that there are places in the world where boys only learn to write and girls read. And communication works.I....I...I can't read ......