Kenzy01
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Dan5k74
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Speaking of the dress, why does everyone keep thinking that it must have been Christian who sent that dress to the Harris' house? I wouldn't take that for granted. What if it was actually Hutch?
I mean, up until that morning Christian barely knew that Hutch had a wife, why then would he so readily know the home address of one of his employees/subordinates with whom he has such a poor relationship? It doesn't even seem to me that Vivian was the one who gave him the home address. So why would he be so interested in sending her a dress?
Sure, Christian could trace the Harris home address through Hutch's personal data. But why take such an interest? Just to impress Vivian? I don't think he needed a trick like that to woo her, or even that it could be an incentive to get her to come to the dinner.
Then, how could Christian be aware of Vivian's work schedule? He, barely knows that she's substitute teacher, how could he be so sure that she would be the one to arrive home before her husband? I mean, what would have happened if that dress, instead of Vivian, had been found by Hutch? If the dress had been part of "Christian's plan for Vivian", this would have collapsed miserably.
Finally, on a somewhat nitpicky note, how could Christian have known Vivian's size so well?
He must have seen her for little more than 15 minutes. He's a business executive not a clerk in a ladies' dress store.
Ok, he's a womanizer, however, it seems to me that he's being implicitly credited with skills beyond his actual talents.
To me, these all seem like things that are usually routine for a husband who has known his wife for a long time (work schedule, size and personal tastes) and that only a woman with a rather clouded mind (by the situation and the boss's alpha-male charm) could mistake for attention from a stranger.
Even when the Harris arrives at Christian's house for dinner, the only reference he makes to the dress is a laconic "That dress looks fabulous on you": nothing that makes me think he was the one who sent it to the Harris home.
In my opinion, if you replay the whole game with the idea that that dress was sent to his house by Hutch himself (to initiate "his plan"), everything takes on a different meaning. Even the mysterious backyard scene takes on another meaning.
Perhaps Vivian (thinking he gave it to her) refers to the dress with Christian, finds out he knows nothing about it, and interprets that dress as a "coded message" from her husband: "Do whatever it takes to convince my boss to turn a blind eye to my "mistakes""... and so if "to get rid of the pain, you have to get rid of the tooth", let's quickly get rid of the panties too, and what better time than a quickie in the backyard to finally shut things down without Hutch noticing.
But then things take an unexpected turn, and neither of them is able to tell the other how things are anymore for fear of being blamed for their own mistakes and/or using the other for their own gain, and of course (in this total inability to communicate) things degenerate more and more (and they will do so again and again until they start talking clearly to each other).
TonyMurray
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My opinion? You're clutching at straws there and still coming up empty.
There are some conveniences, sure, like getting the sizing right (although if you know what you're about, you can get close enough with an educated guess), but nothing that even remotely suggests it wasn't Christian, and/or that it was Hutch sending the dress.
Hutch tries to tell Vivian not to go, he is surprised when he sees her in the dress, he tries to get her to change into something else, he tries to pull down the dress, thinking it too short... if you think that is all an act and it's his actual plan for her to go, and go in that dress, because he was the one who bought it, then I think you're giving Hutch way too much credit in that particular area.
And there is literally nothing unusual about an employer having access to his employees' personal data, including their address. It's unethical for him to access such information for personal use, but I don't think that would surprise anyone about Christian.
Sparta VI
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Nice. This new point of view that I'm reading here for the first time sounds coherent and good, except for a few minor details. That means the dress (package) is the key to the backyard scene. The change of perspective that Hutch has injected everything and is not being honest with his wife could be the red herring in the plot. This would put hutch in a different light, as we trust him more than vivian.
I like that theory. I'm curious what objections the others have?
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packard1928
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THe dress is part of Christians plan to trap Vivian. He tell hutch not to bring his wife. He... Christian sends the dress... She thinks it is a test for hutch... plus she doesn't want hutch to screw up the dinner conversation about work. Since she did not listen to Hucth ... kissed Christian in the office and THEN showed up in the sexy dress... Christian knew he had her.... Plan done perfect.
TheDuke9999
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TonyMurray
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Minor correction - she thinks Christian is testing her, she only realises that he's testing Hutch when they get to his house and start talking.
packard1928
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I'll have to go play that... I thought later she realized he was testing her...
TonyMurray
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Initially, when talking with Christian at the office:
Christian "But if you aren't there... the dinner is over."
Vivian "~ To herself ~ He's playing some kind of game... testing me..."
At Christian's:
Christian "But after meeting you... I'm glad you wear the pants in the family and came anyway."
Vivian "~ To herself ~ Oh shit!"
Vivian "~ To herself ~ I wasn't the one he was testing..."
One of those seemingly simple questions:
Who is the boss's (and/or the author's) actual target?
(meaning: according to his intention, not to the objective impact, and meaning the main intention, notwithstanding others)
VIVIAN? In other games this would be the standard answer. Here I personally wouldn't say so. If he was only after banging a hot chick, he should have a range of other possibilities and perhaps even other types of girls. But there are those who say: he can't let anything pass and she presents herself. In this scenario the boss wouldn't be a sadist but rather a reckless womanizer disregarding the consequences. He just can't help himself if he sees a chance. And we have heard that he is one, so that would be a point in favor of this motive.
HUTCH? Here the aim is not sex but to hit and hurt Hutch through his wife. Many in this thread tend to think so. This is the feeling one gets at his house (if he just wanted Vivian he could have met her alone). This would show a completely different character of the boss: First, here his motivation originates from inter-male competition and domination games, not from appreciating sex and women and being a sexual predator. He sees women as possessions who can be taken away if not protected, that's the challenge and power play. The starting point here psychologically could really be anger and contempt directed against Hutch and his failure. Stepping on those who are down already. Looking how far he can go. Second, here he appears as a sadist, wanting to humiliate, but not necessarily to torture.
THE COUPLE AS A WHOLE? Here his idea would be to create a complex scenario in which to play the couple against each other to observe how and if they cope and if they start hating each other. A sadistic stress test which they only can fail. Hints in this direction: The boss starts to act as a sort of "malevolent counselor", giving advice to Hutch and Vivian how to deal with the mess he initiated in the first place. Here we really reach the territory of sadistic perversion. Maybe he didn't plan this at the beginning but starts to enjoy this more and more. It's not Vivian or Hutch but the interplay which interests him. Here he is not a simple playboy but trying to play god.
THE INSTITUTION OF MARRIAGE ITSELF? (a bit over the top interpretation?) Maybe one could see the game as a critique of marriage, a demonstration that after 20 years of it a couple is an easy target for a not so subtle predator. Marriage in this case has made Hutch weak and Vivian nervous and panicking and unsatisfied (this would be the hypotheses to be proven). The Boss seems to have deliberately avoided marriage himself and kids, and maybe he wants to make a point here.
Again kudos to the Dev: this is a game which is able to change its overall character depending on these answers, which all seem possible at this point.
Who is the boss's (and/or the author's) actual target?
(meaning: according to his intention, not to the objective impact, and meaning the main intention, notwithstanding others)
VIVIAN? In other games this would be the standard answer. Here I personally wouldn't say so. If he was only after banging a hot chick, he should have a range of other possibilities and perhaps even other types of girls. But there are those who say: he can't let anything pass and she presents herself. In this scenario the boss wouldn't be a sadist but rather a reckless womanizer disregarding the consequences. He just can't help himself if he sees a chance. And we have heard that he is one, so that would be a point in favor of this motive.
HUTCH? Here the aim is not sex but to hit and hurt Hutch through his wife. Many in this thread tend to think so. This is the feeling one gets at his house (if he just wanted Vivian he could have met her alone). This would show a completely different character of the boss: First, here his motivation originates from inter-male competition and domination games, not from appreciating sex and women and being a sexual predator. He sees women as possessions who can be taken away if not protected, that's the challenge and power play. The starting point here psychologically could really be anger and contempt directed against Hutch and his failure. Stepping on those who are down already. Looking how far he can go. Second, here he appears as a sadist, wanting to humiliate, but not necessarily to torture.
THE COUPLE AS A WHOLE? Here his idea would be to create a complex scenario in which to play the couple against each other to observe how and if they cope and if they start hating each other. A sadistic stress test which they only can fail. Hints in this direction: The boss starts to act as a sort of "malevolent counselor", giving advice to Hutch and Vivian how to deal with the mess he initiated in the first place. Here we really reach the territory of sadistic perversion. Maybe he didn't plan this at the beginning but starts to enjoy this more and more. It's not Vivian or Hutch but the interplay which interests him. Here he is not a simple playboy but trying to play god.
THE INSTITUTION OF MARRIAGE ITSELF? (a bit over the top interpretation?) Maybe one could see the game as a critique of marriage, a demonstration that after 20 years of it a couple is an easy target for a not so subtle predator. Marriage in this case has made Hutch weak and Vivian nervous and panicking and unsatisfied (this would be the hypotheses to be proven). The Boss seems to have deliberately avoided marriage himself and kids, and maybe he wants to make a point here.
Again kudos to the Dev: this is a game which is able to change its overall character depending on these answers, which all seem possible at this point.
Hattyrulz
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this is the right option i think as christian's dialogues repeatedly point to the couple in the kitchen. i wouldn't say he is a "malevolent counselor" or playing god but more of a narcissistic individual who's kink is wreaking couples/ humiliating them. which is brought up in christian's dialogues throughout the update( i'm not opening the pandora's box again so if you want just read the dialogues of christian)
For Chris it's simple - if she wears a dress it means she's available
really - you're looking for "things" here that aren't there. SC Stories himself said that the story is actually quite simple. The way of narration is fantastic (way to tell this story)
really - you're looking for "things" here that aren't there. SC Stories himself said that the story is actually quite simple. The way of narration is fantastic (way to tell this story)
Hattyrulz
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would be interesting to see how a players reacts to this when it's completed with all its update. a clean approach not spoiled by playing the updates and reading the kn for the first time the whole kn at the end.
lolo540
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I'm afraid that as the months go by and all the different avenues are explored, each one better than the last, I'll be almost disappointed in a scenario that is indeed superbly written and brought to life, but much simpler in its conception than the scenarios imagined here.
Because here, ten or so people add a second or even third reading to the basic scenario...
Sparta VI
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Even if it sounds uninteresting to some. It would pick me up in the course of the story when Vivian rejects Christian at one moment. They both have a fierce argument, she breaks him emotionally. From his narcissistic weakness the whole facade falls away and we learn how he has become the product of character that he is.
exacly !!!I'm afraid that as the months go by and all the different avenues are explored, each one better than the last, I'll be almost disappointed in a scenario that is indeed superbly written and brought to life, but much simpler in its conception than the scenarios imagined here.
Because here, ten or so people add a second or even third reading to the basic scenario...
unfortunately SC Stories doesn't give us enough information "about". So we start coming up with scenarios "why"
If Hutch can see the shadows from outside, the boss can see them from inside when Hutch is leaning his back on the door. How much of what happened in the bedroom was the boss noticing the shadow of Hutch and playing it up? Also coming outside half way through and going again in the kitchen could have been him pushing to make sure Hutch heard it.
ok some one needs to explain this to me cause i don't get it - out side of this game seems ok but instantly closed it after whats in my spoiler till i get more info as it completely disconnected me from the game and thought well whats the point now
so any help with this would be great cause this is legit me in the picture now
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so any help with this would be great cause this is legit me in the picture now
Laying aside my new theory, which casts Hutch in a less sympathetic light, as I have read through different people's take on the betrayal in the story, it seems to me that those who have a stronger belief that a husband and wife are family, tend to be harder on Vivian for the betrayal. This has been my attitude as well. If we look at the opinions here, some people rationalize the cheating, others praise it and seem to think she is entitled to cheat if she did not feel satisfied, others condemn her cheating as a terrible betrayal. I think most people are against betraying and harming family, but in a world where marriage is so easily discarded it makes sense that a lot of people would not make that connection emotionally or psychologically. By the way, I am not judging anyone in this forum by saying this, it is just my subjective opinion based on what I am reading. What I will say is that in the US, despite marriages breaking up all the time, legally a person's spouse is considered to be their closest relative. For example, if Vivian got into a car accident, fell into a coma, and did not have a will, Hutch would be the person that would decide to keep her on life support or terminate her life support. Usually he would have more say in that situation than Vivian's parents, her son Sawyer, or her siblings. That had me thinking.Nice take
Imagine a scenario where Vivian was in a coma for several weeks. The doctor presented the choice of keeping her on life support, or terminating it. He gave the following possible outcomes.
A. Vivian might make a full recovery, but it is looking less and less likely the longer she is in the coma.
B. Vivian might never wake up, and this possibility increases the longer she is in a coma.
C. Vivian might wake up, but the longer she is in a coma, the more likely she will be a vegetable. She will be able to know what is going on around her, but won't be able to move or communicate.
D. Vivian might wake up, but be so crippled that she will need a lot of people to take care of her for the rest of her life, and the longer she is in a coma the more likely this will be the outcome.
We know that Christian is not married to Vivian, so he wouldn't be in the position to make this choice, but people have talked about Vivian choosing Christian over Hutch for various reasons, and on different levels (fucking Christian, leaving Hutch, etc). So, for the sake of argument, we will say that whoever Vivian chose would be the one to make the decision.
Who do you think would be more trustworthy to make the decision, Hutch or Christian? This is directed towards the forum, not JoeBlogs specifically.