Pixillin'

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its only creepy out of context.

the classic love before puberty that never dies trope is kind of a real thing. ive a soft spot for a neighbor girl when i was a child. now ive no intention of ever dating her, looking for her, so much as checking her name on facebook and see what pops up. but i always think of her warmly and in a slightly romaticized way. people do that it seems, and i know its not real but whatever when i think of her it happens that way. we were very close, her brother and i were good buddies and he little sister was a mouse of a girl when she wasnt being a total bitch. their family moved before we were teenagers.

for alice specifically, living in a small village where every man was like a creepy uncle or her brother, and no one really leaves, who else is she gonna pine for? in fact the fantasy that MC somehow survived and is out there somewhere, one day to return. think it would be easy for childhood friendship to turn into romantic loved, one sided or not.

its crazy how real life a childhood friendship can evolve into a romantic love and get sealed in ones heart. its only creepy when the person experiencing it turns it into an obsession and never goes on with their life. alice wasnt that, she was already looking at leaving the village, having a life. she just always hoped MC was out there too, to the point that believing him dead and gone would be a betrayal to her own heart.

i still prefer eliza, but keep alice around, she will be necessary to help herd all of MC and Eliza's whelps
I can kind of see that in your case, but in a medieval(ish) setting I still find it weird. Life expectancy was much lower and people die frequently. I mean in a very, very early context that's kind of what the Winter Solstice celebration (later Christmas) was about - you gather the family and have a huge feast before dipping into winter because there's a decent chance not all of them will see the spring. So I can see her holding on to him as a kind of fantasy, but whatever happens in that setting you suck it up and move on with life. So I still find the idea of her just sitting there and waiting for him for a decade and then just sort of being "finally, there you are - well, let's get on with that adventuring" to be ... unhealthy at the very least.
 

Quetzzz

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You mean Kira, right? :unsure:
Yep, you're right.

According to Pearl she did not attack Kira to kill, she did it to chase her away to save her from her father's wrath.
I mentioned this as well. With what we know of Kira, would that have worked? Wouldn't her twin know this? What would Pearl have done if Kira had lost and refused to leave?

So that also made sense.
I'm not saying it makes no sense for Pearl to do this. I specifically said: "I can honestly understand that Pearl betrays the MC to keep Mira safe."
What I'm saying that even if the MC understands _why_ she did it, he doesn't _have_ to agree with it or her methods. They spent many evenings together between visiting Blackbeard and arriving at the island. At any point, Pearl could've confided in him instead of stealing the artifact.

If you are comparing that to Selena. It really is not. One of them puts their so-called friends in active danger. Even after she denies it, she is very well aware Taron was going to kill both MC and Eliza. That's active betrayal. Not even counting she was part of the ambush that Eliza got kidnapped and it was her who lured Eliza away from MC for the ambush. On top of that, she gloated at the cell. She even mentioned how not either MC or Eliza survive the situation. I am still salty that MC can't kill her and let her sister go. She deserved the worst.
But we were looking at the end result regarding Pearl, right? In the case of Eliza, she's said several times that she now feels better than ever. If we take her at her word, then the worst aspect of those two months of being unable to walk, was the MC being away from her.
Playing devil's advocate, I could say that Selena acts out at the cell because she wanted to gain Taron's trust and cooperation, or that she was overreacting because of feeling guilty.
While their methods were different, what Pearl did wasn't that different from what Selena did. Pearl was putting her sister's wellbeing over that of Eliza & the MC. In Selena's case, the MC could've murdered her sister in cold blood to get even. Pearl doesn't even get an angry look.
You don't sense a certain imbalance there?

Yes, MC do believe it could help someone she does not know, a person she never met. She did not know if the chalice would work, even if it works would Eliza accepts it, Eliza (a person she only know as MC's friend, if Pearl even know that much) was not going to die, if Eliza did not get the chalice there could be another way to help her too. Her sister was in greater danger than somebody she did not know.
All of this has no bearing on how the MC should feel about the chalice getting stolen by someone he trusted.
He's at this island because it's said to contain the only artifact able to heal Eliza. And Pearl steals it, dooming Eliza to never walk again.
He's at that island because he feels he failed to keep Eliza safe, that he's responsible... That getting her to walk again would absolve him. It would be his every right to be furious with Pearl.

Also, another huge difference, Pearl did not follow through the plan, she helped MC and Kira.
That's fair. But should that mean that all is forgiven? That the trust that was lost is entirely gained back?
Would the MC who murdered Selena's sister just let it go? Or would a guy like that want something to hold over Pearl to make sure she'll never betray him again?

So I still find the idea of her just sitting there and waiting for him for a decade and then just sort of being "finally, there you are - well, let's get on with that adventuring" to be ... unhealthy at the very least.
This is an aspect of this game's writing that I don't really enjoy either. For some reason, every LI has to be pure. None of the women have ever been with a man, except for the MILF who says she only had sex once in her life. It's ridiculous how this world is filled with 20 y/o virgins. Even that sex-craving Brenda-chick went out of her way to say that she's only been with her toys.
 
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Quetzzz

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Kira didn't even know or about the Mc's family and he spent way more time with her
Depends... and Kira isn't the easiest person to get along with. I can see that her behavior/personality doesn't make it easy for someone to open up about personal stuff. Pearl, on the other hand, I really liked how she was characterized at first. That the MC and Pearl talked every evening on the railing of the ship during those two weeks of travel would've created a deeper bond, I think.
 
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Pixillin'

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I don't know if we can assume that. In later content it's clear that MC & Pearl had a lot of things to say to each other in the two weeks they were traveling to the island.


What if Blackbeard had used the chalice before MC got there? What if these pirates were actually a bit more capable?
No harm came out of anything that Pearl did because the MC was there to fix things. It's not a good argument, because you could say that no harm resulted from anything Selena did either because the MC put things right.

The whole "daddy made me do it" is just too easy of an excuse. I can honestly understand that Pearl betrays the MC to keep Mira safe. What I don't understand is that Pearl later boards the ship to attack Mira, saying that their father ordered her to get rid of her. That she attacked to chase Mira off... What was her plan? "Hey sis, I beat you, so now you have to sail away and never come back"? As if that would've worked with a firecracker like Mira.
That the MC doesn't even have stern words for her is ridiculous, specially when the story gave us plenty of information on how the MC views betrayal, and how a dark-path MC would handle it.
I've made this argument to the point that it's now pretty much what I'm known for here. The story kinda went off the rails because - If given the option, I would have killed Selena and both of the pirate twins so the idea that I would abandon Eliza to go and save them is just ridiculous to me. I despise them both, and absolutely wouldn't have interfered with someone else trying to kill them (but then, I wouldn't have come in the first place - I would have killed them both myself.)
 

justin.case

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I mentioned this as well. With what we know of Kira, would that have worked? Wouldn't her twin know this? What would Pearl have done if Kira had lost and refused to leave?
She did not have any plan further, chasing Kira away was not a fully developed plan either because she was not even sure her father would believe her.
While their methods were different, what Pearl did wasn't that different from what Selena did. Pearl was putting her sister's wellbeing over that of Eliza & the MC. In Selena's case, the MC could've murdered her sister in cold blood to get even. Pearl doesn't even get an angry look.
You can choose the angry path, then not follow after her. She literally said she did not deserves MC's forgiveness and if MC does not follow her, that will be considered he kinda agrees on that.

You don't sense a certain imbalance there?
I honestly don't. It would be more or less my reaction to those situations. I think, which I mentioned before, the biggest difference is putting someone under active danger and passive danger through consequences of your actions. Selena actively sought to become friends with MC and Eliza, even the quest was a sham. So that makes their meeting was malicious from the start. Pearl and Kira's meet with MC was natural. MC needed a ship, they could provide, so they met. Then, Selena became their friend by the order of Taron, that was fake too. There is a possibility she felt real friendship through the process but her friendship was fake. Pearl and Kira's friendship was not fake, they did not even wanted to become one at the beginning. MC was only a debt getting paid back. Then, Selena lured Eliza by herself, taking active part then took part in kidnapping, so Taron could lure MC too. Pearl did not involved with Chalice search at all. Also, she did not put MC or Eliza in any sort of danger. She just stole an artifact. We don't know the depths of MC and Pearl talks but as far as we know he stated an artifact that can help someone back at home. No more details there. MC might even be lying about it as far as Pearl knew, maybe he was treasure hunting and lying to them about the treasure. So, Selena was aware of the consequences while it was ambiguous for Pearl. If MC could not find it, there was not going to be any betrayal. Next, Selena's gloating at the cell. She even said neither MC nor Eliza was going to survive, which meant she was aware of the danger she was putting them in. You can soften it all you want by assuming things about her but the action stands. Pearl was regretful and apologetic about the whole situation. When MC confronted Selena and later Eliza, she was basically implied she was ready to everything again. While, Pearl owned her mistakes and said she should have chosen different path. Cherry on top, Selena was assuming their forgiveness while Pearl said she did not deserve any forgiveness. Let's not forget, Selena called Eliza a bitch because Eliza was angry when she was sniffing around the place they were staying.

All in all, Selena brought the situation to MC and Eliza, so she could benefitted from their misery. While, Pearl had to take an action to a situation that brought to her by MC. To top that, MC was the one helping to Selena while Pearl was the one helping MC. So, even their power dynamic were different.

All of this has no bearing on how the MC should feel about the chalice getting stolen by someone he trusted.
He's at this island because it's said to contain the only artifact able to heal Eliza. And Pearl steals it, dooming Eliza to never walk again.
He's at that island because he feels he failed to keep Eliza safe, that he's responsible... That getting her to walk again would absolve him. It would be his every right to be furious with Pearl.
This part is not exactly wrong but you are missing a few crucial points. First of all, Selena left both MC and Eliza's faith into hands of Taron. As Dalen said they could have died there. While in other case, Eliza's life was not in danger. Chalice was a long shot from the start and after the vampire talk, MC was not even sure it was the way. So not the same type of danger, nor the same type of actions.

Secondly, MC's immediate response can be anger. It's left to players to choose. Then, he has enough time to cool down and think about it calmly, so when they met enough time has already passed him to make logical decisions. Same goes for Selena btw, MC could have choose to spare them and even allow her to repair what she has broken. I never choose that, because I don't think she deserves it but still, it's up to players there.

Finally, there is sort of additional factors there. At the betrayal points. MC has no relationship with Samarah, so Eliza got hurt because of a stranger. He has either romantic or friendly relationship with Kira, so Pearl's betrayal meant Eliza's cure was in danger because of wellbeing of someone he likes.

That's fair. But should that mean that all is forgiven? That the trust that was lost is entirely gained back?
Would the MC who murdered Selena's sister just let it go? Or would a guy like that want something to hold over Pearl to make sure she'll never betray him again?
Now, we do agree on this point. I think Selena's betrayal and how he handled is mishandled by the dev. Even on dark path, MC would not punish an entirely innocent person to make a point. There are indications for that. Also, as I see it MC is kinda forgiving person, even on dark path. So, him forgiving Pearl and even understand her actions is within his character. But when you put Samarah's murder there, you need to create a darker path from there. Because up until there, MC, even if you choose all the dark paths, still is a nice guy. So, MC should have had darker personality and should not be that forgiving, if players chose the neckbreaker path.

This is an aspect of this game's writing that I don't really enjoy either. For some reason, every LI has to be pure. None of the women have ever been with a man, except for the MILF who says she only had sex once in her life. It's ridiculous how this world is filled with 20 y/o virgins. Even that sex-craving Brenda-chick went out of her way to say that she's only been with her toys.
Dude, same there. I understand Kira and Pearl being virgin, they are captains and daugthers of Blackbeard but what about Kelly? She was easy going, a little gullible, was into romance and docks and seas are never lacking people who would take advantage of that. Her mother's case was more terrible, why was nothing going on for her for a long while? As far as we know, she is not the loyal type. Some do make sense. Eliza, Alice, Luna, up to a point Kira and Pearl but some others not at all.
Though, I have a headcanon for MC's charm. It came from his father. So, his angel side creates an aura to fall women for him. I would suggest how his mom became giddy after she met the angel. Still though, it lowers the value of the story by making story unbelievable. I know it does not have the greatest writing but the story is interesting enough, so I would not want this in this story.
 
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justin.case

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I've made this argument to the point that it's now pretty much what I'm known for here. The story kinda went off the rails because - If given the option, I would have killed Selena and both of the pirate twins so the idea that I would abandon Eliza to go and save them is just ridiculous to me. I despise them both, and absolutely wouldn't have interfered with someone else trying to kill them (but then, I wouldn't have come in the first place - I would have killed them both myself.)
I agree I would have definitely killed Selena. She is dangerous and malicious, also needs to suffer consequences of her actions. I don't agree on twins though. I would definitely choose to save them, if there was an option there. I really like both of them. That means you would not meet Diana too, so that's another plus for me. I am not sure I'd meet them at the first place though. I don't think, I'd go for treasure hunting while Eliza got hurt by my archnemesis. I'd probably choose to burn the city down until I find him and put him on a stake or some other medieval torture. So there is that.

Also, even though I do find both island and twins/Diana arc is extremely interesting, that made story go off the rails. I am not sure MC would have cared to become a king of a remote island while Taron was at large. At best, he'd probably promise to return. Also, the ambassador could dying somewhere on the island while MC doing side quests. He should have refused Diana too. He is under the king's order, ordered to protect princess and he left right after she got kidnapped. I can see a noose in MC's future for disobeying orders. After saving Kira and Pearl, he probably should have said he is under king's order and had to go back. As of now, MC feels like Geralt swimming to distant island at Skellige so he can discover a question mark while Ciri stuck on Isle of Mist. Still though, I find it interesting and trying to recruit allies is somewhat acceptable excuse for me, so I am okay with it.
 

MiltonPowers

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All of this has no bearing on how the MC should feel about the chalice getting stolen by someone he trusted.
He's at this island because it's said to contain the only artifact able to heal Eliza. And Pearl steals it, dooming Eliza to never walk again.
He's at that island because he feels he failed to keep Eliza safe, that he's responsible... That getting her to walk again would absolve him. It would be his every right to be furious with Pearl.
To me it's really simple.

Kira & Selena knowingly put MC and/or Eliza in mortal danger, they are both fully aware of the danger to their lives (from Taron/Blackbeard) and still do it. Neither showed any remorse or apologized for doing it.

Pearl stole a trinket, that as far as we know, had no idea it would save Eliza. She apologized while she was doing it and felt guilty and remorseful and apologized many times after.

But, you're right that we players are forced to forgive her and Kira, when we had a choice with Selena. And it would have been nice for players to be able forgive or not forgive. For the reasons above, I would have forgiven Pearl instantly, but not Kira.

It would have been simpler if Pearl had mentioned to MC what she was supposed to do (except she has no idea of his abilities and his reaction, so understandable). MC could have said no problem, I just need it for one thing and then it's all yours.
 

justin.case

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To me it's really simple.

Kira & Selena knowingly put MC and/or Eliza in mortal danger, they are both fully aware of the danger to their lives (from Taron/Blackbeard) and still do it. Neither showed any remorse or apologized for doing it.

Pearl stole a trinket, that as far as we know, had no idea it would save Eliza. She apologized while she was doing it and felt guilty and remorseful and apologized many times after.

But, you're right that we players are forced to forgive her and Kira, when we had a choice with Selena. And it would have been nice for players to be able forgive or not forgive. For the reasons above, I would have forgiven Pearl instantly, but not Kira.

It would have been simpler if Pearl had mentioned to MC what she was supposed to do (except she has no idea of his abilities and his reaction, so understandable). MC could have said no problem, I just need it for one thing and then it's all yours.
You are actually right about there. I think Kira's betrayal was worse than Pearl's betrayal. First of all, she did only to get praise from her father. She put MC in immediate danger. As far as she knew, MC was just a dude who was an adventurer on a journey to help someone. So, she not only put MC in danger she also put someone, Eliza, in danger by preventing MC's journey. Only think that makes it better than Selena, she was not a friend of MC there. She was still considering MC as a cargo and MC was very well aware a pirate could pull such a thing. Still, worse than Pearl.
 
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Pixillin'

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You are actually right about there. I think Kira's betrayal was worse than Pearl's betrayal. First of all, she did only to get praise from her father. She put MC in immediate danger. As far as she knew, MC was just a dude who was an adventurer on a journey to help someone. So, she not only put MC in danger she also put someone, Eliza, in danger by preventing MC's journey. Only think that makes it better than Selena, she was not a friend of MC there. She was still considering MC as a cargo and MC was very well aware a pirate could pull such a thing. Still, worse than Pearl.
But see ... this is part personal and part (what is supposed to be) the plot of this game. I personally value loyalty and honor above everything. In the game if I'm building a power base, or an army or however you want to look at it. I want to make it very clear from go that I am kind to those that support me but have absolutely zero tolerance for betrayal and disloyalty. I would have killed them all - Selena, Kira and Pearl to make that point in the hope that I no longer have to worry about it after that (though I can create further examples if need be). People don't have to join me, but if they do ... there are rules.
 

justin.case

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But see ... this is part personal and part (what is supposed to be) the plot of this game. I personally value loyalty and honor above everything. In the game if I'm building a power base, or an army or however you want to look at it. I want to make it very clear from go that I am kind to those that support me but have absolutely zero tolerance for betrayal and disloyalty. I would have killed them all - Selena, Kira and Pearl to make that point in the hope that I no longer have to worry about it after that (though I can create further examples if need be). People don't have to join me, but if they do ... there are rules.
Yeah I do agree it's entirely personal. I am not denying Kira and Pearl betrayed MC and it's within your right to not trust them. Problem with that more on technical level. It's not possible to create that many path. Some even maybe okay to forgive Selena. So, you need lots of paths. Dev, as expected, took easy path and went for forgiveness path for lighter betrayal.

So, I do understand your point. As long as we don't disagree Selena's betrayal heavier and more dangerous then we are on the same page.

Edit: Also, I wonder how are we gonna deal with priestess at the island. She literally tried to kill MC. Then she kept going on scheming. While she has extremely good reasons, it still is not acceptable. Are we gonna put her in the harem too? Are we going to get rid of her? Like other people pointed out, what about Brenda? Are we getting a redemption arc for her too? If we are, why? What would be her strength to keep her around? So on and so on.
 

Pixillin'

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Yeah I do agree it's entirely personal. I am not denying Kira and Pearl betrayed MC and it's within your right to not trust them. Problem with that more on technical level. It's not possible to create that many path. Some even maybe okay to forgive Selena. So, you need lots of paths. Dev, as expected, took easy path and went for forgiveness path for lighter betrayal.

So, I do understand your point. As long as we don't disagree Selena's betrayal heavier and more dangerous then we are on the same page.

Edit: Also, I wonder how are we gonna deal with priestess at the island. She literally tried to kill MC. Then she kept going on scheming. While she has extremely good reasons, it still is not acceptable. Are we gonna put her in the harem too? Are we going to get rid of her? Like other people pointed out, what about Brenda? Are we getting a redemption arc for her too? If we are, why? What would be her strength to keep her around? So on and so on.
Yeah, almost none of the relationships in this story make any sense at this point, and the entire Island arc can be thrown off by a little logic and it's about to get worse because Taron (who MC has completely ignored, despite him being the reason MC came to the Capital in the first place) is going to come back while we're gone and create more problems - probably with Eliza.
 

storm1051787

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Kira & Selena knowingly put MC and/or Eliza in mortal danger, they are both fully aware of the danger to their lives (from Taron/Blackbeard) and still do it. Neither showed any remorse or apologized for doing it.

Kira did not knowingly put the mc in danger. All she did was take him to meet her father instead of taking him directly to the island like he asked, and she is shown to feel guilty about it literally right after telling the mc about it. She also says outright that she didn't actually believe that Blackheart was going to hurt him.


I don't know what it is with you guys and selective memory. kira.PNG Kira1.PNG kira2.PNG
 
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MiltonPowers

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Kira did not knowingly put the mc in danger. All she did was take him to meet her father instead of taking him directly to the island like he asked, and she is shown to feel guilty about it literally right after telling the mc about it.


I don't know what it is with you guys and selective memory.
How about you check your own memory? My memory is just fine.

This is pretty clearly knowingly in danger!

Screenshot 2025-04-06 112148.png
Screenshot 2025-04-06 112202.png

She shows some guilt in her thoughts, but not a thing to MC or an apology.
 

storm1051787

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How about you check your own memory? My memory is just fine.

This is pretty clearly knowingly in danger!

View attachment 4718056
View attachment 4718057

She shows some guilt in her thoughts, but not a thing to MC or an apology. And what are you talking about? You said Kira never shown any guilt. She immediately starts looking to the side and you can tell from her facial expression that she looks guilty

Like I said selective memory. You're own quotes say the same thing I just did. She didn't believe blackheart would hurt the mc. She only thought mc would get hurt if he choose to withhold information.

As for apologizing her saying that she doesn't want to do this counts as an apology to me especially after she talks to the mc. She did not believe the mc was ever in mortal danger
 

Dessolos

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Kira did not knowingly put the mc in danger. All she did was take him to meet her father instead of taking him directly to the island like he asked, and she is shown to feel guilty about it literally right after telling the mc about it.


I don't know what it is with you guys and selective memory.
I have to disagree . id say taking the MC to a pirate port town instead of his destination. As well as forcing him to meet with her father who she knows is someone not to be fucked and kills indiscriminately and forced them to do horrible actions growing up without knowing if he would try to kill him , let him ago or what is putting him in danger.

Now I don't think she purposely did it with bad intentions but it doesn't change the fact that he was in potential danger if he wasn't a Nephilim because he didn't know if the other pirates would not try something. He was essential surrounded by people that would see him as a target. Now nothing happened but it doesn't change the fact the potential was there so she did put him in danger as she had no idea about his powers yet.
 
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storm1051787

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I have to disagree . id say taking the MC to a pirate port town instead of his destination. As well as forcing him to meet with her father who she knows is someone not to be fucked and kills indiscriminately and forced them to do horrible actions growing up without knowing if he would try to kill him , let him ago or what is putting him in danger.

Now I don't think she purposely did it with bad intentions but it doesn't change the fact that he was in potential danger if he wasn't a Nephilim because he didn't know if the other pirates would not try something. He was essential surrounded by people that would see him as a target. Now nothing happened but it doesn't change the fact the potential was there so she did put him in danger as she had no idea about his powers yet.
She says her dialogue very clearly that she though he'd be fine if he just tells blackheart what he's after, she also didn't know what he was after or that it was anything important. She thought he was just treasure hunting. It's a betrayal in that she's potentially preventing the mc from getting something that's exteremly valuble, but she had no idea about Eliza or anything.

We also never hear anything about blackheart killing indiscriminately. He explicably kills people he considers enemies, not just random guys for no reason. And the other pirates wouldn't do anything as long as Kira was with him unless blackheart ordered otherwise.
 

Dessolos

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She says her dialogue very clearly that she though he'd be fine if he just tells blackheart what he's after,
that doesn't matter she had no idea how the outcome would go she could guess how it would go if he did what she said but didn't know for 100% certainty nothing bad would happen. Especially when she knows he can be rather violent

We also never hear anything about blackheart killing indiscriminately. He explicably kills people he considers enemies, not just random guys for no reason. And the other pirates wouldn't do anything as long as Kira was with him unless blackheart ordered otherwise.
maybe not indiscriminately but unhinged and kills rather easily especially with that ring corrupting him. As for the other pirates I would say you are only right about the ones loyal to the twins but there were ones that were loyal to Blackheart that didn't give a fuck. Like the one that tried to rape Kelly.
 

MiltonPowers

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Like I said selective memory. You're own quotes say the same thing I just did. She didn't believe blackheart would hurt the mc. She only thought mc would get hurt if he choose to withhold information.

As for apologizing her saying that she doesn't want to do this counts as an apology to me especially after she talks to the mc. She did not believe the mc was ever in mortal danger
Wow! and you say I have a selective memory. :ROFLMAO:
 

justin.case

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Btw storm1051787 , it's nice you have come here. I've managed to have a little time to check Diana fight. MC got fatally wounded once, not twice. Also, he ends the fight twice. At first, he quickly moves and hits Diana and make her flying, then she hit the hull of the ship. MC stops the fight to talk to her instead of ending her. Secondly, MC grabs her by the neck and basically ends the fight. He did not break her neck because he does not want to kill her. There is even a dialogue option there, the interrupt there is that long. Then, at the end they knock each other down but while he recovers, she almost died. So MC, heals her. If you count ice cube thing as second knock out, it's not because while Diana preparing final blow there he melts the ice. All in all, even according to your round counting way MC is the winner of that fight.

Round 1 : Diana stabs MC's neck. Diana's win.
Round 2 : MC yeets Diana to ship's hull. MC's win.
Round 3 : MC grabs the Diana by her neck. MC's win.
Round 4 : Diana and MC knock each other out but Diana gets more damage. MC's win.

Final score : MC 3 - Diana 1

Or we can look at my way and say, MC reached his goal by saving twins. MC won the fight.

Or we can look at as one continues fight. They knock each other out at the end. Diana got hurt more and almost died. MC won the fight.

In all cases MC won. Toodaloo. :)
 
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