VN Ren'Py Our Red String [Ch. 12 Full] [Eva Kiss]

[Rickster82]

Is the game GGGB just about a female main character? I heard about it but never played it. The title sounds a little bit like a story where you can choose the path of a girl (good + loyal or bad + slutty).

 

[Mr_Ainz]

Btw, he is fighting 'Alison sexting' for last place right now

This was so funny to me, I don't think anyone is playing extrictly for the sexting scenes but Robert dude, you gotta change your game or you'll end up losing to Jeremy's dick pics

 

[Moryaka26]

I think next chapter Ian and Cindy will have serious conversation

 

[Zedire]

I feel like expanding Jeremy's role to be more broad in terms of characterisation and availability to Lena is almost too late at this point?
Like, the people that enjoy the BBC kink over anything else are probably already playing his route at this point, which arguably requires for Lena to become a pretty bad person, not just withholding his cheating but becoming Louise's "homewrecker" too.

Any additions would either have to mesh with these events, or be an entirely new Lena/Jeremy route exclusive to players who broke them up early. While I would personally find this option more interesting, I doubt it would go over well with the kink community that there'd be scenes unavailable depending on that kind of choice, so I don't think Eva would go that way.

I suppose there could be random romance added to the Jeremy route, but that sort of seems counter to the structure around it so far. Like, wouldn't it be kinda tacked on?

I don't see how having Jeremy show some personality would in any way get in the way of the BBC Kink, nor necessarily need to instigate a romance path? The content is only meant to flesh out his existing potential. That sort of characterization could quite easily fit into Ian's everyday path where he just happens to be hanging out with Jeremy - no need to change anything that already exists.

There are ways to do it that could feel perfectly natural, you just have to be creative about it. The easiest way would be to have some sort of event that 'provokes' the deeply buried nerd in Jeremy to rear his head.

For example, there could be something like a movie franchise Ian's group (of guy friends?) loved as teens appearing at a convention or something. Ian and his friends all go there, including Jeremy. While Perry, Wade and [potentially a nerdy] Ian are all excited, Jeremy is unusually quiet, but when you all discover that one of the major stars of the last installment (that Jeremey happened to really like) is there signing autographs, something snaps and Jeremy is suddenly a teen again, nerding out about meeting one of his favorite actors and whatnot.

Or it could be something that challenges Jeremy's knowledge of a topic or topics he used to be a master in. So like, maybe something like a quiz night at that old bar or whatever, and Jeremy isn't big on going but eventually agrees when Ian insists, and Jeremy's group absolutely kills it because he knows the answer to every single question.

After either of those scenarios you could have Ian walking with Jeremy (just the two of them), and Ian comments on how he hasn't seen that side of Jeremy in ages. That could then be the point where it gives a bit of an insight into why Jeremy is the way he is now, because if this kind of deep-and-personal is gonna happen with anyone, it's with his best friend, Ian.

For example, in the case of the convention or getting too nerdy over that franchise, it could be that there was a girl who Jeremy really liked back in the day - like, a massive crush - and she rejected him and laughed in his face for being a nerd when he asked her to see a movie in that franchise, or IDK. Point is, he has low self-esteem and was weak willed, and her rejection in front of everyone was so humiliating he threw away all his memorabilia of that series and buried his love of it deep down, and then decided to get hot so he could laugh in her face.

In the case of the quiz, you could have Jeremy talk about how his parents always pushed him to be the best in school or whatever, and it put him under so much pressure that the moment he struck out on his own he completely turned his back on his parents expectations for him. In other words, Jeremy became a chad to rebel, but then found he liked the perks, like getting girls, and thinking too much or being too smart put them off, so he pushed down the nerd in him and tried to embrace the life of a chad. Or whatever.

Anyway, those ideas may be shite, but they serve the purpose of demonstrating how you can give a character a bit of depth even quite a way through - just make it he's pushed his true self down pretty deep, and something just happens to trigger it.

From there you could choose to make his old nerd self start to come out more as he finds people around him are cool with it (cos secretly being self-conscious about his personality could be part of his personality), and by the end either he's a full-on nerd again, or he's buried it down deep, OR, he's managed to find a healthy balance between being a chad and enjoying his nerdy pleasures.

I mean, considering both Eva's games have such a focus on being able to transform characters, no reason it can't happen with Jeremy in the same way as certain other characters - providing players make certain choices.

When you think about it, Jeremy's potential transformation back to a nerd would be the reverse to Ian's potential journey into a chad. That could be kinda interesting too.

 

[Zedire]

You're right on the first part but devs need money to continue their project.
And Patrons are best willing to donate if they can contribute to the game (in terms of decision making) and get what they want from it.

Of course they're most likely to donate if they know their voice is going to matter, but my point was, nothing actually says that their voice matters - that's something they thought up all on their own. Some patrons donate because they simply want to support a project or artist they love (which is all you can realistically expect besides the benefits made clear in tiers). Others go into it with a preconceived notion that their donation automatically grants them influence, simply because some other games have gone that way. Donating doesn't mean influence unless the person owning the individual Patreon either says it does, or shows it in practice with what they produce. As far as I'm aware (please correct me if I'm wrong), Eva has never mentioned that her patrons have the power to direct the game.

There is no stipulation in any tier of Eva's Patreon that donating will allow you to influence the game. The closest thing is the top-most tier which allows your likeness to appear in the game, and even then it mentions nothing about the patron having any say in HOW their likeness appears in the game, just that it'll be added at some point that Eva sees fit. Everything else is either access to polls, early access to earlier version or material that's going to be going into the game, or benefits on Discord. That's it, and as for polls themselves, their existence says nothing other then that Eva is interested in seeing what people think and what was hit or miss amongst it all.

(I can't speak for anyone else, but if I were a dev on Patreon with a defined plot and character paths for my game, I sure as shit wouldn't be giving influence to people who have no idea about my future plans; people who are gonna vote based on their limited knowledge and their own personal desire rather then what's actually best for the game. Further, I couldn't tell them my future plans for the story anyway, because that would destroy any element of surprise for what's to come. It's like telling the plot twist and ending of a movie to someone who's just started watching it)

But anyway, if someone actually has evidence that goes against this and proves me totally wrong, I'm cool with that. I'm only speaking from what I've seen or know, and I'm not a Patron, so...

(Christ, my hand is getting sore from all this typing )

 

[NateGrey]

(Christ, my hand is getting sore from all this typing )

From typing. Uh huh...

 

[jollyjoker27]

Just to make it clear - I don't hate Jeremy, I just don't care about him whatsoever, and that's something that I wish would change.

If we get more Jeremy content as a result of the poll, then so be it, but I hope Eva can at least establish the guy's personality a little more, so I can decide to feel some sort of way about him beyond 'could literally be any black guy'.

I feel like expanding Jeremy's role to be more broad in terms of characterisation and availability to Lena is almost too late at this point?
Like, the people that enjoy the BBC kink over anything else are probably already playing his route at this point, which arguably requires for Lena to become a pretty bad person, not just withholding his cheating but becoming Louise's "homewrecker" too.

Any additions would either have to mesh with these events, or be an entirely new Lena/Jeremy route exclusive to players who broke them up early. While I would personally find this option more interesting, I doubt it would go over well with the kink community that there'd be scenes unavailable depending on that kind of choice, so I don't think Eva would go that way.

I suppose there could be random romance added to the Jeremy route, but that sort of seems counter to the structure around it so far. Like, wouldn't it be kinda tacked on?

Agree with most of this, though I think Jeremy is the one character in the game where you could do a full 180 at any time, without it feeling out of place.

Given his nerdy past it´d be easy to create a scenario where he has been hurt/bullied to the point he built up a shield and became a "player" - it´s thin ice but if you wanted to you could even go as far as a scenario where his black friends ridiculed him for hanging out with only white guys and he then decided to become more like "them".

Based off of that you could write an entry point where, under the right prerequisites, he could confess to Lena his true self and become a viable romance option. I guess it depends on how much time and effort Eva wants to put into it but you could have two routes for him: keep his superficial path with a "bad" Lena or become a viable romance option for a "good" Lena.

I mean it´s not unlike what you could do with Jack in GGGB where you are either just FBs and in the end he fizzles out or if you get him to confess his story about his first love and his brother, you can become an exclusive, successful couple.

Edit: Just read your post Zedire after I posted this. Very good extension to what I was thinking

 

[Albaduldür]

Of course they're most likely to donate if they know their voice is going to matter, but my point was, nothing actually says that their voice matters - that's something they thought up all on their own. Some patrons donate because they simply want to support a project or artist they love (which is all you can realistically expect besides the benefits made clear in tiers). Others go into it with a preconceived notion that their donation automatically grants them influence, simply because some other games have gone that way. Donating doesn't mean influence unless the person owning the individual Patreon either says it does, or shows it in practice with what they produce. As far as I'm aware (please correct me if I'm wrong), Eva has never mentioned that her patrons have the power to direct the game.

There is no stipulation in any tier of Eva's Patreon that donating will allow you to influence the game. The closest thing is the top-most tier which allows your likeness to appear in the game, and even then it mentions nothing about the patron having any say in HOW their likeness appears in the game, just that it'll be added at some point that Eva sees fit. Everything else is either access to polls, early access to earlier version or material that's going to be going into the game, or benefits on Discord. That's it, and as for polls themselves, their existence says nothing other then that Eva is interested in seeing what people think and what was hit or miss amongst it all.

(I can't speak for anyone else, but if I were a dev on Patreon with a defined plot and character paths for my game, I sure as shit wouldn't be giving influence to people who have no idea about my future plans; people who are gonna vote based on their limited knowledge and their own personal desire rather then what's actually best for the game. Further, I couldn't tell them my future plans for the story anyway, because that would destroy any element of surprise for what's to come. It's like telling the plot twist and ending of a movie to someone who's just started watching it)

But anyway, if someone actually has evidence that goes against this and proves me totally wrong, I'm cool with that. I'm only speaking from what I've seen or know, and I'm not a Patron, so...

(Christ, my hand is getting sore from all this typing )

Man I'm not gonna read all of that.
I'm here to fap not to get involved in a discussion.

It's already enough for me to have my university as a place where to debate...

 

[Albaduldür]

I'm Eva's patron and I would in no way assume to have any real influence on development.

Yes but you cannot speak for everybody.

Anyway....I don't mean that you're not gonna heavily influence it.
You're just going to add a little of your own taste to it

 

[BlandChili]

I don't see how having Jeremy show some personality would in any way get in the way of the BBC Kink, nor necessarily need to instigate a romance path? The content is only meant to flesh out his existing potential. That sort of characterization could quite easily fit into Ian's everyday path where he just happens to be hanging out with Jeremy - no need to change anything that already exists.

No, that's true, given the central point of the game - y'know, the porn - I usually assume that any developments would have to be in either a romantic or sexual course, given that Jeremy is purely about the sexual potential, it just seemed obvious to me that any additional work done to him would be of either of these directions.

But I'm not personally a BBC-connoisseur myself, so I can't speak for that kink as a whole.

There are ways to do it that could feel perfectly natural, you just have to be creative about it. The easiest way would be to have some sort of event that 'provokes' the deeply buried nerd in Jeremy to rear his head.

For example, there could be something like a movie franchise Ian's group (of guy friends?) loved as teens appearing at a convention or something. Ian and his friends all go there, including Jeremy. While Perry, Wade and [potentially a nerdy] Ian are all excited, Jeremy is unusually quiet, but when you all discover that one of the major stars of the last installment (that Jeremey happened to really like) is there signing autographs, something snaps and Jeremy is suddenly a teen again, nerding out about meeting one of his favorite actors and whatnot.

Or it could be something that challenges Jeremy's knowledge of a topic or topics he used to be a master in. So like, maybe something like a quiz night at that old bar or whatever, and Jeremy isn't big on going but eventually agrees when Ian insists, and Jeremy's group absolutely kills it because he knows the answer to every single question.

After either of those scenarios you could have Ian walking with Jeremy (just the two of them), and Ian comments on how he hasn't seen that side of Jeremy in ages. That could then be the point where it gives a bit of an insight into why Jeremy is the way he is now, because if this kind of deep-and-personal is gonna happen with anyone, it's with his best friend, Ian.

For example, in the case of the convention or getting too nerdy over that franchise, it could be that there was a girl who Jeremy really liked back in the day - like, a massive crush - and she rejected him and laughed in his face for being a nerd when he asked her to see a movie in that franchise, or IDK. Point is, he has low self-esteem and was weak willed, and her rejection in front of everyone was so humiliating he threw away all his memorabilia of that series and buried his love of it deep down, and then decided to get hot so he could laugh in her face.

In the case of the quiz, you could have Jeremy talk about how his parents always pushed him to be the best in school or whatever, and it put him under so much pressure that the moment he struck out on his own he completely turned his back on his parents expectations for him. In other words, Jeremy became a chad to rebel, but then found he liked the perks, like getting girls, and thinking too much or being too smart put them off, so he pushed down the nerd in him and tried to embrace the life of a chad. Or whatever.

Anyway, those ideas may be shite, but they serve the purpose of demonstrating how you can give a character a bit of depth even quite a way through - just make it he's pushed his true self down pretty deep, and something just happens to trigger it.

Sure, I get the idea, for that matter I don't think they are bad ones, but what would be the story purpose for these developments?
I could see something to do with Ian's writing relating to that sort of development, keep in mind that the point of Jeremy in the game isn't his own story, it's his role as an NPC that facilitates the fighting section of Ian's story and a specific kink to Lena's.

If you were to expand the story into something sexual, say BBC roleplay with Lena, then I could totally see that written into the story. I just don't think Eva would make such a development purely for the benefit of Jeremy as a concrete character.

From there you could choose to make his old nerd self start to come out more as he finds people around him are cool with it (cos secretly being self-conscious about his personality could be part of his personality), and by the end either he's a full-on nerd again, or he's buried it down deep, OR, he's managed to find a healthy balance between being a chad and enjoying his nerdy pleasures.

I mean, considering both Eva's games have such a focus on being able to transform characters, no reason it can't happen with Jeremy in the same way as certain other characters - providing players make certain choices.

When you think about it, Jeremy's potential transformation back to a nerd would be the reverse to Ian's potential journey into a chad. That could be kinda interesting too.

You're right that it could be interesting, there is no reason why he couldn't have a variable like Holly that both Ian and Lena can influence, I just think that for Eva to seriously consider writing it, there has to either be a sexual or romantic hook for Lena and a story-related one for Ian.

Not that Eva doesn't have characters that doesn't seem to relate directly to a sex/romance option, see Wen and Perry for example, but usually those characters relate to a story development for one of the characters or a sexual path for them both, or the other.

In that way, nerd Jeremy could totally make sense in relation to Ian's story, there are fun possibilities there.

Agree with most of this, though I think Jeremy is the one character in the game where you could do a full 180 at any time, without it feeling out of place.

Given his nerdy past it´d be easy to create a scenario where he has been hurt/bullied to the point he built up a shield and became a "player" - it´s thin ice but if you wanted to you could even go as far as a scenario where his black friends ridiculed him for hanging out with only white guys and he then decided to become more like "them".

Based off of that you could write an entry point where, under the right prerequisites, he could confess to Lena his true self and become a viable romance option. I guess it depends on how much time and effort Eva wants to put into it but you could have two routes for him: keep his superficial path with a "bad" Lena or become a viable romance option for a "good" Lena.

I mean it´s not unlike what you could do with Jack in GGGB where you are either just FBs and in the end he fizzles out or if you get him to confess his story about his first love and his brother, you can become an exclusive, successful couple.

Edit: Just read your post Zedire after I posted this. Very good extension to what I was thinking

No, sure, the possibility is there, the set-up just isn't. With Jack in GGGB the whole "Good/Bad girl" aspect is integrated into his development right from the start so the only way to get his romance is to be a good girl and challenge him on his macho bravado.

So far Lena has none of that with Jeremy, which is what prompted me to ask if it wouldn't feel tacked on if the development came out of no where.

Now, Eva does do revisions and if she did that for Jeremy it could facilitate such a path. Is that what the user base that votes for his sex scenes want?

 

[MyStupidPornAccount]

So far Lena has none of that with Jeremy, which is what prompted me to ask if it wouldn't feel tacked on if the development came out of no where.

Most of the routes start out as pure sex, Emma and Alison are both casual sex and we can only announce Ian's feelings on one of those routes yet but both will come, Cindy will for sure get a romance and you start her route by fucking behind her bf's back in a dark ally and Minerva is probably the biggest example of a pure sex route that is getting a confirmed romance. On Lena's side we already have Axl who I presume will be romanceable and his route so far is him hotdogging her ass, Lena has only spoken to Jeremy like twice its completely within the realm of reason for them to get to know each other and like each other and if players don't want that they would just choose to keep it casual like other routes. I mean there has only been two sex scenes with Jeremy and only one has been initiated by either participant, imagine after that first sex scene with Minerva someone saying she should be romanceable you might think its impossible yet her second scene came around and we can already activate a dating Minerva variable. I'm not saying Eva will do it but acting like its out of character for the game to make this a route is a bit absurd considering all the other routes in the game.

 

[BlandChili]

Most of the routes start out as pure sex, Emma and Alison are both casual sex and we can only announce Ian's feelings on one of those routes yet but both will come, Cindy will for sure get a romance and you start her route by fucking behind her bf's back in a dark ally and Minerva is probably the biggest example of a pure sex route that is getting a confirmed romance. On Lena's side we already have Axl who I presume will be romanceable and his route so far is him hotdogging her ass, Lena has only spoken to Jeremy like twice its completely within the realm of reason for them to get to know each other and like each other and if players don't want that they would just choose to keep it casual like other routes. I mean there has only been two sex scenes with Jeremy and only one has been initiated by either participant, imagine after that first sex scene with Minerva someone saying she should be romanceable you might think its impossible yet her second scene came around and we can already activate a dating Minerva variable. I'm not saying Eva will do it but acting like its out of character for the game to make this a route is a bit absurd considering all the other routes in the game.

Emma and Alison are old friends, we already buy that Ian and they have the capacity to develop real feelings for each other (because the basis is already there)

Cindy goes through quite a long process of scenes where her and Ian have clear chemistry where there is plenty of opportunity to be both complimentary and suggestive.

Lena doesn't have a relationship to Jeremy, he is either the guy you ratted out for cheating or the guy whose actions you are deliberately hiding, there is no relationship.
He has a big dick. That's it.

Not to say that, that's something wrong in of itself, but the structure around his role in the game is entirely different to Alison, Emma and Cindy.

Your point about Minerva is a good one though, it can certainly happen, I just don't personally see it currently.

 

[scor099]

I don't think Eva mentioned Jeremy's past for nothing, obviously she has plans for him and him being a nerd in the past and how he changed is an entry point for a change in personality and opening new paths for him, as a writer I don't think Eva would just throw such a valuable information about his past and given his present personality which is 180 from his past self for nothing, she has plans for him beyond the BBC fetish.

 

[Reasoon]

Most of the routes start out as pure sex, Emma and Alison are both casual sex and we can only announce Ian's feelings on one of those routes yet but both will come, Cindy will for sure get a romance and you start her route by fucking behind her bf's back in a dark ally and Minerva is probably the biggest example of a pure sex route that is getting a confirmed romance. On Lena's side we already have Axl who I presume will be romanceable and his route so far is him hotdogging her ass, Lena has only spoken to Jeremy like twice its completely within the realm of reason for them to get to know each other and like each other and if players don't want that they would just choose to keep it casual like other routes. I mean there has only been two sex scenes with Jeremy and only one has been initiated by either participant, imagine after that first sex scene with Minerva someone saying she should be romanceable you might think its impossible yet her second scene came around and we can already activate a dating Minerva variable. I'm not saying Eva will do it but acting like its out of character for the game to make this a route is a bit absurd considering all the other routes in the game.

Exactly this! And with the way Eva is writing and focusing a lot more on good Stories with ORS I'm pretty sure that most of the potential Routes for Ian and Lena will have the Chance to become romantic and lead into Relationships. And since Lena is lacking romantic Encounters right now the Chance for Jeremy evolving into one is very high.

 

[Deleted member 3064965]

I'm also wondering when (and how) Jeremy finally will tell Ian that Lena sucked his dick. He first began telling Ian the story at Wade's birthday party, but then was interrupted, and then tried again in the latest episode – but then Alison's ex came along and interrupted the story again. It almost felt like the beginning of an ever repeating comical scene – Jeremy trying to tell Ian about it over and over, but always being interrupted. The latest episode in general certainly introduced more humour to the story than we've seen before.

I think it would've been funny if it's finally revealed to Ian right before the MMA tournament (or at another visit at the gym, at least), thus leaving Ian with the choice to either not bother about it and just fight as normal, or get angry and beat the shit out of him.

 

[Dilshad Klein]

How does the poll results looks now?

 

[Reasoon]

I'm also wondering when (and how) Jeremy finally will tell Ian that Lena sucked his dick. He first began telling Ian the story at Wade's birthday party, but then was interrupted, and then tried again in the latest episode – but then Alison's ex came along and interrupted the story again. It almost felt like the beginning of an ever repeating comical scene – Jeremy trying to tell Ian about it over and over, but always being interrupted. The latest episode in general certainly introduced more humour to the story than we've seen before.

I think it would've been funny if it's finally revealed to Ian right before the MMA tournament (or at another visit at the gym, at least), thus leaving Ian with the choice to either not bother about it and just fight as normal, or get angry at beat the shit out of him.

You're right that's actually something I haven't realized until now. Jeremy was really going to tell Ian about the Blowjob from Lena but if Lena and Jeremy are also going all the way in Chapter 8 I'm pretty sure Jeremy will shut his mouth as long as possible because Lena clearly told him so.

This brings me to the question does Jeremy say something to Lena before they fuck if Ian told him before that he is falling for Lena? I heard he says something before the Blowjob so this has to be even worse right? I never play the IanxLena Route where they falling in Love with each other so I have no Idea what happens there

 

[MyStupidPornAccount]

You're right that's actually something I haven't realized until now. Jeremy was really going to tell Ian about the Blowjob from Lena but if Lena and Jeremy are also going all the way in Chapter 8 I'm pretty sure Jeremy will shut his mouth as long as possible because Lena clearly told him so.

This brings me to the question does Jeremy say something to Lena before they fuck if Ian told him before that he is falling for Lena? I heard he says something before the Blowjob so this has to be even worse right? I never play the IanxLena Route where they falling in Love with each other so I have no Idea what happens there

He doesn't say anything before they fuck but if Ian has feelings for Lena and Jeremy likes Ian enough then he will refuse the blowjob at the party unless Lena spends a will point. EDIT: its during the texts that Jeremy mentions it was too far and that he wants to tell Ian, Lena tells him that he shouldn't whether she has feelings for Ian or not, then after the sex she will double down saying it should be a secret.

I have actually just found that that dialogue with Jeremy over the phone and during the sex scene in Louises room is busted because it still acts as if Lena is with Ian even if she breaks it off with him for fucking holly.

 

[Rickster82]

Has EVA KISS already hinted at when Update 0.9 is to be expected? August? September?

 

[Reasoon]

He doesn't say anything before they fuck but if Ian has feelings for Lena and Jeremy likes Ian enough then he will refuse the blowjob at the party unless Lena spends a will point. EDIT: its during the texts that Jeremy mentions it was too far and that he wants to tell Ian, Lena tells him that he shouldn't whether she has feelings for Ian or not, then after the sex she will double down saying it should be a secret.

I have actually just found that that dialogue with Jeremy over the phone and during the sex scene in Louises room is busted because it still acts as if Lena is with Ian even if she breaks it off with him for fucking holly.

Thank you very much for checking these Options out! It's really interesting to know all the Possibilities of this Game and I'm sure the Lena/Jeremy Thing and them keeping it secret will explode like a bomb at some Point and then I'm curious what Choices the Player has as Ian to react to this. The reaction from Louise could also be intense when this comes out (same Scenario like Wade with IanxCindy)