VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch.4 Up.5 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[ename144]

But like..... the (presumed) recording of him in Kathleens office clearly shows he isn't unknowingly there?

I guess he might not know there are cameras but i just see it as him going "my wife was involved in a sex club that I got baited into going to before I knew she was there and now I'm mad that people think I'm a cuck..... but I swear I'm not a cuck"

Hey, it's 2025. If Elias lies about it loudly and often enough to start with, no one will care by the time the truth finally makes it's way out.

Besides, even the tape (assuming it has full audio) is a lot more damaging to the Club than it is to Elias. He clearly intended to get involved in an illegal venture, but he also clearly didn't have a lot of details. If the initial story is that he thought it was a high-class brothel and it turned out to be a sadistic human trafficking and honeypotting operation, the truth isn't going to be a stark enough difference to discredit the initial story. Nuance just doesn't make for sexy headlines. At best it will wind up bringing Elias down a couple years after the Club is wiped out.

And as far as everyone thinking Elias is a cuck, there are two important distinctions here. First, his peers thinking he's a cuck is a significantly more pressing concern for a guy like him than the ignorant, unwashed masses thinking it. Second, the scenario in which his wife voluntarily whored herself out purely to stick it to him would be a vastly more damning indictment than the scenario in which an organized criminal conspiracy tricked her into a compromising position as part of a scheme to blackmail him.

The latter scenario isn't true obviously, but it's similar enough to the truth to obscure that truth for quite a while - possible indefinitely - if he gets it out there promptly and forcefully. That would be his threat if he decides to go nuclear, and it would be a difficult one to pre-empt without getting way further into the weeds than the Club would want to. They have a lot more to lose, since Elias is the only one being humiliated at the moment. Kathleen MIGHT be in a position to do it, but none of the rest of the management are.

Public opinion could go either way especially if he gets "ahead of it" but it could just as easily bite him in the ass if the club shows the tapes of him not being "lured" and him partaking in the night before seeing felica. I guess i just think Elias is more of a scrub than most others do. In your idea is Kathleen's plan with van doren (going on longer than the summer) partially reliant on Elias joining the club which is reliant on felica wanting to join as a carnation? Or is it just incidental and anything that would "make rubble" be fine? Gotta get in some last minute speculation before it's invalidated

I don't think Kathleen is relying on Elias to glass the place (metaphorically speaking), I think she expects him to settle for stirring up a lot of drama - in part because I think she'll make sure someone is around to calm Elias down with promises of restitution (at least temporarily). But I also think she's willing to take the risk of him melting down because she is expecting the Club to be wrecked once her deal with van Doren comes to light, so she's planning to cut some losses anyway.

Drama from Elias would be the ideal outcome for Kathleen because it will get everyone looking in the wrong direction when the bigger bomb goes off. If all goes to plan, that blast will reshape things to the point Elias won't feel quite so singled out; he (and some of the other owners) will choose to cut their losses and walk away, leaving the field to Kat. If things escalate to the point the Club goes public (especially right from the start) that would always be a complication for her, but it's a low probability, manageable risk as long as she's knows what might trigger it and has laid the proper groundwork.

Or at least that's my take. But Kathleen does seem the sort to dismiss her adversaries, so it's always possible she shares your view of Elias and expects him to suffer in silence.

 

[Ottoeight]

Only to end up as cheap whorish entertainment for a bunch of men similar to her husband whom she despises. I don't think that's much of a win as some people would argue it to be.



I don't think that's very likely if Grace was working or aiding Chuck's "hobby" I don't think she would be that insistent in getting Ian life in a different life path. After all, I don't think her trying to use Edwin in orded to guide Ian down a certain path seems like a tactic maybe even Victoria would use.


Well, I think you are alone on that man. I don't think nobody else here believes the "nazi doctor" is secretely a good person all along. Just because she is a nerd doesn't make her morality any better or worse xD



I wonder what TD plans for Chuck and Kathleen to be their "biggest sin". I ran pretty much any scenario I can think of in my head but nothing really would make me hate one more than the other, or disliking them more than I already do as people. I mean it's obvious that the club had gotten people killed one way or the other so does it really matter? I'm really curious but not really something I desperately need to learn about.



My predictions would be: Either her finding out about Edwin's "therapy sessions" with her material like at the very end of the update OR she will be confronted by Grace and warned about what both of her sons are doing.


Why isn't Felicia included?

I really don't think Veronica would doublecross Edwin. She seems like a person who is the most likely to give people the benefit of the doubt if they act in a way she approves regardless of who they are or their circumstances.

Felicia and Rose on the other hand....

Rose has proved that she only cares about her daughter and probably also altough she would never say it person the image her daughter has of her, I could see her screwing Edwin over considering the different possibilties regarding their deal and how Edwin treats her during it. If Kath would find out, I could see her selling out Edwin in a moment of desperation OR if she resents him because of how he treats her.

Felicia is also someone I would categorized as someone who at the end of the day only cares about herself. I don't know if I would call her evil But she seems truly selfish. She sold herself out in a petty revenge aspect without ever considering how that would affect her psychologically or what would her own mother and the people she values would think about her decision. If you consider that she is only in the situation she is because of petty revenge, I can't trust a person like that, if she had something to gain out of screwing someone over she would do it in a heartbeat I think.



I really, really, REALLY hope that will not happen. Half of her appeal to me is that she is not directly related to the club plot and if the final big choice is whether to stay or leave the club I'd reallly like for at least 1 girl to not be directly a part of it in any way shape or form. If TD and Gil do this, I hope they add a new girl that has nothing to do with the club. Hell, bring back Mallow I don't care if this extends development time by 10 years and we have a Mallow centered episode, I would just want 1 non-club related option for Edwin to choose!!

110% agree with you, bro.

If we're making predictions for the upcoming update, here are my wild guesses:

• The feud between Warren and Jacob over Emma will reach a boiling point driving everyone in the Club to one side or the other (partially determined by whatever actions the MC took on Emma's behalf in second Exhibition). That should polarize the place just in time for Kathleen's twin bombshells of Elias joining and Abel's research to shatter the foundation like an atomic-powered wedge in the next update.
• We (and probably the MC) will get some actual intel on what Abel is working on, though the ramifications won't be fully realized for a while. (Extra golf clap if Kathleen herself revels the info as part of her 'tutoring' path for the MC.)
• The MC is going to have to make a choice soon, one highlighted way back at the start of the game, to be a "good man" or not. My guess is we'll encounter the impetus for said choice this update (probably as a result of the Darius investigation, but possibly coming from Abel's research instead). I'm not sure if we'll actually make the choice this time or wait for the third Exhibition, but I don't think we'll wait until Week 4.
• An MC who chose to cheat on Hana blatantly will have some explaining to do.
• The MC will have to decide which - if any - of the LIs he's currently pursuing to get serious about. That's not to say he must commit to one and forsake all others this instant, just that he will have an inner debate about where he thinks the relationship(s) could be going and whether he wants to advance one in earnest (or reinforce that choice if he already picked Hana). That said, my guess is we'll get at least the first step of the commitment process during the much-hyped extravaganza on Friday.

1. It might happen, buuut... we haven't seen preview pics with Warren and/or Jacob;

2. It might happen;

3. It might happen;

4. It might happen;

5. Nah.


What might happen that starts stirring the pot with future consequences as well:

- Edwin and Ian learn something more about what happened to Darius & Isla;

- Vic and Ian's mom share their opinions about what Edwin and Ian are doing right now;

- Mina wonders what the "club" is about.

Praying to whatever gods and demons are required for this update to have a Sophia scene I will make any choice no matter how destructive and sacrifice any loved ones that must be sacrificed to see my Goddess once again laid bare before my unworthy eyes may the sight blind me in its radiance. If Edwin is struck dead by the orgasm induced by her it will be worth it.

We haven't seen any preview pictures about her and/or Abel, bro.

 

[slobber]

I actually think the opposite of you in regard to Chuck and I think he is the most evil of the 3 Club bosses.

He seems like the behind the scenes mob boss, smart enough to have everyone do the dirty work to have escape goats and just have future legal issues be with money white collar crimes. His "fun" is just manipulation and soft politicking. Devs did a great job capturing his evil eyes in the renders.

I think they left him ambiguous on purpose. Right now there are two general paths they can take with Chuck. He can literally be the nice uncle with a screw loose. The investigation from the Dr Chick suggested he basically just loved the thrill of "conquest". Constantly hiring skilled women to train him in a 'game' so he could 'conquer' them. Much like him and his chess games with the lady.

Or they could do the twist and he's this crazy manipulative mastermind all along.

I personally prefer the former since thus far, he's chaotic but not malicious, (which coincides with how he lectures / warns Kathleen against pushing MC's buttons with the live-sex-tape-with-Rose to mess with his knowledge of his mother) but that unhinged look in his eyes leaves room for the latter to be true too.

 

[Idontplay]

Only to end up as cheap whorish entertainment for a bunch of men similar to her husband whom she despises. I don't think that's much of a win as some people would argue it to be.
[Supercut]

How dare you say Felicia has become a cheap an expensive whore, just because she decided to become a cheap an expensive whore? She is a confident emancipated woman, who decided to become a sexual object in a (highly expensive) brothel, after having become a sexual object for her (very wealthy) husband, so stop to think about her like a sexual object!

EDIT: Felicia is not cheap

 

[Turret]

I think every sane person can agree the only cheap whore is the 1 Dimensional side pet with way, way, less character depth than Veronica, a 1 D who sold out to Big Pharma. Thats right, SOPHIA, the only blonde whore in PC.

F95 needs to do something to plug that Turret of paid for Pfizer propaganda being spewed propping up the enemy of the working class. Sophia ppphhh more like Sophizer.

Olaf, is that you? Forgotten to take your happy pills in the morning again? You are not on an election campaign meeting right now! Simply do not forget the biggest enemy of the working class is a complete incompetent Zero like you and most of your ministers on the cabinet´s seats.

Joking aside, Sophia is far more intelligent than Veronika ever will be. Even Samson himself says that Veronika could simply walk away and start anew with another gym and live her dream. But our resident silver athlete is too stubborn and/or dumb to do so, instead she subjects herself to a degrading game, knowing even a win is just a band aid!

 

[Darreau91]

Olaf, is that you? Forgotten to take your happy pills in the morning again? You are not on an election campaign meeting right now! Simply do not forget the biggest enemy of the working class is a complete incompetent Zero like you and most of your ministers on the cabinet´s seats.

Joking aside, Sophia is far more intelligent than Veronika ever will be. Even Samson himself says that Veronika could simply walk away and start anew with another gym and live her dream. But our resident silver athlete is too stubborn and/or dumb to do so, instead she subjects herself to a degrading game, knowing even a win is just a band aid!

American… *nervous laughter* Wish Germany well though and don’t elect people over 70, ever. Not… a good… idea.

Veronica has a concept of a plan with her women only gym and is no longer heeding Samsons advice because well, she learned from her previous mistake of listening to his advice before the carnation club.

Sophizers plan to get out from under the thumb from her master creating brain washing medicine is…. playing Chess in a whore house.

4d chess moves I suppose

 

[Flowing Thought]

We haven't seen any preview pictures about her and/or Abel, bro.

 

[Takkatakka]

I can hype a little bit and tell you that every beta-tester loved this update, albeit for different reasons. So I can safely assume that most of you will also love it and won't be disappointed, it has goodies for everyone. And yeah, this update is massive, although to see EVERYTHING you will need a lot of saves or unrenpy tool (but it's totally worth it).

What's more, story-wise this might be the most earth-shattering update ever so brace yourselves.

I just realized, that I don't have a single save her, since I'm away from home over the holidays until new year.

 

[WhytShadow]

I just realized, that I don't have a single save her, since I'm away from home over the holidays until new year.

Word of advice from a veteran renpy player, always backup your saves to the cloud. I have a routine that syncs my saves to my mega drive everyday.

 

[Turret]

American… *nervous laughter* Wish Germany well though and don’t elect people over 70, ever. Not… a good… idea.

Thank you! As for electing people, it should depend on their competence. That is one of the biggest problems the western world has right now, a dearth of competent politicians and agitation by people who have no idea how the world functions.
There are too many "Säler" among the politicians today! Aus dem Kreisssaal in den Schulsaal, in den Hörsaal und den Plenarsaal.(From the birthing room into the school room, then into the university room followed by the parliament room) Results are people big on idiology and no life experience or competence. End Results can be seen in various nations.

Veronica has a concept of a plan with her women only gym and is no longer heeding Samsons advice because well, she learned from her previous mistake of listening to his advice before the carnation club.

The problem with Veronika is as I said her extreme stubborness. She could live her dream, it is not too late to start anew with another gym, even Samson says so.

Sophizers plan to get out from under the thumb from her master creating brain washing medicine is…. playing Chess in a whore house.4d chess moves I suppose

I mentioned it before (even Chuck is aware of it, but probably misinterprets the situation going by dialog) that Abel and Sophia have their own black ops lab where they could experiment to their hearts content without any interference or blackmail potential. They are at the Club for other reasons, the sex drug testing is bogus.

 

[TD1900]

Even Samson himself says that Veronika could simply walk away and start anew with another gym and live her dream. But our resident silver athlete is too stubborn and/or dumb to do so, instead she subjects herself to a degrading game, knowing even a win is just a band aid!

Hey, it's not Veronica's fault some hack handsome writer needs an excuse to dommy a muscle mommy. Don't hold that against her.

 

[Nulldev]

I mentioned a similar opinion several times in the past. I am not against tattoos in general, but normally a girl tattooed to the degree Hana is, is a turn off for me. Still she is one of my favourite female charactrers in the game.

Let us face it: character- and storywise so far Hana, Felicia and Sophia are the most interesting female characters in the game, by a margin.

You can't even spell Kat, your opinion is invalid

 

[MrTrue]

Hey, it's not Veronica's fault some hack handsome writer needs an excuse to dommy a muscle mommy. Don't hold that against her.

She was the very reason I got interested in this game in the first place.
The previews of her had me hooked.

 

[Ungawa]

Praying to whatever gods and demons are required for this update to have a Sophia scene I will make any choice no matter how destructive and sacrifice any loved ones that must be sacrificed to see my Goddess once again laid bare before my unworthy eyes may the sight blind me in its radiance. If Edwin is struck dead by the orgasm induced by her it will be worth it.

The Siren Song of Sophia Strikes Suddenly and Swiftly...

 

[kumenl0l]

i havent had a christmas miracle in years, so I'm praying for a swift hero this year

 

[sunaboz]

(...)
Only to end up as cheap whorish entertainment for a bunch of men similar to her husband whom she despises. I don't think that's much of a win as some people would argue it to be. (...)

As Felicia said: "Money makes for good foreplay."

90% of female characters in PC are whores (including Victoria) which makes for great entertainment for us, although Felicia is anything but cheap and the real reason she's participating isn't her enjoyment but her dream which she would have hard time of realising without some outside help.

As for Elias, until he refused to help her with one thing she truly desired she didn't despise him AFAWK, her marriage was basically a business transaction and she's typical trophy wife (or maybe not so typical when she has "no kids policy" in her pre-nup). Elias didn't care that she had some outside entertainment as long as she looked pretty and would go the parties he wanted her to come.

(...)
Felicia is also someone I would categorized as someone who at the end of the day only cares about herself. I don't know if I would call her evil But she seems truly selfish. She sold herself out in a petty revenge aspect without ever considering how that would affect her psychologically or what would her own mother and the people she values would think about her decision. If you consider that she is only in the situation she is because of petty revenge, I can't trust a person like that, if she had something to gain out of screwing someone over she would do it in a heartbeat I think. (...)

You couldn't be more further from the truth. First of all, she's the most honest character in the whole game (to be fair, the bar is low here). She hides some things, sure (and who doesn't?), but outside of her trophy-wife job, she says what she has on her mind. One of my favourite lines from the last update is this one:

"You, as in the you who plays sexual organ grinder monkey for his day job, is making a point of being monogamous?"
(this happened if we decided we want to have platonic relationship with Felicia and Edwin was in a relationship with Hana)

Secondly, she cares about many people.

She cares about Mina:
"...what about Mina? After going through the wringer with Ian, don't be indelicate with her when you let her know.

She cares about her step-children: "I think Rosie is right. I love my stepkids. They've been a part of my life for eight years, ever since they were babies."

She cares about her muse and favourite artist: "I'm just hoping the best for a talented woman.."

She cares about Rosalind:

Spoiler: more lines for context

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And she cares about Edwin (giving him advice based on her own experience).

I honestly don't know where you got the notion that she's selfish.

Also, WTF do you bring Felicia's mother into this? Everything that goes on in PC club is hush hush, it's not you typical brothel and even if it was why would her mother know about it? WTF? What would Rose's/Veronica's/Victoria's mothers think if they knew what their daughters were doing? I don't see how it's even relevant.

 

[Ottoeight]

I guess Felicia's worshippers need the urge to proclaim their unquestionable and firm admiration even harder than Sophia's little squad members.

In the meanwhile, we majority still think that we wanna bang them all, no matter what you say and think about them chicks.

 

[Flowing Thought]

I guess Felicia's worshippers need the urge to proclaim their unquestionable and firm admiration even harder than Sophia's little squad members.

 

[misfolk]

The Siren Song of Sophia Strikes Suddenly and Swiftly...

"Rolling Rachel," Henry said. "Rachel rolls revealingly round the room. Rachel's rompers ruck up."

 

[Kameri]

anyone else is currently watching “Squid Game S2” and thinking about this game because of the similarities? you know elite rich people using their influence and wealth to screw over desperate people for their pleasure, instead of getting killed, you're getting fucked literally.