VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch.4 Up.6 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[selberdreher]

There is also a choice somewhere, which you only get if your toughness is low.

That would be the 5th choice in my post above. Other kind choices seem to be unaffected.

 

[camube]

There seems to be a misconception regarding the importance of the toughness score. Researching the available walkthroughs (the Ch3Upd2 by ZoeyRaven in particular, which may be outdated) shows that there are only 5(!) out of roughly 330 decisions gated by a certain toughness score, with thresholds of 19, 20 and 21 respectively. None of them do open or close any specific paths.

These choices are:

1. Trying to resist Kathleens temptation in the limousine: If [Tough] >20, then [Tough+1] else [Tough-1]
2. Tell Rosie she is an eager slut in her gonzo video: appears only if [Tough] >=20, and nets us a -1 to [RoseAffection]
3. Daringly tell Kat to bring it on in the gonzo reward scene: If [Tough] >=19, [Kath+2] & [Tough+1], else [Kath+1] & [Tough+1]
4. Relieve your bladder on Veronica in her first exhibition scene: appears only if [Tough]>=21 and yields [Kath+2] [Veron-4] [Rose-1] [Hana-2] [Warren+2] [Sam+1] plus the flag [W1ExVeroPissedOn]
5. and in the same scene, but mutually exclusive, Make sure Veronica is ok: appears only if [Tough] <20 which yields [Kath-1] [Veron+2] [Rosa+1] [Hana+1]

All routes and sex scenes so far available are gated by either affection and/or certain flags, which can be obtained independently from your current toughness score. Altough this may change in the future, TD1900 stated in this post that the main impact of toughness is in altering some of Edwins flavour texts, with thresholds Turret mentioned on a few occasions (btw Turret, where did you get those numbers? Also i would like to see the source of your claim that 30+ toughness disables some softer and kinder choices, because i couldnt find evidence for it). From personal experience i can attest to the statement that toughness indeed alters the internal monologue of Edwin. In my old canon playthrough with 27 toughness, i found his thoughts in Minas sex scene off-putting, so i started a new one and with 23 toughness the scene played out exactly the same way, except this time i was perfectly fine with Edwins internal monologue.
I believe so far the main function of the stat is to provide the players a feedback on their choices, without effectively altering the storyline. Nonetheless, if toughness would be utilizied to a greater degree in future, i would probably welcome it.

So with the absolute impact of Edwins toughness on the storyline (not-spoiler: it is minor) out of the way, lets take a look on the relative influence this stat has, because sometimes choosing a tougher option leads to a loss of affection points which are indeed utilized. Lets assume you aim for high toughness, to get those sweet derogatory lines from Edwin (whatever rocks your boat, pal). Lets further assume you want to be friends with the amazonian bodybuilder, because you have chosen her as your "love interest" (a term i would use very hesitantly in PC, it is not a dating sim). Lets further assume you are into watersports and love to cum on her face (you are a tough guy, remember?) This is no easy task, because Vero starts with just 5 Affection, but i shall prove it viable.

Spoiler: How to befriend Veronica with high toughness and to score also with the other girls

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Bottomline: if someone is hell-bent on taking only asshole choices which give them toughness even if they surpass the cap of 30, they dont need to be flabbergasted when their playthrough went into the gutter. Play it smart guys!
That's it, prove me wrong.

Edit: Typos

What choice/event yield [w2VeroHeated]? what's that?

 

[Bill Temple]

What choice/event yield [w2VeroHeated]? what's that?

choose "Try and warm Veronica up before the rest of the photo shoot".

 

[clauwudi]

Blond can easily pay/solve brown and red hair's problems.
It means, blond can just buy memberships directly with money. The problem of brown and red hair will be solved, they can just leave show. Considering the amount of money it takes for brown and red hair, the blond's entry fee is probably the lowest.

I think the main line can be enhanced a bit:
The brown hair's debtor is an underworld boss, the boss's purpose is to threesome the brown hair and her daughter. The brown hair join game is for her daughter, money is just 2nd goal. If the boss knows repayment comes from the show, the boss will back off because the boss doesn't want to mess up with the club members.
The red hair's gym is a workout spot for talented young people who have the talent to win Olympic and can't afford the exorbitant training fees. They can't compete professionally due to Olympic requirements. (this is a great way to add new girls)

 

[Joker_code]

Where is the save files for the game? I don't see it in the RenPy folder.

 

[deimosphobos]

Blond can easily pay/solve brown and red hair's problems.
It means, blond can just buy memberships directly with money. The problem of brown and red hair will be solved, they can just leave show. Considering the amount of money it takes for brown and red hair, the blond's entry fee is probably the lowest.

I think the main line can be enhanced a bit:
The brown hair's debtor is an underworld boss, the boss's purpose is to threesome the brown hair and her daughter. The brown hair join game is for her daughter, money is just 2nd goal. If the boss knows repayment comes from the show, the boss will back off because the boss doesn't want to mess up with the club members.
The red hair's gym is a workout spot for talented young people who have the talent to win Olympic and can't afford the exorbitant training fees. They can't compete professionally due to Olympic requirements. (this is a great way to add new girls)

Respectfully, I don't think you're understanding the plot of PC as is. Felicia can't spend money to get into this club; considering a few scene that come later, she wants to achieve her entry into an an otherwise male-only space, and the only way to do that is through competing.

Also, your odd tangent about the plot seems somewhat non-sensical; alterations to Rosalind's plot wouldn't make sense now, nor does the Veronica idea. PC (in my opinion) isn't about "add new girls"--it's hardly a harem simulator.

 

[Bill Temple]

Where is the save files for the game? I don't see it in the RenPy folder.

the saves are in folder \PaleCarnations-Ch3Up4Public-pc\game\saves.
Files in \PaleCarnations-Ch3Up4Public-pc\Renpy are the program files for Renpy to run, not the VN data/instructions.

 

[Nobles]

So im playing along. So far I liking it. Mina seems to be my favourt girl so far, so im hoping to steal her from Ian (the good ntr ^_~), and maybe corrupt her? If its possible ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°).

But the thing I want to ask, it has the urination tag, what type of content was it. girls peeing like animals or watched? Wetting themselfs unable to hold it in ? or sexual watersports? Former two I find kinda cute/exciting content. If I keep on playing will I stumble apon said scenes, or do I need to do something specific ? If there is any intentional scenes at all.

 

[darlic]

So im playing along. So far I liking it. Mina seems to be my favourt girl so far, so im hoping to steal her from Ian (the good ntr ^_~), and maybe corrupt her? If its possible ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°).

But the thing I want to ask, it has the urination tag, what type of content was it. girls peeing like animals or watched? Wetting themselfs unable to hold it in ? or sexual watersports? Former two I find kinda cute/exciting content. If I keep on playing will I stumble apon said scenes, or do I need to do something specific ? If there is any intentional scenes at all.

IIRC there is only one optional scene and it's about the mc peeing on one of the girls to humiliate her, if you want more spoilers, it happens during the first audience event

 

[SanaeS]

I have a question for TD that came to mind after replaying the whole game in one go.

Spoiler: Is there going to be a TRUE ENDING?

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[sabadongelov]

No LI is locked out, but depending on their established personality some couple options are easier or harder to create, due to convictions, ideals and compatible outlook of the two persons in question.
E.g. it is easier for a genuinly nice with a modicum of morals Edwin to win the heart of Hana than a deviant agreeing with his best chummer Ian that PC is the best since sliced bread Edwin. A 30+ toughness Edwin can still land with Hana, but this is extremly difficult, since he will have a hard time getting enough relationship points and their different outlooks on life won´t help.

Do you know how the game will be structured going forward? Because I have had no trouble maintaining both a maxed out relationship score with Hana and a toughness score of 30 (which as far as I can remember is also max, eventhough it doesn't say so).

Only in the last update are there some actions that I would like to take, that would lower my affection score with Hana somewhat, but as far as I can see, they're not related to the toughness score.

Otherwise, you're just assuming that it would be extremely difficult for a max toughness Edwin to woo Hana due to their different outlook in life, and I'd agree if there is no way to change Hanas outlook. Cue possible corruption path.

As for "turning Hana to the dark side" there is the question what each person sees as corruption and more important how this shows. For example Hana might only becoming more adventurous in bed when she gets corrupted, something as deeply ingrained as her "freedom of choice" ideal and that she wants a functioning family will not go away early or maybe not at all. I can see an uncorrupted or only slightly to medium corrupted Hana working out with both a low toughness and a mischivious Edwin.

I can't say I'd view getting "more adventurous in bed" as corruption other than if the person in question has expressed moral missgivings about that very sexual practise.

What I'm talking about in PC is corruption in the sense that Hanas outlook on life is changed at least enough for her to not be bothered by the immorality going on at PC and/or high toughness Edwins morals (or lack thereof...).

I also think that Mina wil be easier to corrupt than Hana or Felicia, who both generally know what they want and like and give a damn what most other people think about them. And it is NOT her naivity from coming from a Nuns bunker school, but what we see in glimpses about her. The combination of curiosity and the "I do not know who I am, what are my feelings", is what makes her vulnerable.

There is no need to corrupt Felicia, she already wants to become part of PC, warts and all. While she might not have the same sadistic tendencies as Kathleen (then again, who knows what she might do should she be put in the driver seat?), she definitely have no moral missgivings about what's going on. If anything, the long term conflict should rather be between her outlook on life and that of a low toughness (or at least high morality) Edwin. Somehow I don't think this will be reflected in the game, but it would have been sweet if you could "uncorrupt" Felicia (in the same way it would be sweet to be able to corrupt Hana).

As for Mina, that's difficult to know. She's younger and seems more unsure about her place in the world, but that's not necessarily the same thing as being morally ambivalent. Also, importantly, whereas Hana already exist at PC and is marinated in everything happening there, has accepted it enough to allow for being groomed for a leadership role (which will marinate her even further, and quite possible start chipping away at her moral defences even without Edwins "help"), Mina is completely in the dark. Realistically, unless high toughness Edwin introduce her to the world of evil assholery very, veeery carefully, she should statistically speaking bolt as soon as she understands what he's about.

Actually, that would probably be true even for a low toughness Edwin, as long as he's still working at PC and partaking in it's debauchery. I think most women would go "Yeah, sure, you say you hate it, but still, there you are, working at a criminal enterprise, fucking prostitutes and exploited women for the pleasure of evil rich fucks who delight in their torment. So fuck you, you hypocrite bastard, you can fuck your whores all you want, but you won't be touching me again!". But just as I'm guessing there won't be any need for low toughness Edwin to "uncorrupt" Felicia, I'm guessing at least low toughness Edwin won't have to corrupt Mina. For instance by quitting PC and having a relationship with her without telling her any of the sordid business going on at PC. Or maybe we'll find out she has a dark side we haven't seen yet, which would come in handy if Edwin wants to stay at PC and still get with Mina.

Even in a reformed PC there might be a bit "funny sex business". Not that much, but still a bit. Hana has no problem with prostitution as a job, her problem with the Club is that many of the Girls and Carnations there are exploited or working under duress. If someone working at the Club is there without being forced and by their own decision, then Hana is OK with that. As seen when she told Felicia that she wished all girls at the Club were like her. Feli does not need to be at PC, it was her choice to do so and she has at least sometimes real fun doing the competition.
So for instance if there is a housegirl, who was not forced to be at the Club, who is ok with "waterboarding games" or other kinky stuff, then I can see even the reformed Club keeping these sex practises on the menue.

But yes, reforming the club to be less exploiting, more decent treatment and "special business"-like fits more un- or only slightly/medium corrupted Edwin and Hana.

By "funny business" I meant the kind of exploitative shit that seem to be PC:s USP. Many (not all) of its patrons seem to get off on the power dynamic and would probably not be interested if it was a 100 percent above the board consensual act with a sex worker that's perfectly fine (might even like it) with whatever sexual practise is going on.

Felicia won't need PC to be reformed. If anything, I think a reformed PC might clash with her stated goal of getting in on the action. She wants the influence and the connections she could get by rubbing shoulders with the rich and powerful patrons of PC. But many of these patrons are not likely to stay if PC is reformed into a sustainable fair-trade brothel. And even if it remains a high end brothel, the new kind of clientele would probably not serve Felicias goals in the same way.

 

[The Good Hunter]

How do you activate the cheat mod?

 

[Aner878787]

IIRC there is only one optional scene and it's about the mc peeing on one of the girls to humiliate her, if you want more spoilers, it happens during the first audience event

Nobles There are 4 more scenes that i remember. You can make one of the girls pee like a dog for a photo shoot (optional) and you can make one of the girls pee herself while riding you (optional).
Then there are two scenes with the same patron, in one you see him peeing on a girl through a camera (still frame, not optional) and later he is getting a bj and just pees down a girls throat.

 

[Aner878787]

Hey TD1900 awesome game, one of the best there is. The writing is amazing and the models, while also great have been improving along the game. It just hooks you up and you can't stop playing. It was 2am when i started considering calling it a night and thinking lets just finish this part... suddenly it was 2pm, that never happened to me before.


Some typos and errors i found:
Kathleen: Truth to be told, i don't really mind a little stink
Hana: Well, i need to get off to (the) lower levels.
Felicia: That('s) your advice as a professional?
Rosalind: "N-no, my daughter's twelve..." -- might be wrong but think it was said she was 13 somewhere else
Continuity issue in Lucy-Harper scene. in the "Harper didn't answer her." part, her nipples are covered, the next one uncovered. Tough it can be said it happened between frames.
Kathleen: "First time on one of these before?" -- Have you been on one of these before?
(about Rosalind) I didn't want to throw he(r) down and rut- at least, not yet.
Kathleen: To my boyfriend and his bruised hand... to the frat boy whoa was now half-consciously pulling teeth out of his nose... things were a big deal to them.



Hana will always give Rosalind the point the second event?

I don't think Edwin was unusually moralistic in this last update, if anything i was a little surprised by his inner thoughts when he was with Mina, how he kept calling Mina a bitch or saying "looking at her stupid face". A few minutes later he is worried spiting on her tits would be crude. If he said those things out loud it would be ok as humiliation, but as inner monologue it seems to run against his usual opinion of Mina.
Curious if we will eventually meet her mother.
Like many others, saddened about the no incest, being Victoria the greatest milf of all times, but if that happened it might make her role in the greater story a little awkward, so i submit to the devs wisdom.

 

[Aner878787]

How do you activate the cheat mod?

Look at the bottom right corner of the screen

 

[selberdreher]

Nobles There are 4 more scenes that i remember. You can make one of the girls pee like a dog for a photo shoot (optional) and you can make one of the girls pee herself while riding you (optional).
Then there are two scenes with the same patron, in one you see him peeing on a girl through a camera (still frame, not optional) and later he is getting a bj and just pees down a girls throat.

and a 5th one: after her fourth orgasm our beloved blonde cutie can not hold her bladder anymore (semi-optional)
although i am not 100% sure about the (optional) one ending of the reverse cowgirl of our cow-girl: this could be very well also a heavy squirt, the liquid looks a bit colourless.

 

[sabadongelov]

There seems to be a misconception regarding the importance of the toughness score. Researching the available walkthroughs (the Ch3Upd2 by ZoeyRaven in particular, which may be outdated) shows that there are only 5(!) out of roughly 330 decisions gated by a certain toughness score, with thresholds of 19, 20 and 21 respectively. None of them do open or close any specific paths.

These choices are:

1. Trying to resist Kathleens temptation in the limousine: If [Tough] >20, then [Tough+1] else [Tough-1]
2. Tell Rosie she is an eager slut in her gonzo video: appears only if [Tough] >=20, and nets us a -1 to [RoseAffection]
3. Daringly tell Kat to bring it on in the gonzo reward scene: If [Tough] >=19, [Kath+2] & [Tough+1], else [Kath+1] & [Tough+1]
4. Relieve your bladder on Veronica in her first exhibition scene: appears only if [Tough]>=21 and yields [Kath+2] [Veron-4] [Rose-1] [Hana-2] [Warren+2] [Sam+1] plus the flag [W1ExVeroPissedOn]
5. and in the same scene, but mutually exclusive, Make sure Veronica is ok: appears only if [Tough] <20 which yields [Kath-1] [Veron+2] [Rosa+1] [Hana+1]

All routes and sex scenes so far available are gated by either affection and/or certain flags, which can be obtained independently from your current toughness score. Altough this may change in the future, TD1900 stated in this post that the main impact of toughness is in altering some of Edwins flavour texts, with thresholds Turret mentioned on a few occasions (btw Turret, where did you get those numbers? Also i would like to see the source of your claim that 30+ toughness disables some softer and kinder choices, because i couldnt find evidence for it). From personal experience i can attest to the statement that toughness indeed alters the internal monologue of Edwin. In my old canon playthrough with 27 toughness, i found his thoughts in Minas sex scene off-putting, so i started a new one and with 23 toughness the scene played out exactly the same way, except this time i was perfectly fine with Edwins internal monologue.
I believe so far the main function of the stat is to provide the players a feedback on their choices, without effectively altering the storyline. Nonetheless, if toughness would be utilizied to a greater degree in future, i would probably welcome it.[/SPOILER]

Very interesting and at the same time sad, because it does indeed seem like maximum toughness isn't just a different flavour of the game, but a suboptimal route compared to minimum toughness and mixed.

Because if there isn't that much gated behind toughness and what there is, is in itself suboptimal for the tough route*, while you also ruin your chances with a couple of the LIs by going the tough route** , but don't gain any extra scenes as compensation, then the entire route seem suboptimal to me. Sure, if you really like Kathleen and/or the flavour of the tough route (or dislike Rosalind and Veronica and perhaps even Hana), it might still be worth it, but if you're neutral regarding the flavour difference and the LIs, then the minimum or mixed route seems to be the better choice, because it gives you more options without costing you anything.

That, to me, seem to be a suboptimal strategy for a game that's all about depraved shit extraordinaire. To bad the game is so fucking good anyway...

* In the sense that you loose more than you gain by doing the things that require high toughness and not doing the things that require low toughness.
** Compared to just one of the LIs if you go the non tough route.

Caveat: I'm of course just talking about what we have at the present, things might change later on, but if anything, as I've pointed out, I feel that the last update rather compounds that minimum toughness is really the "right" route and if the "minimum toughness will never be punished with fewer scenes" is to hold true throughout the game, I think it might be difficult to balance things moving forward.

 

[DirtyMario]

Found a C&C easter egg.

 

[sabadongelov]

You also speculated that the carnations wouldn't be "LI" despite the fact that there posts that 100% refute that so I honestly would not worry that you think it might be more difficult when you have seen at most 50% of the story. The subtitle that appears when the title drops is "Tale of Decadence, Depravity and Motherly Devotion" so you are at least 33% right about what the games "all about". If anybody thinks that THIS of all games is just about depravity they are going to be sorely disappointed or going to be skipping a metric ton of text that builds this games characters, setting, and story beyond depravity.

My god did I get under your skin! This is the second time you've replied to something I've written to someone else, trying to goad me into a fight.

Thing is, mr High moral defender of justice good guy, If you want to sit in the sandbox and fling sand, you'll have go at it alone, it just isn't my thing. Sorry mate!

 

[CAznable]

I have a question for TD that came to mind after replaying the whole game in one go.

Spoiler: Is there going to be a TRUE ENDING?

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All of the girls have something that Edwin can relate to in some way. Some think like him, some have a drive like he does, some remind him of his mother, Etc. Every LI has a piece of him. I personally see a lot more of Edwin in Felicia than I do Rose for example.

Very interesting and at the same time sad, because it does indeed seem like maximum toughness isn't just a different flavour of the game, but a suboptimal route compared to minimum toughness and mixed.

Because if there isn't that much gated behind toughness and what there is, is in itself suboptimal for the tough route*, while you also ruin your chances with a couple of the LIs by going the tough route** , but don't gain any extra scenes as compensation, then the entire route seem suboptimal to me. Sure, if you really like Kathleen and/or the flavour of the tough route (or dislike Rosalind and Veronica and perhaps even Hana), it might still be worth it, but if you're neutral regarding the flavour difference and the LIs, then the minimum or mixed route seems to be the better choice, because it gives you more options without costing you anything.

That, to me, seem to be a suboptimal strategy for a game that's all about depraved shit extraordinaire. To bad the game is so fucking good anyway...

* In the sense that you loose more than you gain by doing the things that require high toughness and not doing the things that require low toughness.
** Compared to just one of the LIs if you go the non tough route.

Caveat: I'm of course just talking about what we have at the present, things might change later on, but if anything, as I've pointed out, I feel that the last update rather compounds that minimum toughness is really the "right" route and if the "minimum toughness will never be punished with fewer scenes" is to hold true throughout the game, I think it might be difficult to balance things moving forward.

I don’t think this game is so analytical that “suboptimal” applies to it. It’s not just stats that influence the game. Edwin is ultimately his own character, we can try to shape him, but cannot mold him into the arbitrary cookie-cutter shape that we want. That is not to say that our choices ( and the world around him) do not influence him. Edwin is more Geralt of Rivia and less Commander Shepard. I think this update is a real litmus test for Edwin going forward, especially with some of the ending choices that we can make.
Also Toughness does not have to equal Asshole. A tough person is by no means an asshole.