Thatheras

Newbie
Jan 4, 2022
18
16
Yes, but there's a difference between making and charging for a mod, or making an unofficial remaster of, say, Fallout or Elder Scrolls, without any type of permission from Bethesda. Even if you're charging a price for it or not, doesn't matter, as long as you're doing it without the permission of the original author. At best (for you), it's bad etiquette towards fellow devs. At worst, it's an IP lawsuit waiting to happen (granted, that is less likely in the case of PL, but I'm mentioning it as a general rule).

Like Venris SFO who charges for overhauling Total War warhammer 3 and CA thanks him for his dedication you say?... We live in a society where we all want to make money from what we like. As I said, if you want to get paid for what you only do, write a book, if not... Leave morality aside when you use "condiments" in your product that you did not create.
 

Thatheras

Newbie
Jan 4, 2022
18
16
I'll be honest. I am struggling to figure out what you're trying to say. Is it that if I don't model my own characters from scratch and paint the textures myself, any renders with them aren't something I've 'created,' because I would not know how to respond to that.


You create the story, not the models, the person who improves the models does not touch the story, you charge for different topics, as I see it. There's no reason to confront
 

JGNeon

Active Member
Feb 24, 2021
529
1,587
Like Venris SFO who charges for overhauling Total War warhammer 3 and CA thanks him for his dedication you say?... We live in a society where we all want to make money from what we like. As I said, if you want to get paid for what you only do, write a book, if not... Leave morality aside when you use "condiments" in your product that you did not create.
CA's response is not a given, though. Not all creators respond positively to fan-made remakes. You're also not guaranteed a positive response from fans of the original work.

As an example from "our" world (F95): 16 Years Later got a bit of backlash (from fans) for basically ripping off a major part of the starting premise from My New Family. For the dev of 16YL, it was an homage, but for the players (and fans of MNF), it was ripping off the base story of MNF (replacing two half-sisters and a mother with three step-daughters; and all three LIs had similar personalities to their MNF counterparts). That dev has a lot of work ahead of them to make sure their work stands on its own, instead of being viewed as a "bad copy" of something else. The dev of MNF seemed okay with it (I haven't seen any major public statements from them, at least), but the fanbase didn't like it too much.

Remaking or basing something new on something existing is basically a crapshoot.
 

Thatheras

Newbie
Jan 4, 2022
18
16
CA's response is not a given, though. Not all creators respond positively to fan-made remakes. You're also not guaranteed a positive response from fans of the original work.

As an example from "our" world (F95): 16 Years Later got a bit of backlash (from fans) for basically ripping off a major part of the starting premise from My New Family. For the dev of 16YL, it was an homage, but for the players (and fans of MNF), it was ripping off the base story of MNF (replacing two half-sisters and a mother with three step-daughters; and all three LIs had similar personalities to their MNF counterparts). That dev has a lot of work ahead of them to make sure their work stands on its own, instead of being viewed as a "bad copy" of something else. The dev of MNF seemed okay with it (I haven't seen any major public statements from them, at least), but the fanbase didn't like it too much.

Remaking or basing something new on something existing is basically a crapshoot.


I'm not going to further discuss something that is obvious, there are people charging to post images/videos of porn actresses... HELLO? Think what you want, but where I live there is a saying, either all whores or all friars.


And what I saw in that comment is the law of the funnel, "I am an artist I charge for everything, whether it is it done by me or not", "you are a mere player who loves my game and you want to improve it , DO NOT TOUCH IT and if you do, DO NOT EARN MONEY for a work that I should do".

End of all my argument. I don't like to waste time arguing the obvious. Cya
 
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JGNeon

Active Member
Feb 24, 2021
529
1,587
And what I saw in that comment is the law of the funnel, "I am an artist I charge for everything, whether it is it done by me or not", "you are a mere player who loves my game and you want to improve it , DO NOT TOUCH IT and if you do, DO NOT EARN MONEY for a work that I should do".
And what I was trying to say, it's usually not about money, it's about control. Control over your own creation. The original creators respond in different ways. As a few major examples, Nintendo and Disney are notorious about protecting their properties; Pokemon fan games have been shut down once they get traction, and even daycares have been sued for having murals containing Disney characters (no money was charged or involved for those daycares to have those characters on the wall). On the other side of things, Sega and Bethesda have previously approved fan remakes of Sonic games and one of the Elder Scrolls games.

Sure, those examples are on a much bigger scale, but even in the scale of AVN games, there are creators who welcome fan remakes/renders, and there are creators who get angry if someone makes anything similar to their own. There are even creators who would rather burn down their own creation than let someone make a derivative work.

What I'm trying to boil it down to, is: We don't really know what Luxee (the original creator) would think about a fan-made remake/remaster, and that should be a consideration before starting to make one.
 

Thatheras

Newbie
Jan 4, 2022
18
16
And what I was trying to say, it's usually not about money, it's about control. Control over your own creation. The original creators respond in different ways. As a few major examples, Nintendo and Disney are notorious about protecting their properties; Pokemon fan games have been shut down once they get traction, and even daycares have been sued for having murals containing Disney characters (no money was charged or involved for those daycares to have those characters on the wall). On the other side of things, Sega and Bethesda have previously approved fan remakes of Sonic games and one of the Elder Scrolls games.

Sure, those examples are on a much bigger scale, but even in the scale of AVN games, there are creators who welcome fan remakes/renders, and there are creators who get angry if someone makes anything similar to their own. There are even creators who would rather burn down their own creation than let someone make a derivative work.

What I'm trying to boil it down to, is: We don't really know what Luxee (the original creator) would think about a fan-made remake/remaster, and that should be a consideration before starting to make one.
If what you create is the story, and what is improved are the renders... It's stupid to control anything. If you don't understand, it's not my problem, the product is still intact. It is only given a coat of "paint"
 

Drooskati

Well-Known Member
Game Developer
Jul 15, 2020
1,714
6,457
You create the story, not the models, the person who improves the models does not touch the story, you charge for different topics, as I see it. There's no reason to confront
Yeah, see, you're wrong.

I absolutely created my models. I spent days making each of them. Did I start with some base models? Absolutely. Did I pay for the licensing rights to do so? Absolutely.

My girls are my creations. They are the result of my personal creative process. They are, legally, my intellectual property. Does it matter that they are a derivative of another artists work? Not in the least, as the original artist gave me the right to create my own version of them, and that artist was compensated for it.

I've given my character files to only a handful of people, with specific licensing laid out when I did so. They know what they are allowed to do, and what they are not allowed to do. SomeGuyWithNoImagination happens to be one of those people. If he were to go beyond the scope of the license I gave him, it would be a problem for him. I've also given license to another person to use my characters in their work to be included on their Patreon. But under very specific terms.

If someone were to attempt to "improve" my girls, and insert them into my story in an attempt to make money, without my approval, I would absolutely have any such Patreon, SS, Itch, etc, shut down. That is my right as the person who created the girls, the story, etc.
 

randysum

New Member
Oct 5, 2021
6
20
If what you create is the story, and what is improved are the renders... It's stupid to control anything. If you don't understand, it's not my problem, the product is still intact. It is only given a coat of "paint"

Verry correct, and blue jeans today, are not real blue jeans, they don't grind up woad, and mix it with pee, and lovingly stew it for hours over an open fire so that the oxygen sets the dye. Artists don't paint with iron Gaul they crushed up, mixed with baby chicken embryos. Heck they don't hand wrap their own brush. They go and buy shit to spend their time doing their craft and don't appreciate how it was in the stone age. If I want pee in my pants I have to do it myself now it's such a tragedy. People just don't understand.
 
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