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Hildegardt

Well-Known Member
Oct 18, 2017
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The game has a variable, laurieslaveorloverpoints, tracking the path she's on. A lower score indicates she's closer to a mindless slave, like the blood dolls Fabian delivered. The higher it is, the more human she remains, like Andrew;
Which sadly doesn't seem to have an effect on how she was acting this update.
Laurie constantly gets the shit end of the stick. She's even worse off then Carmen. Her enthrallment has been porn logic with questionable plot relevance from the start and now she outright calls the MC daddy no matter which path you're on.
Also, what was the MC's idea with rushing to bring her back to Scottstown in time for Calisto's visit? Is he trying to protect her or not? I feel like this was the perfect opportunity for a branching path. Why even have love or slave points, if the MC is OK with letting her get succed either way?
 

crowbar214

Member
Apr 25, 2021
124
163
so blood doll is the same as playing a corruption dominance game until we turn them into a sub?
it makes even more sense that your blood dolls be addicted to your blood!
...Yeah, that's exactly what it is. The whole vamp schtick is dom/sub, dude. Always with mortals, with other vamps if you can get away with it.

I believe thralling blood dolls is generally a waste of time. You can achieve similar results with less fuss. Thralls can be messy. You see this in-game with Laurie. It's much easier to find someone who has no family or friends and either get them addicted to the pleasurable part of being fed on, being bitten - you see this in-game with Carmen - or you can use, for lack of a better term, mind tricks. Probably one of the better ways, imo. Multiple sources in game - Ivy, Whispered Club Girl, Dude Merrick Fed On. Gotta watch out for those mortals of strong will, though. Like Miri. They require extra work.
 
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crowbar214

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Apr 25, 2021
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163
Which sadly doesn't seem to have an effect on how she was acting this update.
Laurie constantly gets the shit end of the stick. She's even worse off then Carmen. Her enthrallment has been porn logic with questionable plot relevance from the start and now she outright calls the MC daddy no matter which path you're on.
Also, what was the MC's idea with rushing to bring her back to Scottstown in time for Calisto's visit? Is he trying to protect her or not? I feel like this was the perfect opportunity for a branching path. Why even have love or slave points, if the MC is OK with letting her get succed either way?
Laurie's enthrallment is porn logic? How is, the secret society of vampires found out I told a mortal I'm in a secret society of vampires and they will kill the mortal I've told unless I either kill the mortal or enthrall them, porn logic?

And as I've said before, she calls the MC Daddy because all thralls are addicts and she is trying to manipulate her dealer into giving her her fix.

As for why the MC brought Laurie back to the house... he left her in town to look after his mother. His mother left town. Job finished, she returns home to Scottsdale. I don't see the issue here. If you need additional motivation, the MC is also worried about how many blood dolls vamp mommy requires.
 

Hildegardt

Well-Known Member
Oct 18, 2017
1,115
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Laurie's enthrallment is porn logic? How is, the secret society of vampires found out I told a mortal I'm in a secret society of vampires and they will kill the mortal I've told unless I either kill the mortal or enthrall them, porn logic?
Because things have only been urgent, when it's conveniently kinky. Nobody cares about the hunters they're keeping around, or the other vampire that's locked in a cage in their basement, or the Nos that went missing and turned up mental under their care.
There are supposed to be stakes, but the consequences so far have been turning a sexy childhood friend into a sub that calls you daddy, a humiliating strip tease and a tummy ache.

And as I've said before, she calls the MC Daddy because all thralls are addicts and she is trying to manipulate her dealer into giving her her fix.
Why keep track of love and slave points, if Laurie is a sub either way? This could have been a good moment to show that player choices actually matter.

As for why the MC brought Laurie back to the house... he left her in town to look after his mother. His mother left town. Job finished, she returns home to Scottsdale. I don't see the issue here. If you need additional motivation, the MC is also worried about how many blood dolls vamp mommy requires.
So, the MC made the difficult choice to enthrall Laurie to keep her save, to then just have her as a blood doll anyway, something Fabian explicitly warned him could turn out bad. I don't see the issue with leaving her save in the city for another day or two. Maybe they could've had Andrew in her stead, but I guess he isn't sexy enough to be a doll, so porn logic wouldn't allow that.
In the end we can choose to save her anyway, but why not have that as a consequence of the slave or love choices, to show that those actually matter?
 

UncleFredo

Well-Known Member
Aug 29, 2020
1,940
3,670
I've gone back and replayed episode one, with the express purpose of evaluating the storyline as presented. To be clear, I care not at all about the various VtM foundations of this VN unless they are explicitly presented in the VN itself. As I have said before my only exposure to VtM is reading the various walls of text that its fans present here.

Before I say more I want to make it clear that EP1 is a damn masterpiece. Taken solely on its own, without the hindsight of the following two years, it's really good. Excellent pacing. Lots of tension. The ever increasing sexual banter between Sharron and the MC, along with his guilt over putting both her and Laurie at risk just moves the plot forward. Shannon becoming evermore flirtatious as the MC gradually draws her out of her protective shell. For those of us not fully enveloped in the VtM world, bit by bit we see parts of how the Vampire world holds itself together. Attractive characters, interpersonal tensions, a couple, maybe three, real bad guys (well two are women). The MC presenting diverse powers that defy categorization and present a puzzle to Sharron (our only available expert). It is such good writing.

So now let's look back, at EP2 and EP3. That pace that kept the tensions between Shannon and the MC is gone. It's proven to be all bait and switch. Only now, so many updates later, are the MC's powers starting to matter. Such a waste. If you compare the plot progress and character development in EP1 to EP2 and EP3, everything since EP1 should have been resolved part way through EP2. To be fair things are picking up again, but what a wasteland.

I've taken some heat here for stating that Calisto left the MC to die. Well let's examine the plot line in EP1. She turned him. He went back to his apartment. While in the process of dying Laurie found him and got him into a hospital. According to Shannon, someone at the hospital "noticed" him and notified the Archon who dispatched Shannon to get him out of the hospital and care for him as he died and turned. There is nothing to suggest that the Archon has any idea who turned the MC or that Calisto is involved in anyway. Actually much is made that no one knows who turned him.

If Laurie hadn't gotten the MC into the hospital he'd have died and ended up dead. Calisto had nothing to do with that. Perhaps once he turned up in the hospital she arranged for a call to the Archon, but he easily could have died before that happened. Slice it however you like. The storyline in EP1 is that, until he came to the Archon's attention, he was left on his own. Period.

Perhaps now that he's survived, Calisto is taking an interest, but any notion that she gave a tinker's damn about him prior to that is not supported by the storyline.

As for the lack of sexual content in this VN, and the "this is not a porn game" narrative. I absolutely defy anyone to go back and play EP1 and experience the pace of the building sexual tension between Sharron and the MC and truthfully tell me you expected us to be nearing the end of EP3 with no resolution of the boundaries of that relationship. As I said earlier, bait and switch.

Were I to rate this game I'd give EP1 6 out of 5 stars. EP2 gets maybe 2.5, and so far with the last couple updates actually moving the plot, give EP3 3.5 with the jury out because the writers can really knock this out of the park or strike out at this point.

I find myself a bit embarrassed. A while ago, I challenged the writers to abandon the nudity and teasing, which they pretty clearly had no intention of delivering on, and prove they could deliver an AVN with no sex/porn. Here's what's really amusing. In EP1 they did EXACTLY THAT, but then they shut the tap and stalled the tension and turned the growth of an adult relationship (because this is an "Adult Visual Novel" ) into some weird high school romance level interaction.

So to the writers, I recant my challenge. In retrospect it's quite clear that you can in fact deliver the required quality of writing. So my question is, since you have only done so while growing an adult relationship between the MC and one or another of the women surrounding him, why the hell have you stopped? Seems a fair question.

So this is pretty crazy. EP1 made this game. Grabbed everyone's attention, with damn good reason. As for EP2 & EP3, other that the VtM folks who are loving writing walls of text debating Vampiric nuances about which the rest of us have no clue, you're really letting us down. Pick up the pace let us actually make love to the "love interests" you've put before us. Advance the plot so we can walk whatever path you have in store of us and triumph or fail. That is the foundation you laid in EP1. I'm only asking you live up to it.
 

Babalon

Member
Dec 19, 2019
170
110
And by "she actually like it" and "she respect that", I assume you're thinking her warning of "Don't let bad influences rub off on you" in reply is "respect"? Agree to disagree. Pretty sure the rescal point to which you refer stands for something like "resisted Calisto". I think it might prove useful if you choose to try to overcome her / kill her later, but I don't think it bodes well for future amicability in your relationship with her. It depends on what you want, but I would assume this isn't a positive relationship point.

only way to fight with red head is answered in episode 1 when sharon ask you what will you do if you see her 1. to burn her down 2. or to kiss her :) to trigger further thing what is planned with her if MC desire to betray her. For code to remember burnherdown=True :) this is matter of willpower or whatever :) every point so far is positive in game.. laurielove, sharonlove,savecarmen,rescal,ivylove etc...
 
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-CookieMonster666-

Message Maven
Nov 20, 2018
12,031
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only way to fight with red head is answered in episode 1 when sharon ask you what will you do if you see her 1. to burn her down 2. or to kiss her :) to trigger further thing what is planned with her if MC desire to betray her. For code to remember burnherdown=True :) this is matter of willpower or whatever :) every point so far is positive in game.. laurielove, sharonlove,savecarmen,rescal,ivylove etc...
Are you actually on the development team for this game? If not, you're operating solely on assumptions. How do you know whether Calisto wants you to resist her? Her response if you do doesn't sound like you're doing something she likes. I wouldn't call that "positive".
 

Babalon

Member
Dec 19, 2019
170
110
Are you actually on the development team for this game? If not, you're operating solely on assumptions.
yes yess all is assumptions go and choice answer in hate toward red head for turning you and see code :)
and all choice what you made so far collect all points what we call here on forum good choice or in theory here called 'Humanity" ::LOL:
 

Tserriednich'sNen

Engaged Member
Jan 16, 2020
2,254
6,061
Do ya'll remember when Quaestor Virgil told MC that he'll find out who his sire is for him as a favor? While Calisto herself likely won't care, wouldn't it make sense for MC to tell her about it on top of the visions he's been having just so that she'll be aware of Virgil or anyone associated with him snooping around
 

-CookieMonster666-

Message Maven
Nov 20, 2018
12,031
17,846
yes yess all is assumptions go and choice answer in hate toward red head for turning you and see code :)
and all choice what you made so far collect all points what we call here on forum good choice or in theory here called 'Humanity" ::LOL:
Again, you're assuming a point increase is a "good choice" and gives you "humanity". There is a point increase, but if instead the variable you got were called calistoanger += 1, would that be a "good choice"? It depends on what the variable actually means and what you personally want from your playthrough. These are all values causing consequences, nothing more. What's "good" or "bad" is subjective, completely dependent on what you want. This has been my point this whole time. Just b/c you want to upset Calisto and you want to increase your resistance to her command ability doesn't mean everyone else does. And you still have absolutely zero evidence that she "respects" the MC more when you choose to resist. Thanks for the conversation, but I'm done now.
 
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Valamyr

Member
Oct 7, 2020
256
209
Well this is different! I only finished Episode 1 so far but, I'm a big fan of Vampire games and a VtM/VtR player.

I expected this to be much more of a porn-version of a Vampire VN given where we are, but so far its closer to a real VtM VN like Coteries of New York or something. Clearly a few details/names for stuff have been changed (I guess for copyright issues?) but it's very very close to a simplified VtM rules-wise, and the social structure of vampiric society is just about absolutely alike.

This could be incredibly well recieved by most people who are into Vampire VNs, books, stories and the like. Its few adult elements are not enough of a focus to call it a typical lewdgame, it's much, much closer to a typical Vampire VN. With excellent writing so far to boot.

This should be shared beyond the relatively small confines of the lewdgame community. I know a couple subreddits and discords that would love it. I'll finish the other episodes first but afterwards if there are no objections I would be happy to help spread the word.
 

Babalon

Member
Dec 19, 2019
170
110
Again, you're assuming a point increase is a "good choice" and gives you "humanity". There is a point increase, but if instead the variable you got were called calistoanger += 1, would that be a "good choice"? It depends on what the variable actually means and what you personally want from your playthrough. These are all values causing consequences, nothing more. What's "good" or "bad" is subjective, completely dependent on what you want. This has been my point this whole time. Just b/c you want to upset Calisto and you want to increase your resistance to her command ability doesn't mean everyone else does. And you still have absolutely zero evidence that she "respects" the MC more when you choose to resist. Thanks for the conversation, but I'm done now.
lol... it is a theory dude here on forum every good choice you make it depends on humanity in theory if you break carmen and make only blood bag of her you lose humanity... you have option to be an ass or nice one.. and even resistance of that Calisto mean nothing points mean nothing it is only a number "in your theory mean to anger her if you not kiss her" only what is importaning is under True or False Variables and you will only face Calisto as a enemy if you mark Calisto as a enemy in the first episode when Sharon ask you how you feel about her because it will mark you in variables for next development of betray of her.


if you have power claws you will have variable " Claws=True " and you can have points in prowess how much you want it mean nothinggg..
If you fuck Miri or whatever her name is you get soul stain = True and soul stain is lose of humanity. Is not made for dick to feel better but roleplay on humanity..
 
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FunFuntomes

Engaged Member
Mar 24, 2021
2,524
3,821
Because things have only been urgent, when it's conveniently kinky. Nobody cares about the hunters they're keeping around, or the other vampire that's locked in a cage in their basement, or the Nos that went missing and turned up mental under their care.
There are supposed to be stakes, but the consequences so far have been turning a sexy childhood friend into a sub that calls you daddy, a humiliating strip tease and a tummy ache.


Why keep track of love and slave points, if Laurie is a sub either way? This could have been a good moment to show that player choices actually matter.


So, the MC made the difficult choice to enthrall Laurie to keep her save, to then just have her as a blood doll anyway, something Fabian explicitly warned him could turn out bad. I don't see the issue with leaving her save in the city for another day or two. Maybe they could've had Andrew in her stead, but I guess he isn't sexy enough to be a doll, so porn logic wouldn't allow that.
In the end we can choose to save her anyway, but why not have that as a consequence of the slave or love choices, to show that those actually matter?
everything so far, seems to point at Laurie being turned into a vampire, and at that point her blood bond will be overwritten. And she might even turn hostile if the MC treated her like crap.
Again, you're assuming a point increase is a "good choice" and gives you "humanity". There is a point increase, but if instead the variable you got were called calistoanger += 1, would that be a "good choice"? It depends on what the variable actually means and what you personally want from your playthrough. These are all values causing consequences, nothing more. What's "good" or "bad" is subjective, completely dependent on what you want. This has been my point this whole time. Just b/c you want to upset Calisto and you want to increase your resistance to her command ability doesn't mean everyone else does. And you still have absolutely zero evidence that she "respects" the MC more when you choose to resist. Thanks for the conversation, but I'm done now.
I'm certain that the variable means "resisted calisto" but at the same time I'm convinced it's actually a good variable worth increasing. Calisto has plenty of pets and people blindly loyal to her. Just look at how she told Cindy to shut up and she obeyed. and if she didn't care about MC, Fabian would've not said that she'll have kittens when she finds out MC is alive. and I'm waging my MC's life that Calisto is happy that he's resisting, as long as he doesn't try to take her out. And the only reason she made MC kiss her hand was to temper down the hubris of people in the room (it didn't work that well since Sharon still pissed her off, but perhaps Sharon would've been more arrogant otherwise). besides when MC refused to give her Carmen and Laurie, she said that it's okay since everyone has their favorites, and maybe she was alluding at MC.
 

Arigon

Engaged Member
Aug 27, 2020
2,296
4,534
Great stuff guys. Please keep the antagonism out of it though.
I will write a bigger comment addressing some of the stuff one here in the last couple pages, but I wanted to kudo you guys because some of the stuff is just brilliant. I also have to point out again this was never, ever, intended to be a porn novel. The folks who continually make comments like, it is not VtM, it needs more sex, blah blah blah, need to understand that whether they like it or not, this IS more entertaining for the VtM crew, and it IS NOT a porn novel.
Ok, it is very late or early here in my part of the US, but I wish you all a good night.
Peace
 
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-CookieMonster666-

Message Maven
Nov 20, 2018
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I'm certain that the variable means "resisted calisto" but at the same time I'm convinced it's actually a good variable worth increasing. Calisto has plenty of pets and people blindly loyal to her. Just look at how she told Cindy to shut up and she obeyed. and if she didn't care about MC, Fabian would've not said that she'll have kittens when she finds out MC is alive. and I'm waging my MC's life that Calisto is happy that he's resisting, as long as he doesn't try to take her out. And the only reason she made MC kiss her hand was to temper down the hubris of people in the room (it didn't work that well since Sharon still pissed her off, but perhaps Sharon would've been more arrogant otherwise). besides when MC refused to give her Carmen and Laurie, she said that it's okay since everyone has their favorites, and maybe she was alluding at MC.
Maybe, but I'm unconvinced. She replies that she doesn't like the bad habit he learned when he refuses. Later, she says not having all four girls is fine. Those are two totally different types of responses. I would be happy to find out that she likes him being more independent and not cowing to everything she says. However, saying that the MC's learned bad habits comes off as a negative response. If it was all for show, why wouldn't she respond the same later? There were more than just the four potential blood dolls in the room, so if her aim is to keep up appearances, why wouldn't that continue to apply?

A resistant child/offspring/spawn/whatever might be a point of interest in what she considers an otherwise boring existence. But she herself comes off pretty arrogant and demanding; being willing to accept constant refusal doesn't fit her personality. I'll happily be proven wrong later (I would like it better if it could be a positive thing), but right now I can't see it as such. I guess we'll learn for sure at some point.
 
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cxx

Message Maestro
Nov 14, 2017
66,752
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very nice update as usual and we finally saw "mommy" in flesh. few typos there and there but those didn't matter.

few scrshots:

1. high expectations (apparently expects palace everywhere her mistress goes)
2. couldn't say it better
3.-5. start of beautiful friendship (NOT)
6. she is scary (and total bitch)
 

Ottoeight

Forum Fanatic
Mar 13, 2021
5,315
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For the "classical studies untrained" :eek: :

Hiereia (Ἱέρεια) : priestess, in ancient Greek. The authors made a little mistake and wrote hiereiai, which is plural (priestesses) ;).

I thought you might need to know what Cindy meant.
 
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