VN Ren'Py Ripples [v0.8.0 Public] [Jestur]

[Simpgor]

One possibility is that they generally just don't remember him from the past; can you remember exactly the faces of friends and acquaintances from 20 years in your past if they popped up today? I probably couldn't except for a few.

That's why I didn't list most of the other girls (like val) as right now the interactions they've had are small but like I said someone (you dont know) literally running in from nowhere to beat up (for the first time) the generic 90s school bully, who also happens to be close to your sister and all your friends (again out of nowhere) would be one of the "few I remembered"

One possibility is that they generally just don't remember him from the past; can you remember exactly the faces of friends and acquaintances from 20 years in your past if they popped up today? I probably couldn't except for a few.

Tiffany watched MC grow up, so in her mind he's still that little kid to her, not the guy who saved her and spent time at the (upcoming) party and whatever other activities the plot has planned out.

I think the "scenes" she and MC have shows her not viewing him as a little kid but still she seems like one of the furthest from having any hint MC was in 99 or she is a god tier actress.

Another theory is that someone did all the actions in the past originally, just not MC. But now that he's gone back the timeline is forcing him to assume the roles of whoever originally did them so as to keep the timeline from unravelling. He's caused some minor disruptions, such as passing the "counterfeit" money from 2019, but the timeline smooths that over as well. The more he interacts with the girls in 1999 the more events he becomes the actuator for, thus their memories are more linked to him and they become more likely to recognize his 2019 presence.

I think im a bit confused on the idea of someone doing everything MC has done? How far does it go? Is it all the same person? Did they go to the jewelery shop and got a blow job from val/fucked krystals mom and on a more serious note what about Jenny? How does that work without having knowledge of the future/her location?

DID THE "YO MAMA GUY" AT THE POWERPLANT SAVE JENNY THE FIRST TIME?!?!

 

[Rintal]

One possibility is that they generally just don't remember him from the past; can you remember exactly the faces of friends and acquaintances from 20 years in your past if they popped up today? I probably couldn't except for a few.

Not to mention that no normal person would decide that the similarity of two people from different times is explained by the fact that one of them is a time traveler.

 

[JJ1960]

I think im a bit confused on the idea of someone doing everything MC has done? How far does it go? Is it all the same person? Did they go to the jewelery shop and got a blow job from val/fucked krystals mom and on a more serious note what about Jenny? How does that work without having knowledge of the future/her location?

DID THE "YO MAMA GUY" AT THE POWERPLANT SAVE JENNY THE FIRST TIME?!?!

In this theory MC is either taking the place of someone (think of an NPC in an adventure/RPG game) if the event is important in some way, or the event simply didn't happen or happens differently if he did not travel back. The timeline is like the banks of a river; it tries to contain the flow of time and events, but if something comes along to disrupt the flow it tries to incorporate it into what should happen. If the perturbation is large enough then it has to adapt it as best it can. Think of a river where a beaver builds a dam. This may back up water until it can get diverted around it, maybe flooding a low-lying area that normally wouldn't be under water. Eventually the dam breaks and the area doesn't flood anymore and it's as it was before, or if it doesn't the river gets slightly wider at that point due to erosion and stays that way in perpetuity. MC going back in time is like a series of boulders that drop into the river at various places and the timeline has to make what he's doing work within the rest of the framework of time.

Let's take a couple examples with Khloe. MC stumbles across Jenny and Khloe in the bathroom stall. Jenny knows MC from the night visit and is attracted to him, and Khloe thinks he's hot plus she is trying to get Jenny to explore a little bit. In the original timeline it could be some other lucky dude who finds them and gets the benefit of the activities, or its some other guy who neither knows and isn't that good looking so nothing happens. In the jewelry shop the original timeline has (let me make up a character) Brian, the captain of the school tennis team who Khloe has hooked up with a couple of times because he's nice, good looking, athletic, etc. and now convinces him to help them both out. It's important that this occurs since that's how Valerie starts becoming more sexually adventurous, which is necessary to convince Tiffany to get involved sexually with MC, all part of the core timeline.

Another example would be that the shit ninja saves Darci's mom solo, but with MC and Darci on the hunt for her they wind up doing much of the saving instead. The end result is the same but they get incorporated into the actual events.

One corollary to the "Jenny is Jackie" theory is that having time travelled that perhaps future Jackie remembers the original non-MC timeline (she and Tiffany dance, talk, etc. all night and go to bed but she's not woken up by MC) as well as the version where she comes after MC with the baseball bat. She knows something is going on, and MC plays a part in it but doesn't know what the outcome is so doesn't provide him any information that might change what he has to do naturally in the various situations he finds himself in.

 

[pitao]

In this theory MC is either taking the place of someone (think of an NPC in an adventure/RPG game) if the event is important in some way, or the event simply didn't happen or happens differently if he did not travel back. The timeline is like the banks of a river; it tries to contain the flow of time and events, but if something comes along to disrupt the flow it tries to incorporate it into what should happen. If the perturbation is large enough then it has to adapt it as best it can. Think of a river where a beaver builds a dam. This may back up water until it can get diverted around it, maybe flooding a low-lying area that normally wouldn't be under water. Eventually the dam breaks and the area doesn't flood anymore and it's as it was before, or if it doesn't the river gets slightly wider at that point due to erosion and stays that way in perpetuity. MC going back in time is like a series of boulders that drop into the river at various places and the timeline has to make what he's doing work within the rest of the framework of time.

Loved your explanation and analogy (kind of envious on your proficiency of the use of the English language hehe). Hence why the game is called Ripples, from the term used on time travel stories called the ripple effect (less known as the butterfly effect for example but they are interconnected) that basically are the changes made by altering events in the past, what usually leads to paradoxes, essential for a good time travel story, love some good and well made paradoxes.

 

[Simpgor]

Another example would be that the shit ninja saves Darci's mom solo, but with MC and Darci on the hunt for her they wind up doing much of the saving instead. The end result is the same but they get incorporated into the actual events.

Shit ninja as in the person we've only seen in the school in 2019 (iirc)? I guess the next question would be is shit ninja darci 2 (the one we see kill the scientist)? Or is there a random person who saved Jenny and then 20 years later appeared in front of all the 2019 high schoolers for a second? I think it being someone we've seen in both 2019 and 99 (dont think they aged 20 years naturally becuase they are still pretty "ninja" but i guess that could be porn/game logic) runs into alot of the same paradoxical issues

What about the "original" timeline (before any time travel occurs) ? Or does this theory assume that the "very 1st time" 1999 happened there was already time travel from a point in a future despite the machine not being fully functional yet?

 

[Discrepancy]

Shit ninja as in the person we've only seen in the school in 2019 (iirc)? I guess the next question would be is shit ninja darci 2 (the one we see kill the scientist)? Or is there a random person who saved Jenny and then 20 years later appeared in front of all the 2019 high schoolers for a second?

What about the "original" timeline (before any time travel occurs) ? Or does this theory assume that the "very 1st time" 1999 happened there was already time travel from a point in a future despite the machine not being fully functional yet?

I think it's implied that shit ninja is Darci 2

 

[Simpgor]

I think it's implied that shit ninja is Darci 2

I assumed that is what JJ meant but is there any confirmation? Fwiw I agree that shit ninja is probably darci 2 (or 1 or 1.5 or whatever ) but i still run into the questions at the end of my post .....and to lesser degree is there any story reason to go from 2019 to 1999 or is it just so all the girls 40 year old moms are in their early 20s because Darci 2 looks less than 20 years older imo which means "better" time travel exists (as in not locked in 20 years and can pop up anywhere without the machine/platform thing?)

 

[pitao]

What about the "original" timeline (before any time travel occurs) ? Or does this theory assume that the "very 1st time" 1999 happened there was already time travel from a point in a future despite the machine not being fully functional yet?

I would guess that this "original" timeline already is irrelevant for the current flow of the story. Each time someone goes back in time and changes even the tiniest thing already making a new timeline when goes back to the "present" and before those changes are done it is already a different branch from the "original" timeline, one that already has into account that time travel exists. It is kind of hard to understand even for me by reading all of this hahahaha.

Best thing is not to overthink this, makes we enjoy less the story unless you love to read papers about quantum physics like I do hehehe and are very pragmatic like I am between what is fiction and "reality".

 

[JJ1960]

What about the "original" timeline (before any time travel occurs) ? Or does this theory assume that the "very 1st time" 1999 happened there was already time travel from a point in a future despite the machine not being fully functional yet?

This is one of the problematic conundrums of time travel stories. The time machine hasn't been invented until year X, so no time travel could happen up until the first time it's successfully turned on. However once the time machine is invented in year X time travel can happen and, assuming it's a time machine that can go backwards, then prior to year X time travel can happen if the time machine can go there now. Since time is infinite and the time machine can go to any time in the past then the time machine has always existed and time travel has always been possible.

For the sake of the theory we are talking about, there is in original timeline where no time travel has occurred (the accident happens, MC hasn't banged any of the 1999 hotties, etc.). MC going back to 1999 introduces disruptions, which should either create a parallel timeline (or multiple ones for every time MC goes back and for every decision he makes on each trip) or there is a single cohesive timeline which forces any anomalies back into itself. Jestur has played with us a little with Krystal's name gag but there isn't anything concrete saying that MC changing something in the past has altered the present, plus Scarlett's photos show him from the past. That could be a little like the photo in Back To The Future where actions in the past alter the photo from the future.

 

[JJ1960]

I assumed that is what JJ meant but is there any confirmation? Fwiw I agree that shit ninja is probably darci 2 (or 1 or 1.5 or whatever ) but i still run into the questions at the end of my post .....and to lesser degree is there any story reason to go from 2019 to 1999 or is it just so all the girls 40 year old moms are in their early 20s because Darci 2 looks less than 20 years older imo which means "better" time travel exists (as in not locked in 20 years and can pop up anywhere without the machine/platform thing?)

My operating assumption is that shit ninja is some iteration of future Darci (future to 2019) and she has access to a controllable time machine allowing her appearance at the school and to rescue her mother. Since we have a potentially working time machine in 2019 there isn't any reason that a Darci who is in her late 20s couldn't be using it to alter the past.

 

[Simpgor]

For the sake of the theory we are talking about,

I understand the mechanics (as any of us can given limited information) i was just more curious about werid "edge cases" that pop up under that assumption. Like you say there's a "og timeline" and even if time travel happens for the first time in 2009 (Jacky going missing) there "should" have been a 1999 where neither darci/shit ninja unless all points in time are happening simultaneously?

I think this is a fine point to stop though as we quickly leave the content of the game and enter into "does MC really have any choice (even considering he is a VN protag)" when it's pretty clear that this game isnt going to seriously (as more than a cliffhanger) deal with the idea that the MC never had a choice

My operating assumption is that shit ninja is some iteration of future Darci (future to 2019) and she has access to a controllable time machine allowing her appearance at the school and to rescue her mother. Since we have a potentially working time machine in 2019 there isn't any reason that a Darci who is in her late 20s couldn't be using it to alter the past.

The ONLY thing keeping me from believing this is that the time machine we know of in 2019 requires: you to go to a specific room, have a special phone, text a certain number/coordinates, stand on a platform, and then that platform goes back in time with you. Whereas shit ninja can pop and and dissappear from anywhere and any time with no platform/anything of the like, and while I'll grant you darci is a baby face (looks young) that seems like quite a bit of technological advancement in a field as crazy as time travel in such a short time (presumably less than 15-20 years)

 

[JJ1960]

The ONLY thing keeping me from believing this is that the time machine we know of in 2019 requires: you to go to a specific room, have a special phone, text a certain number/coordinates, stand on a platform, and then that platform goes back in time with you. Whereas shit ninja can pop and and dissappear from anywhere and any time with no platform/anything of the like, and while I'll grant you darci is a baby face (looks young) that seems like quite a bit of technological advancement in a field as crazy as time travel in such a short time (presumably less than 15-20 years)

There is a working time machine in 1999. There is an explosion where people die and disappear. The knowledge to create that time machine doesn't disappear, though, so there is 20 years where additional development and refinement can occur. We also know that there is another group that Mystery Man is working against, so they have been working on their own time machine all that time most likely. Adding a few years to age Darci up means maybe 30 years of refinement before the shit ninja starts using it.

The likelihood that the broken time machine that MC has been using is the only one is low. Some number of people knew the time machine was being worked on and that it was probably working to some degree before the accident or sabotage. Simply having the knowledge that something can be done changes the entire playing field. Think about Roger Bannister, who broke the 4 minute mile when everybody knew with a certainty that it simply wasn't humanly possible. After he did that, it became common for runners to match and better his mark. The same with the knowledge that a time machine is in fact a workable design and you have smart people who would have pooh-poohed it before starting to figure out how to make it work and work better.

 

[alex13_zen]

I understand the mechanics (as any of us can given limited information) i was just more curious about werid "edge cases" that pop up under that assumption. Like you say there's a "og timeline" and even if time travel happens for the first time in 2009 (Jacky going missing) there "should" have been a 1999 where neither darci/shit ninja unless all points in time are happening simultaneously?

I think this is a fine point to stop though as we quickly leave the content of the game and enter into "does MC really have any choice (even considering he is a VN protag)" when it's pretty clear that this game isnt going to seriously (as more than a cliffhanger) deal with the idea that the MC never had a choice







The ONLY thing keeping me from believing this is that the time machine we know of in 2019 requires: you to go to a specific room, have a special phone, text a certain number/coordinates, stand on a platform, and then that platform goes back in time with you. Whereas shit ninja can pop and and dissappear from anywhere and any time with no platform/anything of the like, and while I'll grant you darci is a baby face (looks young) that seems like quite a bit of technological advancement in a field as crazy as time travel in such a short time (presumably less than 15-20 years)

The MC had the choice to not let Scarlett take so many photos of him, it's not like she insisted or anything. He lies about his name. But she clearly recognized him since she knew for sure peanut-butter cookies were his favorites.

Eventually, more and more girls will know about time travel, which is quite a big change from the original timeline.

 

[Simpgor]

There is a working time machine in 1999. There is an explosion where people die and disappear. The knowledge to create that time machine doesn't disappear, though, so there is 20 years where additional development and refinement can occur. We also know that there is another group that Mystery Man is working against, so they have been working on their own time machine all that time most likely. Adding a few years to age Darci up means maybe 30 years of refinement before the shit ninja starts using it.

The likelihood that the broken time machine that MC has been using is the only one is low. Some number of people knew the time machine was being worked on and that it was probably working to some degree before the accident or sabotage. Simply having the knowledge that something can be done changes the entire playing field. Think about Roger Bannister, who broke the 4 minute mile when everybody knew with a certainty that it simply wasn't humanly possible. After he did that, it became common for runners to match and better his mark. The same with the knowledge that a time machine is in fact a workable design and you have smart people who would have pooh-poohed it before starting to figure out how to make it work and work better.

It's been awhile since I've played the earlier chapters so I must have just assumed it didn't work/whoever figured it out died in the explosion (the same one that caused the power plant to be off limits/red light?). I think we just disagree on how complicated time travel is, considering the "bad guys" seem to want to take/use the one we know about (Masked man warning MC etc) instead of just making their own? Someone was able to do it in the 90s but they (despite having the knowledge its possible) still prefer to interfere with masked man other than just getting another scientist? Granted i could be forgetting something about masked man/the "bad guys" but i dont feel like im missing anything THAT major?

I also disagree with the example given and a closer one would be something like a hadron collider being built decades or even a century before it actually was. It should be something that (rightuflly) changes our understanding of the universe in a bigger way than anything including the advent of organized religion

Like I said i think we've covered all we can in the game and are well into esoteric talks about free will/paradoxes that likely won't exist once we get more lore crumbs and while im fine getting into the damn weeds about it (and often do) i feel like the majority of people dont like when I do that

The MC had the choice to not let Scarlett take so many photos of him, it's not like she insisted or anything. He lies about his name. But she clearly recognized him since she knew for sure peanut-butter cookies were his favorites.

Ya know maybe Scarlett (milf variant) making peanut butter cookies is worth not having ever had free will

 

[alex13_zen]

Philosophical discussions aside, the events are maybe a bit too complicated: we also most likely have an older MC roaming around in 2019 and hooking up with Dani, which causes confusion for both herself and the current-day MC.

Spoiler: older MC in the far back?

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Spoiler: Dani confused

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And quite possibly, one version of the MC hooked up with Lizzie a few years prior. Why else would the dev make her a few years older?

Spoiler: Lizzie1

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Spoiler: Lizzie2

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So apart from whatever the MC does in the 1999 past, he'll also have to do some stuff in 2019 when it becomes the past. I sure hope Jestur has a plan

 

[Simpgor]

So apart from whatever the MC does in the 1999 past, he'll also have to do some stuff in 2019 when it becomes the past. I sure hope Jestur has a plan

I guess that confirms "shit ninja level" time travel, or dani really needs help as she cant tell the difference between a 40 and 20 year old MC

I think its pretty clear Jestur puts alot of love and attention in this story (just look at the really good "pointless" animations) but its already at 0.8 (out of 1.0? possibly) and imo its unikely for any of this to be revealed until maybe the very end of the current update since MC is still in 99 with a party, and the game has been in dev/production for half a decade already are people expecting to have as much content in the "past 2019" (lizze scenes, skylar tat, etc) as weve had with 99 and the "current" 2019? and a follow up do people think this will get finished before 2029?

 

[JJ1960]

It's been awhile since I've played the earlier chapters so I must have just assumed it didn't work/whoever figured it out died in the explosion (the same one that caused the power plant to be off limits/red light?). I think we just disagree on how complicated time travel is, considering the "bad guys" seem to want to take/use the one we know about (Masked man warning MC etc) instead of just making their own? Someone was able to do it in the 90s but they (despite having the knowledge its possible) still prefer to interfere with masked man other than just getting another scientist? Granted i could be forgetting something about masked man/the "bad guys" but i dont feel like im missing anything THAT major?

Lots of countries know that making an atomic bomb is possible. They could probably make one (my college physics textbook explains the process and a lot of the math, just not the engineering portion), but there is a good chance it blows up in their lab. However if they could have a spy steal the necessary information from a country (say the United States), then that probably solves many of the issues they have run into and shortens their efforts and mistakes. Even if they have figured out the bomb stealing current technology info from the US helps them improve their version that they are going to produce and potentially use. I won't recount the number of times this has actually happened with the US nuclear program.

An adversarial group working on a time machine that almost or partially works, or even works to a degree, makes accessing another working time machine extremely valuable to them. They know a time machine is feasible, have some general and maybe some specific info from a mole they planted in the development group or a survivor has come over to help them since the original project was shut down.

The power plant section with the time machine was probably put off limits by the developers/owners, or maybe some black government group who was funding the development.

 

[Simpgor]

An adversarial group working on a time machine that almost or partially works, or even works to a degree, makes accessing another working time machine extremely valuable to them. They know a time machine is feasible, have some general and maybe some specific info from a mole they planted in the development group or a survivor has come over to help them since the original project was shut down.

I guess im stuck on the idea how they can know it was possible in the 90s (we have very different ideas how "close" time travel is) and not have made any progress in 20 years despite them getting infinite(?) rewards if they make even the "poorly designed 20 year jump only" time machine. To me its very much a iron man scenario where im asking "how could they do it in a cave with a box of scraps!" where the "bad guys" have had some knowledge, connections, and money to operate/exist "in secret" for way longer and are still having to rely utterly on the masked man. If he dies or fucks off to the end of time what tf would they do?

Then again the people we see with jenny are literally mustache twirling villains who are talking about how they like to nerco vs have the girl struggle..... so maybe the bad guys are just legit incompetent? Wasn't the guy riley bonked on the head one of them? I guess that lines up with them being incompetent

 

[JJ1960]

I guess im stuck on the idea how they can know it was possible in the 90s

Bribery and industrial espionage. Plus it all went down in 1999 so it's more like the 2000s.

(we have very different ideas how "close" time travel is) and not have made any progress in 20 years despite them getting infinite(?) rewards if they make even the "poorly designed 20 year jump only" time machine.

We don't know how much progress they have made, and what info they have about the technical operation and design of the original machine. Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos both own rocket companies. Elon launches satellites and ferries astronauts to and from the ISS with regularity. Jeff has one that looks like a penis and uses it to impress his dimwit pop star girlfriend. You don't think that Bezos would love to get one of Musk's rockets to take apart and reverse engineer to make his actually worth something?

Then again the people we see with jenny are literally mustache twirling villains who are talking about how they like to nerco vs have the girl struggle..... so maybe the bad guys are just legit incompetent? Wasn't the guy riley bonked on the head one of them? I guess that lines up with them being incompetent

No telling how good the adversarial group actually is. So far it looks like their low level helpers are channeling the spirits of Larry, Moe and Curly but they might just be there to monitor things and report back, not do any black bag jobs. Most likely people running security ops on both time machine groups are not good people.

 

[Drunkstrosity]

Amazing game so far really good storyline. The music is a BOP!!!