Sexual Game Mechanics: Why and How

[OgreIt]

I've only skimmed parts of this topic, but I'd like to go ahead and throw in a couple cents.

A lot of porn games do a bad job of integrating their porn into their gameplay loop. I've played great games that are poor porn because of this and horrible games that are great porn because of it. The main difference is frequency and duration. You don't want to spend hours waiting for the porn, but you also don't want the game to interrupt you every ten minutes for an hour long porn scene. Games that have sex tied to a core mechanic of their gameplay loop typically do very well at keeping a steady feed of smut rather than this uncomfortable stop and go that most game that don't seem to have.

Although I do think it's the easiest way, sex doesn't strictly need to be a gameplay mechanic itself. It's ultimately about pace. Those NPC rpg maker games are by no means good games, but they actually integrate their scenes pretty well in the loop. Usually you just explore, maybe do a puzzle, find a girl, watch a smut cutscene, and repeat. It's not amazing gameplay, but it's easy to fap to.

Conversely, there are rpg maker games that set you out on a dragon quest or your final fantasy, then interrupt two hours later to stop the game with a twenty minute sex scene for one CG (+variations). The porn is basically not a part of the gameplay loop with these kinds of games. If I want to play a game, this is much better, but it's not great for fapping.

There's a happy middle ground between these extremes, but it's clearly quite easy to screw up your pacing if sex isn't a game mechanic.

That said, having sex as a game mechanic doesn't mean it's very well tied to the gameplay loop. I recently played Flying Princess Interbreed, and while it had a breeding mechanic and great art, the mechanic was poorly implemented. To start sex, you intentionally had to give up a turn and it resulted in the loss one of your units for the remainder of the stage. This implementation was so punishing that it normally encouraged you to avoid engaging with the mechanic at all.

 

[kzaazul]

First and foremost, I haven't read all posts in this thread. So, forgive me if I'm bringing up some points that have already been throughouly discussed.

For what is worth, I partially agree with OP's idea. If you're designing a porn game, I feel like sex should be part of the main gameplay loop, or a reward for succeeding. Sex-on-defeat games are counterintuitive in the sense that you have to win battles to progress, but lose them to see sex scenes. However, if this rape on defeat doesn't get you a game over, it can be interesting if corrupting your protagonist gives access to other mechanics (for example, bypassing battles or puzzles by seducing opponents). I think Ambrosia does this, but I'm not sure.

Personally, my favorite porn games are the ones where you play through the sexual scenes, like in Karryn's Prison and Lilith's Throne.

 

[TranscendentThots]

This is what's always bugged me about games like Future Fragments, especially the earlier versions where all the sex was NC. Who am I? What am I trying to accomplish in this game? Ludonarrative dissonance.

Of course, then there's the whole thriving Ryona genre in Japan, where I get the impression that going into an intimidating challenge knowing full well you're going to get raped if you mess it up is the point? But sometimes it feels like that's not what the developers were going for. Sometimes, I can't tell what the devs were going for. It's not presented as tragedy, it's not presented as farce, it's not presented as fanservice, the game over rape is just kind of there. Like it's somehow become just another box for developers to tick.

 

[OgreIt]

If you're designing a porn game, I feel like sex should be part of the main gameplay loop, or a reward for succeeding. Sex-on-defeat games are counterintuitive in the sense that you have to win battles to progress, but lose them to see sex scenes.

A gameplay loop can include sex-on-defeat effectively. The mismatch arises when expected defeat is not actually designed into the gameplay loop. Most platformers do a decent job of including porn as a punishment for minor mistakes, but that's because they expect you to make said minor mistakes. Conversely, a lot of RPGs gate the porn behind complete fuckups that no mildly competent player will ever see naturally. Some even go so far as to include "attacks" that help you throw fights.

 

[kzaazul]

A gameplay loop can include sex-on-defeat effectively. The mismatch arises when expected defeat is not actually designed into the gameplay loop. Most platformers do a decent job of including porn as a punishment for minor mistakes, but that's because they expect you to make said minor mistakes. Conversely, a lot of RPGs gate the porn behind complete fuckups that no mildly competent player will ever see naturally. Some even go so far as to include "attacks" that help you throw fights.

Yeah, I don't usually play porn platforms so I forgot about them, but you are right.

 

[nulnil]

If you keep that in mind, one of the best gameplay for adult games is that allows players to use only one hand, such as using only a mouse.

I think a possible fix to make a two-handed control scheme viable is better distribution of sexual content. Essentially, this distribution is a kind of plan for the "fap timeline" a player will have. Instead of just having it stagnate or go up or down forever, the length and rate of sexual content is planned out in expected play sessions.

Say we have a level-based arena fighter, and it has some pre-exisiting sexual game mechanics such as sex attacks.

1. About less than 50% of the level doesn't demand too much use of the SGMs, and they are automatically shorter length-wise.
2. The later parts of a level will be a bit harder, so the rate of SGMs increase. The length of the sex scene increases from the beginning since the player is a little more aroused.
3. Eventually the player reaches the boss of the level or whatever. The boss would have longer sex scenes (for being grabbed and grabbing) since the player should be heading towards finishing.
4. Say to finish off bosses, you have to do a sex grab. This makes a perfect oppertunity to put in a unique and longer sex animation against the boss for the player to finish up to.
5. Repeat this distribution pattern for most levels.

However, this is all expermintal because I haven't seen games do any great examples of this. Corruption games just go up forever, and most others stagnate.

 

[DuniX]

If you keep that in mind, one of the best gameplay for adult games is that allows players to use only one hand, such as using only a mouse.

I do agree as a connoisseur of porn games, it is the attention to detail in how you set your pacing, the downtime/fapping time, how to keep edging the player without cockblocking and maintaining the horny momentum and how you setup the final climax.
Sexual Mechanics are not just Gameplay with Sex, Sexual Mechanics are about creating the Best Fapping Experience.
Masters at it push all your fetish buttons and play you like a piano.

It is a True Art that most heretics and unbelievers here have no respect for.

 

[hakarlman]

Nulnil's ideas are cutting edge.

The people who disagree with Nulnil are stuck in a 2015 mentality, thinking a game's porn should be separate from the story & gameplay, a precedent set by Skyrim; Skyrim is not a porn game, but mods added tons of porn to it, yet the story and gameplay still feel separate from the artificially inserted porn. A lot of devs who want to make a 3d adventure porn game tend to model their game design based on their experiences with Skyrim + porn mods. This was okay back in 2015-2016, but in 2023, story, porn and gameplay should be brought together in some way.

If you disagree with Nulnil, you might be a fan of Carnal Instinct, Subverse, and Wild Life's single player game design; assuming you've spent time in Wild Life's discord, listening to the devs there. These games separate the porn from the gameplay. So, It's like your playing pac man, and after you beat 10 levels, you see a gonzo porn scene, then it just goes back to pacman. IMO that's terrible design for a porn game.

If you agree with Nulnil, you probably like Karryn's Prison a lot, and want more games to bring story, gameplay & porn together the way it did so successfully. However, it's riskier to try something new like Karryn's Prison, but the pay off is HUGE, because Remtairy(dev of karryns prison) is making tons & tons of $$$ using RPGMAKER FFS. Think about that for a while.... Dude is using RPGmaker and making a shit ton of money. How is that possible? It's because his ideas are new and cutting edge, he brought porn, story & gameplay together very successfully, IMO that's the next evolution in porn game design, but 99.9% of devs don't understand this yet, and Remtairy is laughing at them all the way to the bank.

 

[Toramizu]

Nulnil's ideas are cutting edge.

The people who disagree with Nulnil are stuck in a 2015 mentality, thinking a game's porn should be separate from the story & gameplay, a precedent set by Skyrim; Skyrim is not a porn game, but mods added tons of porn to it, yet the story and gameplay still feel separate from the artificially inserted porn. A lot of devs who want to make a 3d adventure porn game tend to model their game design based on their experiences with Skyrim + porn mods. This was okay back in 2015-2016, but in 2023, story, porn and gameplay should be brought together in some way.

If you disagree with Nulnil, you might be a fan of Carnal Instinct, Subverse, and Wild Life's single player game design; assuming you've spent time in Wild Life's discord, listening to the devs there. These games separate the porn from the gameplay. So, It's like your playing pac man, and after you beat 10 levels, you see a gonzo porn scene, then it just goes back to pacman. IMO that's terrible design for a porn game.

If you agree with Nulnil, you probably like Karryn's Prison a lot, and want more games to bring story, gameplay & porn together the way it did so successfully. However, it's riskier to try something new like Karryn's Prison, but the pay off is HUGE, because Remtairy(dev of karryns prison) is making tons & tons of $$$ using RPGMAKER FFS. Think about that for a while.... Dude is using RPGmaker and making a shit ton of money. How is that possible? It's because his ideas are new and cutting edge, he brought porn, story & gameplay together very successfully, IMO that's the next evolution in porn game design, but 99.9% of devs don't understand this yet, and Remtairy is laughing at them all the way to the bank.

That depends on how you play the game. I like Karryn's Prison, but after a while, the sex scenes are repetitive and I'd just like for the turns to go on faster. IMO, it lacks custom scenes, I liked how the victory scene in the happy end started, but felt let down as soon as I saw the same reactions I've already seen up to there.
And for KP, the game's presentation is a huge part of its success : great art, original charsets, voice acting, lots of modding RPGM to fit the game's style. The always on sex gameplay is good at the start, but quickly lacks depth (without talking about the combat system that's either too hard if you don't do what the game expects, or too easy if you do or go slut route).

Sex as a gameplay focus is great and should be a focus, I'm not saying the opposite, but handcrafted scenes, should always be included too. You won against a tough boss, you get/unlock a scene where you domme it, or unlock a scene with a side character. Having always the same kind of sex-gameplay makes them become bland, and while sex for the sake of sex is nice, I'd love some more intimate scenes, sometimes.

 

[DuniX]

the sex scenes are repetitive and I'd just like for the turns to go on faster. IMO, it lacks custom scenes, I liked how the victory scene in the happy end started, but felt let down as soon as I saw the same reactions I've already seen up to there.

This brings the point in how do we add variety and value to the sex scenes for this kind of games.
The thing is even for a game like Honey Select that technically can have infinite scenes based on how many games use that as assets, in that game itself all those scenes and animations are "devalued" even if you have greater customization and control over them.
Sex Scenes are ultimately about Novelty and part of that is Exclusivity and Restriction, the things you don't have access to.
You want New Characters with different bodies and costumes, you want new camera angles, perspectives and poses that you haven't yet seen, you want new expressions, emotions and dialog you haven't yet reached.

On the other hand you can have Extrinsic Rewards as "Value" outside of the Intrinsic Value of the Sex Scene. Things like Rewards, Progression Unlocks, Strategic Resources, New Units and the further Gameplay Consequences of the Sex Act.
I think that's why Training and Brothel Sims work so well is because the Sex Act is part of the Economic System of the game.

 

[lolzorzs]

The comunity doesnt use documents properly | F95zone
Game Design Document GDD | F95zone

Aaaahhhh.... home.

 

[nulnil]

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