Others Shadow over Meridia [v0.82] [GratuitousLove]

[I-Love-Adventure]

nice game thank you

 

[GratuitousLove]

I only get "failed to set audio device" message and program closes. Any solutions?

Yeah, this is an error linked to SRPG (the engine I use to make the game). Someone already reported me this error once, I can't find their message, but I know we tried a couple things :
-Update your sound drivers can't hurt, and might fix it.
-I remember them talking about the game working when they use, and the issue could be because their audio device was set to use quality sound that is not supported by SRPG (like too high bitrate or something like that) so you might want to change your audio setting to something more commonly used if that's your case or try to use any other audio device.

 

[BeholdTheWizzard]

She is aroused when having people under her power, which laso has an impact about how sex scenes unfold.
From what I heard until now I think you'll be fine with the game.

Yeah, happily telling a girl to kill her friends even as she tries to resist. Such a "good" MC.
Dunno, everything just rubs me the wrong way.

 

[bitsybobs3]

ShadowOverMeridia-0.82

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[EvolutionKills]

Gotta love a banner image with 9 characters, each in a different style. Hard to find a better one image explanation of how zero fucks were given.

 

[GratuitousLove]

Gotta love a banner image with 9 characters, each in a different style. Hard to find a better one image explanation of how zero fucks were given.

Well I did try hard but unfortunately I had not nearly enough money to comission artist for every single art, especialy in the begining. Now I'm starting to earn on bit on partreon so as the game progressed I could comission artist for latest scenes, but I'm not making nearly enough to replace all the old one.
Honestly I'm a bit pissed at those kind of comment that imply that game dev just try to make money without giving a fuck.
Making a game is hard, I spent thousands of hours on my games, trying to write a story, make an interesting gameplay, align sound so an action happens at the very frame a music reach its peak etc, you might not like the result but pretending we don't care it's just uselessly mean.

We wouldn't spend that much time making a game if we didn't care, most dev could probably earn 2-10 times the money working in ANY other industry than video game, we just choose game cause we love making them.

 

[Rosen King]

Gotta love a banner image with 9 characters, each in a different style. Hard to find a better one image explanation of how zero fucks were given.

The amount of effort put into the gameplay itself far outstrips most games on this site, even to the point of modding the game engine to include mechanics that it wasn't originally meant to handle. The art inconsistency stems from the fact that the dev can't make the artwork themselves or commission another artist, so they've relied on AI to fill the gap, which itself is something that's been rapidly changing in the time that they've been working on this game. And while AI has its own share of issues, it's no more "lazy" than using canned Daz or Honey Select or Koikatsu models.

 

[EvolutionKills]

Well I did try hard but unfortunately I had not nearly enough money to comission artist for every single art, especialy in the begining. Now I'm starting to earn on bit on partreon so as the game progressed I could comission artist for latest scenes, but I'm not making nearly enough to replace all the old one.
Honestly I'm a bit pissed at those kind of comment that imply that game dev just try to make money without giving a fuck.
Making a game is hard, I spent thousands of hours on my games, trying to write a story, make an interesting gameplay, align sound so an action happens at the very frame a music reach its peak etc, you might not like the result but pretending we don't care it's just uselessly mean.

We wouldn't spend that much time making a game if we didn't care, most dev could probably earn 2-10 times the money working in ANY other industry than video game, we just choose game cause we love making them.

Sorry, but generative AI is a complete cop-out. It says that you don't care about other creatives, other artist or developers, so long as you get yours. Fuck everyone else who isn't you and your project. You are the special snowflake whom deserves respect for their supposed work, while the efforts of everyone else serve only to fuel your personal advancement. Despite farming off the 'art' to a machine, you still couldn't be bothered to pick a singular visual cue (e.g. 90's anime) and stick with it? Hitting 'regen' to roll the dice over and over again was somehow too much effort for you? Yeah, I don't fucking buy it.

When I see generative AI visuals, I have ZERO reason to believe that literally anything else is aboveboard. If you're cool with farming off the visuals to a machine built upon world-spanning art theft (for the explicit benefit of shareholders at the expense of other creatives, the general usability of the internet, and exacerbating climate change), why should I believe you didn't do the same to the writing or the coding? It's like getting caught plagiarizing other people's content; if you caught that person doing it once, more than likely they've rolled those dice a few times before they were found out. Nobody has any reason to take anything you say at face value, because you yourself are advertising up-front that you explicitly don't care about the corners you cut. It is 'Fuck everyone else, so long as I got mine!' in as many words.

 

[EvolutionKills]

The amount of effort put into the gameplay itself far outstrips most games on this site, even to the point of modding the game engine to include mechanics that it wasn't originally meant to handle. The art inconsistency stems from the fact that the dev can't make the artwork themselves or commission another artist, so they've relied on AI to fill the gap, which itself is something that's been rapidly changing in the time that they've been working on this game. And while AI has its own share of issues, it's no more "lazy" than using canned Daz or Honey Select or Koikatsu models.

Machinma =/= generative AI. Stop being obtuse.

 

[GratuitousLove]

Sorry, but generative AI is a complete cop-out. It says that you don't care about other creatives, other artist or developers, so long as you get yours. Fuck everyone else who isn't you and your project. You are the special snowflake whom deserves respect for their supposed work, while the efforts of everyone else serve only to fuel your personal advancement. Despite farming off the 'art' to a machine, you still couldn't be bothered to pick a singular visual cue (e.g. 90's anime) and stick with it? Hitting 'regen' to roll the dice over and over again was somehow too much effort for you? Yeah, I don't fucking buy it.

When I see generative AI visuals, I have ZERO reason to believe that literally anything else is aboveboard. If you're cool with farming off the visuals to a machine built upon world-spanning art theft (for the explicit benefit of shareholders at the expense of other creatives, the general usability of the internet, and exacerbating climate change), why should I believe you didn't do the same to the writing or the coding? It's like getting caught plagiarizing other people's content; if you caught that person doing it once, more than likely they've rolled those dice a few times before they were found out. Nobody has any reason to take anything you say at face value, because you yourself are advertising up-front that you explicitly don't care about the corners you cut. It is 'Fuck everyone else, so long as I got mine!' in as many words.

First let's answer the stupid stuff.
Well, first I really doubt that any code generator would be able to create plugin for SRPG which not only isn't fully open source but also using so prehistoric version of javascript.
Also the same way, I use AI art to make my game, I'm also perfectly fine with people using AI to code, even if it might have fed itself on my code I really don't care.
For the art consistency it is a mix of me being a beginner and the fact that AI is really bad as producing the same character again and I had to change tool I used as I learned.
And no having even somewhat consistent character won't work by hiting regen button a million time, you have to draw (at least for original character)

Now for the ethical use of AI :
I'll be honest with you I think this is just stupid, I'm a dev, I make code, and honestly if an AI use my code to produce more code then cool. I wasn't angry when gameMaker, RPG maker, Unity or w/e allowed people that can't code able to make game, quite the opposite and I'm not going to start now.

Not only I don't think AI is really violating copyright, (it's just use huge amount of data to see shape/color are likely to be close to other coupled with a data that link text with shape) but, even if it did I just don't really care. I just believe everyone should be able to share cultural objects w/e they are and be free to use them as they please. (And to be honest I find it a bit strange that someone on a pirate website is complaining about it but hee, you do you.)

I understand the issue that if AI becomes much better than it is atm, artist might have more trouble to earn a living in the future, but first I doubt it happens anytime soon. Because even if AI become hypothetically better at some task, as long as there are task they can't do, there will be artist. The same concern rose when photo happened, people where worried that artist as a career would get destroyed, but the opposite happenned, because artist future isn't tied to the fact you can't replace part of what they do to with technology, but by how much people are willing to spend in culture in other words, the amount of worker in culture (artist, musician, actor etc) is dependant on 2 things !
-How much people are still available to do it once more mandatory needs (like food, medicine having a roof) are met.
-Polical reason (money given to shareholder or used to make guns can't go to artists)

So if I can give you my humble opinion, you should spend more time trying to influence the politic to w/e country you live in than complaining about a game dev that use AI to make art and who wouldn't be able to pay artist more than I do even if I wanted to. Because in the end, there is absolutely no technical reason that prevent politician to redistribute wealth however they wishes, and if you wishes more wealth to go to artist, I suggest you use your time doing that.

Also I'm a bit sad with how people are overeacting about AI, really this is just business as usual. 90% of everyday product you use are made mainly with machine using the knowledge of the people they replaced. People are just waking up now because it replaces people that thought they were too smart/creative w/e to replace while until now it was mainly replacing low wage worker that had very little influence. The only reason we hear it now is because artist, lawyer, physician dev etc are people that are privileged enough to have influence of some sort. (Manual worker usualy have 0 access to mass media/ don't have an audience).

So if you don't think I don't deserve your money fine, again I'm not posting my game on a pirate site to complain about people not giving me money. But really don't expect me to stop just because a brat ask me to, pretending I'm an evil bastard because I dare to earn 10% of my country's minimum wage making a video game and allow anyone to play it for free.

 

[Wyrtyn]

Sorry, but generative AI is a complete cop-out. It says that you don't care about other creatives, other artist or developers, so long as you get yours. Fuck everyone else who isn't you and your project. You are the special snowflake whom deserves respect for their supposed work, while the efforts of everyone else serve only to fuel your personal advancement. Despite farming off the 'art' to a machine, you still couldn't be bothered to pick a singular visual cue (e.g. 90's anime) and stick with it? Hitting 'regen' to roll the dice over and over again was somehow too much effort for you? Yeah, I don't fucking buy it.

When I see generative AI visuals, I have ZERO reason to believe that literally anything else is aboveboard. If you're cool with farming off the visuals to a machine built upon world-spanning art theft (for the explicit benefit of shareholders at the expense of other creatives, the general usability of the internet, and exacerbating climate change), why should I believe you didn't do the same to the writing or the coding? It's like getting caught plagiarizing other people's content; if you caught that person doing it once, more than likely they've rolled those dice a few times before they were found out. Nobody has any reason to take anything you say at face value, because you yourself are advertising up-front that you explicitly don't care about the corners you cut. It is 'Fuck everyone else, so long as I got mine!' in as many words.

"Art theft. Creatives."

Fucks sake, nobody told me the march of progress is gonna be to the tune of whining. Actual children. Still acting like they're god's little angels above automatization that affects literally everyone else ever.

 

[EvolutionKills]

Now for the ethical use of AI :
I'll be honest with you I think this is just stupid, I'm a dev, I make code, and honestly if an AI use my code to produce more code then cool. I wasn't angry when gameMaker, RPG maker, Unity or w/e allowed people that can't code able to make game, quite the opposite and I'm not going to start now.

Weak equivocation. AI is not a 'tool' in the same way a game engine is. You can't just ask Unity to 'Yo, make me a platformer in the style of Super Mario Bros.' and let it do it's thing.

Not only I don't think AI is really violating copyright, (it's just use huge amount of data to see shape/color are likely to be close to other coupled with a data that link text with shape) but, even if it did I just don't really care. I just believe everyone should be able to share cultural objects w/e they are and be free to use them as they please. (And to be honest I find it a bit strange that someone on a pirate website is complaining about it but hee, you do you.)

First off, are you using this site to pirate stuff right now? Is this conversation we're having an act of piracy? No? Then stop being fucking obtuse. F95Zone is a site that aggregates downloadable game content and hosts accompanying forums, and the overwhelming majority of those games are freely available to the public. You are here not because F95Zone is just a pirate website, but because it offers a valuable platform to spread your game to a larger audience. So lets stop pretending that 'being on F95Zone' and 'using generative AI created with worldwide art theft to enrich yourself' are equivalent positions.

It is theft, because you can ask generative AI to make stuff 'in the style of' or even get it to deliver whole pages of copy-pasted copyrighted material, because all of that material was taken (without attribution or compensation) and used to train these models; models which are ultimately commercial products. If a huge tech company takes your shit and uses it to make a profit, that's both theft and copyright infringement. Generative AI is doing that, except across the whole internet and against millions of people all at once. You might be alright with Tech-Bro Dipshits and Venture Capitalist Ghouls stealing your stuff, but that's not your decision to make for everyone else.

Generative AI is not a computer comprehending art and learning like a human does (if it was, they would in effect be a trapped and shackled general purpose intelligences, and using them as you do would be digital forced labor), it is a commercial product that could not exist if not for the metric fuck-ton of copyrighted work that was taken without attribution or compensation to refine them. Do you want to know who can afford to pay artist for their work? Billionaire venture capitalists.

I understand the issue that if AI becomes much better than it is atm, artist might have more trouble to earn a living in the future, but first I doubt it happens anytime soon. Because even if AI become hypothetically better at some task, as long as there are task they can't do, there will be artist. The same concern rose when photo happened, people where worried that artist as a career would get destroyed, but the opposite happenned, because artist future isn't tied to the fact you can't replace part of what they do to with technology, but by how much people are willing to spend in culture in other words, the amount of worker in culture (artist, musician, actor etc) is dependant on 2 things !
-How much people are still available to do it once more mandatory needs (like food, medicine having a roof) are met.
-Polical reason (money given to shareholder or used to make guns can't go to artists)

Do you use the internet at all outside of F95Zone? Serious question. Because it sounds like you haven't at all experienced how generative AI is making the whole of the internet worse for the end-user, with seemingly zero beneficial use-cases that didn't already exist before.

Google's top search result now is generative AI nonsense, and Image Search is awash in unmarked generated AI images. Amazon and Etsy are filled with zero effort dropshippers using AI to make images and text to flood the marketplaces with crap. Quora, Facebook, and Twitter are filled with bot posts and that are then swarmed with bot replies; it's bots just talking to each other. Generative AI has slapped rocket boosters to the enablement of fraud and the creation of spam, all the while gobbling up limited electricity and creating an environmentally destructive amount of CO2. Everything is being made demonstrably worse.

So if I can give you my humble opinion, you should spend more time trying to influence the politic to w/e country you live in than complaining about a game dev that use AI to make art and who wouldn't be able to pay artist more than I do even if I wanted to. Because in the end, there is absolutely no technical reason that prevent politician to redistribute wealth however they wishes, and if you wishes more wealth to go to artist, I suggest you use your time doing that.

I can do both. Also, none of this changes the fact that you could have created images without generative AI. F95Zone is filled with examples of such; weather it be the longstanding practice of machinma in repurposing game assets in new and creative ways, dedicated 3DCG models, or even just sticking with 'bad' art you created yourself (it might not be pretty, but it is honest). There are more than just the two options of 'generative AI slop born of globe spanning theft' and 'commissioning the real artist being threatened by said AI slop'.

Also I'm a bit sad with how people are overeacting about AI, really this is just business as usual. 90% of everyday product you use are made mainly with machine using the knowledge of the people they replaced. People are just waking up now because it replaces people that thought they were too smart/creative w/e to replace while until now it was mainly replacing low wage worker that had very little influence. The only reason we hear it now is because artist, lawyer, physician dev etc are people that are privileged enough to have influence of some sort. (Manual worker usualy have 0 access to mass media/ don't have an audience).

That is both ahistorical and total bullshit. At the dawn of the industrial revolution, textile mills brought automation to the textile market. Whereas before textiles were created by a large group of skilled artisans that were compensated for the work it took to make a quality product, they were being muscled out of the market by it being flooded with quickly produced and inferior products created by automation. Their very livelihoods were being threatened, their jobs displaced, by factories that made a worse product far cheaper; and all of the wealth generated by these new and worse products didn't go to factory workers, but rather was funneled up to the factory owners. It destroyed middle-class skilled artisans and enriched the already super wealthy. These textile artisans were the

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, and they were fucking right when they fought back over a century ago.

Just an FYI, Great Britain made the sabotage of these machine (i.e. industrial sabotage) a capital crime and punishable by death. They called in the literal fucking army to quell the protesting laborers. They put on massive show trials, replete with transportation to penal colonies and executions, to scare the citizenry into submission. They crushed the Luddites with the force of the state, wielded exclusively to benefit the holders of capital.

Much like the slave holders of the antebellum South, you are on the wrong side of history on this one. Unfortunately history will very likely repeat itself; but that's more an indictment of the failure of our systems of governance to protect its citizens, rather than the righteousness of their exploitation.

So if you don't think I don't deserve your money fine, again I'm not posting my game on a pirate site to complain about people not giving me money. But really don't expect me to stop just because a brat ask me to, pretending I'm an evil bastard because I dare to earn 10% of my country's minimum wage making a video game and allow anyone to play it for free.

Yeah, scammers generally don't stop scamming when they get called out for it. But if you put out shite images created without any attempt to create a cohesive presentation, people are going to comment on it. If you actually cared, there are non-bullshit ways to make consistent images and create a cohesive visual presentation. But you opted for the path of least resistance, built upon the wholesale theft of people who did care enough to make their own art. Like it or not, I don't find that position worthy of respect; in the same way that I don't respect YouTube video-essay creators when they plagiarize the content of their script from other people, as no amount of work in sound recording and video editing excuses the theft of the writing. You are essentially doing the same thing, but obfuscated through a new 'tool' that adds an extra step between you and those who were stolen from.

Again, your answer is 'Fuck you, I got mine' in as many words.

 

[Wyrtyn]

Somebody tell this creature that the progress of technology doesn't care it spent a semester failing to read the german ideology.

 

[GratuitousLove]

Weak equivocation. AI is not a 'tool' in the same way a game engine is. You can't just ask Unity to 'Yo, make me a platformer in the style of Super Mario Bros.' and let it do it's thing.

I didn't know all you had to do was to ask Ai to make you an awesome game to get one...
Joke asides, the real difference between new AIs and game engines, is that they're able to translate natural language into effect unlike older game engines which require you to learn their language. While it lower the required the technical skill to do something (which I think is a good thing) it doesn't necessarily prevent people using them to express their creativity.

Now for the art style or creation being copied and violating copyright, you're right, except that it has nothing to do with AI. You could copy a style or a character before AI and you can still do it now, and it didn't become "legal" to copy a character just because you use AI to do it. Now if you think X character from my game is a copy of Y character from any other game, then maybe you should have started here, but I don't think that was your point.

Now you're lecturing me about history. How capitalists ruined artisans by flooding cheap product made from automation.Yeah that's capitalism but spoiler alert, they don't need new technologies to do that. A few month ago in France they literaly send cops to shut down a strike of refiners, they were protesting against their pay being too low when their boss increased his by millions. The governement literaly decreed that those who would refuse to go to work would be sentenced to jail.

So I'm asking you again why are you wasting your time with me? If you're affraid that some people aren't getting corectly paid for their work, why not just try to have politician in place get them to get paid correctly? Because trying fight AIs user's, and even worse a pennyless game dev somehow trying to make game with little mean they have in the strange hope that MAYBE it would somehow change anything about how often AI are use, and then hope that MAYBE it would increase a bit artist's leverage against big company and then hope that MAYBE they won't find another way to reduce their "costs", seems like a REALY CONVOLUTED way to do it when those in power can just choose to change how wealth is distributed.
It's always frustrating when people blame "technical issues" or "technology" as if the problem wasn't purely political to begin with.
You say you do both but let's be honest here, we all have limited time/energy on earth, and every minute you spend bothering is a minute you're not doing something really usefull... But I suppose it's easier to take on the pennyless dev than the politician that are responsibles for wealth distribution.

Anyway I'm not going to waste any more time reading you, you're just the type that selectively attack pick on the weak because you don't want to change anything, you just want to take a fight you think you can win in hope to feel better afterward.
I'll say it again, 90+% of stuff you're using have been made by machine that replaced workers, including the computer/cell phone you use to harass me, maybe you should stop using it and leave me alone. For sure I wasted enough on my time reading you.

 

[bassrass]

Just block the idiot nothing good comes from talking with them.

 

[Tahxeol]

Little feedback: some missions require you to beat an enemy (the ice witch or the queen in the practice duel for example).
If you convert the enemy, the mission will softlock, because you can't kill your own units

 

[GratuitousLove]

Little feedback: some missions require you to beat an enemy (the ice witch or the queen in the practice duel for example).
If you convert the enemy, the mission will softlock, because you can't kill your own units

Thank you for your report, that's because at the time you converted enemy by "killing them" with the debuff. Now I changed that they are invulnerable with the debuff, so I'll have to change event, it should be fixed next update thank you for your feedback.

 

[EvolutionKills]

I didn't know all you had to do was to ask Ai to make you an awesome game to get one...
Joke asides, the real difference between new AIs and game engines, is that they're able to translate natural language into effect unlike older game engines which require you to learn their language. While it lower the required the technical skill to do something (which I think is a good thing) it doesn't necessarily prevent people using them to express their creativity.

Now for the art style or creation being copied and violating copyright, you're right, except that it has nothing to do with AI. You could copy a style or a character before AI and you can still do it now, and it didn't become "legal" to copy a character just because you use AI to do it. Now if you think X character from my game is a copy of Y character from any other game, then maybe you should have started here, but I don't think that was your point.

Now you're lecturing me about history. How capitalists ruined artisans by flooding cheap product made from automation.Yeah that's capitalism but spoiler alert, they don't need new technologies to do that. A few month ago in France they literaly send cops to shut down a strike of refiners, they were protesting against their pay being too low when their boss increased his by millions. The governement literaly decreed that those who would refuse to go to work would be sentenced to jail.

So I'm asking you again why are you wasting your time with me? If you're affraid that some people aren't getting corectly paid for their work, why not just try to have politician in place get them to get paid correctly? Because trying fight AIs user's, and even worse a pennyless game dev somehow trying to make game with little mean they have in the strange hope that MAYBE it would somehow change anything about how often AI are use, and then hope that MAYBE it would increase a bit artist's leverage against big company and then hope that MAYBE they won't find another way to reduce their "costs", seems like a REALY CONVOLUTED way to do it when those in power can just choose to change how wealth is distributed.
It's always frustrating when people blame "technical issues" or "technology" as if the problem wasn't purely political to begin with.
You say you do both but let's be honest here, we all have limited time/energy on earth, and every minute you spend bothering is a minute you're not doing something really usefull... But I suppose it's easier to take on the pennyless dev than the politician that are responsibles for wealth distribution.

Anyway I'm not going to waste any more time reading you, you're just the type that selectively attack pick on the weak because you don't want to change anything, you just want to take a fight you think you can win in hope to feel better afterward.
I'll say it again, 90+% of stuff you're using have been made by machine that replaced workers, including the computer/cell phone you use to harass me, maybe you should stop using it and leave me alone. For sure I wasted enough on my time reading you.

Stop picking on little ol' me, I'm only profiting from and enabling the further exploitation of other real creative people and normalizing anti-human technology and theft-by-proxy.

Don't hate the players, hate the game!

I take zero personal responsibility for my actions!

Ignore my awful shitty decisions, because there's someone over there doing way worse, so that makes it okay! Why haven't you ignored me yet?


Notice how none of your defenses at all stem from 'this is my creative vision', because if you actually had one, you wouldn't be farming it off said vision to a machine that did it for you. You just cry how it's not actually shitty to other people (it is), and ignores how it serves to further alienate and exploit the very medium you are working in (it does). Again, nothing you have said here rises above 'Fuck you, I got mine!' other than to whine and add the addendum '...so stop being mean about it!'. You have every opportunity to use non-exploitative means to generate visuals, and you keep taking and trying to defend the most exploitative one. This isn't going to a Dollar Store to buy food, because it's the only thing you can afford while keeping a roof over your head. You have other options, you just choose not to use them out of personal convenience.

But, if you really are so desperate that you need to exploit other artists via proxy using silicon valley parlor tricks, why aren't YOU spending more of you time lobbying your government to help raise you out of such desperation, rather than stepping on the backs of your fellow proletariat? You sure as shit aren't a capital holder. Even your feeble arguments are actually an indictment against yourself...

 

[Wyrtyn]

Let us all take lessons on class solidarity and getting creatives paid on a pirate forum. Actual crocodile tears by a crybully. Insane person who merely wishes to harm others to feel petty sadistic glee.

 

[GratuitousLove]

Just block the idiot nothing good comes from talking with them.

I didn't know I could do that thank you.

Notice how none of your defenses at all stem from 'this is my creative vision', because if you actually had one, you wouldn't be farming it off said vision to a machine that did it for you.

The very first thing I told you was how I shared my "creative vision" as you call it through gameplay... writing... Realisation. But it looks like you're not really reading me.
Now as I already told you earlier, I don't want to talk with you and if you continue to insult someone who tells you to stop, there is a name for that and it's harassment, so I'll just put you on my ignore list sorry for that, as I said I'd rather spend my time making game than deal with obnoxious people.