Venitus

Newbie
Sep 21, 2017
44
8
See this is why I wish there wasn't a debate going on, I completely missed this one.

Assuming you're referring to the surprise attack the duo performs early on in the light puzzles after your first conversation with them, bring Adrenaline and use it once they bind you to clear the debuffs disabling your struggle.
I ended up simply skipping the fight with Debug mode,I don't recall if I used it,but it wasn't that the struggle option was disabled,the struggle option was completely gone,not there,and I could attack as normal but no matter how much damage I put out,the fight doesn't end.
 

EvokedShadow

Newbie
Aug 15, 2023
73
37
I ended up simply skipping the fight with Debug mode,I don't recall if I used it,but it wasn't that the struggle option was disabled,the struggle option was completely gone,not there,and I could attack as normal but no matter how much damage I put out,the fight doesn't end.
The Struggle Option doesn't appear unless you're bound, they're supposed to deabilitate you turn one with Ena's needle, which leads into a binding. I'm very curious as to what chain of events happened in your fight for them to not do that.
 

EvokedShadow

Newbie
Aug 15, 2023
73
37
Phew, thank god you didn't respond in full again, we were writing short essays each response. :KEK:
I had fun, my perspective got expanded a bit too, cheers mate, and happy new year.
I totally could've, but I'm also going insane by writing that long lol.

Tis was fun, even if I don't agree with the general outlook, I do like hearing how and why that outlook comes to be, I find it interesting.

Happy new year to you as well.
 

EvokedShadow

Newbie
Aug 15, 2023
73
37
Hard core is: excstasy and struggle spam and preying to god to any attack with this shit
Hardcore is not that hard.

The only fight in the entire game that is actually a struggle loop is Suicidal Iron Maiden.

Even then theres a good strategy you can loop to win.
 

SilmeToO

Newbie
May 23, 2020
25
1
Hardcore is not that hard.

The only fight in the entire game that is actually a struggle loop is Suicidal Iron Maiden.

Even then theres a good strategy you can loop to win.
Muruko be like: cursed hair/ecstasy, struggled from bound? Get another one, and another one, and another also take puppet. When i should attack? I got 5 bound attack in a row, and anything can i do Its struggle
 

SilmeToO

Newbie
May 23, 2020
25
1
Difficult should be fair, not just: get bound attack all of time, which prevents anything except struggle, and just pray to god to avoid fucking rng
 

SilmeToO

Newbie
May 23, 2020
25
1
Got just fucking tired of spam cursed hair and time which cannot prevent anything, just got magnum from console
 

EvokedShadow

Newbie
Aug 15, 2023
73
37
Muruko be like: cursed hair/ecstasy, struggled from bound? Get another one, and another one, and another also take puppet. When i should attack? I got 5 bound attack in a row, and anything can i do Its struggle
Mukuro is the second/first hardest boss in the game, you really shouldn't be surprised.

A while back I posted a highly consistent strat for Mukuro on every difficulty except Suicidal, its not that hard to deal with her.
 

Bruhhhbbb

Newbie
Jun 25, 2020
29
23
Muruko be like: cursed hair/ecstasy, struggled from bound? Get another one, and another one, and another also take puppet. When i should attack? I got 5 bound attack in a row, and anything can i do Its struggle
Shotgun, vitality regen, vitality regen ring, and all you need to do is tank it out while getting a couple hits. If we're being serious the first iron maiden fight is 100 times more annoying because you'll always be bound and have statuses you can't deal with. Muruko is like a fair iron maiden to me because you actually have resources to beat them.
 

Venitus

Newbie
Sep 21, 2017
44
8
The Struggle Option doesn't appear unless you're bound, they're supposed to deabilitate you turn one with Ena's needle, which leads into a binding. I'm very curious as to what chain of events happened in your fight for them to not do that.
Yeah,the beginning plays out as normal with them hitting me with the needle,then going to the ear licking,but the game never considers me "bound" so I can attack as normal,cast magic as normal,even do things like evasive or defensive stance and use items,but the option to struggle just straight up isn't there,in that fight or the Lampas one after the ladder. I have no clue what chain of events went on to that,literally everything before and after those two fights specifically works perfectly normal,even EX4,it's ONLY those two fights.
 
Dec 9, 2021
35
66
i beat genocide on hardcore and mukuro was piss easy didnt even have to struggle i just chopped her into pieces, though i guess thats just the benefit of genocide 1735843397556.png
 

JadedKnight

Newbie
Nov 12, 2021
86
95
Very late into this, but how can you beat Hyakki post-update without cheating if she has like triple the stats over Daji? (Most likely I'm wrong on that triple part)

Daji's stats are on the 200s, and Hyakki's are on like the 600s after the update.

Edit: They were 150, yeah.
Daji stats.png

Now let's take a look at Hyakki's stats, maybe I have misremem-
Hyakki stats.png

SWEET MERCIFUL CHRIST
 
Last edited:

Noah Neim

Well-Known Member
Nov 25, 2020
1,493
2,941
Very late into this, but how can you beat Hyakki post-update without cheating if she has like triple the stats over Daji? (Most likely I'm wrong on that triple part)

Daji's stats are on the 200s, and Hyakki's are on like the 600s after the update.

Edit: They were 150, yeah.
View attachment 4405198

Now let's take a look at Hyakki's stats, maybe I have misremem-
View attachment 4405205

SWEET MERCIFUL CHRIST
like evoked said, there's this video, which is an absurd 2 hours long
 

EvokedShadow

Newbie
Aug 15, 2023
73
37
Is she really? I didn't play harder difficulties so she might scale higher there but i had no trouble with her on standard. :unsure:
She is basically a glass cannon due to having 1440 Health but having the highest binding frequency in the game.(Most variable binding moves). It's just that Regular lets you blitz her down due to having halved binding chances on everything. Where as Suicidal Increases Binding Changes, so its double Regular, and then some.

You can still beat her but it requires a lot more patience. And on some of my suicidal challenge runs(No Hitting 0 Willpower, Handgun-Only, etc.). Mukuro did actually become literal RNG, for the first time ever. But in that case I was doing self-imposed stupid challenges.
 

EvokedShadow

Newbie
Aug 15, 2023
73
37
Very late into this, but how can you beat Hyakki post-update without cheating if she has like triple the stats over Daji? (Most likely I'm wrong on that triple part)

Daji's stats are on the 200s, and Hyakki's are on like the 600s after the update.

Edit: They were 150, yeah.
View attachment 4405198

Now let's take a look at Hyakki's stats, maybe I have misremem-
View attachment 4405205

SWEET MERCIFUL CHRIST
Honestly less than I thought it was :D. Makes me curious about a few other stats.

Daji also really doesn't deal a lot of stat damage, Aconitums have higher stats than her.
1736038977882.png
Though Aconitums are actually rather dangerous enemies, most demons have 150 stat averages in the game. Since most attacks use custom multipliers or set damage values anyways.
 

EvokedShadow

Newbie
Aug 15, 2023
73
37
i beat genocide on hardcore and mukuro was piss easy didnt even have to struggle i just chopped her into pieces, though i guess thats just the benefit of genocide View attachment 4402311
Geno Mukuro is a joke because she's not modified in the slightest despite playing Daji's theme rather than her own.

That being said, there was originally a Mukuro (G) in the files, but it seems it was never implemented. Then again, a Mukuro with higher stats proportionate to Genocide would arguably be a harder boss than Hyakki herself.
 

EvokedShadow

Newbie
Aug 15, 2023
73
37
Shotgun, vitality regen, vitality regen ring, and all you need to do is tank it out while getting a couple hits. If we're being serious the first iron maiden fight is 100 times more annoying because you'll always be bound and have statuses you can't deal with. Muruko is like a fair iron maiden to me because you actually have resources to beat them.
I'd argue Lucy binding you always also makes her more consistent, since you can create a reliable cycle to deal with Suicidal Iron Maiden that will never have to change because she won't ever fuck up, and if she does, its usually a bonus action for you.
 
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