Recommending Story-first games

5.00 star(s) 8 Votes

jufot

Well-Known Member
May 15, 2021
1,640
3,710
- Simple beginnings

Hard to talk about this one. It seems to be a story first game, but you can't really tell what the story's actually going to be about. Her sister went missing... aaaaand that's basically it. You get some small story snippets here and there, but it's weird. It's supposed to have supernatural and horror elements somewhere down the line, but... we'll see I guess. Maybe?, Eventually?

Maybe this is a case for inspector Jufot to take over :p
This turned out to be a good recommendation. The story is just getting started, but I'm already hooked and the prose is surprisingly good. It feels like this is not the first time the dev is writing fiction.

Based on episode 1, two things are obvious: Dad didn't commit suicide, and Sarah didn't run away. But also, perhaps surprisingly, I believe Emma's "I'm immortal" joke wasn't.

I'm a big fan of Emma. She's so fun, and exactly the kind of best friend you'd want as an introvert living in relative poverty. I imagine she'll be instrumental in protecting Jenny from Amanda and Carl's scheme. Speaking of which, I also like Amanda (Jenny's mum). Yes, she's vile to her daughter, but her talk with Carl in the kitchen was very illuminating. The way her shame and guilt causes her to mistreat her children felt very true to life.

I'm also curious if the various bits of school drama (Jasmyn and Mr. Baker, the promotion issue with Uma and Mrs. Goodwin, and Murphy's threat to Jenny) will tie in to the central mystery.

Anyway, good game, recommended! :) I'll leave you with my favourite line so far:
Emma said:
I never thought Murphy would do the dirty deed in a bathroom. It's almost like walking in on Mother Teresa putting on a strap-on.
I'll wait for one more chapter before adding the game to the OP.
 

realjitter

Member
Jun 21, 2021
317
399
protecting Jenny from Amanda and Carl's scheme
Will she need protection though?. It'll all come down to what's the story's going to be. I mean, supernatural, there aren't that many possibilities here. Vampires maybe?, underground society stuff, magic/super heroes/whatever...., but then again, there aren't any real signs of any of that yet. No strange events where someone does something weird. It's more like the opposite, the game is very grounded so far and leans heavy towards realism, actual realism i might add.. Take all the campus scenes for example who're done way different than what you get to see in your usual AVN.

Which brings me to another point here, the "dating sim" aspect of it. Near the end of the current content you get to choose your path lesbian/bi/straight, but it's interesting because there aren't that many people introduced as of yet. A lot of them feel more like acquaintances at most. Sure, there's the swim/sports teacher who'll come into play at some point I suppose. I was honestly kinda surprised that him and the MC haven't had a conversation of sorts yet. Maybe he isn't even supposed to be an LI?. Other than that there's only "Loverboy" and her BFF as of yet...

So what's going to happen here?. Does this game will take some drastic story turn in the upcoming chapters?, I have no idea.. All I know is that this AVN definitely does his own thing. Pretty intriguing I have to admitt, but whe have to wait and see... The title " Simple beginnings " does seem to fit though =)


I also played "Beyond tomorrow"

This game felt a bit like watching some old abercrombie and fitch advertising campaign, or calvin klein or something... With the MC more often than not striking a pose, letting the audience admire his leet tats & body or whatever. I mean, hell, even cancer mom, who looks more like 25 instead of 40, seemed more like she was on some set for some chemotherapy photoshot rather than her being in actual danger of dying... Combine that with all the theatrical dialogue... My emotional investment ended up somewhere close to 0% :p.

Still, at the end of the day, a pretty inoffensive game and probably worth checking out. It just wasn't really my thing..

I did like Samantha though, she seemed to have some character to her. Gotta strike fast here mr model MC. The search is already over imo :p
 
Last edited:

jufot

Well-Known Member
May 15, 2021
1,640
3,710
Will she need protection though?
I assume she will because we were repeatedly told just how obscenely rich, powerful, and influential Emma's parents are and how much her mum loves Jenny. I assume that emphasis is for a reason.

But yes, there isn't anything supernatural yet. The intro definitely told us otherwise, though, so I reckon we'll start seeing bits and pieces of it soon.

Which brings me to another point here, the "dating sim" aspect of it. Near the end of the current content you get to choose your path lesbian/bi/straight, but it's interesting because there aren't that many people introduced as of yet. A lot of them feel more like acquaintances at most. Sure, there's the swim/sports teacher who'll come into play at some point I suppose. I was honestly kinda surprised that him and the MC haven't had a conversation of sorts yet. Maybe he isn't even supposed to be an LI?. Other than that there's only "Loverboy" and her BFF as of yet...
I like the way it was handled. There is no pressure, no in-your-face sexuality. Just a bunch of people who might vaguely be interesting to / interested in Jenny. "Loverboy" is obnoxious though :) I'm not playing a straight route, which leaves Emma, and that's just fine by me.


This game felt a bit like watching some old abercrombie and fitch advertising campaign, or calvin klein or something... With the MC more often than not striking a pose, letting the audience admire his leet tats & body or whatever. I mean, hell, even cancer mom, who looks more like 25 instead of 40, seemed more like she was on some set for some chemotherapy photoshot rather than her being in actual danger of dying... Combine that with all the theatrical dialogue... My emotional investment ended up somewhere close to 0% :p.
That's such an astute description of the game :D I've complained multiple times on this thread about most AVN characters being underwear models LARPing as ordinary people. This game is a prime example.
 

Hildegardt

Well-Known Member
Oct 18, 2017
1,126
2,317
I also played "Beyond tomorrow"

This game felt a bit like watching some old abercrombie and fitch advertising campaign, or calvin klein or something... With the MC more often than not striking a pose, letting the audience admire his leet tats & body or whatever. I mean, hell, even cancer mom, who looks more like 25 instead of 40, seemed more like she was on some set for some chemotherapy photoshot rather than her being in actual danger of dying... Combine that with all the theatrical dialogue... My emotional investment ended up somewhere close to 0% :p.
The LoF cameo made me think that someone discovered a new fetish, when his peepee got hard at the parts of the game it wasn't supposed to. Maybe this is the start of some kind of melancholy porn genre.
Idk this stuff seems like a cheap tear jerker to me, but people seem to love it. I guess it plays into the power fantasy of being dependable, when all the women need the PC's shoulder to cry on. But things like clinical depression, cancer and physical disabilities in a porn game are dangerously close to the fetishization of "damaged goods", where it's all about dependency, which is creepy af.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jufot

EndlessNights

Member
Jun 18, 2022
318
2,224
Maybe this is the start of some kind of melancholy porn genre.
Well, there's nakige and utsuge for Japanese VNs (they're not necessarily or exclusively AVNs, though). I haven't played very many, but I get the impression that they're often very melodramatic and like to pile on tragedy after tragedy. Imagine a week in the life of some poor MC: his parents die in a car crash, his sister is so traumatized as a result that she stops speaking or displaying any emotion, and his girlfriend is also diagnosed with a fatal illness.

Idk this stuff seems like a cheap tear jerker to me, but people seem to love it. I guess it plays into the power fantasy of being dependable, when all the women need the PC's shoulder to cry on. But things like clinical depression, cancer and physical disabilities in a porn game are dangerously close to the fetishization of "damaged goods", where it's all about dependency, which is creepy af.
I think a lot depends on the way the story is told. Ideally, we should be able to have characters in AVNs who have disabilities, serious physical illnesses, and/or mental health issues just like real people do. As long as they're depicted as actual people and not just empty gateways to exploitative sex scenes, I think it's generally a good thing. Katawa Shoujo for instance I thought did a good job of making sure the routes were not centered around the characters' disabilities for the most part. Instead, the game focuses on who they are as individuals and their relationships with Hisao and the other characters. Hanako's route is perhaps the one exception because she has so much unresolved mental scarring to go along with her physical scars and she is more dependent than the other LIs, but I still would be reluctant to call her route fetishized.

I also see a lot of potential social value in stories that depict characters with disabilities and physical/mental health issues as being both desirable and lovable. That's a world away from the games that act like only underwear models can get any action or affection.
 

Éama

Member
Apr 17, 2022
138
956
But things like clinical depression, cancer and physical disabilities in a porn game are dangerously close to the fetishization of "damaged goods", where it's all about dependency, which is creepy af.
That's like every telenovela ever written. Melodrama is just not supposed to be very realistic or sensitive, it thrives on hyperbolic emotions by default. Children lose their parents until they reappear, people have accidents until it turns out everything was staged or the victim survived in the wilderness for ten years, sisters and brothers and loved ones get diagnosed with terminal illness till total remission due to their closeness to God or the power of love. And sometimes there is no salvation at all. I don't think we would ever consider this as fetishization in the context of a normal telenovela, only because AVNs are sexual in nature, we suddenly have this idea.

In my opinion many of us humans just have a desire for strong emotions, so we seek thrills in action, horror, drama and love to feel ourselves more. At least that is why I enjoy watching and playing such content. Sex and sexual thoughts are one way to achieve that, but melodrama, horror and love stories are just different paths to the same experience of katharsis. I don't feel it's entirely fair to denounce this as a form of fetishization, unless it's really thriving on blatant crime, abuse or torture.

On a side note: I am a nurse and I deal with a lot of suffering and loss on a daily basis. To me the poor handling of stories around cancer, depression, suicide etc. boils down to the fact that we push that away for most of our life. So, when it finally hits (and that it does for everyone at some point) we just don't have the emotional bandwidth and vocabulary to treat it with the complexity it deserves. It's no surprise to me that one of the best AVNs about suicide or drug abuse is written by people who are processing personal experiences with it. For many of us our treatment of the subject is inadequate, like a picture drawn by a toddler. We kind of know that it has to be mentioned in order to write a complete story, but we don't have the words and devices to do it in a way that doesn't appear like a fetish.

Anyway. Don't mind me rambling. Have a beautiful Sunday. :giggle:
 

Raife

Active Member
May 16, 2018
630
1,111
That's like every telenovela ever written.
What you say is wise and true: I love your observations about human nature, how we process emotions, and how we tell each other stories.

Your 'side note' about loss particularly resonated with me. We usually don't treat emotions and stories associated with pain, suffering and loss with the depth and sophistication they deserve... certainly not in AVNs. Moreover -- with apologies to jufot, as he's heard this from me many times -- truly appreciating the beauty and wonder of life _requires_ a familiarity with the darker side, much the way painters like Vermeer used dark backgrouds to illuminate the beauty of their subjects.

Your points don't just apply to telenovelas or melodrama: they cover classical drama and most of the English canon. Look at basically every Dickens novel. But you know that very well: you mentioned the concept of katharsis. Not much has changed about human beings since Aeschylus!

The quality of writing you've described is exactly what jufot wants to see; it's what many of us on this thread want to play in AVNs.

The difficulty -- particularly for devs and for players with tastes like ours -- is that most AVN players hail from a particular demographic and see games as a wish-fulfilling escape. Thus, most games eschew strong emotion, feature physically dominant (and emotionally immature) male protagonists, and use porny tropes. I find these games deadly dull... at best.

Finally: I am pleased whenever someone like you posts on this thread. Many, many users on this site... aren't my favourite people. But what you've written here requires a degree of insight and wisdom that you don't encounter very often anywhere, let alone on F95. Finding users like you on this site... well, let's just say it puts me in a more optimistic frame of mind. :)
 
Last edited:

Raife

Active Member
May 16, 2018
630
1,111
The Bite: Revenant's new chapter is out !
Another solid update: _The Bite: Revenant_ is definitely one of my favourites at the moment.

But I am concerned that, much like _Rebirth_, the dev risks eventually making the MC overpowered, which could diminish the strong female LIs or NPCs. He will need to handle that transition carefully, and preserve the autonomy and integrity of his female characters...
 
  • Like
Reactions: jufot

yossa999

Engaged Member
Dec 5, 2020
3,243
21,994
[...] Anyway. Don't mind me rambling. Have a beautiful Sunday. :giggle:
Those were very thoughtful ramblings, thank you for sharing them :)
And once LoF was mentioned, it was a great example of your point that we generally just don't have the emotional range and vocabulary to deal with dark topics like suicide, drug use, or life-threatening illnesses with the complexity which they deserve.

When I did my first playthrough, I definitely had a range of different emotions about Cece's arc. Irritation, distrust, skepticism, misunderstanding. Like, while looking with a smirk: “Yeah, sure, this dev guy knows how to draw attention to his characters. This Damsel in Distress was simply waiting for our Prince Charming to arrive before drawing herself into the abyss of the black waters. How the hell did he even manage to catch her on the fly, is he an acrobat or what? What a cheap trick! Well, at least she's hot, me and my MC will have a lot of fun saving her from her theatrical misery."

Later, as the story progressed, it became even more annoying: “What is she talking about? What's wrong with her? Where do these constant mood swings, vague attempts to explain her state of mind come from? This is simply not right, the author is not playing by the rules. The lass was going to end her life, I get it. For... whatever the reason, there just had to be a rationale for this... Unhappy love, loss of someone important, unbearable grief, drug overdose, anything that we've seen in thousands of dramas. But now everything is fine, Prince Charming is here, he saved you, we live happily ever after, and that means a lot of fun and hot steamy sex scenes."

And at the end of the story, after a fun and joyful summer spent at Lexie's house, reuinon at their old school, when everything seemed to be working out and getting better, suddenly bam! We are at the same point where it all began. And the final nail in the head is the author’s remark that Cece’s character has a real prototype.

This came as a shock to me and made me retrospect my view of the game and the characters. I replayed Cece's path, paying more attention to her words and facial expressions rather than her... um... assets. Damn, I was embarrassed that I thought the author was just trying to get attention with the Cece drama when he was telling the real story of how complex and dangerous some types of mental illness can be.

As someone who has never had to deal with such things (and I hope I will never have to), I got my ideas about what it is from mainstream media, primarily movies. And they tend to simplify it, usually in the mainstream, suicide always has a rational reason, it may seem stupid or far-fetched, but at least there is some logic, the desire to end one’s life does not arise out of nowhere. And although such characters often experienced a kind of ptsd after a failed suicide attempt, they easily recovered with the help of counseling groups, friends and loved ones.

But Drifty showed well that not everything is so simple. That sometimes a person cannot even explain with the words what is wrong. But even though “it” cannot be seen, heard, touched or even explained, for an ill person “it” is very real. And "it" can become so intense that a young, cheerful, witty, attractive and full of life girl would prefer to end her life rather than experience constant torment, the essence of which she can hardly even explain to anybody. It’s even more surprising that the author managed to wrap such a complex and serious topic in an essentially entertaining AVN format.
 

Den1mo

Member
Aug 26, 2023
203
1,215
And at the end of the story, after a fun and joyful summer spent at Lexie's house, reuinon at their old school, when everything seemed to be working out and getting better, suddenly bam! We are at the same point where it all began. And the final nail in the head is the author’s remark that Cece’s character has a real prototype.

This came as a shock to me and made me retrospect my view of the game and the characters. I replayed Cece's path, paying more attention to her words and facial expressions rather than her... um... assets. Damn, I was embarrassed that I thought the author was just trying to get attention with the Cece drama when he was telling the real story of how complex and dangerous some types of mental illness can be.
I agree with everything you wrote, so take a second to think if Dream isn't just another developer doing the same thing. If someone is making a game just to get the most money out of it, they will focus on content that fulfills almost all the lewd imaginations of the players. An emotional story behind this makes no sense. As you said yourself, in the case of LoF you understood some things at the end. Someone will say that "BT's story is too much". I don't think so, it's real, it happens every day to everyone all around us. People know that cancer exists, but they ignore it but only until the moment cancer becomes a part of their lives. It could be exactly the same with Lily as with Cece. And considering that Cece wasn't just a cameo and Dream probably "bonded" with Drifty when it came to BT, it probably doesn't need more words. People like Drifty aren't stupid, they don't get along with everyone
 
  • Hey there
Reactions: yossa999

yossa999

Engaged Member
Dec 5, 2020
3,243
21,994
I agree with everything you wrote, so take a second to think if Dream isn't just another developer doing the same thing. If someone is making a game just to get the most money out of it, they will focus on content that fulfills almost all the lewd imaginations of the players. An emotional story behind this makes no sense. As you said yourself, in the case of LoF you understood some things at the end. Someone will say that "BT's story is too much". I don't think so, it's real, it happens every day to everyone all around us. People know that cancer exists, but they ignore it but only until the moment cancer becomes a part of their lives. It could be exactly the same with Lily as with Cece. And considering that Cece wasn't just a cameo and Dream probably "bonded" with Drifty when it came to BT, it probably doesn't need more words. People like Drifty aren't stupid, they don't get along with everyone
I never thought any less of Dream and his work. I noticed his game from the first release here, and I wrote the first review in the game's main thread. :)

I like this kind of stories, although many consider them depressing, and the appearance of such recognizable character in the game only fuels my curiosity. And of course, I see that the story is still in its early stages, the main characters are introduced (maybe not all), the current life situation they find themselves in is shown, the relationships between some characters are depicted, and hints are also given about some skeletons in the characters' closets. Basically, that’s all for now, and it would be pointless to draw far-fetched conclusions about a book after reading only a dozen pages, unless you already don't like what you've read. Like I said before, I'm enjoying it so far, we'll see where it goes.

Lily seems quite natural in the terrible situation, which she have to cope with. I don’t see any falsehood in her, especially considering her experience as a psychological consultant, she’s definitely not a shoemaker without boots. I'm not kink shaming anyone, just voicing my own preferences, but the idea of making her lewdable or LI for her son feels disgusting and would completely ruin the game for me.

So for now, I can say that the author is making a good story-based game with a decent plot and excellent renderings, I like it and follow game's thread and I expect some very intriguing twists and turns ahead :)

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.
 

Den1mo

Member
Aug 26, 2023
203
1,215
I never thought any less of Dream and his work. I noticed his game from the first release here, and I wrote the first review in the game's main thread.
I know, he mentioned you somewhere before that you were one of the few players who didn't complain

the idea of making her lewdable or LI for her son feels disgusting and would completely ruin the game for me
You are not the only one. People are capable of creating all sorts of nasty things, especially when we're talking about AVNs, but Dream also said that there are boundaries everywhere and this is one of those that he won't cross no matter what. I don't even want to imagine something like that, as you said yourself, it's disgusting

About that spoiler:

I have not yet noticed that he pays much attention to it. The truth is that the criticism starts here and ends here. As for the people on his server or Patreon, they write something negative or criticize him, but at the same time no one has to call him "dumbass" or "idiot" to point out a mistake. No request, criticism or opinion was ever ignored by him, but it depends on how one writes it. He is learning... I believe that chapter 3 will be the turning point when some potential will show :ROFLMAO:
 
  • Like
Reactions: yossa999

Cskin Games

Well-Known Member
Game Developer
Jun 24, 2021
1,864
2,931
The LoF cameo made me think that someone discovered a new fetish, when his peepee got hard at the parts of the game it wasn't supposed to. Maybe this is the start of some kind of melancholy porn genre.
Idk this stuff seems like a cheap tear jerker to me, but people seem to love it. I guess it plays into the power fantasy of being dependable, when all the women need the PC's shoulder to cry on. But things like clinical depression, cancer and physical disabilities in a porn game are dangerously close to the fetishization of "damaged goods", where it's all about dependency, which is creepy af.

I'm gonna note - I haven't talked to the dev, nor played the game, so nothing I say here should be taken as commentary on it, since I lack all knowledge and context. This is more of a global thing -

I think topic like those, and others, are fine, and can even be meaningful - depending on how they're handled, and what their purpose is.

My first game, a big undercurrent of the overall story, was domestic violence/abuse. It wasn't used as a means for sex, nor was it a defining trait of the character, but it was relevant to the story.

My new game, the MC's mom is schizophrenic. Another character.... (I won't say, because the topic will come up in CH2, which isn't out yet!). The main catalyst to the story, and one of the drives being the MC, was the murder of his fiancé. There's ofc other things I won't mention, because they won't really come up for a bit.

The point is, there's plenty of "melancholy" in my storytelling, tons of issues, and lots of characters could in some ways be seen as "damaged goods" - But for me, I did this for three reasons. #1 - It, IMO, makes for interesting storytelling. #2 - It presents opportunities to add character depth that you might otherwise struggle to add. #3 - These things all exist. Some people are all about the pure fantasy, whatever way it goes - but I like to try and find that blend between fantasy and reality - the sort of situation where a part of you *knows* it's all made up and just a story, but another part goes "Well, I've seen crazier shit in my life".

There certainly are devs who might take such topics and try to fetishize them, which I guess I have mixed feelings about, but many that I've seen at least, are really just trying to tell a story - and well, those stories just often tend to contain a litany of sex.

Ultimately I think it comes down to (at least for the player) - Did I enjoy that, or not? Different people will have different answers to different games, everyone has different tastes after all, but I can say most devs I know are trying to create games where people will go "Yes, I enjoyed that". Ofc that's based on what the dev themselves enjoys, and hey. Like they say, There's no accounting for taste.
 
Nov 1, 2022
32
85
Hi Everyone,

May I humbly suggest my game?

Circumstances

The story and deep relationships are vital parts of it.

If you do check it out, Enjoy

Cheers
I played this based on your posting here and I really enjoyed it. Very much a story-driven game and the story is engaging. I thought the first chapter was particularly well-done. It generated an emotional response on multiple levels, including through its presentation of an abusive childhood situation, through the "light in the dark tunnel" relationship between MC and Carrie, and by creating strong tension with both the fight and gun scenes.

I did think you unnecessarily relied on porn-cliched scenes at times (e.g. the accidental towel drop, the naive girl discovering a morning erection). I say unnecessarily because that kind of thing can break immersion in an otherwise compelling narrative and I think you are a good enough writer to move the relationships between the characters forward without it.

All in all a great effort and I will look forward to future chapters.
 

camube

Well-Known Member
Jun 4, 2022
1,485
1,323
i don't actually know if this is new or old feature but i just learned this today.

Apparently on patreon, if you go to a creator's page, if you clicked the three dots settings, there is an option for "Join for Free"

i'm not sure yet what it does in terms of email notifications but i joined for free a couple games i'm not patroning.

So below are the links of game devs i think you all should "Join for Free"









 

skrusher

Active Member
May 11, 2019
676
2,197
i don't actually know if this is new or old feature but i just learned this today.

Apparently on patreon, if you go to a creator's page, if you clicked the three dots settings, there is an option for "Join for Free"

i'm not sure yet what it does in terms of email notifications but i joined for free a couple games i'm not patroning.

So below are the links of game devs i think you all should "Join for Free"









"All fans can join for free if their creator has a free offering listed on their page. Some creators may only show their paid options prominently on their Patreon. You’ll know a creator offers this option if you see a Join for free button on their page."

.
 
Last edited:

Raife

Active Member
May 16, 2018
630
1,111
I played this based on your posting here and I really enjoyed it.
I agree, Impenitent: the game has an interesting story, although the first chapter is light years better than what follows.

The dev's decision to put the player in a true 'no win' situation right at the outset was great. I loved the feeling of desperate vulnerability that inspired... where the player starts casting around for a Kobayashi Maru solution, but no such escape is possible.

But... the dev, predictably, was given endless shit for the way the game began by a vocal group of the usual suspects on this site. I suspect that contributed, consciously and subconsciously, to the MC's 'grown up' characterization later in the game... where he is essentially a Gary Stu, the LIs are (mostly) taken with him immediately, and porny logic begins to prevail.

I understand the economics of the dev's decisions about the MC and the subsequent course of the game. And it's still enjoyable to play. But it's not a game that would make jufot's list in its current state. If the dev had retained 40% of the creativity and raw feel of Chapter 1, and eschewed porny tropes, it would have made the list.
 
5.00 star(s) 8 Votes