Ren'Py Summertime Saga [v21.0.0 wip.5003] [Kompas Productions]

[j4yj4m]

Since when branching paths = good story?
Movies, tv series and most novels don't have that

Well, there's an obvious difference between a movie/series/novel/etc. and a sandbox game, right?

In your move/novel/etc. you aren't supposed to choose anything, but to simply follow the story. That's it. In games like SS on the other hand the player is able to pursue the characters he wants and to ignore those, he doesn't. To make that work without glaring gaps or bad outcomes, choices are a massive benefit. Without them it's actually quite hard to write that many different characters in a credible and somewhat interesting way. Especially once there are more than just a handful of characters involved.

I've mentioned Eve's case but you could just as well mention Harold. How on earth are you supposed to decent ending for him, if MC takes his (ex)-wife, girlfiend and daughter? Sure, you could just kill him off or make him some kind of asshole/loser, but I'd much rather prefer the chilled guy he is now either getting his wife back or getting a sweet girlfriend as alternative. It's just a way better plotline.

 

[DarkDaemonX]

Well, there's an obvious difference between a movie/series/novel/etc. and a sandbox game, right?

In your move/novel/etc. you aren't supposed to choose anything, but to simply follow the story. That's it. In games like SS on the other hand the player is able to pursue the characters he wants and to ignore those, he doesn't. To make that work without glaring gaps or bad outcomes, choices are a massive benefit. Without them it's actually quite hard to write that many different characters in a credible and somewhat interesting way. Especially once there are more than just a handful of characters involved.

I've mentioned Eve's case but you could just as well mention Harold. How on earth are you supposed to decent ending for him, if MC takes his (ex)-wife, girlfiend and daughter? Sure, you could just kill him off or make him some kind of asshole/loser, but I'd much rather prefer the chilled guy he is now either getting his wife back or getting a sweet girlfriend as alternative. It's just a way better plotline.

Exactly, you said everything I wanted to say here, at least someone understands.

 

[Ultimate_Mayhem21]

Does the android port already have the incest patch?

 

[srksrk 68]

Well, there's an obvious difference between a movie/series/novel/etc. and a sandbox game, right?

In your move/novel/etc. you aren't supposed to choose anything, but to simply follow the story. That's it. In games like SS on the other hand the player is able to pursue the characters he wants and to ignore those, he doesn't. To make that work without glaring gaps or bad outcomes, choices are a massive benefit. Without them it's actually quite hard to write that many different characters in a credible and somewhat interesting way. Especially once there are more than just a handful of characters involved.

I've mentioned Eve's case but you could just as well mention Harold. How on earth are you supposed to decent ending for him, if MC takes his (ex)-wife, girlfiend and daughter? Sure, you could just kill him off or make him some kind of asshole/loser, but I'd much rather prefer the chilled guy he is now either getting his wife back or getting a sweet girlfriend as alternative. It's just a way better plotline.

You are just desparately trying to find arguments that prove your point, except that they don't imo. You say you want to make choices because you want to pursue one girl but not the other. So just do that: ignore the other. No need to force everybody else to do the same.

 

[DarkDaemonX]

You are just desparately trying to find arguments that prove your point, except that they don't imo. You say you want to make choices because you want to pursue one girl but not the other. So just do that: ignore the other. No need to force everybody else to do the same.

You're forgetting the continuity errors with how characters act though.

 

[CUNTBLAZER420]

You're forgetting the continuity errors with how characters act though.

specifically?

 

[j4yj4m]

You are just desparately trying to find arguments that prove your point, except that they don't imo. You say you want to make choices because you want to pursue one girl but not the other. So just do that: ignore the other. No need to force everybody else to do the same.

I think my point about for example Grace stands pretty well. In the end there should be a decision or you'll get outcomes which are quite unsatisfactory to anyone who actually cares. Sure, I know that many people don't really care about the story/details as long as MC gets some pussy. Though I have no idea why these play this game in the first place. There are so many games that would suit their taste so much better.

And no, I think the point is actually important for the game and I'll certainly continue to make it. It's not like I'm starting these discussions. You know that I'm following this game for quite some time and I remember being pretty annoyed when people started to push this whole harem idea on DC. Now we've got a situation where there'll be some elements of both. To me that's fine, but I really can't agree with those who want to push even further. It'll simply ruin at lof the atmosphere etc. this game stood and stands for.

You're forgetting the continuity errors with how characters act though.

These will always be there across different branches and I don't expect them to solve them. If somebody actually has to get as many girls as possible in one single playthrough, it's kinda his fault if things don't add up.

To me the main point is to avoid problems within branches, which is something DC actually seems to care for.

 

[srksrk 68]

I think my point about for example Grace stands pretty well. In the end there should be a decision or you'll get outcomes which are quite unsatisfactory to anyone who actually cares. Sure, I know that many people don't really care about the story/details as long as MC gets some pussy. Though I have no idea why these play this game in the first place. There are so many games that would suit their taste so much better.

And no, I think the point is actually important for the game and I'll certainly continue to make it. It's not like I'm starting these discussions. You know that I'm following this game for quite some time and I remember being pretty annoyed when people started to push this whole harem idea on DC. Now we've got a situation where there'll be some elements of both. To me that's fine, but I really can't agree with those who want to push even further. It'll simply ruin at lof the atmosphere etc. this game stood and stands for.


These will always be there across different branches and I don't expect them to solve them. If somebody actually has to get as many girls as possible in one single playthrough, it's kinda his fault if things don't add up.

To me the main point is to avoid problems within branches, which is something DC actually seems to care for.

Again, you want to prove your point with questionable arguments, this time claiming that whoever disagrees just wants to fap and does not want the story. I cannot disagree more. I like the story and I don't like branches. That's all there is to say. And again I ask: why not simply *not* making out with a girl as a free will decision instead of forbidding it to everyone?

 

[j4yj4m]

And again I ask: why not simply *not* making out with a girl as a free will decision instead of forbidding it to everyone?

Because that obviously massively influences the story/character? If every girl in the game agress that MC fucks every other girl in town the game just gets horribly one-dimensional. You can't have it both in this case. I'll just refer to Eve again, either you have a classical and rather deep romantic story with a nice built-up/finale or not. The devs of WaL! tried a compromise with Myrtles branch and it completely fucks her whole actually pretty well crafted story.
The only real alternative that's left is "to cheat" which is what DC and Sploosh decided for Grace (and Odette). That's fine to me personally, but I don't think it's what fans of Grace wanted to see and I'm sure it's the reason why she's pretty much neglected now.

I know it's just a porn game, but that shouldn't mean that we can't talk about these things. If you don't see a problem here, it's fine, enjoy. But don't blame me, if I do.

 

[Azrael502]

Wow The butthurt is strong in this thread

 

[Kryptozoid]

Didn't play the latest update, but was Debbie (& some others) replaced with the "new" art ? If this is not done in the next (& final ?) tech update, I will march on the streets in protest. This "new" art was already done more or less a year ago, it was just never implemented. Which pisses me of because all of the good people doing fanart are forced to use old art. Anyways, just another reason to be pissed off when the next updates comes. I wonder if the devs didn't completely forget that they have new art to implement since waaaaay to long.

 

[j4yj4m]

Didn't play the latest update, but was Debbie (& some others) replaced with the "new" art ? If this is not done in the next (& final ?) tech update, I will march on the streets in protest. This "new" art was already done more or less a year ago, it was just never implemented. Which pisses me of because all of the good people doing fanart are forced to use old art. Anyways, just another reason to be pissed off when the next updates comes. I wonder if the devs didn't completely forget that they have new art to implement since waaaaay to long.

As of now it looks like their art will be replaced once they actually win their polls. So it's not like they are forgotten, but the recent updates certainly took/take quite a bit longer than expected and people didn't vote for them. So in Debbie's case it looks like it'll take years until she finally gets her update. Unless DC decides to change his schedule once again, that is.

 

[Stil996]

As of now it looks like their art will be replaced once they actually win their polls. So it's not like they are forgotten, but the recent updates certainly took/take quite a bit longer than expected and people didn't vote for them. So in Debbie's case it looks like it'll take years until she finally gets her update. Unless DC decides to change his schedule once again, that is.

Have there been any sneak peeks that show what changes will be in effect when they finally do this?

 

[Omnikuken]

Have there been any sneak peeks that show what changes will be in effect when they finally do this?

Do Debbie's route (or check her scenes in the jar) and then do the main route. Every-ish time she's around the MC when the mafia bois rekt his face, that's her "new" art. Compare those to her route's art and you'll see

 

[j4yj4m]

Have there been any sneak peeks that show what changes will be in effect when they finally do this?

Well, the new art is mostly implemented in the "first day scenario" (for Debbie, Mia, Judith, the Latinas, Annie, Ms. Bissette etc.) and in some other places for almost everybody, but a few exceptions (like Rhonda, see below).

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I'm sure there are more...

 

[DarkDaemonX]

specifically?

One of the biggest examples, is when you finish Roxxy's path, or even just get far enough on it for her to be nicer towards the MC, even around others, and then interact with her on any other character's storyline.

 

[CUNTBLAZER420]

One of the biggest examples, is when you finish Roxxy's path, or even just get far enough on it for her to be nicer towards the MC, even around others, and then interact with her on any other character's storyline.

How would a choice help that?

 

[Omnikuken]

One of the biggest examples, is when you finish Roxxy's path, or even just get far enough on it for her to be nicer towards the MC, even around others, and then interact with her on any other character's storyline.

How would a choice help that?

Also, what choice ? Roxxy is alone in her route, Missy and Becca are doing/following everything she tells them to do. You don't need a choice between main girl and sub girl(s) if said sub girl(s) are around carpet-tier level of leadership.

 

[j4yj4m]

Also, what choice ? Roxxy is alone in her route, Missy and Becca are doing/following everything she tells them to do. You don't need a choice between main girl and sub girl(s) if said sub girl(s) are around carpet-tier level of leadership.

Yeah, Roxxy is simply a cuckquean and certainly doesn't mind.

The choices I see that could/should be implemented would be a proper split for Jenny, so we'd actually get something that's closer to femdom on one hand and an option where people actually get the choice to dominate her on the other. Right now it's really neither one nor the other.

Next to that it would have been great to have split in Eve's route. Her current romantic branch, but without Grace and Odette, and one where MC solves Eve's issue but where they essentially become friends with benefits and where MC can have his fun Grace and Odette too.

Both of these would greatly benefit the game as a whole in my opinion.

 

[DarkDaemonX]

Also, what choice ? Roxxy is alone in her route, Missy and Becca are doing/following everything she tells them to do. You don't need a choice between main girl and sub girl(s) if said sub girl(s) are around carpet-tier level of leadership.

Any character development made on 1 character's route is completely wiped out on another character's route is what I was trying to say, and if it was more of a VN with lots of choices and branching paths instead of a sandbox that wouldn't happen.